GA - Suspicion over heat death of Cooper, 22 mo., Cobb County, June 2014, #1

[JeannaT]

You say this can happen and then relate a story where it took you less than 20 minutes to realize you had a kid missing. That's not the same thing as leaving a kid in the car for hours.

I personally do not think there is any excuse for forgetting a baby for HOURS. It's inconceivable to me. And far too often parents who had "close calls" react to these stories with a "there but for the grace of God go I" sympathy.

If the case is investigated and parent is truly considered to have forgotten, they should STILL BE CHARGED IMO because it will save countless other children's lives in the future. If the idea of a dead baby isn't enough to motivate you to pay attention, perhaps the threat of 10 years in prison or another punishment will be enough.

These days almost everyone uses a car seat with their child. I grew up in a time when my parents loaded us into a station wagon and went on road trips with us crawling all over the seats and mom holding the baby in the front.

You never see this any more because you can get a ticket immediately.

You would think that with these stories happening that more people would be more cautious, but quite the opposite is happening, more and more babies are dying horrific torturous deaths of being baked alive in a car. I'm sorry but my sympathies lie with the victim, not the parent.

RBBM.

That would work in cases of lazy mothers who purposely leave babies in the car while they shop or do whatever. That doesn't work in the case of a baby who is accidentally left in the car - because they can't remember they did it. In some cases, parents actually have no idea the baby is IN the car since their spouse put the baby in there and they have an understanding of a rotating responsibility of dropping the baby off at daycare. I've seen cases where during the flurry of action with both parents leaving for work, the baby is in placed in the car without the parent's knowledge.

When we were kids, if you had a baby in the car, it was in the front seat where you could see it. No one could "forget" the baby right there in the front seat. In the back seat, you can't see it when you get out of the car. Additionally, when and where I grew up there were virtually no families where both the husband and wife worked and used day care every day, and also shared the responsibility for who had the baby. So the chances of forgetting because it wasn't routine habit to have the baby didn't exist all that much.

I have an invention that would work. ;D You could put a fob on the car seat that would not allow you to lock the car if there was weight in the car seat. You go to "boop" the car locked and it won't boop. You would have to MANUALLY lock the car by depressing the locking mechanism closest the car seat. That would end this tragic horror. Virtually no one forgets to lock their car - that's something you do every single time so it's rote habit - and if you had to open the car door nearest the baby, you'd see the baby.

 

[Chewy]

I think people need to stop texting and being so busy and slow down and prioritize their babies. The fact that people need a "reminder" to remember a baby is just mind boggling to me. I seriously don't believe that half these people actually forgot their baby. I do think they left them on purpose in some of these cases. Just like I think some "accidental drownings" are not so accidental.


One more thing, I just thought of, I like your idea about the key fob, but the problem is two fold. First of the car industry isn't going to change the way it makes cars and incur all that cost just because a couple dozen kids were left to die in a car. It's not their problem, and by addressing it, they are playing with fire and facing million dollar lawsuits if for any reason the fob failed to work.

I would suggest a better solution would be a button on the car seat itself which can be used to lock the car. That doesn't make it a car company problem and limits it to people with babies. But again, any failure to work and we're facing huge law suits. No company is going to take on a problem that is the result of bad and careless parenting. Bad and careless parents are usually the first one to blame someone else for their own mistake.


What I would suggest is that parents need to change their routine to make sure baby is number 1. A parent could easily take a stuffed animal into the car with them and leave it on the front seat to remind them they have a baby in the back. Take a teddy bear and put it on the front seat, take a rubber ducky and put it on the dashboard. The problem isn't "forgetfulness" or "busyness" It's parents who have yet to prioritize the needs of the baby over EVERYTHING else.


http://www.nasa.gov/centers/langley/news/releases/2002/02-008.html

 

[Linda7NJ]

I forgot my son once, granted it was only from the car to inside the house..then the feeling washed over me that I was forgetting something important. So for about 2 minutes he was forgotten.

