FL - Mass Shooting at Pulse Nightclub, Orlando 12 June 2016 #4

[Cryptic]

Isn't Arabic the language of the mideast. Just like English is the language of certain parts of the West? Even though different dialects may be involved?

Yes, you are right about Arabic being the language of the Middle East, though there are different dialiects and the citizens of some countries can mix alot of French into their Arabic. But.... the use of Arabic stops at Iraq. The people of Iran, Turkey, Afghanistan and Pakistan, though they are moslems, are not arabs and do not dont speak Arabic.

Arabic is the language of islam, and probably most often the language of the middle east, but Turks speak Turkish, Afghans are not middle east and have a few languages, Pakistan has a language, Iran is Persian. All islamists know some or lots of Arabic. JMO

Even the most observant Moslems from non arabic countries would not speak conversational Arabic unless they had friendship or business contacts with arabs. In short, casual Moslems know a memorized prayer or two in Koranic Arabic. More observant moslems know more prayers, and even a few Koran passages. Religous authorities might be fluent in Koranic arabic.

Koranic arabic and modern arabic, however, is like comparing the English of Beowulf to modern English. I once showed some Koranic arabic to a Christian arab and later, to a Moslem arab for a translation. Neither could truly read it and both said in general terms that it was part of the story of Moses.

So he might be a Persian who was speaking Farsi. How does ISIS feel about Persians?

Not good. Nearly all Persians are Shia Moslems and thus mortal enemies of ISIS.

 

[KMouse]

Maybe he tagged them.

 

[bluesneakers]

Arabic is the language of islam, and probably most often the language of the middle east, but Turks speak Turkish, Afghans are not middle east and have a few languages, Pakistan has a language, Iran is Persian. All islamists know some or lots of Arabic. JMO

There are also different dialects of Arabic. Not that it would make much difference unless you learned Modern Standard from an Egyptian and are trying to speak to a Jordanian.

 

[Everyday Grace]

Very true. As a side note however, I doubt he was speaking Arabic as he is Afghan, not Arab. Aside from some commonly memorized prayers in arabic, my bet is that the shooter does not speak the language.

In these records, Mateen said he had been convicted of a crime, placed on probation and had a criminal conviction sealed or expunged. He did not specify the offense. He said he spoke excellent Farsi and good Arabic.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...expand-after-massacre/?utm_term=.6bc3da0f4d12

It is possible that the language heard by others was Farsi, but apparently he also spoke some Arabic.

 

[CARIIS]

Dig Obama . What it is we expect him to say .

We do conolences

we love first resonders

our team has been fab

we will get to the bottom of this

BS once the media leaves non story


only depends on when the next attrocity happens

look at the voice singer shot to death

nothing after the next night here

the media was here with all there anchors

the story would (alligator) far less if they were not here alreddy

As a gay man I am glad America is seeing we are not a bunch of wrist moving . drama queens, that we are "manly" ,that most of us have no desire to be woman, that lots of us of us are bright educated, diverse ,are bright, that we all are not all hairdressers.have careers in law , politics, energy, etc etc


, that gay bars have served as a safe haven cause so many people . have cause of the bible, taught that they are destined for hell

That many of us are bright , educated not a bunch of sissy males that want to be woman. Trust me 99.58% of us are thrilled to be male

So sadly there are many elements of this horror , in the next decade, will be helpful, and all directly involved imo need to despite all this need to go to sleep (not for months) knowing that

Friendly fire has been nothing, and it has to be, nothing not understandable about that - in the circumanstens -- but it should ( it wont) be addressed mooooo

 

[cady]

So he might be a Persian who was speaking Farsi. How does ISIS feel about Persians?

Hates 'em ISIS is Sunni Persians( Iran) are Shiite. JMO

 

[bluesneakers]

When is the press conference supposed to start?

 

[sonjay]

You could consider him an Islamic terrorist but I do wonder why that label seems so important. I do think he had some of the beliefs that these groups tout,but I also think he had other issues and wanted to be viewed as more involved than he actually was.
At any rate,hopefully the investigation will tell us more. If he did have ties,knowing may help to prevent future attacks.

It seems to be extremely important in various cases to apply labels such as racist, sexist, homophobe, etc. I do wonder why there's so much resistance to labeling an Islamic terrorist an Islamic terrorist.

Whether or not he had "ties," we know that ISIS commands its followers to go out and kill infidels, whether they're acting on their own or as part of a coordinated effort. It can certainly be helpful to our national security efforts to identify those individuals who self-identify as Islamic terrorists.

 

[Cryptic]

All islamists know some or lots of Arabic. JMO Israelis speak Hebrew, but probably a majority can speak Arabic.

The key word is "some". Many of the US prison converts rants in "arabic" are tarzan level arabic. Even a good number of the ISIS jihaders in Syria are known to prefer communicating in English, French or Russian and will lapse back into those languages when broadcasting their manifestos. I also believe the coordinator of the Paris Charlie Hebdo attackers usually spoke, texted, emailed, and screamed in French.

