"G (Guilty)" vs "NG (Not Guilty)" Where do you stand? #2

[Patty G]

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[The Eunice Burns]

fftopic: When bolding other members posts or copying and pasting other posts PLEASE make sure you the "quote" at the end of the sentence has not been deleted. Also DO NOT bold beyond the end of the sentence into the end quote Always preview bolded or copied posts of others before submitting. When posts are previewed it saves the MODS time in having to edit them. fftopic: Thank you.

I don't know if you were referring to my quoting... But if you go back in the thread...

I may have put a broken quote in my OT post. But the way you edited it, you reversed what Leila and I said. She posted the alert about the Peterson's appeal, and I responded with: For 95K! And then went on to try and steer it into being on topic by saying I could see the As doing that in the future. But, I didn't want to undo what you did and complicate things futher....But in editing this, I may have screwed up anyway!

 

[Patty G]

I don't know if you were referring to my quoting... But if you go back in the thread...

I may have put a broken quote in my OT post. But the way you edited it, you reversed what Leila and I said. She posted the alert about the Peterson's appeal, and I responded with: For 95K! And then went on to try and steer it into being on topic by saying I could see the As doing that in the future. But, I didn't want to undo what you did and complicate things futher....But in editing this, I may have screwed up anyway!

I fixed it.

 

[milliac]

Just wanted to thank everyone for such insightful posts. I don't post often (mostly because I read from my IPod touch, and it's a pain to use this touch screen keyboard) This has been truly facinating. I'm hooked!

 

[DotsEyes]

Oh sure, KC was so upset over the gapping mouth of her dead child, she taped it shut and put a heart on top. But she wasn't too upset to double bag her and toss her into the swampy woods behind the house so the animals could eat her body.

The tape was on TIGHT. It stayed on and kept the jaw attached to the skull despite the fact that the child remains were scattered like confetti.

Give me and Caylee a break. Her mother murdered her and never looked back. I don't care why she did it, she did it. She needs to be imprisoned for life without benefit of parole, probation or commutation of sentence. She is a nut job and is dangerous.

 

[doogiesgirl]

Oh sure, KC was so upset over the gapping mouth of her dead child, she taped it shut and put a heart on top. But she wasn't too upset to double bag her and toss her into the swampy woods behind the house so the animals could eat her body.

The tape was on TIGHT. It stayed on and kept the jaw attached to the skull despite the fact that the child remains were scattered like confetti.

Give me and Caylee a break. Her mother murdered her and never looked back. I don't care why she did it, she did it. She needs to be imprisoned for life without benefit of parole, probation or commutation of sentence. She is a nut job and is dangerous.

:laugh:Oh sure, KC was so upset over the gapping mouth of her dead child, she taped it shut and put a heart on top. But she wasn't too upset to double bag her and toss her into the swampy woods behind the house so the animals could eat her body. (Above is DotsEyes quote)

Ok I know, I know, this is not a funny subject, believe me I know, but this response is. LOL This is such a great response DotsEyes, and so true. You go girl! (No offense meant to whoever's post she's responding to.) JMO

 

[marspiter]

I don't think - as I'm sure many others here think also - that you have any reason to worry or have deep concern, Princess Rose.

Regardless of what happens in her murder trial, she will be spending YEARS in prison on the fraud charges alone. And many years for neglecting Caylee in the murder trial, no matter what charges she ends up being convicted of. And she will be convicted of something.

She will NEVER EVER (Repeat: NEVER EVER) have a normal life. Even if she eventually got out of prison - which many here highly doubt, I think - she will forever be looked at harshly, pointed at, laughed at, and probably even spit upon. :crazy:

Her life, as she envisioned it, is over - 100% due to her own actions and words.

That and like uncle Charlie (Charles Manson) it maybe dangerous for her when she is released. Allot of strange people would like the notoriety of killing said individuals. Kinda like people wanting credit for killing famous gunmen of the old west. Lets face it this case has created some pretty passionate debate and polarization in the public. If she's not convicted of murder and then released it's very possible something would happen. Not condoning vigilante behavior (I believe it undermines the ideals of justice our fore fathers had in writing our laws) just saying its a very real possibility.

