FL - Mass Shooting at Pulse Nightclub, Orlando 12 June 2016 #5

[CARIIS]

BBM

Thank you for researching this and finding this information. It's very interested about the gold and jewelery. The sentence I bolded is very important IMO to remember and not dismiss. This is NOT just a hate and gay crime.

Respectfully?

 

[Doghairrules]

At work this morning I was on a conference call of funders to discuss how best to respond to the Orlando massacre. It was both chilling and heartbreaking to hear reports from the ground in both Orlando and Puerto Rico.

They also mentioned that there is a possibility some victims (I'm including all those at the club that night) may lose housing and/or jobs because now they are outed. Sigh.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[CARIIS]

Congress is acfting like children again. I could care less if this useless bill passes but there they go I think they are pouting again

they are doing a sit in GROW UP and act like leaders --


we have to be the laughting stock globally

 

[0101ABA]

A Sacramento, Calif., church whose pastor celebrated the Orlando massacre will not have its lease renewed next year, its landlord said Tuesday.

(...)

Hundreds of protesters gathered for a demonstration outside the church on Sunday. Executives from the independent church’s landlord, Harsch Investment Properties, told KXTV on Tuesday that Jimenez’s church will not have its 4,700-square-foot lease renewed at the end of March 2017, and Jimenez can move the church out before the current lease expires at no penalty.

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/nat...orlando-shooting-lose-lease-article-1.2682475

 

[i.b.nora]

“"We stand with those who make their voices heard: Intolerance and hate are not the values that have made our country great," Harsch executives said in a statement. "We have many places of worship and other religious organizations in the properties we manage. Like all our tenants, their occupancy rights are protected in their leases, but we will not tolerate tenants who advocate hatred and the taking of innocent lives."”

Hip, hip, hooray!!!

 

[CARIIS]

Assimilation : levels of education, socio‐economic status, marital status, levels of education and socio‐economic status, marital status, labor force participation, religiosity, age, and gender;, religiosity, age, and gender;

I remain confused at how the actual degree of asimmilation that has occurred here seems unnoticed. And it appears to be like any other population; the older the members of the family system have done less than their kids.

But IMO dad held onto his cultural a bit more, but the meida still needs to paint him as non assimlated. How folks have not taken note of his embracing American notions is befuddling.

We are a materilistic society. It is hard to ignore dad selling insurance, living in an upper middle class home, a medcedes and antoher vehicle in his driveway , educating his children, and becoming fastideous about american clothing. Those are indicators of assimalting. He held on to some oh his older views marrying his son off, homosexuality,and beleive in in the Koran. Does assimilation actually mean total abdonment of ones religion? No.

He wasn't a radical muslim. He feels pretty much identical as my my father and mother, we are Jewsih, about the Isreal Patestine issue. Dad has issues with Pakistan and his home land of Afgastian. My folks are not orthdsox jews by ANY stretch of the imagination, yet they endorse percieived wounds to Isreal in the identical OM dad regarding the homeland .

Gererationally, did his family system assimilate more? Yes

His son just died, and shot 100 people, and in everyone of his "appearences" he looks like he spent an hour and half before he opened the door to his many internviews., in flashy very Western atire. That embracing American culture IMO

Did he educated his children (collage) yes, thats a very American belief system.

Socio econmically did he embrace our culture - indeed. Did OM appear to be living in poverty no. $14 an hour clears out at what $1600 a month. I would assume when (not sure) when OM agreed to forced maggiage, dad may have done some stuff financially.

Did dad move a bit from arranged marriage on his sons second marriage - appears so- more assimation.

labor force participation: His son guarded institions of the United States of AMerica

I think these two statemetns IMO are really important

Islamic societies are also strongly religious in their values, while in comparison mostWestern countries are almost always more secular. far less tolerant towards issues of sexualliberalization, as manifested in their attitudes towards abortion, divorce and homosexuality.

So its kinda like if AMerica is at a 8 on homophobia generally at the start and Islam is 10 if both cultures drop 2 in the direction of less rigidity that is movemetn, but it is still 8-6!

https://dash.harvard.edu/bitstream/handle/1/4481625/Norris_MuslimIntegration.pdf?sequence=1

 

[cady]

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/nat...orlando-shooting-lose-lease-article-1.2682475

THANKS! Will you post this in the Terrorism Thread, as well?

 

[0101ABA]

THANKS! Will you post this in the Terrorism Thread, as well?

Yes, I'll do it now

 

[CARIIS]

The latest information about him being gay doesn't change my mind one bit that this was a Muslim extremist who carried out an act of terrorism. Until it is confirmed I see no proof he was HIV positive.

All it does is clarify for me why he selected this particular group of 'infidels' to be his targets when he did his terrorist attack..

