FL - Mass Shooting at Pulse nightclub, Orlando, 12 June 2016 #2

[Elley Mae]

He could have purchased a firearm even if he had been a felon. Just not legally. If laws against murder and terrorism didn't stop this Islamic terrorist, then a little thing like a firearm purchase prohibition certainly wouldn't have stopped him.

My issue is the no fly list. One can be on that yet still buy a gun. Seems the government should be sharing that no fly list. jmo idk

 

[bluesneakers]

Well, we already have a terror watch list. They can't fly on an airplane. If you can't fly on airplane, then you shouldn't be able to purchase a firearm. That's just my personal belief. I don't call that gungrabbing nor profiling.

I agree with you - no fly should mean no gun - but flying on a plane isn't mentioned in the Constitution.

In the end though, I think, it doesn't matter what we do. I said this after the attacks in Paris - they will always be a step ahead. They're going to morph and adapt and do whatever they can to keep killing us.

They will find a way to kill us.

 

[cvaldez1975]

what facts have come out that this was indeed Islamic terrorism? to me on the outside, it just looks like good old fashioned hate, the perp just happened to be Muslim. was this organized? are there other perps? sorry, this has started so fast, I have not been able to keep up.

 

[sonjay]

Well, we already have a terror watch list. They can't fly on an airplane. If you can't fly on airplane, then you shouldn't be able to purchase a firearm. That's just my personal belief. I don't call that gungrabbing nor profiling.

Frankly, I disagree with having a secret no-fly list that people have no defense against.

The no-fly list is mishandled as well as abused for political purposes. It's not who we are as Americans.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/No_Fly_List#False_positives

Numerous children (including many under the age of five, and some under the age of one) have generated false positives.

Daniel Brown, a United States Marine returning from Iraq, was prevented from boarding a flight home in April 2006 because his name matched one on the No Fly List

Some members of the Federal Air Marshal Service have been denied boarding on flights that they were assigned to protect because their names matched those of persons on the no-fly list.

Robert J. Johnson, a surgeon and a former lieutenant colonel in the U.S. Army, was told in 2006 that he was on the list, although he had had no problem in flying the month before. Johnson was running as a Democrat against U.S. Representative John McHugh, a Republican. Johnson wondered whether he was on the list because of his opposition to the Iraq War. He stated, "This could just be a government screw-up, but I don't know, and they won't tell me."

In October 2008, the Washington Post reported that Maryland State Police classified 53 nonviolent political activists as terrorists, and entered their names and personal information into state and federal databases, with labels indicating that they were terror suspects. The protest groups were also entered as terrorist organizations. During a hearing, it was revealed that these individuals and organizations had been placed in the databases because of a surveillance operation that targeted opponents of the death penalty and the Iraq war.

 

[sonjay]

what facts have come out that this was indeed Islamic terrorism? to me on the outside, it just looks like good old fashioned hate, the perp just happened to be Muslim. was this organized? are there other perps? sorry, this has started so fast, I have not been able to keep up.

Well, for starters, he called up the cops and pledged allegiance to ISIS. He gave a shout-out to the Boston Bombers. He traveled to Saudi Arabia more than once. Investigations by the FBI found ties to terrorists. Also, he called up the cops and pledged allegiance to ISIS. What more do we need, really?

 

[sonjay]

I agree with you - no fly should mean no gun - but flying on a plane isn't mentioned in the Constitution.

In the end though, I think, it doesn't matter what we do. I said this after the attacks in Paris - they will always be a step ahead. They're going to morph and adapt and do whatever they can to keep killing us.

They will find a way to kill us.

That's why we need to keep them out of the US. And if they're already here, we need to deport them.

 

[Beautybee123]

Brief, upsetting footage from phone of female victim.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/201...l-wages-war-on-gays-in-the-west-after-omar-m/

^^^^^ Should be quoted but I don't know how to since I deleted part of the original post. Sorry

[emoji24] So sad



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[LaborDayRN]

I accept that he did this as Isis. What I don't accept is that he did not target the lgbt community because he did. Some seem to think that they are two separate things. They are not . Imo To ignore that this club and these people were targeted...is wrong. It's like demeaning to the victims. And they have been treated as less far too long as it is.

This ^^^

 

[Paige SC]

what facts have come out that this was indeed Islamic terrorism? to me on the outside, it just looks like good old fashioned hate, the perp just happened to be Muslim. was this organized? are there other perps? sorry, this has started so fast, I have not been able to keep up.

Many things, but if I had to pull one funfact out of my hat it would be that ISIS has claimed responsibility for the Orlando Massacre.

 

[Everyday Grace]

That's pretty fatalistic. I prefer not to be so fatalistic. I think we can stop allowing Islamic terrorists and Islamic terrorism into the US, and I think we must do so.

OM was born in the US.

Should we have prevented his parents from entering in the 1980's?

At the time we needed Islamic allies in Afghanistan for a covert war we were conducting against the Soviet Union.

