GA - Kendrick Johnson, 17, Suspicious Death, Jan. 10/11, 2013, #1

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  • #581
Ah, but the EMTs report contradicted what the SD said ad the coroner said the SD was negligent in waiting 6 hours to call and compromised the investigation. I posted the links upthread.

So if there is some CYA going on, those parties are not in on it.

KJ's body was discovered around 10:00 AM. LE and EMTs were dispatched around 10:30 AM. The school was locked down around 11:00 PM. The coroner was called around 3:00 PM. LE did not wait six hours to call the coroner. At most, they spent four and a half hours processing the scene and then notified the coroner. IMO, their explanation is completely understandable. They did not "compromise" the investigation.

By law, someone from the sheriff’s office should have contacted Lowndes County Coroner Bill Watson when they learned of Johnson’s body so that a declaration of death could be made, and Prine acknowledged that they should have done so. However, fearing a leak to the media and understanding that there was little the coroner could do until investigators secured all of the evidence and reached Johnson’s body, Prine waited to call Watson.

“It’s been kind of an understanding with all of the coroners from the surrounding counties,” said Prine. “Rather than sitting there in the parking lot waiting for us to finish, you just call them when you get to the body. And I swear to you— no law-enforcement officer touched that body until the coroner got there and examined it.”


http://valdostadailytimes.com/local/x6223544/Timeline-of-a-tragedy/
 
  • #582
OK. But it seems to me that if KJ could have purposefully wedged himself into the mat, other students could have equally purposefully wedged him into the mat.

I don't see the two possibilities as mutually exclusive, unless the timeframe allowed for full rigor, which it doesn't.

IMO, it would be much harder to force a struggling (or unconscious) young man into the mat. First, they would have had to get him up on top of the mat stack, quite difficult to do whether KJ is struggling or unconscious. Next they would have had to get him upside down and force him into the mat head first. (Again, a difficult task whether he is struggling or unconscious.) Sorry but I just don't see it. The easiest way for KJ to get wedged in the mat would be for him to enter it on his own.
 
  • #583
Ah, but the EMTs report contradicted what the SD said ad the coroner said the SD was negligent in waiting 6 hours to call and compromised the investigation. I posted the links upthread.

So if there is some CYA going on, those parties are not in on it.

An EMT is not a medical doctor, their role at an emergency scene is to give emergency aid in order to stabilize for transport. The bruising he thought he saw was the pooling of blood in Kendrick's jaw area. Kendrick's face was resting on that side (can't remember left or right), when he was found after almost 20 hours of being in that position. At the time the EMT arrived, he could not have known this detail.

Waiting six hours to call the coroner did not "compromise" the investigation (but may have bruised a coroner's ego). The investigation is processed from the outside in. When investigators got to KJ's body, the coroner was called. The coroner's only concern is the body, nothing else. He basically announces death, manner of death, and time of death. In the case of Kendrick Johnson, he was able only to say KJ was dead, which would not have been news to anyone six hours earlier. Because he is an elected official, and not a medical doctor, the coroner sent the body for further investigation.

So to say the investigation was compromised makes little sense, a cover up makes even less sense. Those are simplyhot button talking points given by the family attorney to the media. The same goes for the EMT report and the newspaper where organs should be. The ME didn't say the scene or the body was compromised, and she had to give the final report.

The family attorney, Chevene King, reads the EMT report and sees the unofficial notation of bruising. After he reads the completed autopsy report from the GBI, and sees the bruising was not a factor and cause of death deemed an accident, he calls for another autopsy. He needs this death to be a homicide for litigation purposes. The attorney takes the EMT report to his hired, private Pathologist and what is the result? Exactly what the attorney wanted the result to be, backed up by an EMT report - blunt force trauma in the same area noted by the EMT.

