GA - Katherine Janness, 40, fatally stabbed and dog killed, Piedmont Park, Atlanta, 28 Jul 2021 #3

[dotr]

Tree branch stories. Fwiw.
Police: Man dies in tree branch assault, murder charge to be sought against alleged attacker | KGET 17
2019
''BAKERSFIELD, Calif. (KGET) — A man charged with assault in connection with beating and seriously injuring another man with a tree branch now faces a murder charge because the victim has died, according to police''
California tree trimmer charged in deadly throat-slashings
2021
''OROVILLE, CALIF. -- A tree trimmer in rural Northern California has been charged in throat-slashing serial killings that left three people dead, prosecutors announced Thursday.''

Murder of Suzanne Marie Collins - Wikipedia
''On the evening of July 11, 1985, Suzanne Marie Collins was abducted while jogging on the base, and was taken to nearby Edmund Orgill Park. There, the kidnapper severely beat Collins, fracturing her skull, before repeatedly shoving a tree limb up her vagina with enough force to penetrate her abdomen and tear one of her lungs. The autopsy would state that Collins died from blunt force trauma to the head and internal hemorrhaging from the tree limb''
Dover NJ man accused of killing man with tree branch
''Dover man, accused of beating victim to death with a tree branch, backs out of plea deal''

https://graphics.chicagotribune.com/james-jordan-murder/index.html
''Jordan wound up in a South Carolina swamp, his dead body draped over a tree limb. Green and Demery wound up with life sentences for first-degree murder.''

 

[PrairieWind]

On the issue of DNA, they may have a useable sample or samples but there is no match in the system for a known suspect. In an earlier thread it was discussed when and on which crimes Georgia collects (or doesn't collect ) DNA from arrestees. Iirc misdemeanor arrests (and maybe even some convictions?) don't allow DNA samples to be collected, and iirc again there might be certain felonies that can only take an individual's DNA if convicted.

All of this to point our that just because we aren't seeing visible progress and don't have an arrest doesn't mean no DNA.

Is anyone aware of any crimes committed recently where genetic genealogy has been used to successfully help identify a suspect? I only hear about cold cases that have been solved this way.

I think the concern is that, if they did have a DNA sample that they believed was from the killer, even if it didn't match anyone in the system, they could still use that profile to start eliminating people, ie, Emma, the jogger, any of the other people that they may have identified in the park. But saying they haven't eliminated anyone makes me wonder if there is no usable DNA.

 

[AtlantaBourne]

A necropsy was performed on Bowie per LE. Emma stated in her interview w/MSM that she saw Bowie first and thought he was a trash bag. She stated she picked him up & thought he had been hit by a car at first. I would think her DNA would definitely be on Bowie & his on her. Also Emma stated upon finding Katie she touched her face w/her hands & checked for a pulse but she was already gone. So I would think the same about DNA from Katie being on Emma & possibly visa versa. Joe Clark is who IR stating first that Bowie, as well as Katie, fought the murderer & that Bowie was definitely protecting Katie. This was stated by him at the vigil at CA & 10th and again in the interview with Emma. He also stated at the vigil that there was DNA found on Bowie. I don't recall LE ever stating any of this.

 

[Shellinaya]

A necropsy was performed on Bowie per LE. Emma stated in her interview w/MSM that she saw Bowie first and thought he was a trash bag. She stated she picked him up & thought he had been hit by a car at first. I would think her DNA would definitely be on Bowie & his on her. Also Emma stated upon finding Katie she touched her face w/her hands & checked for a pulse but she was already gone. So I would think the same about DNA from Katie being on Emma & possibly visa versa. Joe Clark is who IR stating first that Bowie, as well as Katie, fought the murderer & that Bowie was definitely protecting Katie. This was stated by him at the vigil at CA & 10th and again in the interview with Emma. He also stated at the vigil that there was DNA found on Bowie. I don't recall LE ever stating any of this.

I don't think Joe Clark is a reliable expert on facts in this case, Just my opinion.

DNA on or in Bowie could be from anything. Like my dog will eat random things on the ground when we are walking. I have pulled some very gross things from my dog's mouth that she finds on walks! I'm sure LE is taking that into account. If they find human DNA that's another story, but would Joe Clark have known that at the time of the vigil?

One more thing on the CBS46 reporter's story and tweet yesterday. There was a full Atlanta PD press conference on September 2nd about a variety of topics. At about 16:14 in the video, the police chief talks about the Katie case, and again at about 34:04 he is asked another question

At that point he says something that the reporter did not include in her TV report. He says,

"It is still an open case. No one is ruled out. We've not focused in on any particular person. It's still an open case."

