FL - Sara Morales, 35, shot dead by motorcyclist she hit with car, Orange City, 20 Nov 2021

[everybodhi]

If ALL of the above is true, why no arrests?

Why would these 3 people follow her if there was nothing to the accident:? I don't get that at all.

Well that’s a good question, vengeance?
Hot headed?
There are photos of his bike in her yard and bodycam video of him, he had no problems driving it to her house and no injury that I can see.

And to clarify concealed carry law in Florida, you can have a criminal record including violence, just no felonies, pleading down to misdemeanors works and even an extensive record does not apply after 3 years of serving your sentence.
So, for instance, if you have a charge of theft, assault and fleeing and evading LE with no drivers license going 95 in a 50mph zone with a broken taillight and an unregistered dog and pleaded down each charge to the misdemeanor version of the crime, you can still eventually get yourself a concealed carry permit in Florida.
They make it pretty easy for violent and repeat offenders. We all know how short those sentences can be especially with good behavior.
Just keep taking those plea deals.

https://bja.ojp.gov/sites/g/files/xyckuh186/files/media/document/PleaBargainingResearchSummary.pdf

While there are no exact estimates of the proportion of cases that are resolved through plea bargaining, scholars estimate that about 90 to 95 percent of both federal and state court cases are resolved through this process (Bureau of Justice Statistics)

Disqualifying Conditions / Eligibility Requirements / Applying for a Concealed Weapon License / Concealed Weapon License / Consumer Rights and Responsibilities / Consumer Resources / Home - Florida Department of Agriculture & Consumer Services

If you have been convicted or found guilty of a misdemeanor crime of violence, you are not eligible for a Concealed Weapon or Firearm License unless a period of three years has elapsed since probation.

Eligibility Requirements / Applying for a Concealed Weapon License / Concealed Weapon License / Consumer Resources / Home - Florida Department of Agriculture & Consumer Services

What disqualifies you from concealed carry in Florida?

Failing to provide proof of proficiency with a firearm. Having been issued a domestic violence injunction or an injunction against repeat violence that is currently in force. Renouncement of U.S. citizenship. A dishonorable discharge from the armed forces.

 

[scriabina]

If ALL of the above is true, why no arrests?

Why would these 3 people follow her if there was nothing to the accident:? I don't get that at all.

Argument from incredulity, also known as argument from personal incredulity, appeal to common sense, or the divine fallacy,[1] is a fallacy in informal logic. It asserts that a proposition must be false because it contradicts one's personal expectations or beliefs, or is difficult to imagine.

Arguments from incredulity can take the form:

1. I cannot imagine how F could be true; therefore F must be false.
2. I cannot imagine how F could be false; therefore F must be true.

 

[everybodhi]

Argument from incredulity, also known as argument from personal incredulity, appeal to common sense, or the divine fallacy,[1] is a fallacy in informal logic. It asserts that a proposition must be false because it contradicts one's personal expectations or beliefs, or is difficult to imagine.

Arguments from incredulity can take the form:

1. I cannot imagine how F could be true; therefore F must be false.
2. I cannot imagine how F could be false; therefore F must be true.

Of all the sites, what regular websleuths member can’t think of a few cases where a person committed a criminal act and was not charged, pleaded down to lessor charges, had charges dropped, was released early, and all of that repeatedly?
It happens everyday.
Or when you read the most atrocious, senseless crime that cannot be ignored and then their background can be discussed per TOS and everyone says.. “OMG, why did they keep letting him off so easy, why wasn’t he in prison serving his sentence? This could have been prevented, everything he got away with emboldened him and then he escalated”, I’ve read it on so many threads.
I guess we’re not there yet, I guess it seems perfectly fine if someone follows us home and fires 8 shots at us over a fender bender that’s not even bent.
And people opine over such senseless and tragic deaths that you shouldn’t have tried to protect yourself and your unborn child and family at your own home in this frightening situation or you would still be alive.
And her shooter can continue to carry a concealed weapon, no problem, unless he gets a felony charge one day that he can not plead down to a misdemeanor.

 

[everybodhi]

I'd like to hear what the other witnesses had to say about that. Maybe she was pointing it specifically at the guy who shot her?

The police were not there so all their statements are based on what Derr and the witnesses who arrived with him told the cops and apparently they say she pointed the gun at them.

Police release 911 calls from shooting of Volusia library assistant after hit-and-run crash

“Police say Morales pointed her gun at Derr and the witnesses, at which point Derr drew his own handgun and shot her multiple times.”