 

[bluesneakers]

what facts have come out that this was indeed Islamic terrorism? to me on the outside, it just looks like good old fashioned hate, the perp just happened to be Muslim. was this organized? are there other perps? sorry, this has started so fast, I have not been able to keep up.

They've admitted to liking each other but afaik there have been no definite, provable connections established. I'm especially interested in who paid for his gun and/or if he sent any money internationally

 

[bluesneakers]

That's pretty fatalistic. I prefer not to be so fatalistic. I think we can stop allowing Islamic terrorists and Islamic terrorism into the US, and I think we must do so.

OM was American. Born in New York.

 

[Paige SC]

This ^^^

Gays today, Jews tomorrow, blacks next week and women the month after. Every man, woman and child in the USA is equally at risk of being targeted by islamic terror. Equally at risk.

 

[LaborDayRN]

Just wanted to let all the people out there my sincere sympathy for this horrible and senseless crime. I too would be surprised if I saw a gay couple kissing in public. However, I might feel a little queasy and turn my head, but would never consider retaliating in any shape, form or fashion… There's no way we can live in a democratic country and not see things that bother us. Regardless of how these victims lived their lives, they shouldn't have been mowed down like a pack of wild rabid dogs.

It hurts me to read that when two people show affection, love to one another, it makes people queasy. It makes me upset when I hear people saying horrible things about others, harm one another, are intolerant of others. But I hope and pray as long as I live, I will never be offended by a sign of love between two human beings. JMO

 

[sonjay]

OM was born in the US.

Should we have prevented his parents from entering in the 1980's?

At the time we needed Islamic allies in Afghanistan for a covert war we were conducting against the Soviet Union.

Yeah, we probably should have. The Middle East has been a hotbed of Islamic terrorism for centuries. We knew that in the 1980s.

 

[BetteDavisEyes]

Just received email alert from local TV station.

Michigan native among victims of Orlando nightclub shooting

By Local 4 - ClickOnDetroit news staff

Posted: 1:38 PM, June 13, 2016
Updated: 1:39 PM, June 13, 2016

DETROIT - A Michigan native is among the victims of a mass shooting at the Orlando nightclub Pulse.

Christopher Leinonen, 32, who goes by Drew, moved with his mother from metro Detroit to Florida...

http://www.clickondetroit.com/news/michigan-native-among-victims-of-orlando-nightclub-shooting

 

[stmarysmead]

Don't put words in my mouth. I just said I know a lot of folks who would like a religious legal system instituted in our country based on the Bible. I don't know a lot of Christians who are paving the way for gay rights. I am a Christian and am for gay rights. But, I'm kind of a minority in that line of thought where I'm from. There's also Christian pastors who preach that gays should be put behind electric fences, and planes should go overhead and drop food for them, until they just die of natural causes, and that way they'll be out of our population. There's ignorant, hateful, dangerous, people in all walks of life, who interpret and twist what they read to fit their own agenda. j.s. Pointing no fingers though.

Terrible. But what's the death count equivalency? That's where your argument breaks down.

 

[bluesneakers]

Yeah, we probably should have. The Middle East has been a hotbed of Islamic terrorism for centuries. We knew that in the 1980s.

So what good does it do now? Let's pretend we can forbid Muslims from immigrating - what about all the Muslims who are here now? What about the family members they want to join them here?

 

[AlwaysShocked]

I'd love to know how that was allowed while being on an FBI watch list? Same thing for the Boston Bomber's if I recall.
Who will answer to this? FBI?

He had the job as a security guard for eight years or so. He did not come to the attention of the FBI until four years ago. He would have already had his clearances in place.

In all of this, even though nothing apparently came of it, I was glad to hear that it was co-workers who reported him for the statements he was making at work. There is one co-worker in particular who gave an interview which said OM was an angry idiot, always raving, always angry.

Today the FBI said they investigated him for 10 months, including even following him. They found nothing to arrest him for. But don't tell me the FBI just "went away" at the end of that investigation. What about all those "government spying programs" we've heard so much about? Would the FBI not have been monitoring him through whatever means they have?

I suspect the FBI at this point will be looking very closely at how they missed this. Hopefully they will learn from this tragedy to enable them to prevent it from happening in the future. Because, folks, they are basically all we have.

I am still up in the air as to whether this guy was a lone-wolf nutcase or an ISIS nutcase. But it sure sounds like he's been some kind of a nutcase for a long time. I consider all religious extremists to be nutcases.

 

[tehcloser]

Gays today, Jews tomorrow, blacks next week and women the month after. Every man, woman and child in the USA is equally at risk of being targeted by islamic terror. Equally at risk.

I agree with that. But today it was a specific group. Tomorrow they may choose a church. I will say they specifically targeted Christians of a certain faith then. If it's at a sporting event...then it's everyone. It really bothers some people to admit the lgbt community was targeted because they look down on them too. They have no empathy unless it strikes them right in the head.