 

[TinaD]

I have to vote "premeditated". The duct tape does it for me. The only way I could reasonably accept that it was applied after death to stem "leakage" *shudder* is if there was also tape on Caylee's ears, eyes and between her legs. And we've heard nothing to that effect.

By the by, doesn't this quote that Lin has in her signature give it all away??

"Casey's attorney said it's not in her best interest to tell what she knows about where Caylee is. "It does her no good to show her cards to give the prosecution any advantage they have to put her away for life," Baez said."

So from this, you have to conclude that Casey knew something?? Otherwise, the statement makes no sense. So much for the invisinanny huh JB???

 

[tweety933]

31 things that would convince me that little miss Casey; unemployed, unmarried, and trapped; killed off her little snot head (intentionally) to have a beautiful life.

1. Caylee was dead before on or before 6/30 because her decomposing hair was found in the trunk of the Pontiac which had been towed from AMSCOT on that date. (See FBI hair analysis)
2. The last person seen with Caylee alive was Casey Anthony, by her grandfather George Anthony on 6/16/08. (See George Anthony statement)
3. Therefore Caylee died sometime between 6/16 and 6/30. (See George Anthony statement, tow truck driver interview, and tow lot owner statement)
4. Casey reported to have heard from Caylee on 7/15……obviously a lie due to physical evidence. (See Casey statement)
5. Casey lied to investigators who were looking for her missing daughter. (See Casey statement, fictitious names etc at universal statement.)
6. Caylee's death was a homicide (See medical examiners report)
7. Caylee’s body was disposed of close to her home, and near the time of death, (See Jail video/transcript…close to home statement, crime scene photos, and botanical evidence)
8. Caylee’s skull was found with duct tape across her nose and mouth and adhering to her hair. This duct tape is the same duct tape found on the gas can at the Anthony house. (Show evidence photos)
9. Caylee’s remains were discarded in a laundry tote that is the same brand as a laundry tote in the Anthony home. (Show evidence photos)
10. Caylee’s remains were found with a Winnie the Pooh blanket that was missing/ matched the crib set from her home. (Show evidence photos)
11. Casey was a pathological liar, who premeditated Caylee's demise by making up a nanny named Zanny months prior to Caylees death (show witness statements & Jesse Grund DNA report on Caylee, Universal employment records)
12. Casey was a thief (show witness statements, Target, Bank of America, and Winn Dixie and grandma Plesea),
13. Casey was sexually active and had a very active social life and no job to support herself (see volumes of text and phone calls, and internet usage).
14. Casey was irresponsible with her sexuality, evidenced by her not having Caylees’ father identified or involved in her life, and the Brandon miscarriage.
15. Casey was educationally impaired, with no H.S. diploma or GED.
16. Casey’s boyfriend told her he only wanted to have boys, if he had any children.
17. Casey was jealous of her mother’s relationship with Caylee. (Show Cindy Anthony My caylees missing post & witness statements)
18. Casey had high hopes of her parents separating and divorcing.
19. Casey got a tattoo with “Bella Vida” on it, weeks after Caylee died.
20. Casey smelled something dead in/on her car (see text messages)
21. Casey broke into the family storage shed and stole gasoline without her parents permission. (See Tony L. interview, and police Report)
22. Casey lied to her family about her pregnancy with Caylee ( Rick Plesea)…she was ashamed of being pregnant.
23. Casey told her friend she wanted to put Caylee up for adoption but her parents wouldn’t let her (Kio Marie Kruz)
24. Casey had a lover/s whom would not accept Caylee’s presence during their time together. (NY italiano3, and Caylee couldn’t spend night at Tony’s)
25. Casey was more like a sister to Caylee than a mother.
26. None of Caylee’s belongings were found with Casey at Tony’s were she’d been living.
27. None of the purchases related to Casey had any application to supplying for little Caylee.
28. Casey told NO ONE of Caylee’s death.
29. Casey insisted Caylee was alive until her little skeleton was discovered
30. Casey was always uncooperative in the search for Caylee.
31. Casey blamed an anonymous Hispanic person for kidnapping Caylee . BTW, her mother Cindy was racially predjudiced against Hispanics (see KioMarie Kruz statement)

 

[AZlawyer]

31 things that would convince me that little miss Casey; unemployed, unmarried, and trapped; killed off her little snot head (intentionally) to have a beautiful life.