After that, I was mortified and overcome with guilt. My mother told me to always put my purse back there.

I always put my purse on the other backseat. I made it a habit.

Never forgot again.

Although, I did also drop
him off at my parents house and as I was going down the freeway, glanced up to the rear view ...forgot I had dropped him off...and went into total panic for a minute.



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[blue22]

I wonder why the car became this place where it's legally okay to forget children? If I forget my child anywhere else and he dies, I'm charged with a crime.

While it may be an "accident" to leave a child in a car, that does not absolve guilt. People are charged with accidental crimes all the time. This is a fact: parents NEGLECT to remember their children, and the children die. The child is dead, because a parent NEGLECTED to ensure sure their safety.

I think a parent should be charged with something, and it should not matter if they have to live with their baby's death. They should have to live with it, that is a natural consequence to neglectful inaction. There should be a legal consequence, as well. Not even to prevent this from happening in the future, but to hold the neglectful party responsible.

Since when did the personal hell of guilt trump following the law? By law, these parents neglect their children. By LAW.

"Neglect is frequently defined as the failure of a parent or other
person with responsibility for the child to provide needed food,
clothing, shelter, medical care, or supervision to the degree
that the child’s health, safety, and well-being are threatened
with harm"

https://www.childwelfare.gov/systemwide/laws_policies/statutes/define.pdf

This does cause me to wonder, how many parents have left their child in a car purposefully, because they knew they wouldn't be charged with a crime?

 

[Chewy]

Good observations One of the reasons I'm so suspect is the lack of desperate running to the car mid day. I don't believe people wouldn't realize at some point sooner.

 

[eileenhawkeye]

I think when LE does an investigation, they would be able to determine whether it was an accident or whether the parent chose to murder their child. If this father is killed of premeditated killing, perhaps the on-site daycare makes it more suspicious, perhaps he parked in a different lot than he normally does that is more sunny, maybe they saw him look into the car at one point in the day, maybe they found some sort of correspondence where he said he was tired of the kid, etc. The demeanor of someone who forgets their child accidentally would be very different than someone who chooses to kill their child in such a horrific way. If they have a partner, perhaps there are inconsistencies w/ their stories (if they planned it together) or the partner has suspicions that it was on purpose.

 

[FL Wannabe]

When my children were little, cell phones were not really out there - 26 and 30 years ago. However, peopole still forgot their children in cars on occasion.

I used to take my daughter to work with me, and my dad would meet me and take her home. This was before she was two years old. When she got out of the car, we would put a doll into her carseat to leave in my car and she would go into my dad's car where she had other toys and her own carseat. Well, one day a customer came ranting into the office about the idiot who left their baby in the car. Of course, I panicked that it was me! Went out to find quite a few people around my car - thinking all kinds of terrible things about me! I was lucky they didn't smash a window. I took that doll baby (that looked like a 9 month old baby) out of the car and my daughter then used a stuffed teddy bear.

I have also accidentally locked both my baby and my keys in the car on a cloudy, not hot day. First I called my dad to bring me a spare set of keys, and then I called the sheriff to sit with me in case we needed to break in to the car. That was humbling, I tell you...

Back to the case - I don't see anything new today. Wish there would be more released, but it looks like we may need to wait until mid July for the father's arraignment.

 

[T4Tide]

This case brought me to the website kidsandcars.org. There is a link to read all the stories of the accidents involving cars and kids, including back overs, front overs, accidental entrapment, power window accidents, and yes.... forgotten children in car seats. Most of these stories are written by the parents, and a good many of them are the parent "at fault." In all of these stories, the parent or caregiver thought the child was in a different location, or thought they were in the care of the other parent, or just got busy for a few minutes doing something else. I don't care how perfect you want people to think you are, if you are a parent..... especially of more than one child... there are moments where your children are not constantly in your sight. Most of us realize it within a few moments. For some of these unfortunate parents, those moments took the lives of their children. The guilt in their stories broke my heart. In the cases of parents/caregivers leaving children in the car accidentally, it isn't that they don't think of the child all day, but rather their busy brains confuse them to think the child is safely away at daycare, etc. They DO think of the children.... they just don't think for an instant that the kid is in the car.