It doesn't erase the two different times he was on the FBIs radar........not for homosexuality but each time it was because they had suspicions to believe he was a radical Muslim.

If he gave blood two weeks before the murders it still does not explain why he put his assets into someone else's name back in April before any blood was given by him. Nor does it erase his lengthy obsessive admiration for Islamic terrorists including suicide bombers. It does not erase all of his extreme radical Muslim views or the hate fill words he spewed for years every time Muslim terrorists murdered what he perceived as infidels even victims who were murdered on our own soil.

IMO

a feeling or thought that something is possible-FBI concluded it was not possible. The endless focus was, becasue of hindsight, did the FBI drop the ball. That like a car defect was not discovered until major accident. Does that mean the car maker failed, no. The refusal for media to beleive that FBI did a through job, per rules in place at the time, makes it somewhat ironic that the same people are screaming for more FBI. If noone is going to trust the FBI why is everone asking for more FBI - if people think they cant do thier tasks.

Theb bugged his phones and tracked him - what else would one want. To be right all the time. If he commited a terrorist act 2 months after he was taken off the list maybe a question. If one moves their conclusions, regarding motivation, based on endless new info that actually indicate the FBI was correct -he was not a terrorist at all, and that was their correct conclusion. The ironies!

In light of new information asssets could be suicide or notions/fears about dying becuase he discovered he had slept with someone who was postive. I think Muslim society, becasue of radical homphobia, would still endorse the notion that HIV is a death sentence, it no longer is , but it can be hold onto cause it corresponds to their hate

 

[human]

I think this fits in because now these people feel terrorized even more so cuz of Orlando

http://m.startribune.com/fear-stalks-minnesota-muslims-as-anti-islam-feeling-builds/383809081/

 

[CARIIS]

Regarding the gift of $9K in jewelry from OM to wife Noor, it's important, IMO, to understand the meaning of gifts of jewelry in middle eastern islamic cultures. Both Noor and OM are deeply immersed in middle eastern culture and values, even while in the U.S., because of their families, which have not assimilated their thinking and cultural adaptation, IMO. They "live" between 2 worlds-- american capitalism and freedom, and the "culture" of Afghanistan and middle eastern islamic culture and patriarchy.

Jewelry is given to a middle eastern woman as a form of security (gold holds value and can be sold), as a form of dowry, and also as BOTH expressions of love, and apology. Women do not buy their own jewelry, even if they can afford it. (Many shopkeepers are uncomfortable selling to western women for the same reason, in my experience.) The gift of gold jewelry from a husband to a wife has many meanings in middle eastern cultures, far beyond a simple token of affection, or "showing off" how wealthy and generous the man is.

It would be difficult to explain how many gold souks are in middle eastern markets-- they are EVERYWHERE. Much of the jewelry is (by western standards) extremely gaudy, large, and heavy. Gold is sold by weight there, so "big" is better, even if the women never intends to actually WEAR the pieces. (You typically pay for the weight of the piece, not the craftmanship or design.) Some extraordinary pieces are literally like gold lingerie, with large plates, chains, etc. When I was in the middle east, it was actually difficult to find pieces small enough for a westerner to comfortably wear, and shopkeepers always steer you to very large pieces. (Small represents poor and cheap to the shopkeeper, on the part of the buyer. It's an insult to the shopkeeper if you buy a small piece!)

Anyway, OM's gift of jewelry to Noor has many cultural overtones. I think it also represents a pre-emptive apology.

Here's a passage about the meanings of gold jewelry:



https://americanbedu.com/2012/06/19/saudi-arabia-why-saudi-women-receive-so-much-jewelry/

It would be interesting to know exactly which kind of pieces of jewelry he bought for Noor, IMO.

I have a very hard time believing that authorities "don't know" where Noor is at this time. That would be beyond incompetent.

Again, unless they have already used thier skill set and determied that she was not invoved, she has the American right to go on with her life. It will be interesting to see if a grand jury even happens imo, political passivaction.

 

[bluesneakers]

JMO Mateen was a dangerous FRAUD in every aspect of his life. And he knew it. JMO

Like so many other mass shooters. This was the only way he could be something. This was his idea of showing everyone how big/bad/smart he was.

Just another angry selfish loser with a gun.

 

[bluesneakers]

At work this morning I was on a conference call of funders to discuss how best to respond to the Orlando massacre. It was both chilling and heartbreaking to hear reports from the ground in both Orlando and Puerto Rico.

They also mentioned that there is a possibility some victims (I'm including all those at the club that night) may lose housing and/or jobs because now they are outed. Sigh.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

This is a good opportunity for all the politicians offering thoughts and prayers to back it up with legislation.

