GA - Kendrick Johnson, 17, Suspicious Death, Jan. 10/11, 2013, #1

[Karmady]

School officials confirm surveillance video shows KJ was not alone in the gym.

http://ac360.blogs.cnn.com/category/kendrick-johnson/

how is this any different than prior reporting about the other kid entering the gym first and turning in the other direction. Nothing I heard the news guy say is inconsistent with that yet he's acting like this is something new and different.

eta: he also says the video shows Kendrick not going right like Stride says. But it sure looks like he's going right to me :::shrug:::

jmo

 

[FrayedKnot]

it is like a chinese finger puller game in some ways. The surface of those mats has give- but not a lot. It also depends on how tightly they are rolled. I am not "rooting" for one side or another- I am explaining the mats. Until you have worked with them , it is a bit hard to explain.

See, I appreciate your honest apprisal of the mats.

My hinky meter is raised more because of the statements made by the SD regarding the mats, and pretty much everything.

Mats were 7" tall. They were 6" tall. They were always stored on their sides until Christmas break. But yet the kids were known to hang out all of the time and walk on the (newly upended) mats. So much so that candy wrappers and soda cans were found in them. But the day Kendrick died was the first day back to school after the mats were rearranged....:waitasec: but the kids were ALWAYS walking on them.....mmmmkay.

Kendrick's arms and head were sticking out of the mat. (EMT report). Kendrick's feet were protruding from the mat. (SD). Crime scene photos show Kendrick's feet well within the mat. Kendrick would have to be about 6'8" for both to be true. And about a foot wide to fit into the mat. Um. No.

And THIS.

The SD did not call the coroner for SIX HOURS. The school had already informed other PARENTS before anyone bothered to call the daggum CORONER. Which is protocol.


The coroner stated the scene was manipulated before his arrival.

Milk ain't clean.

 

[IzzyBlanche]

how is this any different than prior reporting about the other kid entering the gym first and turning in the other direction. Nothing I heard the news guy say is inconsistent with that yet he's acting like this is something new and different.

jmo

As I understand it, the initial reports from the sheriff's department were that no one was in the gym but Kendrick, because the surveillance video showed the one kid entering and KJ right behind him, but the sheriff said they confirmed that the other kid went directly to class, implying that KJ was therefore alone in the gym.

Now school officials are saying that in fact, there were other kids in the gym besides the one KJ followed in, as shown on the surveillance video.

It just seems common sense to me that if the surveillance video showed KJ alone in the gym, the sheriff's department would have released it long ago to support their theory of how KJ died. That excuse about it showing minors is hogwash; how many times a day are people on TV with their faces blurred out to conceal their identities? Including minors?

This just reeks of some sort of cover-up to me.

 

[jjenny]

how is this any different than prior reporting about the other kid entering the gym first and turning in the other direction. Nothing I heard the news guy say is inconsistent with that yet he's acting like this is something new and different.

eta: he also says the video shows Kendrick not going right like Stride says. But it sure looks like he's going right to me :::shrug:::

jmo

ITA. When did anybody ever claim Kendrick was alone in the gym? There was even a class in there from what has been reported, soon after Kendrick went into the gym. All the reports I've seen say other students went in shortly after Kendrick. And one went in before him, but went into other direction. Why is AC acting as if it was some sort of revelation that he wasn't alone in the gym? And I saw the video, Kendrick is going to the right. The video is on the website.

 

[Karmady]

As I understand it, the initial reports from the sheriff's department were that no one was in the gym but Kendrick, because the surveillance video showed the one kid entering and KJ right behind him, but the sheriff said they confirmed that the other kid went directly to class, implying that KJ was therefore alone in the gym.

Now school officials are saying that in fact, there were other kids in the gym besides the one KJ followed in, as shown on the surveillance video.

It just seems common sense to me that if the surveillance video showed KJ alone in the gym, the sheriff's department would have released it long ago to support their theory of how KJ died. That excuse about it showing minors is hogwash; how many times a day are people on TV with their faces blurred out to conceal their identities? Including minors?


This just reeks of some sort of cover-up to me.

