Found Deceased FL - Lane Graves, 2, Walt Disney World, 14 June 2016 #1

[LaborDayRN]

A grown man should be able to wrangle a gator that size enough to remove the victim, right? Might lose a finger or something? How much would that gator weigh approximately? It could be picked up?

Well I know over the last few weeks I've learnt there is some huuuge gators in Florida. The golf course one still has me :scared:

Edited to add, not blaming dad, thinking that the gator must have been a lot bigger than that if poor dad didn't stand a chance.

I think it's important to keep in mind that the alligator in question was possibly up to 7 - 8 feet (I've read both). Dad more than likely wasn't dealing with a 4 foot alligator, that just cut off for relocation per Disney.

 

[LaborDayRN]

Yeah, the witness estimates are, I think, 4-7 feet. I think it had to be much closer to 7 than 4, and possibly even bigger. A 4-footer just really isn't that big.

A grown man could absolutely pick up a gator the size of the one in my picture. Just the other day, the neighbor kids hooked a gator while fishing, down at the river when we were there for our nightly sunset. It was about that size -- 4, maybe 5 feet. The neighbor kid -- a teenage boy about 14 -- picked it up completely out of the water.

Has there been any information on the size of the alligators found yesterday? I know they were over 4 feet, but how much over I wonder.

 

[Wyle_E_Coyote]

Assist law enforcement with what, exactly?

This statement was made prior to his body being found.

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[LaborDayRN]

Disney does not need to put fences up! That is absurd. Should the beach be blocked off because of sharks? We have deadly snakes in FL as well.... could be anywhere! People these days just seem to lack common sense, in my opinion.

Going forward, Disney needs the correct signage if they don't want people going in the water. If people can't follow the rules, then that is their (people, not Disney) problem!

Respectfully, the beach is not privately owned. Beaches do however have lifegaurds who clear the water in the event of riptides, large and powerful waves (Due to storms) large amounts of jelly fish, or shark sightings (At least in CA they do) They can't force people to get out, but at least they make an attempt.

I LOVE Disneyland!!! But Disneyland and Disney World are privately owned properties that attract guest to the beach for movies etc. There are pictures all over the internet (an above poster directed people to trip advisor) of hotel guests wading in the water of this lagoon. It appears it was a pretty common practice. Do they need to fence it off? I Don't know if that's the answer, but better signage is a must!

 

[JerseyGirl]

Assist law enforcement with what, exactly?

The investigation is continuing, said Orange County Sheriff's Department spokeswoman Rose Silva, adding, "It's not criminal in nature at this time." She did not provide further details.

http://kelo.com/news/articles/2016/...year-old-into-florida-lagoon-authorities-say/

A Disney spokeswoman has said the company would review the posted signs that ban swimming in Seven Seas Lagoon but do not specifically warn about alligators.

http://www.reuters.com/article/us-florida-alligator-child-idUSKCN0Z10I4

“There’s nothing in this case to indicate that there was anything extraordinary” in terms of neglect by the parents, Orange County Sheriff Jerry Demings told The AP. Mr Demings said his department and the state wildlife agency would look into signage around Seven Seas Lagoon, where Disney had posted “no swimming” signs but no warnings about the presence of alligators,

http://www.adelaidenow.com.au/news/...s/news-story/f7a085d798b5ec775b1814fa34fbf503

 

[CHICANA]

The Internet has been a beautiful invention, it has brought our immense unimaginable Earth into our tiny homes. However, along with the good always comes the bad. And I AM SICK OF IT!!! I read a blog post today that spoke exactly what I have been thinking especially over the last month .
It was written on a blog by a mom (initials MF) of four boys (that gives you some info to google it). In it she brings up 2 situations that if you are at least 35 -40 you should recall. I will paraphrase a bit of it below.

35 years ago a mom left her 6 year old son with another group of boys while she looked for something while shopping at the mall.
30 years ago, we sat helpless in front of the TV as workers spent hours trying to free an 18 month old that was stuck in her aunt's well.

That first boy was Adam Walsh and of course the second was Baby Jessica.

Guess what else those 2 events have in common? The entire country LOVED them and SUPPORTED them. I would be naive to think there weren't snarky thoughts entering minds back then...but they didn't have the ability to publicly shame.
And just because we have that ability now does not mean we should.
As the mods say to us here at WS- "scroll and roll," and as my mama always has said "your words have the power to heal and the power to destroy. Use your power carefully."

RIP beautiful Lane. Your life was short, but it reminds me how precious my children are and how easy accidents happen. I pray for your family, currently walking though a blurry unimaginable existence , that each day will bring a renewed strength to cope with coming years. I pray for the big sister left to grow in the shadow of this tragedy, that her life is blessed with unconditional love and support.

Thank you

 

[LaborDayRN]

OT--This tragic incident has made me mull over what kind of legal slippery slope my local government and well-known Shakespeare Festival may be on. For thirty years, the deer population has exploded and they have become increasingly comfortable around people. The city has done nothing to address the problem except hold meetings. The deer live all over town in residential areas and wander downtown. Some residents have fed them and put out salt licks for them, which was just recently made illegal and signs have been posted on the main drag.