1. Caylee was dead before on or before 6/30 because her decomposing hair was found in the trunk of the Pontiac which had been towed from AMSCOT on that date. (See FBI hair analysis)
2. The last person seen with Caylee alive was Casey Anthony, by her grandfather George Anthony on 6/16/08. (See George Anthony statement)
3. Therefore Caylee died sometime between 6/16 and 6/30. (See George Anthony statement, tow truck driver interview, and tow lot owner statement)
4. Casey reported to have heard from Caylee on 7/15……obviously a lie due to physical evidence. (See Casey statement)
5. Casey lied to investigators who were looking for her missing daughter. (See Casey statement, fictitious names etc at universal statement.)
6. Caylee was murdered (See medical examiners report)
7. Caylee’s body was disposed of close to her home, and near the time of death, (See Jail video/transcript…close to home statement, crime scene photos, and botanical evidence)
8. Caylee’s skull was found with duct tape across her nose and mouth and adhering to her hair. This duct tape is the same duct tape found on the gas can at the Anthony house. (Show evidence photos)
9. Caylee’s remains were discarded in a laundry tote that is the same brand as a laundry tote in the Anthony home. (Show evidence photos)
10. Caylee’s remains were found with a Winnie the Pooh blanket that was missing/ matched the crib set from her home. (Show evidence photos)
11. Casey was a pathological liar. (show witness statements & Jesse Grund DNA report on Caylee, Universal employment records)
12. Casey was a thief (show witness statements, Target, Bank of America, and Winn Dixie and grandma Plesea),
13. Casey was sexually active and had a very active social life and no job to support herself (see volumes of text and phone calls, and internet usage).
14. Casey was irresponsible with her sexuality, evidenced by her not having Caylees’ father identified or involved in her life, and the Brandon miscarriage.
15. Casey was educationally impaired, with no H.S. diploma or GED.
16. Casey’s boyfriend told her he only wanted to have boys, if he had any children.
17. Casey was jealous of her mother’s relationship with Caylee. (Show Cindy Anthony My caylees missing post & witness statements)
18. Casey had high hopes of her parents separating and divorcing.
19. Casey got a tattoo with “Bella Vida” on it, weeks after Caylee died.
20. Casey smelled something dead in/on her car (see text messages)
21. Casey broke into the family storage shed and stole gasoline without her parents permission. (See Tony L. interview, and police Report)
22. Casey lied to her family about her pregnancy with Caylee ( Rick Plesea)…she was ashamed of being pregnant.
23. Casey told her friend she wanted to put Caylee up for adoption but her parents wouldn’t let her (Kio Marie Kruz)
24. Casey had a lover/s whom would not accept Caylee’s presence during their time together. (NY italiano3, and Caylee couldn’t spend night at Tony’s)
25. Casey was more like a sister to Caylee than a mother.
26. None of Caylee’s belongings were found with Casey at Tony’s were she’d been living.
27. None of the purchases related to Casey had any application to supplying for little Caylee.
28. Casey told NO ONE of Caylee’s death.
29. Casey insisted Caylee was alive until her little skeleton was discovered
30. Casey was always uncooperative in the search for Caylee.
31. Casey blamed an anonymous Hispanic person for kidnapping Caylee . BTW, her mother Cindy was racially predjudiced against Hispanics (see KioMarie Kruz statement)

Re #6: The medical examiner's report said that Caylee died of homicide, not that she was murdered...which is important because the term "homicide" includes a wide range of killings, some of which are criminal (like murder) and some of which are not (like excusable homicide resulting from a non-negligent accident).

 

[tweety933]

The duct tape was evidence that it was a homicide, but apparently it can't be deduced that that tape was not put there by accident, thereby it couldn't be evidence of murder as well? Or could it? I'd say whomever put that tape over that baby's mouth was pretty negligent! JMHO

 

[tweety933]

The duct tape was evidence that it was a homicide, but apparently it can't be deduced that that tape was not put there by accident, thereby it couldn't be evidence of murder as well? Or could it? I'd say whomever put that tape over that baby's mouth was pretty negligent! JMHO

The thought just occured to me that Caylee may have put the duct tape all over her mouth and nose, and because it was in her hair she couldn't get it off, and BAM, she killed herself accidently. HOW SAD.... It could happen!