He also repeated that people should be vigilant when out. If they had someone in mind that they were watching, why would he say to still be vigilant? IMO - they do not yet have a suspect. He basically said that.

Video here:

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He also talked about the cameras being still worked on for more images. I don't think they have much to go on yet. IMO. I did not hear him talk about DNA - they might have but I could have missed it.

 

[TL4S]

A necropsy was performed on Bowie per LE. Emma stated in her interview w/MSM that she saw Bowie first and thought he was a trash bag. She stated she picked him up & thought he had been hit by a car at first. I would think her DNA would definitely be on Bowie & his on her. Also Emma stated upon finding Katie she touched her face w/her hands & checked for a pulse but she was already gone. So I would think the same about DNA from Katie being on Emma & possibly visa versa. Joe Clark is who IR stating first that Bowie, as well as Katie, fought the murderer & that Bowie was definitely protecting Katie. This was stated by him at the vigil at CA & 10th and again in the interview with Emma. He also stated at the vigil that there was DNA found on Bowie. I don't recall LE ever stating any of this.

You're right. Bowie could have had DNA on him, even inside his mouth, for just about anyone he had recent contact with: Katie, Emma, anyone at Henry's or on their walk that might have petted Bowie, or been licked, jumped on, etc. I think it would have been clear if Bowie had bitten somebody, though, and that DNA would be on his teeth, in his injuries, etc. Hoping!

 

[Shellinaya]

Another observation about the tree limb, imo, is that it does not appear to be covered in any way while inside the back of the LE van. I'm not well-versed in crime scene collection, but I would assume if the tree limb was suspected of containing DNA or other such forensic evidence, it would not be placed inside that vehicle, with the potential of touching all surfaces within, without some kind of protective covering to avoid contamination. Jmo.

https://mobile.twitter.com/ZacOnTV/status/1421228472748417027

Good point, if the tree limb was considered evidence, they were not treating it that way by loading it up uncovered like that. It could be they were just picking up the tree limb to get rid of it. A killer in that park would not need to sit on a tree limb to hide or surprise someone. It was very dark at that spot in the park and plenty of trees to just hide behind. You can't really pick up a tree limb that size and attack someone with it. It was pretty big and way too clumsy to use as a weapon, IMO.

 

[Atlmom]

They must believe the killer(s) were in view of one or more of the park cameras— OR they want the killer to think they were on camera. Notice he didn’t mention what evidence they might have obtained from the fully functional city cameras. .

@FonescaFan, I agree with you. It’s my thought that LE is attempting to compare park camera video footage with videos obtained from neighborhood, business or city of Atlanta surveillance cameras located near the park. They may actually have more than one POI seen entering & leaving the park around the suspected time of the murder… and would like to pinpoint that person on park cameras near the murder scene, also.

JMO, but it seems with outdated park cameras, the images obtained (if there are any at all) are probably poor quality, especially since the park is so dark at night. But judging how clear the pics were of Katie & Bowie on the rainbow crosswalk and of the possible witnesses that LE was previously looking for…they may have some very good pics of people to follow up on.

 

[dotr]

Early on iirc, there was some talk about the possibility that this murder could have been gang related in some way, ie. initiation etc.
To be clear, when using labels such as gang, cartel, mafia etc, i am not necessarily referring to any one race or religion, just using a generic term to describe any group essentially composed of people who engage in criminal activity.

Just read about this incident which occurred far from Georgia, but had me thinking again about the possibility of some kind of group of criminals activity.
fwiw, imo, speculation.
2020
Kamloops man who helped carve the word ‘rat’ into flesh of victim handed 13-year prison sentence
''Kamloops man who helped carve the word ‘rat’ into flesh of victim handed 13-year prison sentence
Jeremy Bellows was among a group that offered the victim three choices of punishment: have fingers severed, have the word ‘rat’ burned into his flesh or have the word ‘rat’ carved into his flesh.''

 

[GeorgiaPeach1]

"It is still an open case. No one is ruled out. We've not focused in on any particular person. It's still an open case."

He also repeated that people should be vigilant when out. If they had someone in mind that they were watching, why would he say to still be vigilant? IMO - they do not yet have a suspect. He basically said that

Crime is really high in atlanta so it’s good advice to remind citizens to be vigilant period. This vicious crime was committed out in the open and it may have gone unnoticed by potential witnesses. People really need to pay attention to their surroundings no matter where they are or how safe they think the area is.
My boyfriend tells me to “be safe” everyday. As a homicide detective he sees the worst of the worst daily and it has become a habit for him to remind people to be careful. Prior to meeting him, I used to walk around certain areas that I thought were relatively safe carelessly until he told me how much crime that doesn’t make MSM happens in those areas.