They did release the video of kendrick in the gym. It's right in the news report. They did not release the part of the video of the kid who entered the gym just before him and went left (afaik) for the reason given, but they did say he was in the gym, too. And if Kendrick "followed" him in they were probably both in there during the 11 minute time frame the reporter referenced in his question to the school board lawyer, and possibly, briefly, at the same time. Nowhere in anything in the statements referenced in that news piece say that "there were other kids" (plural) in the gym during that 11 minute period, as you posted. This is not news, imo. Just trying to create interest and controversy. jmo

 

[Montjoy]

Nowhere in anything in the statements referenced in that news piece say that "there were other kids" (plural) in the gym during that 11 minute period, as you posted. This is not news, imo. Just trying to create interest and controversy. jmo

I think the waters have been muddied by a lot of bad reporting well after the fact -- much of which isn't even reporting, but is more like editorializing and presenting public interest pieces as if they are news. Facts and logic go out the window, perhaps because it was such an unusual death that people can't believe that such an accident could happen. But I have yet to see anyone suggest how some sort of murder, coverup, and wide-ranging conspiracy (involving, presumably, students, the school, the SD, and the GBI -- a number of groups whose interests do not necessarily align) could have happened (and happened so quickly) in a way that is consistent with the known facts. So for many, it seems easier to ignore the facts -- things like the timeline, the surveillance video -- than it is to accept an improbable death.

Make no mistake, the sort of justice that is being sought is in the form of a lawsuit. Nobody has ever suggested that there is any person of interest who had any desire to hurt KJ. The focus from the parents and their lawyer has been less on who is responsible for the death, and more on who is liable for it. The 'where' of KJ's murder is more important than the 'who' of it. "How did my son go missing during school hours in broad daylight? We know our son was murdered while he was at Lowndes High School," said his father.

 

[IzzyBlanche]

They did release the video of kendrick in the gym. It's right in the news report. They did not release the part of the video of the kid who entered the gym just before him and went left (afaik) for the reason given, but they did say he was in the gym, too. And if Kendrick "followed" him in they were probably both in there during the 11 minute time frame the reporter referenced in his question to the school board lawyer, and possibly, briefly, at the same time. Nowhere in anything in the statements referenced in that news piece say that "there were other kids" (plural) in the gym during that 11 minute period, as you posted. This is not news, imo. Just trying to create interest and controversy. jmo

You may be right. I may be completely confused. It's happened before, but just once. :floorlaugh:

As I understood it though, the news report refers to a different, as yet unreleased video.

 

[IzzyBlanche]

I think the waters have been muddied by a lot of bad reporting well after the fact -- much of which isn't even reporting, but is more like editorializing and presenting public interest pieces as if they are news. Facts and logic go out the window, perhaps because it was such an unusual death that people can't believe that such an accident could happen. But I have yet to see anyone suggest how some sort of murder, coverup, and wide-ranging conspiracy (involving, presumably, students, the school, the SD, and the GBI -- a number of groups whose interests do not necessarily align) could have happened (and happened so quickly) in a way that is consistent with the known facts. So for many, it seems easier to ignore the facts -- things like the timeline, the surveillance video -- than it is to accept an improbable death.

Make no mistake, the sort of justice that is being sought is in the form of a lawsuit. Nobody has ever suggested that there is any person of interest who had any desire to hurt KJ. The focus from the parents and their lawyer has been less on who is responsible for the death, and more on who is liable for it. The 'where' of KJ's murder is more important than the 'who' of it. "How did my son go missing during school hours in broad daylight? We know our son was murdered while he was at Lowndes High School," said his father.

BBM for focus.

Is this such a suggestion? I apologize in advance if Valdosta Today isn't considered MSM.

In addition, two students allegedly told the LCSO that Johnson had recently been in a ‘dispute’ over a girl just prior to his death. On the day his body was found, a Facebook post read, “‘when you start messing the goons bodies show up.”

http://valdostatoday.com/2013/06/kendrick-johnsons-body-to-be-exhumed-2nd-autopsy-done/

 

[IzzyBlanche]

Two other questions:

If he died from asphyxiation hanging upside down, how did blood get on his chest?

And if he was hanging upside down reaching for a shoe, how come his elbow was bent upward fixed in rigor?

Gravity, it's not just a good idea, it's the law.

 

[Montjoy]

Is this such a suggestion? I apologize in advance if Valdosta Today isn't considered MSM.

In addition, two students allegedly told the LCSO that Johnson had recently been in a ‘dispute’ over a girl just prior to his death. On the day his body was found, a Facebook post read, “‘when you start messing the goons bodies show up.”

Quoting the timeline article of the Valdosta Daily times:

"“He comes down the hallway, and essentially he enters the gym. He’s following another kid,” said Jones. “The first kid comes in and goes to the left. Kendrick goes in and off to the right towards the corner where the mats are. You don’t see anyone trailing him or someone he’s having a dispute with,” adding that allegations he had been in a confrontation that day or the day before were false."

http://valdostadailytimes.com/local/x6223544/Timeline-of-a-tragedy

 

[Karmady]

You may be right. I may be completely confused. It's happened before, but just once. :floorlaugh:

As I understood it though, the news report refers to a different, as yet unreleased video.