 

[DotsEyes]

Well, of course, the almost 3 year old Caylee ripped strips from a roll of duck tape, wrapped it around her own head, slapped on a heart sticker, hid the left over roll of tape such that it would never be found, then slid into a couple of plastic bags and jumped into her mother's locked car trunk.

No. KC murdered her child and was canoodling with the beau du jour before the body had cooled down.

 

[Tuffy]

The thought just occured to me that Caylee may have put the duct tape all over her mouth and nose, and because it was in her hair she couldn't get it off, and BAM, she killed herself accidently. HOW SAD.... It could happen!

This sounds highly unlikely to me. Keep in mind that we have not seen the photos showing the placement of the several strips of duct tape that were layered over her nose and mouth, then into her hair.

I can't see a toddler having the strength and coordination to put the tape on in such a way that 1) it would stay put throughout the decomp process 2) it would not look accidental to an experienced and thorough ME.

I mean, did Caylee pull this off so well that it fooled Dr. G into believing homocide?

 

[Tuffy]

The duct tape was evidence that it was a homicide, but apparently it can't be deduced that that tape was not put there by accident, thereby it couldn't be evidence of murder as well? Or could it? I'd say whomever put that tape over that baby's mouth was pretty negligent! JMHO

BBM:

No, you are correct, tweety. It can be deduced that the tape was not put there by accident. The ME called the death a "homicide" not murder, though. I think that was the only point that was being corrected.

 

[legalmania]

Within moments of dying a person's mouth gapes open. It's very disturbing and shocking to see someone like this. The duct tape was put on strongly enough to hold Caylee's mandible in place even after decomposition which indicates to me that holding the mandible in place may be the actual reason for the duct tape. I think that the heart shaped sticker actually indicates that Casey was trying to fix this problem. I don't think Casey had ever been around someone who died (all of her grandparents are aparently alive) and I suspect she would be unaware that normally the mandible is closed after death with a headband that goes under the chin and around the top of the head.

The other part of this is twofold:

1. The duct tape was put on the front of Caylee's face only - not wrapped around the back of her head.
That indicates to me that Caylee was probably on her back when the duct tape was applied.
2. The duct tape was put on in several strips that were layered.
If Caylee were alive and thrashing about because she couldn't breathe, it would be very difficult to layer the duct tape with additional pieces and place the heart shaped sticker.

For all these reasons, I believe it was put on immediately following Caylee's death.

I have to agree with you Princess Rose for the following reasons in the Huck case:

1. The victim had white duct tape over her mouth, nose and eyes.
2. Her hands were bound with rope.
3. Something was used to weigh her down, in the water.
4. The ME found no evidence that she was bound ante-mortem or post
mortem.
5. The victim was found nude.

I also believe when Casey found Caylee with her mouth open and she couldn't close it because rigor mortis was setting in, she used duct tape and a heart. In my opinion I believe it was part of her mental illness, most of us can't understand. I think Caylees eyes were closed. This is JMO.

Here is the entire case:

http://www.5dca.org/Opinions/Opin2004/071204/5D03-1906.op.pdf

 

[lizzysf]

If you pay me for an interview, i'll answer the question.. lol.


GUILTY. Ab-sho-lutely!

 

[Jolynna]

I have to agree with you Princess Rose for the following reasons in the Huck case:

1. The victim had white duct tape over her mouth, nose and eyes.
2. Her hands were bound with rope.
3. Something was used to weigh her down, in the water.
4. The ME found no evidence that she was bound ante-mortem or post
mortem.
5. The victim was found nude.

I also believe when Casey found Caylee with her mouth open and she couldn't close it because rigor mortis was setting in, she used duct tape and a heart. In my opinion I believe it was part of her mental illness, most of us can't understand. I think Caylees eyes were closed. This is JMO.

Here is the entire case:

http://www.5dca.org/Opinions/Opin2004/071204/5D03-1906.op.pdf

The determination of the higher court which reviewed Huck's case is that it is not reasonable or logical to put duct tape over another human mouth except to make the other human stop screaming or breathing. I challenge anyone to find even ONE instance of a defendant successfully using the excuse that the "duct taping" happened after death.