What's in it for the Pathologist? Money. What's in it for the government paid ME? Nothing, she makes the same regardless of her findings. I know, I know, she is part of the big conspiracy to cover for some kid whose parents must be extraordinarily connected to higher-ups in the city of Valdosta. The only renegade not involved in the cover up is Bill Watson...obviously they forgot to send him the conspiracy memo.

Con: to persuade (someone) to do or believe something, typically by use of a deception.
The EMT and compromised scene rhetoric served a purpose - immediate and sustained public outrage which puts pressure on officials. When public interest dwindles and the officials move on to other matters, a more sensational bombshell is announced: newspaper in the body cavity (5 months after it was discovered)!

If the DOJ thought this was a cover up they would have opened an investigation - they did not.

All IMO

RIP KJ.
 
  • #584
http://www.11alive.com/news/article/310726/40/LIVE--News-conference-in-Kendrick-Johnson-case
Per linked text:
"The SCLC in south Georgia is offering a $10,000 reward for information in Johnson's death."

Per linked video:
"Over the weekend, the Johnson family attorney C. V. King told 11alive news he is skeptical of that reward offer since it's only good for 90 days."

So rather than expressing appreciation of reward offer and saying it may help someone come forward soon with info,
instead parents' attorney scoffs. "Only 90 days."
Maybe he thinks it should be offered indefinitely?
Maybe he thinks he should dictate the terms of the reward?

My, oh, my.
JM2cts.
 
  • #585
They are still stating that the parents have been denied viewing of the video in the gym, but yet other statements have been made that they have been told they could come in for months and watch the video. I'm confused. Which is it?
 
  • #586
They are still stating that the parents have been denied viewing of the video in the gym, but yet other statements have been made that they have been told they could come in for months and watch the video. I'm confused. Which is it?

I don't know the complete answer to this, but here's what I gather from everything I've read and heard, including the presser today. It seems that the family would be permitted to view the parts of the video we've seen the snips of, but only the parts depicting Kendrick. They wouldn't be allowed to see the other students for the same reason the public isn't. His family's lawyers made it sound today like the school is asserting FERPA as the basis for the refusal to disclose the information. I'm not sure if that's the whole basis for the refusal, but it certainly seems like it's at least part of it. (side note: Crump knows his way around FERPA from other cases he's involved in. In other cases, he's used it as a shield, while here he's using it as a sword -- which should prove interesting.)

The families' lawyers also mentioned that there are four video cameras in the gym and that they believe, therefore, that there are three additional views of the gym -- one of which they believe may show the mat area if the camera was operational. It's not clear to me whether there definitely are three other views from three other cameras available or whether, if there are, the parts of the views from those other cameras were offered to the parents for viewing to the extent that they show Kendrick.

Finally, what was VERY clear from the presser, is that the school has invited the family to make a motion to compel the release of the videos and the family has declined. That's the part that really makes little sense until you look at the overall strategy. The school is obviously looking to CYA with a court order requiring them to disclose the footage so that it's legally off the hook wrt to any liability that could arise from a FERPA violation or similar. And, obviously, filing a petition for a coroner's inquest is certainly no easier than filing a motion to compel. So one would think they'd just file the motion to compel and be done with it.

Crump acknowledged, though, that if they get a coroner's inquest all of the information will become fully public (as in, to the media and the general public, not just to the parents). So, imo, it's a tactic that they are using in order to get the matter more fully in front of the public to drum up interest and outrage sufficient to strike fear into the hearts of the deep pockets (the insurers). That's Crump's consistent blueprint.

All of that said. It seems awfully risky for the family to take that approach unless, for example, someone knows that fourth camera wasn't working. If the videos exist, are made public and show nothing, this approach means its all over. I guess at that point the family can take the fall back position that they only ever wanted justice and closure...stay tuned!

all jmo
 
  • #587
I don't know the complete answer to this, but here's what I gather from everything I've read and heard, including the presser today. It seems that the family would be permitted to view the parts of the video we've seen the snips of, but only the parts depicting Kendrick. They wouldn't be allowed to see the other students for the same reason the public isn't. His family's lawyers made it sound today like the school is asserting FERPA as the basis for the refusal to disclose the information. I'm not sure if that's the whole basis for the refusal, but it certainly seems like it's at least part of it. (side note: Crump knows his way around FERPA from other cases he's involved in. In other cases, he's used it as a shield, while here he's using it as a sword -- which should prove interesting.)