That was definitely the implication. But there is no "different" unreleased video. There's one video from one camera. Some of which has been released because it show kendrick. Some of which hasn't because it shows a minor, or maybe more than one, who happened to be in or walking through the gym during the pertinent time frame. However, ALL of the video is available to the lawyers for the school district, just for example. If they had evidence of murder, they wouldn't be releasing parts of the video and making "damning" statements about undisclosed students present at the scene. Especially to the media. It just goes without saying.

jmo

 

[IzzyBlanche]

Quoting the timeline article of the Valdosta Daily times:

"“He comes down the hallway, and essentially he enters the gym. He’s following another kid,” said Jones. “The first kid comes in and goes to the left. Kendrick goes in and off to the right towards the corner where the mats are. You don’t see anyone trailing him or someone he’s having a dispute with,” adding that allegations he had been in a confrontation that day or the day before were false."

http://valdostadailytimes.com/local/x6223544/Timeline-of-a-tragedy

Not directed at you personally, just jumping off:

I guess it boils down to which unreliable source one chooses to believe. The reported rumors, or the official statements from the sheriff's department who indubitably violated state law by not notifying the coroner immediately.

In my view the sheriff's department therefore blew their credibility by acting illegally although sworn to uphold the law.

I generally tend to disregard rumors as just that, but in this case I'm thinking there may be actual fire beneath the smoke.

 

[IzzyBlanche]

That was definitely the implication. But there is no "different" unreleased video. There's one video from one camera. Some of which has been released because it show kendrick. Some of which hasn't because it shows a minor, or maybe more than one, who happened to be in or walking through the gym during the pertinent time frame. However, ALL of the video is available to the lawyers for the school district, just for example. If they had evidence of murder, they wouldn't be releasing parts of the video and making "damning" statements about undisclosed students present at the scene. Especially to the media. It just goes without saying.

jmo

OK. Got it.

I guess I was confused because way further upthread someone was saying that no one could have attacked KJ in the gym unless they teleported in or out because the video showed no one else in the gym.

That must have been where I got the idea that people were saying KJ was alone in the gym, and the video proved it.

 

[Montjoy]

Personally, I don't even think motive plays into the equation here. By all accounts, KJ was very well liked at school. But let's say that was not true (however well documented it has been, both before and after his death).

For him to have been murdered in the manner suggested by some, so many things would have had to have happened in an impossibly small period of time, as well as a number of dark stars aligning:

-- first, multiple students would need to be involved. Whether he was rolled up in a mat which was then propped up, or lifted and dropped into a (let's say) 6' mat (itself, a difficult and risky task), one student could not have pulled it off.

-- the murderers would need to know that KJ would be going to the mat to retrieve his shoes, as they were found inside it, and they would have to have been laying in wait for him, never having been seen entering the gym and not leaving.

-- the murderers would have had to have killed him very quickly, with no mess or noise; KJ could not have struggled or have tried to escape.

-- If he was placed in the mat and then rolled up in it, the murderers would have then had to have unrolled a mat, placed him inside of it, rolled it up, and stood it on its end. The mat and KJ would have weighed hundreds of pounds.

-- the murderers would then have to disappear before any other students saw or heard them, evading the cameras at the gym's entrance and exit.

-- the murderers would have had to have ensured that they left no trace of their crime.

-- the murderers would have had to rely on a very wide-ranging conspiracy of silence, involving the school, coroner, SD, CID, and GBI. This would entail a huge number of bad people who care nothing about justice or human life.

I cannot fathom how anyone could see this as being more likely than a student reaching deeply into a mat to retrieve some shoes, getting stuck, and sinking down into it.

 

[Linda7NJ]

That was definitely the implication. But there is no "different" unreleased video. There's one video from one camera. Some of which has been released because it show kendrick. Some of which hasn't because it shows a minor, or maybe more than one, who happened to be in or walking through the gym during the pertinent time frame. However, ALL of the video is available to the lawyers for the school district, just for example. If they had evidence of murder, they wouldn't be releasing parts of the video and making "damning" statements about undisclosed students present at the scene. Especially to the media. It just goes without saying.

jmo

It goes without saying?

Really?

Look at what goes on at highschools when football players rape unconscious girls! And not just at one school....


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[IzzyBlanche]

Personally, I don't even think motive plays into the equation here. By all accounts, KJ was very well liked at school. But let's say that was not true (however well documented it has been, both before and after his death).

