GA GA - Shirley, 87, & Russell Dermond, 88, Putnam Co, 2 May 2014 - #13

[STAGNUM]

Interesting that they're raising the reward again. I don't think that sounds like a good sign for the case, cuz I don't think they would raise it if they had good info.

I wonder how that works with the reward, do you need to actually solve the case to get the reward, or just give some small tip that eventually leads to help solving the case. I would imagine you would actually have to actually help solve the case.

I always wonder about why the reward is so paltry for two homicides. The Putnam County contribution is only $5K. It only adds to my suspicion that Sills has no interest in facing the killers.

 

[STAGNUM]

Also, not sure about detective sills looking like Mr. Dermond, the detective looks more like the actor Walter Brimley to me. I think that's what the detective is going for too.

While the nuwaubian cult is super interesting... but after the leader was arrested most of the cult was also arrested or ran off to Macon and surrounding cities, so I'm not sure if there is any legitimate connection to them and the detective. Most of the cult illegal activities centered around construction that wasn't up to code and allegations of sexual abuse. Murder wouldn't be a leap by any means, I just don't see any possible connection, maybe there's more info out there to connect them outside of just a good hunch?

Detective? You mean Sheriff.
The cult still exists both inside the prisons and outside. In fact some LEO have been or are members.

As far as mistaken identity, we are not talking about the smartest bunch that might do their homework and double check. 1) I suspect Sheriff Sill's property records are sealed and as such, he was not easily tracked to his home. 2) RD had a brief encounter with someone at the Publix where the video was collected. The person he spoke to has never been identified. The encounter is so very brief that it seems apparent this person is a complete stranger to RD. Perhaps the person addressed him as "Sheriff". The only discrepancy is the mustache. Did RD have a bit of fuzz that day? We don't know. But the resemblance is undeniable.

 

[fsngruv]

Sheriff Sills over reacted, pulled his gun and shot the tires out from the pickup truck the men were driving. He was exonerated of course, but what else would you expect.

Can you provide a connection to the suspects in this encounter to the nuwaubian or is the same connection you've made with sills and dermond?

 

[Vedder]

Detective? You mean Sheriff.
The cult still exists both inside the prisons and outside. In fact some LEO have been or are members.

As far as mistaken identity, we are not talking about the smartest bunch that might do their homework and double check. 1) I suspect Sheriff Sill's property records are sealed and as such, he was not easily tracked to his home. 2) RD had a brief encounter with someone at the Publix where the video was collected. The person he spoke to has never been identified. The encounter is so very brief that it seems apparent this person is a complete stranger to RD. Perhaps the person addressed him as "Sheriff". The only discrepancy is the mustache. Did RD have a bit of fuzz that day? We don't know. But the resemblance is undeniable.

IMO Sills and Mr. Dermond look nothing alike. Now Sills and Wilford Brimley, they look like they could be brothers.

 

[auburnmomof2]

My opinion only...I still have a strong feeling this was someone related or in a relationship with someone related to them. Early on there were social media posts that led me to believe this. Nothing nefarious but just interesting. This was a very personal crime in my opinion. And I think it had to do with family secrets. We never know what truly goes on behind closed doors in families. Not victim blaming at all! Nothing would ever justify this type of violence. But I truly think the motive was revenge for something that happened many many years prior. I also wish the gbi had assisted early on. I think it would have been solved with outside help

 

[airportwoman]

The only feeling I have about it is that when and if an arrest is made, it's either going to be a complete no-brainer, or it's going to knock a lot of people's socks off.

 

[auburnmomof2]

The only feeling I have about it is that when and if an arrest is made, it's either going to be a complete no-brainer, or it's going to knock a lot of people's socks off.

I just hope they finally arrest the correct perpetrators

 

[Rush4087]

Does anybody know if Russell & Shirley owned any Bitcoin? Maybe kept it in a hard wallet? I haven't seen it mentioned in the thread.

Even if you bought only 2-3k worth of Bitcoin in '10 or early '11, I think it would've been worth 1-2 million by early '14

Jmo

 

[Hansen]

Can you provide a connection to the suspects in this encounter to the nuwaubian or is the same connection you've made with sills and dermond?

I don't claim this as a connection. That said, here's some info about the Nuwaubian cult with Sheriff Sills and Putnam County mentioned multiple times. https://www3.trincoll.edu/csrpl/RINVol9No1/Cult Fighting in Middle Georgia.htm

Also this

Middle Georgia's cult legacy: the Nuwaubian Nation

PUTNAM COUNTY, Ga. --- The United States is no stranger to cults. Whether it's Jim Jones' Jonestown, Charles Manson's Family, or the Branch Davidians of Waco, cults have been a fascinating part of American history. Cults have even found their way here to Middle Georgia. To learn about that, you...

wgxa.tv

 

[Valiant]

People keep bring up the cult, but no one can establish any relationship between the cult and the Dermonds. It's just grasping at straws in my opinion.