There are exceptions, however. One US convert from California known as "Al Americani" apaprently has made speeches on behalf of Al Queda in fluent, conversational arabic.

 

[human]

Trying to buy bullet proof vest + bulk ammo = suspicious

Trying to buy bullet proof vest + bulk ammo + calling someone on the phone and speaking in Arabic when vest isn't available = extremely suspicious

How would the average person know a language is Arabic?

 

[LinasK]

It's weird that gun stores aren't in touch with each other to say "I refused to sell this guy a gun. I suspect he's a terrorist" but maybe there are too many gun stores to do that. If he was refused it really seems to me the message should have gone out and everyone refused him, especially because he passed the background check. It should be like when you're refused at the border and the other crossings get your plate number. Could they use his driver's license?

I wonder if any of the owners actually called anyone too.

I don't know. The owner said if he hadn't sold him the weapons someone else would have.

Maybe they should have a database for that like the no-fly list, NamUs, and the CODIS/AFIS?? The one gun store thought he was creepy, so why didn't the one who sold to him pick up on it???

 

[cady]

Cryptic................interesting information! Please keep it coming.....JMO

 

[galiuro]

Don't get why so much is being made of 'he can't be a terrorist because he doesn't know whether ISIS is Sunni or Shia and other excuses along the same vein. I'll bet there are a lot of possible terrorists out there who don't care about such fine theological parsing; all they are a bunch of disaffected hoodlums who want any excuse to destroy the West. Even when they have been literally nursed by that same West...

 

[CARIIS]

I have been going all over the place.

The truth here is , these people were not killed instanly. They (if they could) sat on floor , bleeding out , in pain, shivering from blood loss,, watching loved ones withering away and dying in front of them ,watching strangers being double shot to make sure they sure they were dead, high velocity weapon, watching dead people , when shot again , bouncing off the floor, hearing people crying, screaming out in horrid pain,hopeless, no way out, in the dark , hearing that thing go bang,watching friends take their last breath,hearing cell phones doing ring, buzz the favorite hit song of the moment, going unanswered endlessly, light flickering , darkness,moments of no gun shots, only to hear a gun shot , a scream of pain, and then nothing but dead, not knowing where or what happened to people they went there to have some fun , big machines crashing into into walls , porclin tires in the bathroom crashing down, loud, water pipe spraying cold water all over,getting out and seeing 475 blinding blue and red cops car lights, not knowing what happened to people you came with for hours,sirens, a lot of noise, people screaming once you got out, houndreds of cops micrhrones blaring, officers yelling directives, seeing people being carried and bloody and taken god knows where ,concusion bombs going on, walls being being crashed through, sirens blaring,cars screthcing to stops, friends thrown into the back of a chevy truck,gawkers , on their cell phones recording you bleeding,clusters of friends pounding on their loved ones chests to see them , maybe tommorow, noise noise noise

Need to stop

ty

 

[bluesneakers]

Maybe they should have a database for that like the no-fly list, NamUs, and the CODIS/AFIS?? The one gun store thought he was creepy, so why didn't the one who sold to him pick up on it???

Exactly!

 

[Dionysia]

There was a good interview on the BBC the other day with a young gay Muslim man whose homophobia and self-hatred nearly led him to commit a terrorist attack in London:
http://bbc.in/1WMCkOI

 

[passionflower]

Horror!

 

[popsicle]

Karla Ray ‏@KRayWFTV
#BREAKING- Police officer actually wrote letter of recommendation for Pulse shooter to help him get job with DOC. #WFTV

 

[nomoresorrow]

BBM - this is why. It doesn't matter if someone believes just a little in Islamic extremism or a lot. If what they believe in any way compromises the safety of others and intends to feed fear and terror, the label needs to be applied. Learning about individuals on all parts of this continuum can help guide changes to legislation, policies and security measures to prevent terror incidents.

IMO

And here is the slippery slope... to apply this, it would need to be applied across the board. Your statement would then read like this;

"this is why. It doesn't matter if ANYONE believes just a little in RELIGIOUS/POLITICAL extremism or a lot. If what their believe in any way compromises the safety of others and intends to feed fear and terror, the label needs to be applied."

This could apply to far right conservative media outlets (i.e., Fox news, *********, Rush Limbaugh...), clergy behind every church pulpit, white extremist groups, internet bloggers and posters, etc. every/anyone who propagates hate messages that have the potential to compromise the safety of others and/or incite violence.

MO ~

 

[Everyday Grace]

The Orlando shooter and his wife exchanged text messages during the Pulse nightclub rampage, a law enforcement official briefed on the investigation told CNN. Around 4 a.m., about two hours after he started the attack and while holed up in a bathroom, Omar Mateen texted his wife, Noor Salman, asking if she'd seen the news, the official said.

At one point, she responded with a text saying that she loved him. Salman also tried calling her husband several times during the standoff, a second law enforcement official said. The timing of her calls came after reports of the attack had emerged, and apparently after she realized her husband might be responsible. He didn't answer, the official said.

http://www.cnn.com/2016/06/16/us/orlando-shooter-omar-mateen/