The families' lawyers also mentioned that there are four video cameras in the gym and that they believe, therefore, that there are three additional views of the gym -- one of which they believe may show the mat area if the camera was operational. It's not clear to me whether there definitely are three other views from three other cameras available or whether, if there are, the parts of the views from those other cameras were offered to the parents for viewing to the extent that they show Kendrick.

Finally, what was VERY clear from the presser, is that the school has invited the family to make a motion to compel the release of the videos and the family has declined. That's the part that really makes little sense until you look at the overall strategy. The school is obviously looking to CYA with a court order requiring them to disclose the footage so that it's legally off the hook wrt to any liability that could arise from a FERPA violation or similar. And, obviously, filing a petition for a coroner's inquest is certainly no easier than filing a motion to compel. So one would think they'd just file the motion to compel and be done with it.

Crump acknowledged, though, that if they get a coroner's inquest all of the information will become fully public (as in, to the media and the general public, not just to the parents). So, imo, it's a tactic that they are using in order to get the matter more fully in front of the public to drum up interest and outrage sufficient to strike fear into the hearts of the deep pockets (the insurers). That's Crump's consistent blueprint.

All of that said. It seems awfully risky for the family to take that approach unless, for example, someone knows that fourth camera wasn't working. If the videos exist, are made public and show nothing, this approach means its all over. I guess at that point the family can take the fall back position that they only ever wanted justice and closure...stay tuned!

all jmo

Can't they show the footage with bars over the students eyes or slightly blurred? It's ridiculous. The parents have a legal right to know what happened to their son. If it was me I would be LIVID! They lost their child.
I wouldn't take anyone's word on it either. Prove it was an accident. I do not trust public schools at all, would not entrust my child's safety especially after this case.
 
  • #588
Can't they show the footage with bars over the students eyes or slightly blurred? It's ridiculous. The parents have a legal right to know what happened to their son. If it was me I would be LIVID! They lost their child.
I wouldn't take anyone's word on it either. Prove it was an accident. I do not trust public schools at all, would not entrust my child's safety especially after this case.

~bbm

That's probably the gray area that is the basis for the school saying file a motion to compel. Once such a motion is granted (assuming it would be) the school has no potential exposure from lawsuits from other parents and Kendrick's parents get to see the full video.

To me, it makes no sense that they wouldn't just go ahead and file that (very simple) motion unless you consider the bigger strategy.

eta: also consider that this strategy also has the effect of making the school look very bad since a lot of people can't understand why they don't do exactly what you said. The lawyers are, imo, using the public's (understandable) lack of knowledge of legal intricacies to sway their opinion...in my opinion lol

all jmo
 
  • #589
The parents said today at the press conference they had to learn from the media their son was dead. Looking through this time line, it would appear the media made every effort to contact them before releasing KJ's name.

Also, the kids who found KJ's body said the time was 10:30 a.m.
Lowndes County, GA - At the young age of sixteen years old, Bryant Thagard witnessed something most people hope to never experience. He was among several students who found a classmate dead in the Lowndes High School's old gymnasium.

"First block went by, second block came by and that's when the tragedy happened," he said.

He says it was around 10:30 a.m. when his friend went to play with wrestling mats in the gym. That's when he says his friend saw the body of a male sophomore student.
 