Defendants, Brent Huck, Florida; Brookey West, Nevada and Kenneth Padgett, Alaska, tried to say it happened that way. The victim's cause of death in Huck's and West's cases could not conclusively be determined in any of the above cases because of decompostion. (West's victim was found 3 years after death.) Padgett's victim, like Caylee, wasn't found for months, but because of the tape, the medical examiner ruled death by suffocation. West said she'd panicked after her victim's death and didn't report it. She'd tied plastic over her victim's mouth as a shroud to keep her mouth closed. Padgett said he panicked over his victim's death because he had an outstanding warrant. He taped over his victim's mouth and nose after her death so he wouldn't have to look at her. None of the juries bought Huck's, West's or Padgett's explanations and all three were convicted of 1st Degree Murder. http://peninsulaclarion.com/stories/010602/ala_010602ala0100001.shtml, http://www.nytimes.com/2009/05/12/science/12file-fly.html

I challenge anyone to find a single, just one, instance of a parent in this century taping over their child's mouth and nose for any reason except to kill the baby.

moo

 

[MissJames]

I have to agree with you Princess Rose for the following reasons in the Huck case:

1. The victim had white duct tape over her mouth, nose and eyes.
2. Her hands were bound with rope.
3. Something was used to weigh her down, in the water.
4. The ME found no evidence that she was bound ante-mortem or post
mortem.
5. The victim was found nude.

I also believe when Casey found Caylee with her mouth open and she couldn't close it because rigor mortis was setting in, she used duct tape and a heart. In my opinion I believe it was part of her mental illness, most of us can't understand. I think Caylees eyes were closed. This is JMO.

Here is the entire case:

http://www.5dca.org/Opinions/Opin2004/071204/5D03-1906.op.pdf

Why is it easier to imagine that KC put duct tape on Caylee after she died instead of before? Putting it on to stop her screaming and or breathing just makes a lot more sense to me. i think it will to the jury,also.JMO
ETA: There is NO EVIDENCE that KC has a mental illness.Even the defense has not gone there.

 

[MyTinkieGirl]

The determination of the higher court in the Huck case was that it is not reasonable or logical to put duct tape over another human mouth except to make the other human stop screaming or breathing. I challenge anyone to find even ONE instance of a defendant successfully using the excuse that the "duct taping" happened after death.

Defendants, Brent Huck, Florida; Brookey West, Nevada and Kenneth Padgett, Alaska, tried to say it happened that way. The victim's cause of death in Huck's and West's cases could not conclusively be determined in any of the above cases because of decompostion. (West's victim was found 3 years after death.) Padgett's victim, like Caylee, wasn't found for months, but because of the tape, the medical examiner ruled death by suffocation. West said she'd panicked after her victim's death and didn't report it. She'd tied plastic over her victim's mouth as a shroud to keep her mouth closed. Padgett said he panicked over his victim's death because he had an outstanding warrant. He taped over his victim's mouth and nose after her death so he wouldn't have to look at her. None of the juries bought Huck's, West's or Padgett's explanations and all three were convicted of 1st Degree Murder. http://peninsulaclarion.com/stories/010602/ala_010602ala0100001.shtml, http://www.nytimes.com/2009/05/12/science/12file-fly.html

I challenge anyone to find a single, just one, instance of a parent in this century taping over their child's mouth and nose except to kill the baby.

moo

Great post...I guess to think about it....I've read some of the posts about rigor setting in and the mouth being open....and that something is usually put under the chin, up to the top of the head to keep the mouth closed.
IMO, the duct tape might have been needed to be put in the same manner to keep little Caylee's mouth closed, IF it was used, in fact, to keep her mouth closed....IMO, it would be put beneath her chin and up, etc - horrible to have to evaluate it that way.
OR...at least wrapped AROUND the head, not just over the mouth...and not just two pieces...again, just my thoughts about it. NEVER done that, so I'll never know. I don't know if we'll ever really know...BUT, I DO agree that by the looks of it, I'd have to deduce that the "reasonable" use of the tape in that way, in that area, that it was put in that manner to cause death via suffocation.

ETA : Guilty