 

[Yemelyan]

Good point, if the tree limb was considered evidence, they were not treating it that way by loading it up uncovered like that. It could be they were just picking up the tree limb to get rid of it. A killer in that park would not need to sit on a tree limb to hide or surprise someone. It was very dark at that spot in the park and plenty of trees to just hide behind. You can't really pick up a tree limb that size and attack someone with it. It was pretty big and way too clumsy to use as a weapon, IMO.

You really think they'd send the crime scene van back out to the site of a murder to pick up a tree branch just to dispose of it? Why do that when, I'm sure, there is a parks department responsible for branch removal/landscaping? I don't buy that theory at all.

I think something was found at autopsy that made them think they needed to go back and get that sample. It may not be, however, that this particular branch was an actual piece of evidence needing to be forensically preserved (as in, actually touched/used by murderer or victim). Instead they may need it to be a sample that shows or eliminates the origin of physical evidence in or near her body. Perhaps they want to show that her body was or was not moved from a different location in the park, for example, by demonstrating the similarity or dissimilarity of the plant material on or under her with that of the tree where she was found.

 

[Shellinaya]

Early on iirc, there was some talk about the possibility that this murder could have been gang related in some way, ie. initiation etc.
To be clear, when using labels such as gang, cartel, mafia etc, i am not necessarily referring to any one race or religion, just using a generic term to describe any group essentially composed of people who engage in criminal activity.

Just read about this incident which occurred far from Georgia, but had me thinking again about the possibility of some kind of group of criminals activity.
fwiw, imo, speculation.
2020
Kamloops man who helped carve the word ‘rat’ into flesh of victim handed 13-year prison sentence
''Kamloops man who helped carve the word ‘rat’ into flesh of victim handed 13-year prison sentence
Jeremy Bellows was among a group that offered the victim three choices of punishment: have fingers severed, have the word ‘rat’ burned into his flesh or have the word ‘rat’ carved into his flesh.''

I agree, and I brought up gang activity in Atlanta as potentially involved in this case early on, because the Fulton County District Attorney Fani Willis made it a point to mention gang activity in the ATL area during a press conference shortly after the Piedmont park murders.
People here didn't think that it could have been related to gang activity but I'm not sure why. It was the first thing I thought of. There are many active criminal gangs in Atlanta. This wasn't the press conference I'm thinking of where she warned about it, but it's an interview with her about it.

Atlanta Crime | Fulton DA Fani Willis speaks out | 11alive.com

Quote from article:

"She says nothing about the rise of violent crime in Atlanta has been exaggerated.

"And we track a lot of it back to gang violence. There's also something going in in society right now, where people are resolving their issues with violence. It is absolutely that bad," she said.

Willis says law enforcement officials in the city and the county, her office included, can't work fast enough to get criminals off the street."

Some recent murders in Atlanta have been factually tied back to gang activity.

 

[Atlmom]

You really think they'd send the crime scene van back out to the site of a murder to pick up a tree branch just to dispose of it? Why do that when, I'm sure, there is a parks department responsible for branch removal/landscaping? I don't buy that theory at all.

I think something was found at autopsy that made them think they needed to go back and get that sample. It may not be, however, that this particular branch was an actual piece of evidence needing to be forensically preserved (as in, actually touched/used by murderer or victim). Instead they may need it to be a sample that shows or eliminates the origin of physical evidence in or near her body. Perhaps they want to show that her body was or was not moved from a different location in the park, for example, by demonstrating the similarity or dissimilarity of the plant material on or under her with that of the tree where she was found.

@Yemelyan. I agree with you. IMO, either something was found on autopsy OR perhaps LE has a piece of evidence such as clothing, towel, etc that was ditched elsewhere in the park or even in a neighborhood yard or trash can etc. that contained significant DNA and plant material (leaves, bark etc) that warrants matching the plant/tree fiber forensically to the tree branch from the murder site. Only speculation, but if LE has a piece of evidence that contains DNA other than Katie’s or Bowie’s AND if the plant fibers match the tree branch from the crime scene, then LE may have a perpetrator on the radar.

 

[Yuletide]

A couple of things that linger in my mind as I await the capture and life in prison verdict for the person that did this:

<modsnip: No MSM, LE, or other approved source to substantiate>

In the area I live, walking, jogging, etc is very uncommon after dark. At sunrise, there is a sudden flurry of bicyclists, walkers with or without dogs, and joggers. In Atlanta, or at least the Piedmont Park area, it appears that it's very common, possibly because it's well lit or just an area that is a hub of activity with restaurants etc. I have no idea how often Katie walked Bowie after dark, but if it happened often, perhaps someone was waiting for her.

