GA - Kendrick Johnson, 17, Suspicious Death, Jan. 10/11, 2013, #1

[BeginnersLuck]

I posted a link in this thread that explains autopsy. Sometimes the organs are returned to the body and sometimes they are not depending on condition. Due to the condition of KJ's organs they were not returned to the body. The link also explains that after autopsy, the body is packed with filler material, regardless of whether the organs are returned or not. What type of filler material is used is immaterial considering that packing using filler is a common procedure.

I imagine the above letter was written because it was a rebuttal to being accused of wrong doing, when in fact in autopsy it is common procedure. Of course a layman would not know these things and therefore it would contribute to shock value just as the photo of KJ's face did. The face photo was for shock value as well, because again a layman would not understand the pooling and hemorrhaging of blood.

Any investigation is going to have differences. All professionals will give different opinions and word things different, unless they simply copy each others statements.

Coroners are only required to have a high school diploma and so many hours of training each year. There was no need for the coroner to be there earlier. The EMT was qualified to pronounce KJ as deceased. There were multiple LE agencies present to do the investigation. They are the expert investigators not the coroner. The coroner simply documents what is visible scene on the body. The crime scene WAS altered by the gym teacher. He did nothing that anyone else wouldn't have done under the same circumstance. Although it may be stated in the guidelines that the coroner should be called immediately, it in no way affected the investigation that he wasn't. Nothing IMO nefarious.

This reminds me of another case that did not get as much publicity as this one. The parents simply refused to look at facts and ran with whatever they could find to pick apart, even if there was a viable explanation. They accuse neighbors and all authority figures of wrong doing and a giant conspiracy. No matter how much fact is presented to them they manipulate things to fit "their" theory. I don't know whether there is money motivation, blockage due to grief, including getting stuck in denial, or both.

If you haven't read this letter yet http://mediabugs.org/bugs/kendrick-johnson-racist-murder---valdosta-ga- I highly recommend you do. This man did his homework, unlike the many others that simply provided an opinion on this case.

 

[gxm]

I posted a link in this thread that explains autopsy. Sometimes the organs are returned to the body and sometimes they are not depending on condition. Due to the condition of KJ's organs they were not returned to the body. The link also explains that after autopsy, the body is packed with filler material, regardless of whether the organs are returned or not. What type of filler material is used is immaterial considering that packing using filler is a common procedure.

I imagine the above letter was written because it was a rebuttal to being accused of wrong doing, when in fact in autopsy it is common procedure. Of course a layman would not know these things and therefore it would contribute to shock value just as the photo of KJ's face did. The face photo was for shock value as well, because again a layman would not understand the pooling and hemorrhaging of blood.

Any investigation is going to have differences. All professionals will give different opinions and word things different, unless they simply copy each others statements.

Coroners are only required to have a high school diploma and so many hours of training each year. There was no need for the coroner to be there earlier. The EMT was qualified to pronounce KJ as deceased. There were multiple LE agencies present to do the investigation. They are the expert investigators not the coroner. The coroner simply documents what is visible scene on the body. The crime scene WAS altered by the gym teacher. He did nothing that anyone else wouldn't have done under the same circumstance. Although it may be stated in the guidelines that the coroner should be called immediately, it in no way affected the investigation that he wasn't. Nothing IMO nefarious.

This reminds me of another case that did not get as much publicity as this one. The parents simply refused to look at facts and ran with whatever they could find to pick apart, even if there was a viable explanation. They accuse neighbors and all authority figures of wrong doing and a giant conspiracy. No matter how much fact is presented to them they manipulate things to fit "their" theory. I don't know whether there is money motivation, blockage due to grief, including getting stuck in denial, or both.

If you haven't read this letter yet http://mediabugs.org/bugs/kendrick-johnson-racist-murder---valdosta-ga- I highly recommend you do. This man did his homework, unlike the many others that simply provided an opinion on this case.

Thank you. I've bookmarked the link for future reference. I find it very interesting that the boy they think had a disagreement with KJ was on the other side of the school when KJ went missing.

The boy that Kenneth Johnson told me he believes is involved in Kendrick's death was on the other side of the school when Kendrick went missing.

http://mediabugs.org/bugs/kendrick-johnson-racist-murder---valdosta-ga-

 

[IzzyBlanche]

I posted a link in this thread that explains autopsy. Sometimes the organs are returned to the body and sometimes they are not depending on condition. Due to the condition of KJ's organs they were not returned to the body. The link also explains that after autopsy, the body is packed with filler material, regardless of whether the organs are returned or not. What type of filler material is used is immaterial considering that packing using filler is a common procedure.