For him to have been murdered in the manner suggested by some, so many things would have had to have happened in an impossibly small period of time, as well as a number of dark stars aligning:

-- first, multiple students would need to be involved. Whether he was rolled up in a mat which was then propped up, or lifted and dropped into a (let's say) 6' mat (itself, a difficult and risky task), one student could not have pulled it off.

-- the murderers would need to know that KJ would be going to the mat to retrieve his shoes, as they were found inside it, and they would have to have been laying in wait for him, never having been seen entering the gym and not leaving.

-- the murderers would have had to have killed him very quickly, with no mess or noise; KJ could not have struggled or have tried to escape.

-- If he was placed in the mat and then rolled up in it, the murderers would have then had to have unrolled a mat, placed him inside of it, rolled it up, and stood it on its end. The mat and KJ would have weighed hundreds of pounds.

-- the murderers would then have to disappear before any other students saw or heard them, evading the cameras at the gym's entrance and exit.

-- the murderers would have had to have ensured that they left no trace of their crime.

-- the murderers would have had to rely on a very wide-ranging conspiracy of silence, involving the school, coroner, SD, CID, and GBI. This would entail a huge number of bad people who care nothing about justice or human life.

I cannot fathom how anyone could see this as being more likely than a student reaching deeply into a mat to retrieve some shoes, getting stuck, and sinking down into it.

A lot of improbabilities, I totally agree with you there.

Yet the official story has as many improbabilities:

I cannot fathom how someone with a 19 inch shoulder span could fall into/crawl into/squirm into a 14 inch wide opening.

Or that he would even have been attempting to reach down from a 6 foot height to retrieve something on the floor, rather than simply pushing the mat over to a horizontal position and getting his shoe off the floor that way.

I mean if one teacher was able to push the mat over with KJ's 100-plus pound body inside, how come KJ couldn't push that same mat over himself?

All my doubts would go away if I could just see a convincing demonstration of how it happened. But as it is, there is too much that doesn't make sense to me.

 

[Montjoy]

I cannot fathom how someone with a 19 inch shoulder span could fall into/crawl into/squirm into a 14 inch wide opening.

Or that he would even have been attempting to reach down from a 6 foot height to retrieve something on the floor, rather than simply pushing the mat over to a horizontal position and getting his shoe off the floor that way.

I mean if one teacher was able to push the mat over with KJ's 100-plus pound body inside, how come KJ couldn't push that same mat over himself?

As for the shoulder span issue, give yourself a hug -- you will see that the width of your shoulder span can narrow considerably. So too with reaching downward to a single point.

Surely KJ could have pushed a mat over -- but he may not have thought to have done that. Who could guess why someone would not have done something? Perhaps he thought his shoes hadn't sunk all the way to the bottom. Perhaps one of them was wedged between an inner end of the mat and wasn't all the way to the floor.

And as for the improbabilities of the scenario I suggested -- I would suggest that taking them all into account, with the very small window of time available, that the improbabilities amount to an impossibility, and it is telling that I have not seen anyone suggest a way in which he could have been murdered that fits within the known facts.

 

[Karmady]

It goes without saying?

Really?

Look at what goes on at highschools when football players rape unconscious girls! And not just at one school....


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did the lawyers in the stuebenville or maryville cases make damning statements to the media?

 

[Linda7NJ]

did the lawyers in the stuebenville or maryville cases make damning statements to the media?

There was that other case too, years ago where the unconscious girl was gang raped on a pool table, with a que, recorded by the sheriffs son IIRC.

Honestly? I have no idea. I didn't follow either case as closely as this one. What I got from the reading I did do....I was shocked, stunned and surprised the lengths people in high places go to protect the guilty.

Anyho... My point being, nothing would surprise me and my lifetime of experience leads me to not blindly assume the story I'm being spoon fed is the truth

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[Karmady]

There was that other case too, years ago where the unconscious girl was gang raped on a pool table, with a que, recorded by the sheriffs son IIRC.

Honestly? I have no idea. I didn't follow either case as closely as this one. What I got from the reading I did do....I was shocked, stunned and surprised the lengths people in high places go to protect the guilty.

Anyho... My point being, nothing would surprise me and my lifetime of experience leads me to not blindly assume the story I'm being spoon fed is the truth

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I was talking about the supposed breaking news in the OP that the school district's lawyer had supposedly confirmed new information that kendrick was not alone when he got into the mat. When I said it goes without saying, I was referring to the claim that the school district's lawyer supposedly disclosed this new and damning information, and not only disclosed it, but disclosed it only to the media. Not happening...jmo