 

[everybodhi]

I haven’t been able to find any criminal background on Sara, only love and admiration expressed by those who knew her.

Volusia libraries close to grieve death of library assistant shot, killed after hit-and-run crash

“The temporary closures are necessary to provide library staff time to cope with the stages of grief having lost one of their caring library assistants, Sara Morales, who died tragically,” the news release said. “Volusia County Library staff are a close family, whose close and compassionate relationships are deeply affected by Sara’s death.”

“Our immediate concern is for the welfare of Sara’s family, her library colleagues, and all of our county employees,” said Volusia County Deputy Manager Suzanne Konchan in a statement. “We are all shaken up by the incident. As we grieve the loss of one of our own, we stand together in wholeheartedly supporting one another during this difficult time.”

“Sara was well-liked by patrons and staff for her upbeat personality,” said Regional Librarian Ann Collins in a statement. “She was kind, hardworking, a team player and always ready to help.”

 

[wendybtn]

Wendy, please check the information because Sara called 911.

Wendy, did you catch the video where one of the motorcycles is on Sara's front porch? That suggests that one of the motorcycle male bikers tried to get inside her house. There were three motorcycles in total.

Personally, I think very very few women would remain on the accident scene with a motorcycle gang. I wouldn't and would not want my mother or sister to remain.

I usually don't watch bystander videos because they do not capture all of an event and are often edited by news stations. And no,I was not aware this lady drove her car into a motorcycle gang.

 

[wendybtn]

Yikes, that seems harsh. You legally can’t just exchange insurance information after a fender bender and go on with your day? Even if there isn’t any damage?

Edit:
Found this information about Florida law. It is not always necessary to call police after an accident.

Do You Have to Call Police After Car Accident?
As with most legal questions, the answer is — it depends. Florida Statutes section 316.066 establishes when it’s required to obtain a written police report when you’re involved in a car crash. Specifically, it states that — under certain circumstances — a long-form should be completed and submitted to the police department within 10 days after an investigation is completed by the law enforcement officer who investigated the scene of the accident. For this rule to apply, the car accident must fall under one of the following categories:

• Any of the drivers involved were under the influence of drugs or alcohol
• Any of the motor vehicles involved were totaled or had to be towed
• Someone involved in the accident is complaining of pain or discomfort
• A commercial motor vehicle was involved
• There was a fatality (death) at the scene
• 
  Do You Always Have to Call the Police After a Car Accident? - Clark Law

A fender-bender is one type of incident. Leaving the scene as a primary aggressor is a felony. And I live in Tennessee, not Florida.

 

[darring21]

A fender-bender is one type of incident. Leaving the scene as a primary aggressor is a felony. And I live in Tennessee, not Florida.

If you leave the scene of an accident that only involved property damage, you may be charged with a second-degree misdemeanor and, if convicted, you could face as many as 60 days in jail and a $500 fine.

Leaving the Scene of an Accident in Florida - Traffic Attorneys - The Law Place

 

[moonriverfarm]

News sources have posted that there was NO DAMAGE to his precious motorcycle or his body from her "running into him".
There is absolutely NO EXCUSE for him killing her. ZERO.

 

[Gardenista]

Me too. Her mom says she wasn’t pointing the gun at him or them. Listening to her 911 call she arrives home, exits her car and is shot dead. It’s just a matter of seconds.

If you listen to the 911 call, the unidentified guy says they are talking to a lady at the scene. Since they didn't charge him, it seems like her account must have matched the shooter's.

 

[SuziQ]

Well that’s a good question, vengeance?
Hot headed?
There are photos of his bike in her yard and bodycam video of him, he had no problems driving it to her house and no injury that I can see.

And to clarify concealed carry law in Florida, you can have a criminal record including violence, just no felonies, pleading down to misdemeanors works and even an extensive record does not apply after 3 years of serving your sentence.
So, for instance, if you have a charge of theft, assault and fleeing and evading LE with no drivers license going 95 in a 50mph zone with a broken taillight and an unregistered dog and pleaded down each charge to the misdemeanor version of the crime, you can still eventually get yourself a concealed carry permit in Florida.
They make it pretty easy for violent and repeat offenders. We all know how short those sentences can be especially with good behavior.
Just keep taking those plea deals.

https://bja.ojp.gov/sites/g/files/xyckuh186/files/media/document/PleaBargainingResearchSummary.pdf

While there are no exact estimates of the proportion of cases that are resolved through plea bargaining, scholars estimate that about 90 to 95 percent of both federal and state court cases are resolved through this process (Bureau of Justice Statistics)

Disqualifying Conditions / Eligibility Requirements / Applying for a Concealed Weapon License / Concealed Weapon License / Consumer Rights and Responsibilities / Consumer Resources / Home - Florida Department of Agriculture & Consumer Services

If you have been convicted or found guilty of a misdemeanor crime of violence, you are not eligible for a Concealed Weapon or Firearm License unless a period of three years has elapsed since probation.