I imagine the above letter was written because it was a rebuttal to being accused of wrong doing, when in fact in autopsy it is common procedure. Of course a layman would not know these things and therefore it would contribute to shock value just as the photo of KJ's face did. The face photo was for shock value as well, because again a layman would not understand the pooling and hemorrhaging of blood.

Any investigation is going to have differences. All professionals will give different opinions and word things different, unless they simply copy each others statements.

Coroners are only required to have a high school diploma and so many hours of training each year. There was no need for the coroner to be there earlier. The EMT was qualified to pronounce KJ as deceased. There were multiple LE agencies present to do the investigation. They are the expert investigators not the coroner. The coroner simply documents what is visible scene on the body. The crime scene WAS altered by the gym teacher. He did nothing that anyone else wouldn't have done under the same circumstance. Although it may be stated in the guidelines that the coroner should be called immediately, it in no way affected the investigation that he wasn't. Nothing IMO nefarious.

This reminds me of another case that did not get as much publicity as this one. The parents simply refused to look at facts and ran with whatever they could find to pick apart, even if there was a viable explanation. They accuse neighbors and all authority figures of wrong doing and a giant conspiracy. No matter how much fact is presented to them they manipulate things to fit "their" theory. I don't know whether there is money motivation, blockage due to grief, including getting stuck in denial, or both.

If you haven't read this letter yet http://mediabugs.org/bugs/kendrick-johnson-racist-murder---valdosta-ga- I highly recommend you do. This man did his homework, unlike the many others that simply provided an opinion on this case.

BBM for focus.

Are you saying that the law is merely a guideline?

It might not have affected the sheriff's investigation, but the coroner himself states it affected his own invesigation:

"Well it compromises my investigation one hundred percent," Watson said.

Source: http://www.examiner.com/article/low...teen-s-body-was-moved-crime-scene-compromised

Just FYI, the letter writer is a woman.

 

[gxm]

BBM for focus.

Are you saying that the law is merely a guideline?

It might not have affected the sheriff's investigation, but the coroner himself states it affected his own invesigation:

"Well it compromises my investigation one hundred percent," Watson said.

Source: http://www.examiner.com/article/low...teen-s-body-was-moved-crime-scene-compromised

Just FYI, the letter writer is a woman.

First, he seems to be saying that LE processing the scene was an issue which IMO is just ridiculous. They had to process the scene and collect evidence.

Further the coroner then goes on to say that the body had been moved, making it sound like LE moved KJ's body when it was actually the coach who pulled the mats down and "compromised" the scene by doing what anyone else would do: get the kid out of the mat. I can't begin to imagine the frantic effort to rescue KJ, not realizing he'd been in there for 24 hours. Yes, the scene was "compromised" by well-intentioned people who thought they could save him. That's what the coroner has a problem with? GMAB.

 

[vlpate]

Thank you. I've bookmarked the link for future reference. I find it very interesting that the boy they think had a disagreement with KJ was on the other side of the school when KJ went missing.

The boy that Kenneth Johnson told me he believes is involved in Kendrick's death was on the other side of the school when Kendrick went missing.

http://mediabugs.org/bugs/kendrick-johnson-racist-murder---valdosta-ga-

Thanks for posting this, I didn't realize we could use the source. This is a great article on the case. I hope everyone reads it.

 

[IzzyBlanche]

First, he seems to be saying that LE processing the scene was an issue which IMO is just ridiculous. They had to process the scene and collect evidence.

Further the coroner then goes on to say that the body had been moved, making it sound like LE moved KJ's body when it was actually the coach who pulled the mats down and "compromised" the scene by doing what anyone else would do: get the kid out of the mat. I can't begin to imagine the frantic effort to rescue KJ, not realizing he'd been in there for 24 hours. Yes, the scene was "compromised" by well-intentioned people who thought they could save him. That's what the coroner has a problem with? GMAB.

I'm sorry, I posted the wrong link. (This isn't a response to your post, I am just using it to post the correct link).

http://www.wctv.tv/home/headlines/Coroner-Claims--203428171.html

 

[IzzyBlanche]

First, he seems to be saying that LE processing the scene was an issue which IMO is just ridiculous. They had to process the scene and collect evidence.

Further the coroner then goes on to say that the body had been moved, making it sound like LE moved KJ's body when it was actually the coach who pulled the mats down and "compromised" the scene by doing what anyone else would do: get the kid out of the mat. I can't begin to imagine the frantic effort to rescue KJ, not realizing he'd been in there for 24 hours. Yes, the scene was "compromised" by well-intentioned people who thought they could save him. That's what the coroner has a problem with? GMAB.

On page 2 of the crime lab report, it states that when EMS arrived KJ was pulled "slightly" out of the mat.

On page 3 when the coroner arrives, it states that KJ is now lying on his side sticking out of the mat "from his head to approximately his abdominal area."