 

[Cedars]

People keep bring up the cult, but no one can establish any relationship between the cult and the Dermonds. It's just grasping at straws in my opinion.

Echos of Odinism (Delphi).

Something I came across made me think a bit about the possibility of two teens or similar, just messed up young buddies from the local area, wanting to commit a 'perfect crime'.

It helps explain two different methods for disposing of the two victims. The victims chosen only for the privacy of their location, easy for two perps to overpower them and a dislike of "rich old people". Local knowledge for how to successfully approach the property, use a boat, where to hide Shirley's remains. Could even have practised, just to enjoy planning it all out.

JMO

 

[Rush4087]

Detective? You mean Sheriff.
The cult still exists both inside the prisons and outside. In fact some LEO have been or are members.

As far as mistaken identity, we are not talking about the smartest bunch that might do their homework and double check. 1) I suspect Sheriff Sill's property records are sealed and as such, he was not easily tracked to his home. 2) RD had a brief encounter with someone at the Publix where the video was collected. The person he spoke to has never been identified. The encounter is so very brief that it seems apparent this person is a complete stranger to RD. Perhaps the person addressed him as "Sheriff". The only discrepancy is the mustache. Did RD have a bit of fuzz that day? We don't know. But the resemblance is undeniable.

The Nuwaubian Cult theory is one possible motive, but I don't think it's any stronger than several others that've been kicked around (well, maybe the "mob hit of RD who was in the witness protection" one..)

Family is also a possibility, and a random serial/thrill killer is not out if the question. Hell, it could even have been a GW / Reynolds golf club/community employee or a contractor who felt disrespected by one or both D's and held a grudge. Same goes for GW community neighbors/residents - even somebody from the D's church.

But back to the Nuwaubian Cult. Malachi York certainly hated Sills, and York had (and has) nothing to lose. There's likely to be former NC members floating around in the Putnam, Jasper, Morgan, Oconee, Greene, and Clarke County areas (and maybe even over towards Augusta). One or two could have taken an assignment from MY, or they could've come up with the idea on their own.

For that matter, maybe it was somebody else who Sills put in jail/prison while employing a little too much Buford T Pusser attitude. What about the pine straw guys? If I were one of them, Sills would definitely not be on my Christmas card list..

The biggest problem I have with the Nuwaubian Cult theory is that Sheriff Sills is still alive. If the cult was involved, I refuse to believe that they would just say: "Dang, wrong guy. Oh well".

No, I think they would have kept after Sills until they got him. If you hate somebody bad enough to behead them and take the head with you and murder their spouse and try to sink her body in the deepest part of the lake, you hate them enough to keep after them even after finding out that your first attempt was a case of mistaken identity.

I live an hour and a half away from Oconee, and know several people who live in Great Waters and in the other nearby Reynolds Plantation developments. I've played golf there many times. This crime shook all of Oconee. Such things just didn't (and don't) happen there. Ever.

I have followed this case since it first hit the ATL news. I'd put it in my top 5-6 WS cases that I'd most like to see solved - like, solved right now. It's been way too long. I have great disdain for Sills, but bashing him won't help solve the crime. I hope that the FBI can solve this case via DNA and possibly genetic genealogy and obtain some measure of justice for the Dermond's and their family.

All jmo

 

[concernedcitizen706]

My opinion only...I still have a strong feeling this was someone related or in a relationship with someone related to them. Early on there were social media posts that led me to believe this. Nothing nefarious but just interesting. This was a very personal crime in my opinion. And I think it had to do with family secrets. We never know what truly goes on behind closed doors in families. Not victim blaming at all! Nothing would ever justify this type of violence. But I truly think the motive was revenge for something that happened many many years prior. I also wish the gbi had assisted early on. I think it would have been solved with outside help

Can you describe these interesting social posts you saw early on, more?

 

[auburnmomof2]

Can you describe these interesting social posts you saw early on, more?

I really am hesitant to be specific. I have a very sharp memory. I will say this much, if I recall correctly, there were social media posts by someone who would have definitely known the couple, the post is specifically remember showed a picnic near water. I'm intentionally being very vague due to the nature of my recollection. I am fairly certain I submitted what I saw to authorities. I do remember that the social media post was deleted at some point. Just my opinion as always.

