FL - 17-yo Teen Trayvon Martin Shot to Death by Neighborhood Watch Captain #5

[Deleted member 39678]

That is simply not true.

In fact it has been my experience that those who carry guns are MORE likely to begin a confrontation, simply because they have an ace in the hole...they will feel very confortable starting a physical confrontation simply because they have a gun and it is highly unlikely that they will lose.

People who carry guns do not simply draw their gun on someone first....if they did they would all be in jail. IMO JMHO and stuff

How many times have you seen people with CCW permits get into fist fights while carrying their guns?

 

[m00c0w]

Well, I'd put it another way. People who are responsible and carry guns avoid confrontations. People who should not be carrying guns get into trouble. Background checks are to keep people who should not have guns from getting them. With GZ's background shoving a police officer and reports of domestic violence I'm surprised he was able to get a license to carry a handgun. 46 calls to LE with complaints such as, children playing in the street, neighbor left a garage door open, someone is weaving in and out of traffic, someone is playing music too loud when they drive by, party at clubhouse too loud (he lived at the other end of the community away from the clubhouse), etc. He seemed to let everything bother him, even little things like calling LE because someone left a trash bag in the middle of the road. Pick the darn thing up and put it in your trash, why complain to LE about it. He was a ticking time bomb. jmo

He was not convicted of the domestic violence, else the Lautenberg amendment would have prevented him from getting a permit or even owning a gun. The violence against a police officer charge was expunged after he went through a pre-trial diversion program. IIRC, the state of Florida does not expunge convictions/guilty pleas. He would have pled nolo contendere.

He was never actually convicted of any crimes.

 

[songline]

Nope. It was Bill Lee. Not Tray's dad.

At some point Martin noticed that he was being trailed, Lee has said. The chief said Martin turned and confronted Zimmerman, asking why he was being followed. At that point Lee said a confrontation ensued. Lee says that Zimmerman said he stepped out of his truck to jot down the address to give to a 911 dispatcher when Martin attacked him from behind.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/...case-george-zimmerman-bill-lee_n_1371635.html

OK who told Lee tha story?

 

[ejw009]

They did not keep GZ's clothing; they let him leave the police station wearing the same clothes he wore that night.

I saw something that said that they had his clothing. That's not the same as contradicting that they let him leave in those clothes.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/201...sanford-police-chief-steps-down?newsfeed=true

Sergeant David Morgenstern, a spokesman for Sanford Police, said...

... the investigation recovered Zimmerman's clothes from the night of the shooting and that they had custody of the gun. He confirmed that one shot had been fired.​

 

[rossva]

SPD Police report. <modsnip>

http://www.sanfordfl.gov/investigation/docs/Twin Lakes Shooting Initial Report.pdf

"I also observed a black male, wearing a grey hooded sweat shirt laying face down in the grass."

"I then noticed that there was, what appeared to be a black male wearing a grey sweater......"


IMO grey = nearly white

How do you know that Trayvon's hoodie was nearly white? Link please?

 

[OrdinaryLife]

IMO we need the details of who started the altercation before we know whether or not GZ was justified to shoot.

I disagree. Zimmerman followed Trayvon as is accounted by the phone calls Zimmerman made to 911. Trayvon did nothing, but attempt to walk home after buying a drink and Skittles at a grocery mart.

imvho

 

[christee]

IMO we need the details of who started the altercation before we know whether or not GZ was justified to shoot.

Respectfully, there was no altercation before GZ's phonecall to the operator. He was told not to follow TM. He ignored that request and did so anyway. I believe the altercation would never have happened had GZ stayed in his car as he was clearly told to do.

MHO

 

[Isabelle]

This is JMO: Zimmerman saw Trayvon leave the complex heading to the 7-11 and positioned himself so that he could ambush Trayvon upon his return. I don't believe 'John' saw anything at all.

 

[Sensei]

It's one story that makes absolutely no sense. If Zimmerman were going to claim self defense, he at least needed to come up with a better story than this. No one could possibly believe that a 6 feet 3 inch, 140 pound boy sit on top of Zimmerman at 250 pounds with his hand over his mouth telling him to "shut the ****** up." Such a crock of bullcrap.

I'll be soooooooo thankful when I log onto the internet and see that ZIMMERMAN HAS BEEN ARRESTED. It can't come soon enough.



~jmo~

That really doesn't make any sense unless GZ was blubbering like a baby....the girlfriend said that Trayvon asks why are you following me, which makes sense. But as far as we know, GZ and TM have not had any words, GZ has not questioned him, (by this story) so why would he tell him to Shut the ****up???? That's just bizarre IMO JMHO and stuff

 

[Isabelle]

Are there any pics of Zimmerman taken the night of the incident? Were there any lights illuminating the area where the murder took place? Depending on what color red Zimmerman's shirt was, in the dark it would have looked black, not red!