So the crime lab's own report suggests that the body was moved between the time the teacher found it and the time the coroner arrived.

http://www.news4jax.com/blob/view/-...Crime-lab-report-in-Kendrick-Johnson-case.pdf

 

[i.b.nora]

REWARD OFFERED IN KENDRICK JOHNSON CASE
Cody Gibson | October 18, 2013 | 33 Comments

http://valdostatoday.com/2013/10/reward-offered-in-kendrick-johnson-case/

"VALDOSTA, GA — The Valdosta-Lowndes County chapter of the Southern Christian Leadership Conference (SCLC) has not spoken on the death of Kendrick Johnson in recent months. However, on Friday, October 18th, Pastor Floyd Rose broke that silence with an offer of a $10,000 reward for information."

*

" “There has been speculation that the Lowndes County Sheriff’s office and the Georgia Bureau of Investigation have in some way conducted a poor investigation and/or covered up facts in the case…,” said Rose, ”The Valdosta-Lowndes County chapter of SCLC wants to be clear…our organization has not taken a definitive position on this case. We don’t know what happened.”"

More...

The intrepid SCLC 'Investigator', Leigh Touchton differs with the President of the SCLC. See her comments there. Could she be putting the Valdosta SCLC at risk for a lawsuit?

 

[Karmady]

On page 2 of the crime lab report, it states that when EMS arrived KJ was pulled "slightly" out of the mat.

On page 3 when the coroner arrives, it states that KJ is now lying on his side sticking out of the mat "from his head to approximately his abdominal area."

So the crime lab's own report suggests that the body was moved between the time the teacher found it and the time the coroner arrived.

http://www.news4jax.com/blob/view/-...Crime-lab-report-in-Kendrick-Johnson-case.pdf

I would think EMS certainly would have moved him a little at least.

 

[IzzyBlanche]

I would think EMS certainly would have moved him a little at least.

They did. They pulled him slightly out of the mat.

Then when the coroner got there he was halfway out of the mat.

That's how I'm reading it anyway.

 

[BeginnersLuck]

BBM for focus.

Are you saying that the law is merely a guideline?

It might not have affected the sheriff's investigation, but the coroner himself states it affected his own invesigation:

"Well it compromises my investigation one hundred percent," Watson said.

Source: http://www.examiner.com/article/low...teen-s-body-was-moved-crime-scene-compromised

Just FYI, the letter writer is a woman.

http://www.wctv.tv/news/georgianews/headlines/Coroner-Claims--203428171.html#storyTitleSummary

"Well it compromises my investigation one hundred percent," Watson said. "I don't know what the county did when they got there on the scene. The body had been moved. The scene, in my opinion, had been compromised."

Yes, the body had been moved and the scene compromised by the gym teacher not LE. There were multiple agencies on the scene more than qualified to conduct the investigation. Their qualification being in crime scene investigation. The coroner isn't a MD nor a experienced investigator like the GBI. LE has stated they did not touch the body. I believe them.

I would think from now on they will call him immediately. The fact that they didn't, doesn't indicate to me that this is some kind of huge conspiracy by multiple LE agencies. It's a procedural issue they will have to address. IMO, it wouldn't have changed the outcome either way. They are not suing, because procedure wasn't immediately followed.

The bottom line is this is about whether the facts add up to a murder and conspiracy by a vast amount of different people, or an accident. This is their campaign.

It's going to take a lot more than the lack of a immediate phone call to the coroner or any other things that they have presented thus far, (a lot of which there are professional explanations for) to convince me a murder and a cover up occurred.

 

[Karmady]

They did. They pulled him slightly out of the mat.

Then when the coroner got there he was halfway out of the mat.

That's how I'm reading it anyway.

My thought on that is that they would have had to pull him out of the mat enough to check for a heartbeat/respiration -- which it's my understanding they must do even if it's obvious that there will be none. Which seems consistent with his torso being exposed. So maybe the "slightly" and the reference on page 3 aren't all that inconsistent. With slightly having the connotation "only as much as we needed to." Idk. Seems like a minor point to me. Especially since it's difficult for me to imagine how the difference between slightly removing him from the mat and moving him out up to his torso would make a significant difference to the investigation. The circumstances of him being in the mat in the first place made it virtually impossible that his body position at time of death wouldn't be altered by both the EMS and the gym teacher who found him. And also by moving the mat from vertical to horizontal. jmo

 

[vlpate]

BBM for focus.

Are you saying that the law is merely a guideline?

It might not have affected the sheriff's investigation, but the coroner himself states it affected his own invesigation:

"Well it compromises my investigation one hundred percent," Watson said.

Source: http://www.examiner.com/article/low...teen-s-body-was-moved-crime-scene-compromised

Just FYI, the letter writer is a woman.