Contrary to popular belief, I am not defending Ross..... yet. I believe there hasn't been enough info released either way. In the description of him being arrested, I assumed the struggle was because they were trying to get him away from his son to allow paramedics to do their job, and he was so upset that he had to be restrained. Not that he was belligerent.

I can think of many of these types of accidental cases.... including many drowning deaths I've heard of recently. The truth to me is that.... for the parents that these things are truly an accident, there is no legal ramification, no vicious internet poster opinions, etc., that would be worse than losing my child and knowing it was my fault. None. I think each case should be viewed and determined individually. Last year, this same thing happened to a Birmingham mother and her daughter, to which the DA decided charges were unnecessary and needlessly painful. (Katie and Ella Luong.)

All accidents happen (not just ones including children) as a result of things not going perfectly as planned. Because humans aren't perfect people. Especially after reading the stories on kidsandcars.org, I'm choosing to extend compassion before wrath.

 

[rob]

I'm not a young mother, but a 53 yr old that forgets everything. IF I had a grandchild I would perhaps put the carseat in the front, like you shouldn't do, or affix something to the steering wheel to remind me, or put my purse back there, or have the mother and my husband call me, or all of the above.
I have left a gallon of milk in the passenger side floor 5 minutes after buying it and finding it the next morning. The father mentioned above in Hartsville SC, had never taken his daughter to daycare before and simply forgot her. I could understand it. It seems obvious there is more to this case, more evidence. But I do believe it could happen, innocently, and the parent would never recover.

 

[JeannaT]

rob, grandparents don't seem to do this. This seems to be a problem nearly exclusively of parents who share parenting duties. I think we've all forgotten milk in the car.

 

[T4Tide]

I wonder why the car became this place where it's legally okay to forget children? If I forget my child anywhere else and he dies, I'm charged with a crime.

While it may be an "accident" to leave a child in a car, that does not absolve guilt. People are charged with accidental crimes all the time. This is a fact: parents NEGLECT to remember their children, and the children die. The child is dead, because a parent NEGLECTED to ensure sure their safety.

I think a parent should be charged with something, and it should not matter if they have to live with their baby's death. They should have to live with it, that is a natural consequence to neglectful inaction. There should be a legal consequence, as well. Not even to prevent this from happening in the future, but to hold the neglectful party responsible.

Since when did the personal hell of guilt trump following the law? By law, these parents neglect their children. By LAW.

"Neglect is frequently defined as the failure of a parent or other
person with responsibility for the child to provide needed food,
clothing, shelter, medical care, or supervision to the degree
that the child’s health, safety, and well-being are threatened
with harm"

https://www.childwelfare.gov/systemwide/laws_policies/statutes/define.pdf

This does cause me to wonder, how many parents have left their child in a car purposefully, because they knew they wouldn't be charged with a crime?

bbm.... actually, that's not true. There are many "accidents" where the child is not being attended that caused death. The truth is, if they were being attended, the child would be alive. Swimming pool drownings, lake drownings, furniture and swing set accidents (I know locally of 3 of these... a TV crushing, a dresser crushing, and a swing set hanging.) Abductions.... WS is filled with stories of missing children, who for a moment, were not being watched. In some of those cases, there were negligent parents. In the other half, the parent is just as much a victim of the accident as any other. If I accidentally forget my child at Target, and come running back to get them, they won't arrest me. They'll know through my tears and anxiety that it was truly an accident and everyone will smile and hug and be glad nothing worse happened. However, if I abandoned my child at Target, and there's proof of that, I should be arrested.