 

[CARIIS]

I think this fits in because now these people feel terrorized even more so cuz of Orlando

http://m.startribune.com/fear-stalks-minnesota-muslims-as-anti-islam-feeling-builds/383809081/

Sadly with some stuff before the thread was split I think they have good reasons..........

 

[CARIIS]

[COLOR=#FFFFFF !important]

[/COLOR]
[COLOR=#FFFFFF !important][FONT=&quot]ecause he felt used by them, the man told the network. “I’ve cried like you have no idea. But the thing that makes me want to tell the truth is that he didn’t do it for terrorism,”

[FONT=&quot]later revealed he was HIV positive,

[/FONT][FONT=&quot]FBI confirmed to the network that it had met with him. [/FONT][FONT=&quot]Mateen was attracted to Latino men [/FONT][FONT=&quot]“He (Omar) was terrified that he [/FONT][FONT=&quot]Did you do a test?’ Yes. He went to the pharmacy and did[/FONT]
[/FONT][/COLOR]

​

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[CARIIS]

[FONT=&amp]He (Omar) was terrified that he was infected,” he said. “I asked him, ‘Did you do a test?’ Yes. He went to the pharmacy and did the test … it came out negative but it doesn’t come out right away. It takes 4, 5 months. (that does not sound right??)

[/FONT][FONT=&amp]“When I asked him what he was going to do now, his answer was, ‘I’m going to make them pay for what they did to me,’” he added

both posts

[/FONT]http://www.newsjs.com/url.php?p=http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/pulse-shooter-omar-mateen-revenge-alleged-ex-lover-article-1.2682856

I checked it out it depends on what kind ot testing he did. Thw Walmart one apparently can be 20 seconds. But the deal is on some more sophisticated ones takes longer, then retest of postive.

When my doctor did it it took like 4 weeks , but long time ago . But q quarter of a year sounds off moo



==============

[h=2]Tampa Bay Times retold accounts of choice and chance at the Pulse nightclub shooting[/h]
Amination stuff


http://www.newsjs.com/url.php?p=htt...e-and-chance-at-the-pulse-nightclub-shooting/

 

[bluesneakers]

CARIIS you were right.

I was thinking the same thing, and it's not the first time.

 

[CARIIS]

ter an initial burst of fire between Omar Mateenand a security guard at the Pulse nightclub, a group of five to six police officers arrived on the scene within minutes, broke through a large glass window and ....according to a Belle Isle police officer who was among the first responders.
In the first public accounting r Brandon Cornwell, 25, said the ad-hoc team spent the first seconds inside "trying to locate exactly where the shooter was - we kept hearing people scream and shots fired."
... never saw Mateen;

he said the shooter had vanished inside the dimly lit club as Cornwell and the other officers followed the sounds of screams and echoing gunfire ........ they aimed their assault rifles toward that area as the sounds of gunfire stopped.

they then followed orders to hold their position for what he described as "15 or 20 minutes - could've been longer" until the SWAT team arrived.
What is not entirely clear from Cornwell's statements is whether the officers spent that entire period inside the club, guns aimed at the bathroom area, or whether they withdrew

, leaving Mateen time to move freely about the club and possibly start shooting again. Cornwell declined to clarify this point among others, citing the ongoing investigation and instructions not to talk about such details.

http://www.newsjs.com/url.php?p=htt...do-shooting-first-minutes-20160621-story.html

 

[alas]

To check out security - how did he miss the guy at the front door with a gun!! WOnder if he went outside like Holmes did to get his killing stuff. He rented a van so he could "work" in the back of the van moo

Makes you wonder why a van? Why not any other rental car?

 

[alas]

This is a young crowd. For this generation there cell phones are like their arms. It hit me as odd that only two cell phone videos have surfaced. So then I tried to do some math!

There is a cover. So I am thinking that the number 300 people had been in there, probalby came from the door throughtout the night.

But everytone who comes does not stay till closing in any bar!

For you guys, the fact that one video is right as it starts, and the other is in the bathroom, there would have to be others in the other rooms. 11 died after getting out.

What I am getting at is it would seem there were some in the other two rooms, that would have been capable of taking cell phone video inside there in the other two rooms after he ran to bathroom.

They video video tape french toast on their cell phones!

Isn't that strange that in reality only one cell phone video after it started?

We cant be saying that everyone out there had passed cause they did get some out from the front after the breach.

I do not know what I am getting at, if anything , but that seems strange imo??



I found this it is from 3-6 that morning

[video=youtube;cdhBeT7FtLg]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cdhBeT7FtLg[/video]

My assumption has been that there are more videos but have been confiscated by the authorities. I am sure someone would have taped him in the bathroom thinking it could be evidence later. I am positive there is more out there that we aren't privy to.