In years past they were only a nuisance if they ate your flowers. However, in recent years there have been a number of attacks on people by mama deer who think their fawns are threatened. Anyone walking a dog through a neighborhood, not even seeing deer, can be a target. I've run outside and warned a dog walker that a doe is stalking them. In at least one case, a woman walking alone without a dog near the post office downtown was attacked from behind. Deer come right up to my front door and they aren't scared at all but they scare me!

In addition to locals, there are over 250,000 visitors to the Shakespeare Festival in our community each year who think "Bambi" is sooooo cute and have no clue that they can be attacked. Given the relative rarity of these attacks, I wonder what responsibility the City or the Festival has to warn people. There are also mountain lions and bears in parts of our beautiful downtown park and even neighborhoods, who have not attacked anyone, although a bear entered a home recently. I have no answers, but I would like to the City and the Festival to err on the side of caution and inform the visitors they actively invite of the remote risks somehow. It just seems like the courteous thing to do. I warn people who visit me.
JMO

Hi Lilibet! You're right, the city should err on the side of caution and warn visitors. I wanted to add that I love the festival (I've only been once) but have been to your area many times. Such a beautiful place! I love Oregon!!

 

[eileenhawkeye]

Disney had to have known that this was a possibility. They chose to not have the signs warning of gators, to not have any sort of barrier, and to not enforce a rule where you can't even go into the water at all. They must have figured that the chance of this happening was so low--and that if it did happen, the impact of it would be less than it would be if they spent the last 45 years with signs warning of gators. They have ways of calculating the cost/lost revenue of everything. I bet there are other situations, that are just as rare as this one, where Disney has done much more to prevent because they know it will have a bigger impact on them.

 

[amymarie]

A grown man should be able to wrangle a gator that size enough to remove the victim, right? Might lose a finger or something? How much would that gator weigh approximately? It could be picked up?

Well I know over the last few weeks I've learnt there is some huuuge gators in Florida. The golf course one still has me :scared:

Edited to add, not blaming dad, thinking that the gator must have been a lot bigger than that if poor dad didn't stand a chance.

You're completely underestimating the strength of an alligator's jaws. Once they clamp down, it is extremely difficult to get them to open their mouth because they lock their jaw. Dad could wrestle all he wanted, but he would not have been able to pry those jaws open. And once the gator pulled the boy under the dark, murky water, it would have been impossible to see where he went.

What's sad to me is that Lane was found so close to where the alligator dragged him in. This means the alligator grabbed him and decided pretty quickly that he wasn't something he wanted to eat and let him go. He could have even possibly been saved if his body could have just been found in time.

I do not blame the parents at all. They were not being negligent. Maybe a little naive, but what parents haven't been that way on occasion? Accidents happen, especially to 2-3 year olds. It is absolutely heartbreaking, but society can't predict every single bad thing that's going to happen before it happens. Disney has been open a long time and has never had anything even close to this happen before.

 

[AmyPond]

The family of Lane Graves will hold a special service at St. Patrick's Church in Elkhorn, Nebraska Thursday. A priest at the church will also pray a rosary specifically for the Graves family.

The Graves family asks for their privacy during this time.

http://www.wpsdlocal6.com/story/32234955/services-scheduled-for-lane-graves

____

to add to that...

George A. Kalogridis, the president of Walt Disney World Resort, said in a statement, "There are no words to convey the profound sorrow we feel for the family and their unimaginable loss. We are devastated and heartbroken by this tragic accident and are doing what we can to help the family during this difficult time. On behalf of everyone at Disney, we offer our deepest sympathies."

Robert A. Iger, chairman and CEO of The Walt Disney Company, also said in a statement, "As a parent and a grandparent, my heart goes out to the Graves family during this time of devastating loss. My thoughts and prayers are with them, and I know everyone at Disney joins me in offering our deepest sympathies."

http://www.wkow.com/story/32236331/...after-alligator-attack-that-killed-2-year-old

I assume that means Lane's extended family. I mean, I don't think his parents and sister would be back in town already, right? Elkhorn is a fairly small suburb so I am sure the people there will be very supportive to the family which makes me thankful.

 

[Wyle_E_Coyote]

but society can't predict every single bad thing that's going to happen before it happens. Disney has been open a long time and has never had anything even close to this happen before.

Snipped for focus

Actually, it has happened before.

http://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory/man-seized-disney-gator-86-horrified-boys-family-39911010

In 1986, Santamaria's family was staying at Disney's Fort Wilderness Resort and Campground when he was attacked while feeding ducks at a pond. The gator knocked him down, grabbed his leg and started to thrash around and try to pull him into the water, Santamaria said.

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[sonjay]

While i understand they are difficult to find, they did manage to find 5 in less than 24 hours.

I wonder how many are in there that they didn't find.