Eligibility Requirements / Applying for a Concealed Weapon License / Concealed Weapon License / Consumer Resources / Home - Florida Department of Agriculture & Consumer Services

What disqualifies you from concealed carry in Florida?

Failing to provide proof of proficiency with a firearm. Having been issued a domestic violence injunction or an injunction against repeat violence that is currently in force. Renouncement of U.S. citizenship. A dishonorable discharge from the armed forces.

I keep seeing it mentioned that this bike was in her yard. I have seen the pic, but is there a link even saying it was his bike?

 

[SuziQ]

News sources have posted that there was NO DAMAGE to his precious motorcycle or his body from her "running into him".
There is absolutely NO EXCUSE for him killing her. ZERO.

Apparently, she was shot because she pulled a gun on the men. We might find out differently later on. But the official statement is she was shot for pulling a gun on someone. You don't leave the scene of an accident because that is illegal. You don't leave the scene of an accident and then pull a gun on someone because that is how you get shot. What was legal to do, is for the victim of the accident to follow her. Probably not smart, but it is legal.

Moo.

 

[neesaki]

Apparently, she was shot because she pulled a gun on the men. We might find out differently later on. But the official statement is she was shot for pulling a gun on someone. You don't leave the scene of an accident because that is illegal. You don't leave the scene of an accident and then pull a gun on someone because that is how you get shot. What was legal to do, is for the victim of the accident to follow her. Probably not smart, but it is legal.

Moo.

I am a little behind, but if she pulled a gun on them and pointed at them , it sounds like their lives were in imminent danger. As in, they thought she was going to shoot. Self defense has to be initiated when one believes their life is in danger, and before it’s too late.
I’m guessing she didn’t realize they were armed, so maybe she thought she could intimidate them into leaving. Maybe she never planned to pull the trigger. But they had to assume she did. Jmo

I need to go back and see if I’m missing something.

 

[neesaki]

I can’t find a 911 call recording from SM. Did she not call 911?

 

[steeltowngirl]

Apparently, she was shot because she pulled a gun on the men. We might find out differently later on. But the official statement is she was shot for pulling a gun on someone. You don't leave the scene of an accident because that is illegal. You don't leave the scene of an accident and then pull a gun on someone because that is how you get shot. What was legal to do, is for the victim of the accident to follow her. Probably not smart, but it is legal.

Moo.

Can you please cite the legality of following a driver who has left the scene of an accident? This is just a quick Google search leading to a lawyer site, but it says:

“Leaving the scene of an accident is a serious offense. Drivers who do so face harsh penalties. If you are involved in an accident and the driver leaves the scene, you should not follow them. You should neither leave the scene, as this will lower your chances of getting justice. Take notes of the incident, record a police statement, and contact your insurance provider.”

What to Do if the Driver Leaves the Scene? - LamberGoodnow

 

[cvaldez1975]

No, that's his bike in the video and the guy on the 911 call didn't even know his name, so they weren't friends.

no, im talking about the bike on the porch. and the guy on 911 possibly did know him.

 

[Sarahlou]

I can’t find a 911 call recording from SM. Did she not call 911?

Yes she did. Her call is in the video in this link.

Police release 911 calls from shooting of Volusia library assistant after hit-and-run crash

 

[cvaldez1975]

I can’t find a 911 call recording from SM. Did she not call 911?

yes she did and its a few pages back.

 

[steeltowngirl]

Yes she did. Her call is in the video in this link.

Police release 911 calls from shooting of Volusia library assistant after hit-and-run crash

In the last few seconds of the video in the linked article the reporter says “The autopsy results on her pregnancy were inconclusive.”

What in the heck does that mean? They couldn’t confirm she was pregnant?

 

[oviedo]

In the last few seconds of the video in the linked article the reporter says “The autopsy results on her pregnancy were inconclusive.”

What in the heck does that mean? They couldn’t confirm she was pregnant?

It's very odd IMO. This whole situation still seems to be something more "involved..." -
JMO