  • #590
Version 1 -Mom learned of death when she overheard phone call at school Fri. am. from Sept. 4 article
http://www.grantland.com/story/_/id/9626413/the-mysterious-death-17-year-old-football-player-valdosta-georgiav
"Memories of the next day come in flashes. There's Jackie in the school at 8:30 a.m., asking if anyone had seen her son. There were the text messages she received while sitting in the guidance counselor's office: "There are ambulances and fire trucks in the parking lot. No one can come in the entrance.
"Then there was the sentence she wasn't supposed to hear, the one said to the guidance counselor, whose phone's volume was turned up too loud. 'They found a body in the gym,' the voice on the other end said, according to Jackie. The counselor left the room, and that's when Jackie knew."

Version 2 - Mom learned of death from media
Not a quote from article. I'm quoting vlpate, from a post or two up:
The parents said today at the press conference they had to learn from the media their son was dead.

I wonder which one it was. Or another circumstance.

First article says she was at school at 8:30am.
But IIRC, his body was not found until ~10 or 10:30-ish, so she must have hung around a while.

Hmmm.
 
  • #591
I think I need to quit reading this thread. The victim blaming is making me feel awful. These people lost their CHILD! Why is it okay to accuse them of seeking a payday? G*d! I hope none of you ever have to lose a child under suspicious circumstances. :(

I agree, they have the right to be angry and demand answers they are being more civil than I would.
Let them have the answers they seek.
 
  • #592
Version 1 -Mom learned of death when she overheard phone call at school Fri. am. from Sept. 4 article
http://www.grantland.com/story/_/id/9626413/the-mysterious-death-17-year-old-football-player-valdosta-georgiav
"Memories of the next day come in flashes. There's Jackie in the school at 8:30 a.m., asking if anyone had seen her son. There were the text messages she received while sitting in the guidance counselor's office: "There are ambulances and fire trucks in the parking lot. No one can come in the entrance.
"Then there was the sentence she wasn't supposed to hear, the one said to the guidance counselor, whose phone's volume was turned up too loud. 'They found a body in the gym,' the voice on the other end said, according to Jackie. The counselor left the room, and that's when Jackie knew."

Version 2 - Mom learned of death from media
Not a quote from article. I'm quoting vlpate, from a post or two up:
The parents said today at the press conference they had to learn from the media their son was dead.

I wonder which one it was. Or another circumstance.

First article says she was at school at 8:30am.
But IIRC, his body was not found until ~10 or 10:30-ish, so she must have hung around a while.

Hmmm.

Maybe the guidance counselor was on the phone with the media?
 
  • #593
http://www.wctv.tv/home/headlines/M...Death-Threats-To-Local-Sheriff-207601681.html

For some reason I can't cut and paste from the link, but a distant cousin of Kendrick's was arrested for making threats to the Sheriff over the handling of the case. Like I said, no way, no how I'd be letting the school release anything that could even remotely have any chance of linkng my child to that gym on that day -- face blurred or not. I don't blame those other parents whatsoever. jmo
 
  • #594
http://www.wctv.tv/home/headlines/M...Death-Threats-To-Local-Sheriff-207601681.html

For some reason I can't cut and paste from the link, but a distant cousin of Kendrick's was arrested for making threats to the Sheriff over the handling of the case. Like I said, no way, no how I'd be letting the school release anything that could even remotely have any chance of linkng my child to that gym on that day -- face blurred or not. I don't blame those other parents whatsoever. jmo

I agree. The community is very heated over this and the parents are very distraught. Any child that is seen in the gym during or around that time period, could be a target by others in the community. I'm afraid there are some that would be quick to point fingers before thinking rationally.
 
  • #595
I agree. The community is very heated over this and the parents are very distraught. Any child that is seen in the gym during or around that time period, could be a target by others in the community. I'm afraid there are some that would be quick to point fingers before thinking rationally.

Just stumbled across this very apropos post here about deblurring software.

Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - Unblurring Images Using Free SmartDeblur App
 
  • #596
The locker fees are cheaper than the gym shoes by a mile, no doubt.

So? Should his family have paid locker fees but not gym shoes to keep in it, or use for gym? Do we even know specifically why KJ didn't pay for a locker? Could the family not afford it? Did his parents give him money for locker fees and he spent out on something else?