 

[Chewy]

This case brought me to the website kidsandcars.org. There is a link to read all the stories of the accidents involving cars and kids, including back overs, front overs, accidental entrapment, power window accidents, and yes.... forgotten children in car seats. Most of these stories are written by the parents, and a good many of them are the parent "at fault." In all of these stories, the parent or caregiver thought the child was in a different location, or thought they were in the care of the other parent, or just got busy for a few minutes doing something else. I don't care how perfect you want people to think you are, if you are a parent..... especially of more than one child... there are moments where your children are not constantly in your sight. Most of us realize it within a few moments. For some of these unfortunate parents, those moments took the lives of their children. The guilt in their stories broke my heart

Losing track of your child for few minutes and having an accident occur is not the same thing as forgetting a baby for SEVEN HOURS :facepalm:

My sympathy lies with the victim.

 

[T4Tide]

rob, grandparents don't seem to do this. This seems to be a problem nearly exclusively of parents who share parenting duties. I think we've all forgotten milk in the car.

If you go to kidsandcars.org, you will find a few stories of grandparents absolutely doing this.

 

[hikerchick]

While I do think this case is really...off...I fo want to address a few things I read upthread.

A. I dont have a mirror to see my rear facing toddler. I was advised to avoid them as they can become projectiles in a crash, and I think I'm more likely to get un a wreck than forget my child.

B. Do we know that they used the on-site daycare? When I was working, we opted not to use the most convenient facility since their values were not in line with ours.

All that being said, I highly doubt LE would charge the dad with murder without good reason.

 

[blue22]

bbm.... actually, that's not true. There are many "accidents" where the child is not being attended that caused death. The truth is, if they were being attended, the child would be alive. Swimming pool drownings, lake drownings, furniture and swing set accidents (I know locally of 3 of these... a TV crushing, a dresser crushing, and a swing set hanging.) Abductions.... WS is filled with stories of missing children, who for a moment, were not being watched. In some of those cases, there were negligent parents. In the other half, the parent is just as much a victim of the accident as any other. If I accidentally forget my child at Target, and come running back to get them, they won't arrest me. They'll know through my tears and anxiety that it was truly an accident and everyone will smile and hug and be glad nothing worse happened. However, if I abandoned my child at Target, and there's proof of that, I should be arrested.

There is a difference bewtween losing a child for a moment, and forgetting a child for HOURS and that resulting in death. If a parent looks away for a moment and their child dies, that is different than a parent forgetting a child and the child baking to death. Accidents can happen in moments, and I don't believe those are crimes. Moments are nearly always out of our control. A child in a car for the day is not a moment, nor is it out of our control.

If you forget your child in target and they are abducted and murder, at the least CPS should investigate your parenting. IMO.

 

[T4Tide]

Losing track of your child for few minutes and having an accident occur is not the same thing as forgetting a baby for SEVEN HOURS :facepalm:

My sympathy lies with the victim.

Mine does, too.... and I believe the victims are the children AND parents in these situations.


I'm not trying to be argumentative, and I don't appreciate the eye rolls, but the part I am reading and learning about isn't about parents "forgetting" babies and absolutely NOT THINKING ABOUT THEM FOR 7 HOURS. The studies are showing that these parent's brains are so preoccupied that they truly believe they've already safely secured the baby wherever it's supposed to be, or that the baby is safely with the other parent, etc. One of the stories detailed about how the baby was dressed for Luau day or something cute at daycare. Dad was supposed to take the baby that day, and he and mom had a lunchtime phone conversation. Mom asked, "What did they think of her luau costume?" It was that moment that the dad realized he didn't remember anyone's reaction to the costume and bolted out to the parking lot to find his deceased daughter. In his mind, as unfathomable as it may seem to you and me, his daughter was safe at day care.