I will be surprised to find out that this was a random crime. In my opinion, someone targeted her for some deranged reason. From all that is available to know about Katie, she seemed like a hard working individual, with a love for animals, and had an inquisitive mind that loved to read and learn. She hardly seemed the type that was combative or would anger someone. Instead, I lean toward someone being obsessed with her, jealous of her, and their sick mind reacted. This is all just my opinion.

I hope the FBI is making great progress.

 

[dotr]

Noting, fwiw..
May 6 2021
Police: Robbers targeting Atlanta LGBTQ community through dating app
''ATLANTA - Atlanta police say robbers are using a popular dating app to target members of the LGBTQ community.

Investigators say eight victims have come forward since February and they believe there are more victims out there that may be afraid or too ashamed to come forward.

Police have released surveillance video of one of the suspects, asking the public to help identify him.

According to officials, the man caught on camera is one of three suspects targeting members of the LGBTQ community through the dating app Grindr.''

''Police would not say exactly where these crimes happened. But they described one of the suspects as a Black man with a dark complexion who is in his late teens or early 20s. The suspect has a slim but muscular build with his hair in 3 to 4 inch-long twists or dreads.''

''Signs of trouble could include luring dates to a remote location or giving a vague description of where to meet.''

 

[TL4S]

@Yemelyan. I agree with you. IMO, either something was found on autopsy OR perhaps LE has a piece of evidence such as clothing, towel, etc that was ditched elsewhere in the park or even in a neighborhood yard or trash can etc. that contained significant DNA and plant material (leaves, bark etc) that warrants matching the plant/tree fiber forensically to the tree branch from the murder site. Only speculation, but if LE has a piece of evidence that contains DNA other than Katie’s or Bowie’s AND if the plant fibers match the tree branch from the crime scene, then LE may have a perpetrator on the radar.

That's a good thought about something found elsewhere but containing forensic evidence linked to the tree. There seems to be a lot of trees around the crime scene, yet that was the only sample we saw being removed. I wonder if other samples were taken that we aren't aware of. Are the trees around the cs all the same species, or are they different? Why did they choose that one specifically?

 

[Shellinaya]

You really think they'd send the crime scene van back out to the site of a murder to pick up a tree branch just to dispose of it? Why do that when, I'm sure, there is a parks department responsible for branch removal/landscaping? I don't buy that theory at all.

I think something was found at autopsy that made them think they needed to go back and get that sample. It may not be, however, that this particular branch was an actual piece of evidence needing to be forensically preserved (as in, actually touched/used by murderer or victim). Instead they may need it to be a sample that shows or eliminates the origin of physical evidence in or near her body. Perhaps they want to show that her body was or was not moved from a different location in the park, for example, by demonstrating the similarity or dissimilarity of the plant material on or under her with that of the tree where she was found.

I didn't realize they drove back to pick it up, so yes your explanation makes more sense. We might never know why they picked it up though, because this is a park with tree and plant material all over the place. I just don't think there would be much difference between tree/plant material under her and tree/plant material 10' away, or 50' away. It's all the same stuff.

 

[TL4S]

I didn't realize they drove back to pick it up, so yes your explanation makes more sense. We might never know why they picked it up though, because this is a park with tree and plant material all over the place. I just don't think there would be much difference between tree/plant material under her and tree/plant material 10' away, or 50' away. It's all the same stuff.

Someone can surely explain this more effectively than I can (ahem... @Yemelyan), but plants and trees vary a lot within a species, as can soil within a small area. Trees can be female (fruit bearing), or male (pollen bearing), or both. Soil can have different acidity and microbial biomes, etc. A tree can even grow differently in different soil types, as well. My guess, at the forensic level, is that the tree limb will tell LE a lot about its specific location, which might then hopefully tell them a lot about other evidence they have. Jmo.

 

[Yemelyan]

Someone can surely explain this more effectively than I can (ahem... @Yemelyan), but plants and trees vary a lot within a species, as can soil within a small area. Trees can be female (fruit bearing), or male (pollen bearing), or both. Soil can have different acidity and microbial biomes, etc. A tree can even grow differently in different soil types, as well. My guess, at the forensic level, is that the tree limb will tell LE a lot about its specific location, which might then hopefully tell them a lot about other evidence they have. Jmo.

Perfectly explained!

 

[Sillybilly]

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[AzPistonsGirl]

bumping for Katie and Bowie and those who knew and loved them.