My question about the locker fees is why aren't lockers just provided for students as part of school?
 
  • #597
So? Should his family have paid locker fees but not gym shoes to keep in it, or use for gym? Do we even know specifically why KJ didn't pay for a locker? Could the family not afford it? Did his parents give him money for locker fees and he spent out on something else?

My question about the locker fees is why aren't lockers just provided for students as part of school?

I'm guessing the locker fee is for maintenance/vandalism. The fee is $10. A pair of canvas converse cost about $30-50. Leather brand names cost much more. No, we don't know specifically if he had a locker. He may have just kept his gym shoes there because it was more convenient. But the msm stories say that's why a number of students did that.

If it were my dd I'd guess I gave her the ten bucks and she spent it on something else. My ds would have paid the locker fee. So who knows.

jmo
 
  • #598
Exactly, I just had to say that I totally agree with this. If its impossible for someone else to force him into the mat then its impossible for him to force himself...I don't know what the hell happened that day but what I don't believe is that KJ wedged himself in that mat :(

I guess for me the difference is if he was forcing himself into the mat, he was doing so purposefully and his body would cooperate with his mind's intent.

If someone else was forcing him into the mat against his will, he would not be entering the mat purposefully, and his body would cooperate with his intent which in that case would be to NOT enter the mat.

If he was incapacitated and someone tried to force him into the mat, that would also prove rather difficult, as unconscious people are difficult to maneuver successfully in general, and I'd imagine particularly difficult to shove into a narrow vertical space.

This is all assuming that the mat was vertical amongst other vertical mats when he entered the mat.

I don't believe there was enough time to attack him then roll him up into the mat and stack them all up vertically.

Hasn't anyone here ever gone off balance when trying to reach down into something? I'm short, so I worry about toppling into shopping carts while reaching for small items in the far corner of the cart. I can totally see how he could have reached in so far that his footing was lost, particularly if his shoes were off, and he got stuck. Just seems so much more plausible than a cover up. Some poor choices during the investigation, but I think that's more its own issue, and doesn't relate to this case in the sense of "What happened?" But more in the sense of "wow, we need to revisit our procedures and use this as an opportunity for additional training" and whatever they need in order to raise the general competency levels.
 
  • #599
I guess for me the difference is if he was forcing himself into the mat, he was doing so purposefully and his body would cooperate with his mind's intent.

If someone else was forcing him into the mat against his will, he would not be entering the mat purposefully, and his body would cooperate with his intent which in that case would be to NOT enter the mat.

If he was incapacitated and someone tried to force him into the mat, that would also prove rather difficult, as unconscious people are difficult to maneuver successfully in general, and I'd imagine particularly difficult to shove into a narrow vertical space.

This is all assuming that the mat was vertical amongst other vertical mats when he entered the mat.

I don't believe there was enough time to attack him then roll him up into the mat and stack them all up vertically.

Hasn't anyone here ever gone off balance when trying to reach down into something? I'm short, so I worry about toppling into shopping carts while reaching for small items in the far corner of the cart. I can totally see how he could have reached in so far that his footing was lost, particularly if his shoes were off, and he got stuck. Just seems so much more plausible than a cover up. Some poor choices during the investigation, but I think that's more its own issue, and doesn't relate to this case in the sense of "What happened?" But more in the sense of "wow, we need to revisit our procedures and use this as an opportunity for additional training" and whatever they need in order to raise the general competency levels.

I agree with all except the last part. I don't think anything that was done "wrong" was a serious departure from protocol that resulted in a compromise of the scene. I'm not a big fan of additonal "training and procedures" where the result is likely to become a bunch of new and costly CYA regulations that don't enhance anything but might go a small way to prevent frivolous lawsuits. Everything is already geared toward overcompensating against liability. And that's why everything costs so dang much! jmo
 
  • #600
I just want to see a reenactment


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