 

[Bibi55]

I have written a few observations after going through the Dermonds autopsy reports.

Russell Dermond Autopsy

• Cause of death: Craniocerebral trauma (severe blunt force injury to the head). IMO he wasn't decapitated in order to hide evidence.
• Decapitation: Done after death. No hemorrhage at the cut margins proves the beheading was postmortem.
• Other injuries: Multiple bruises on arms/hands and a crush injury on his left index finger consistent with defensive wounds.
• No gunshot evidence noted: No stippling, soot, or bullet fragments described (unless limited by the missing head).

Shirley Dermond Autopsy

• Cause of death: Blunt impact injury to the head.
• Multiple depressed skull fractures on the right side, consistent with a heavy, rounded blunt object. A baseball bat, metal pipe, or maybe a hammer?
• Bindings: Ankles tied together and separately with 550 paracord; cords attached to a mesh bag containing two red concrete blocks.
• No hemorrhage beneath the bindings → proves she was bound after death.
• Clothing: Fully dressed — shirt, pants, bra, underwear, socks, and sneakers.

While Shirley’s Disposal was strictly practical, IMO, Russell's was symbolic.

This also confirms (to me) that the murders were planned. The killer(s) brought the mesh bag, paracords, and red concrete blocks with them.

Yes planned well in advance and premeditated

 

[Bibi55]

Can you describe these interesting social posts you saw early on, more?

I agree with you on this. The interesting thing to me was that son Brad used to ring his parents every day/second at most going on earlier media reports. He spoke to his parents Friday night I believe (correct me if I’m wrong). Mr Dermond’s body was not found until Tuesday afternoon. It was mentioned in media Dermond’s didn’t go out at night as a rule - they were supposed to be attending the Saturday afternoon party but didn’t of course. I don’t understand if Brad kept in regular contact with his parents why an alarm wasn’t raised sooner as in my opinion one would assume he would have rang then and got no answer and that would be a concern.just my personal think. I thought Brad’s behaviour and answers to questions in media interviews were a little off. Just my opinion. Could be just me. What was said quite early on was the Dermonds had an alarm system installed in house but their daughter had told them a few weeks before murder to worry about using this. I only heard about this twice and have heard nothing since but I think it odd that the children wouldn’t want their parents to be highly protected in their house being they were in their 80s. I also find it odd the the children/grandchildren have never done things like create a Facebook page, talked to media like Dateline, 48 hours, podcasters etc to get as much publicity as possible for their parents case. These brutal murders were certainly preplanned and premeditated well in advance. The murderers knew that there was a party that Saturday that many residents would be at, they knew the Dermond’s alarm system didn’t work, they knew the security system for entry to the complex was not working, they knew that that weekend most of the Dermond’s neighbours were not in residence as some were overseas or at other homes. It was perfect opportunity for murderers to strike. Just my opinion based on my own observations. I hope they follow up the dna down ancestry root. It’s frustrating things to do with dna take so long.

 

[Canaille]

I have written a few observations after going through the Dermonds autopsy reports.

Russell Dermond Autopsy

• Cause of death: Craniocerebral trauma (severe blunt force injury to the head). IMO he wasn't decapitated in order to hide evidence.
• Decapitation: Done after death. No hemorrhage at the cut margins proves the beheading was postmortem.
• Other injuries: Multiple bruises on arms/hands and a crush injury on his left index finger consistent with defensive wounds.
• No gunshot evidence noted: No stippling, soot, or bullet fragments described (unless limited by the missing head).

Shirley Dermond Autopsy

• Cause of death: Blunt impact injury to the head.
• Multiple depressed skull fractures on the right side, consistent with a heavy, rounded blunt object. A baseball bat, metal pipe, or maybe a hammer?
• Bindings: Ankles tied together and separately with 550 paracord; cords attached to a mesh bag containing two red concrete blocks.
• No hemorrhage beneath the bindings → proves she was bound after death.
• Clothing: Fully dressed — shirt, pants, bra, underwear, socks, and sneakers.

While Shirley’s Disposal was strictly practical, IMO, Russell's was symbolic.

This also confirms (to me) that the murders were planned. The killer(s) brought the mesh bag, paracords, and red concrete blocks with them.

I’ve always felt his death was symbolic.

 

[stmarysmead]

I live in a lakefront community like this. Although the most logical theory is entry and exit by the lake, there is a more ‘invisible’ way. Lakefront homes take full advantage of that view…large windows, decks, beaches, docks. Many eyes can also be watching that view, using their docks or even sitting on a deck at night. Wasn’t their home on a narrow stretch of the lake? More eyes across the cove as well.