Personally, while I am not without error, I am so thankful to be able to be a stay at home mom and not work anymore. I don't think we need gadgets and bells and whistles to fix this problem. We need parents that stay home, minimize, prioritize, and concentrate on just raising kids. We've made a two-income home a believed necessity in many people's lives, because the 4bd fully stylized with furnishing homes, two new cars, boat, every electronic gadget, and keeping up with the Jones' is a must. We need moms and dads that aren't overloaded. Those are personal priorities that people must change if they want to decrease the chances of these incidents occurring to them and their children.


I know there's no way to know, but it'd be interesting to find out how often this happens when the heat isn't excessive enough to kill the child. How many parents do this in the cooler months, only to find the child dehydrated and sleeping, not dead? Doesn't make the news, but the parent was just as "negligent." It's kinda like driving drunk. It's only a felony if the person you hit dies (depending on state laws.) I know. I was hit by a drunk driver and didn't die. He only got a DUI. His negligence was the same, however... so should the legal ramifications be?

 

[Linda7NJ]

IMO human beings didn't evolve to be tasked with so many things.
IMO the vast majority of cases where children are truly forgotten...parents had a change in routine or simply had far too much to keep track of.

All IMO


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[blue22]

Mine does, too.... and I believe the victims are the children AND parents in these situations.


I'm not trying to be argumentative, and I don't appreciate the eye rolls, but the part I am reading and learning about isn't about parents "forgetting" babies and absolutely NOT THINKING ABOUT THEM FOR 7 HOURS. The studies are showing that these parent's brains are so preoccupied that they truly believe they've already safely secured the baby wherever it's supposed to be, or that the baby is safely with the other parent, etc. One of the stories detailed about how the baby was dressed for Luau day or something cute at daycare. Dad was supposed to take the baby that day, and he and mom had a lunchtime phone conversation. Mom asked, "What did they think of her luau costume?" It was that moment that the dad realized he didn't remember anyone's reaction to the costume and bolted out to the parking lot to find his deceased daughter. In his mind, as unfathomable as it may seem to you and me, his daughter was safe at day care.

Personally, while I am not without error, I am so thankful to be able to be a stay at home mom and not work anymore. I don't think we need gadgets and bells and whistles to fix this problem. We need parents that stay home, minimize, prioritize, and concentrate on just raising kids. We've made a two-income home a believed necessity in many people's lives, because the 4bd fully stylized with furnishing homes, two new cars, boat, every electronic gadget, and keeping up with the Jones' is a must. We need moms and dads that aren't overloaded. Those are personal priorities that people must change if they want to decrease the chances of these incidents occurring to them and their children.


I know there's no way to know, but it'd be interesting to find out how often this happens when the heat isn't excessive enough to kill the child. How many parents do this in the cooler months, only to find the child dehydrated and sleeping, not dead? Doesn't make the news, but the parent was just as "negligent." It's kinda like driving drunk. It's only a felony if the person you hit dies (depending on state laws.) I know. I was hit by a drunk driver and didn't die. He only got a DUI. His negligence was the same, however... so should the legal ramifications be?

That is their fault, and not something that can't be controlled. It terrifies me, that business is a valid excuse for a babies death.

Can you link to these studies?

 

[T4Tide]

While I do think this case is really...off...I fo want to address a few things I read upthread.

A. I dont have a mirror to see my rear facing toddler. I was advised to avoid them as they can become projectiles in a crash, and I think I'm more likely to get un a wreck than forget my child.

B. Do we know that they used the on-site daycare? When I was working, we opted not to use the most convenient facility since their values were not in line with ours.

All that being said, I highly doubt LE would charge the dad with murder without good reason.

bbm.... I agree, and am hoping we get insight soon to what they may or may not know.

 

[blue22]

IMO human beings didn't evolve to be tasked with so many things.
IMO the vast majority of cases where children are truly forgotten...parents had a change in routine or simply had far too much to keep track of.

All IMO


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Again, that is not a variable outside of their control. Business and change, is not a valid excuse. You have a change in routine, you slow yourself down and make sure your kid isn't baking to death from the inside out for hours. SIMPLE.