 

[BetteDavisEyes]

Alligator found in backyard of home on Detroit's west side

Animal Control removes 2-foot animal from Strathmoor Street yard

By Halston Herrera - Digital news editor

Posted: 2:05 PM, June 15, 2016
Updated: 2:45 PM, June 15, 2016

DETROIT - Animal Control was called Wednesday to remove a two-foot alligator from the backyard of a home in Detroit...

http://www.clickondetroit.com/news/...gn=Breaking News Alert&utm_term=wdiv_breaking

Alligator taken from west-side neighborhood

James David Dickson, The Detroit News 1:10 p.m. EDT June 16, 2016
See you later, alligator.

A baby alligator is in safe hands, and the public is safe from it, after Detroit Animal Control officials took it from a home on Detroit’s west side Wednesday afternoon.

Animal Control responded to reports that there was an alligator in a west-side neighborhood...

http://www.detroitnews.com/story/ne...igator-taken-west-side-neighborhood/85985638/

 

[keyleigh]

You're completely underestimating the strength of an alligator's jaws. Once they clamp down, it is extremely difficult to get them to open their mouth because they lock their jaw. Dad could wrestle all he wanted, but he would not have been able to pry those jaws open. And once the gator pulled the boy under the dark, murky water, it would have been impossible to see where he went.

What's sad to me is that Lane was found so close to where the alligator dragged him in. This means the alligator grabbed him and decided pretty quickly that he wasn't something he wanted to eat and let him go. He could have even possibly been saved if his body could have just been found in time.

I do not blame the parents at all. They were not being negligent. Maybe a little naive, but what parents haven't been that way on occasion? Accidents happen, especially to 2-3 year olds. It is absolutely heartbreaking, but society can't predict every single bad thing that's going to happen before it happens. Disney has been open a long time and has never had anything even close to this happen before.

I don't blame the parents either. I've been pretty vocal right from the start that this is Disneys fault. I was only trying to understand the character and strength of gators, hence my questions. And it has happened before. 1986.

 

[Lilibet]

Hi Lilibet! You're right, the city should err on the side of caution and warn visitors. I wanted to add that I love the festival (I've only been once) but have been to your area many times. Such a beautiful place! I love Oregon!!

OT--Thanks, LDRN. I'm glad you enjoyed it here. We do live in a beautiful place! On the flip side of the coin, when I worked at the Festival a patron became irate because a bird "traumatized" her child by dropping some poop on her head as it flew through the outdoor theatre. The patron felt that the birds should be controlled. Hmmmmm. I understand the ick factor, but the same thing could happen anywhere outdoors. I'm sure the Festival did something to compensate, but things happen. We also have starlings that get a little aggressive sometimes as well as bats that swoop through on occasion. The Elizabethan Theatre is outdoors after all, but there are two indoor theatres too for those who are uncomfortable with flying creatures doing what they do. Fortunately, they do little harm.

 

[LinasK]

Disney does not need to put fences up! That is absurd. Should the beach be blocked off because of sharks? We have deadly snakes in FL as well.... could be anywhere! People these days just seem to lack common sense, in my opinion.

Going forward, Disney needs the correct signage if they don't want people going in the water. If people can't follow the rules, then that is their (people, not Disney) problem!

Well I happen to think it was a stupid idea to build a resort on swampland known to have alligators in it and then make it an inviting beach with white sand and movie night, appealing to families with children when you are not going to put up detailed signs for fear of scaring people! You can't have it both ways. Most tourists (out-of-state and out of country) were not aware that Disney World has a gator problem. If they can't manage the gators, then yes this particular beach should be closed off, or as one poster suggested- turned into an alligator/wildlife educational exhibit.

 

[BetteDavisEyes]

I assume that means Lane's extended family. I mean, I don't think his parents and sister would be back in town already, right? Elkhorn is a fairly small suburb so I am sure the people there will be very supportive to the family which makes me thankful.

Per CNN: Autopsy was to take place this afternoon. Presumably, the family is still in the Orlando area until Lane's remains are released to them.

 

[LinasK]

Exactly. Someone would sue for getting cut therefore ruining their vacation. Guaranteed.

The solution to that is to add to the signage- stay off rocks, danger. Then if they sue Disney won't lose.

 

[x_files]

Well I happen to think it was a stupid idea to build a resort on swampland known to have alligators in it and then make it an inviting beach with white sand and movie night, appealing to families with children when you are not going to put up detailed signs for fear of scaring people! You can't have it both ways. Most tourists (out-of-state and out of country) were not aware that Disney World has a gator problem. If they can't manage the gators, then yes this particular beach should be closed off, or as one poster suggested- turned into an alligator/wildlife educational exhibit.

It's a manmade "lake/lagoon" and alligators are crafty buggers they sneak into any body of water, even shallow ditches have gators hiding out. I still think Disney should put up big signs and constantly remove all gators though.

 

[sloane7777]

Sadly it does boil down to ......If there were a sign warning of danger or alligator presence Lane would most likely be alive now.