But we have many types of workers and their trucks that provide upkeep on community areas, golf course and other amenities. They and their vehicles move in and out of the gates at will and many of these employees are personally unknown to residents.

Mrs Desmond could have easily been taken out of the area in a vehicle and dumped in a more secluded area of the lake. I wonder if they had any issues or confrontations with any community employees?

 

[Cedars]

Mrs Desmond could have easily been taken out of the area in a vehicle and dumped in a more secluded area of the lake. I wonder if they had any issues or confrontations with any community employees?

I believe that is, or at one point was, the Sheriff's theory.

My question is, if she was taken by vehicle, why would they/he bother to then later transfer her to a boat?

Sadly, there are innumerable cases of victims taken by vehicle to some remote place on land, where they won't be found.

Putting a victim in a boat and taking them out to the middle of lake, rarely happens, unless the crime involves a boat to begin with.

And then, unless her killers had their own private boat launch, they'd have to use a public one, and transfer her from the vehicle into the boat, with a high likelihood of CCTV cameras. The idea that a public boat launch is more private than the shoreline of their property (or neighbour's property), doesn't leap out as obvious to me.

Another thing is that everybody knows a vehicle often involves witnesses/camera descriptions of the make and color, and potentially license plate. Although the cameras weren't actually working at the gate, I doubt the perps knew that.

It also leads to criminal conviction because the victim will shed DNA, even if they're not harmed. It's not usually desireable to get rid of a vehicle. Whereas a small outboard boat - even if witnessed - is rarely identifiable, and can easily be hosed down and sold.

JMO

ETA: everybody who had ever worked in the community was interviewed/ polygraphed with assistance of the FBI.

 

[Danaya]

I’ve always felt his death was symbolic.

I agree. I think the symbolism is key here, and it's what keeps drawing me back to this case. I know many people online believe Russell was shot in the head as fact and that the decapitation served a practical purpose only—to remove ballistic evidence. But that doesn't make sense to me when I look at the level of planning involved.

Consider what the killer(s) brought with them: zip ties for Shirley, tools capable of cleanly decapitating Russell in a single cut (according to the autopsy), and cinder blocks to weigh down Shirley's body. They were able to move Shirley's body nearly five miles down the lake without being spotted. That indicates careful consideration, potential research, and deliberate execution. Nine years later, they remain completely off law enforcement's radar.

So why would someone this careful use a traceable gun and then have to resort to the extreme measure of decapitation in order to hide it? If they were concerned about ballistic evidence, they could have used a ghost gun, stolen gun, or simply not used a gun at all. Russell was a big man but he was elderly. The decapitation-as-practical-solution theory assumes sophisticated planning in every other aspect but a critical oversight with the murder weapon.

Let me focus on the forensic evidence. The autopsy found no gunshot residue on Russell's body. Later testing detected trace amounts on his shirt collar, which the sheriff acknowledged could have come from other sources, including Russell's habit of shooting squirrels in the attic. No bullet, bullet fragments, or shell casings were recovered from the scene.

A killer this careful wouldn't make a mistake that required beheading to fix. They'd plan the method of death from start to finish. They would have given their decision as to what weapon to use the same careful consideration that they gave to everything else—like the fact that they brought a mesh bag in order to contain the cinder blocks, making it easier to secure them to Shirley's body.

Instead, they may have deliberately chosen decapitation to make investigators focus on the how and why of the beheading itself, rather than the more crucial questions—who had motive, means, and opportunity? It's a dramatic and disturbing act that dominates the investigation as well as public discourse. We're all talking about the missing head, even now.

So, based on the evidence and nature of the crime, I can think of several possibilities for why Russell was decapitated:

• An act of revenge for a serious wrong, whether real or perceived, that someone believed Russell committed against them
• A symbolic message intended for someone specific: perhaps a business associate, family member, or criminal contact who would understand its meaning, or to send a message to a member of the Dermond's family or the killer's associates
• A sign that Russell has been killed, his head taken as a trophy, or as an assertion of power
• A financial motive disguised by theatrical violence—perhaps someone who stood to gain from their deaths (inheritance, business dealings, insurance) but staged the crime to appear far more sinister, possibly mimicking cartel-style brutality to misdirect investigators away from following the money
• A professional hit with intentional misdirection, not mob-style (as the sheriff noted, hitmen don't typically do all this) but maybe hired killers who deliberately made it look bizarre to throw off investigation
• Sending a message about silence or betrayal—the missing head might symbolize "you talked" or "you knew too much," communicating to others who might have similar knowledge of something, such as a crime