Patrick Davis, Examiner, is playing word tricks, IMO.

For instance, from the article you cite:

Lowndes County doesn't have a medical examiner. The GBI office in Thomasville--led by Special Agent Steve Turner-- doesn't have a medical examiner. However, the investigators from the Lowndes County Sheriff's Office, GBI-Thomaville and other local agencies came to a conclusion that Kendrick Johnson died due to a freak accident-- on the same day the Lowndes County High School student was found--January 11, 2013.
The Valdosta Daily Times went with the Lowndes Co. Sheriff's Office 'theory' --discounting the elected coroner--and it was printed on the front page of their newspaper. This is well documented.

He is implying the decision to call KJ's death an accident was based on opinion and not a medical examination. Nothing about what he actually wrote is untrue. While there's not a medical examiner in Thomasville, there are labs in Decatur, Augusta, Macon, and Savannah. Reading his article one would think there was no autopsy, only opinions from the Keystone cops. From his own "well documented" link above:

The Georgia Bureau of Investigation Medical Examiner’s Office’s autopsy appears to support investigators’ conclusion of no foul play into the death of 17-year-old Kendrick Johnson, whose body was found Friday morning, Jan. 11, in Lowndes High’s old gym.

Lowndes County Sheriff Chris Prine told The Times that the autopsy, his investigators and GBI investigators found no signs of struggle.

He basically tried to divert attention away from what the autopsy revealed and place it on the "inept" officials conducting the investigation. Yet what a private medical examiner, William Anderson, with a less that stellar work ethic, says is gospel.

JMO

 

[IzzyBlanche]

Respectfully snipped.

I'm sorry, that is not the link I intended to post. I take Examiner articles with a grain of salt (or more) myself.

 

[Yoda]

FYI. Please visit the justice for KJ website. Nowhere on their website do they say they believe he was murdered. NOWHERE. IMO I think they realize it was an accident but want their son to be remembered for something. I do not mean that in a 'look at me' sense, but in a "he meant the world to us" sense.

Their appeal on the website is for" fairness, decency, and nondiscriminatory treatment" and "to seek legal and statutory redress for suspected violations of human dignity".

Amend: found a place where it asks to call us attorney to say you think it wasn't an accident.
They do have links to articles that others wrote, but the about us and donate is not about a murder. Jmo

 

[AzPistonsGirl]

IMO: prank gone wrong does not equal murder.

But I am more and more leaning toward this actually being a horrible accident, and appreciate the family's call for an investigation of any "suspected violations of human dignity." That I can get behind. IMO.

 

[Karmady]

FYI. Please visit the justice for KJ website. Nowhere on their website do they say they believe he was murdered. NOWHERE. IMO I think they realize it was an accident but want their son to be remembered for something. I do not mean that in a 'look at me' sense, but in a "he meant the world to us" sense.

Their appeal on the website is for" fairness, decency, and nondiscriminatory treatment" and "to seek legal and statutory redress for suspected violations of human dignity".

Amend: found a place where it asks to call us attorney to say you think it wasn't an accident.
They do have links to articles that others wrote, but the about us and donate is not about a murder. Jmo

Idk. There's this, depending on who the boy is and how the dad believes he "is involved."

The boy that Kenneth Johnson told me he believes is involved in Kendrick's death was on the other side of the school when Kendrick went missing.

http://mediabugs.org/bugs/kendrick-j...--valdosta-ga-

 

[Yoda]

:truce:

IMO: prank gone wrong does not equal murder.

But I am more and more leaning toward this actually being a horrible accident, and appreciate the family's call for an investigation of any "suspected violations of human dignity." That I can get behind. IMO.

Asking your honest opinion. Don't you think the parents, lawyer, would be saying they thought it might be a prank and ask for those involved to come forward? If they just believed that he was treated disrespectfully in death then why all the misdirect? Is it grief? Is it a self serving outsider who is driving the bus just to get media attention? TIA

 

[x_files]

IMO: prank gone wrong does not equal murder.

But I am more and more leaning toward this actually being a horrible accident, and appreciate the family's call for an investigation of any "suspected violations of human dignity." That I can get behind. IMO.

But, the person(s) responsible could be charged with manslaughter (accidental murder).
When they release the entire footage then I will be convinced it was an accident until then, it stinks of a cover-up.
The video should show how he ended up in the mat.

 

[vlpate]

But, the person(s) responsible could be charged with manslaughter (accidental murder).
When they release the entire footage then I will be convinced it was an accident until then, it stinks of a cover-up.
The video should show how he ended up in the mat.

Or, the family and their attorney can view the tape and tell the world what they show. The school attorney has filed for a court order to have the tapes released since no one else has as of a week or so ago.

The Johnsons could clear this all up if they would just go and view the tapes.