 

[Dr.Fessel]

SPD Police report. Actually very interesting <modsnip>

http://www.sanfordfl.gov/investigation/docs/Twin Lakes Shooting Initial Report.pdf

"I also observed a black male, wearing a grey hooded sweat shirt laying face down in the grass."

"I then noticed that there was, what appeared to be a black male wearing a grey sweater......"


IMO grey = nearly white

Hmmmmm, wonder how he knew it was a black male when he first saw him?

 

[francie]

Good grief... The discussion has now gone to what color Trayvon's hoodie (sweatshirt)? I have tried to catch up and just read, but this is getting way out of hand.

The fact is Trayvon was walking home from a store, Zimmerman was following him, Zimmerman made 911 phone call, Trayvon had no clue why this stanger was following him, and Trayvon, *the VICTIM* of a stanger stalking him, is dead.

If there is an injuries to Zimmerman, it is due to Trayvon fighting for his life. Zimmerman made this happen and made the conscience decision to do so even after being told by 911 operator not to.

This was not racial. Disturbs me on *so* many levels that it is being made as such. Zimmerman was out of power control. Period. I have absolutely no sympathy for him.

jmvho

BBM..... I appreciate your opinion but disagree, I fully believe Zimmerman would not have shot a white teenager under the same circumstances. jmo.

 

[Sensei]

How many times have you seen people with CCW permits get into fist fights while carrying their guns?

My employment affords the the opportunity to see the aftermath of these types of confrontations....and I have seen it happen I would not say frequently, but it happens far more often that people would want to know.

About a fourth of the time when a gunshot comes in it is caused by someone who is carrying a legal weapon, and quite often there was an altercation prior to the shot, and the person shot was NOT always the person who started the confrontation

It runs about the same for people who are carrying legal weapons and those who do NOT have carry permits but carry their guns anyway...

People who carry guns DO get into fistfights and those who have guns do NOT always try to avoid a fight, and in fact sometimes start them, and we have to patch 'em up, as best we can, if we can or do post mortem care and attach a toe tag...

 

[Adrienne37]

That really doesn't make any sense unless GZ was blubbering like a baby....the girlfriend said that Trayvon asks why are you following me, which makes sense. But as far as we know, GZ and TM have not had any words, GZ has not questioned him, (by this story) so why would he tell him to Shut the ****up???? That's just bizarre IMO JMHO and stuff

Agreed. The whole shebang doesn't make a bit of sense.



~jmo~

 

[Isabelle]

SPD Police report. <modsnip>

http://www.sanfordfl.gov/investigation/docs/Twin Lakes Shooting Initial Report.pdf

"I also observed a black male, wearing a grey hooded sweat shirt laying face down in the grass."

"I then noticed that there was, what appeared to be a black male wearing a grey sweater......"


IMO grey = nearly white

The pdf won't open, wonder if it was removed??

 

[Deleted member 39678]

This is JMO: Zimmerman saw Trayvon leave the complex heading to the 7-11 and positioned himself so that he could ambush Trayvon upon his return. I don't believe 'John' saw anything at all.

How would GZ know that Trayvon was only going to the 7-11 and back?

 

[songline]

Okay, whatever. Whoever said it, I don't think that's the reason GZ exited his car.

But I still back shooting someone if your nose is broken by them.

OK broken nose you do not kill common!
How about shooting the leg, arm shoulder...
I do not think he shot to kill - I really do not think so.
He himself became traumatized by it and cried uncontrollably for days
why is this not believable?

Allot of great research by many here and posting without hanging GZ kudos
to you guys, but but but....
What happened to humanity?
IT IS HORRIBAL A YOUNG MAN IS DEAD, or that parents have to burry a child
yes it is unbearable, and no one should have to go through that....
BUT HOW IS VENGENCE GOING TO HELP?
Why not wait till we dig up all the pieces and put the puzzle together.

LOOK MORE CLOSELY PLEASE.

 

[rossva]

Are you questioning the that the LEO's id'd the body as black, male, or both? Neither LEO said that Martin's face was obscurred when they arrived at the scene. And when you walk up on a body, laying on the ground, at close proximity to you, it's pretty easy to determine race. IMO

Hmmmmm, wonder how he knew it was a black male when he first saw him?

 

[m00c0w]

Hmmmmm, wonder how he knew it was a black male when he first saw him?

He said he observed a black male, not that he identified the male as black. There's a difference, and that strikes me as pedantry.

 

[m00c0w]

The pdf won't open, wonder if it was removed??

It works for me.