GA - Suspicion over heat death of Cooper, 22 mo., Cobb County, June 2014, #6

[princesslisa]

That's great news for you and your husband -- thanks for educating me -- do you think that for some men this could be an ''issue'' ((meaning they resent the fact that they need some medical assistance in the fertilization)) ?

That is a sincere question -- am just wondering if for some men this could be an issue?

I know that it can be dependent on their financial situation as well - ICSI is more expensive than say doing IUI with donor sperm, for example.

Cost may have been a consideration as well. Because, I am not extremely well versed in this beyond conversations with other women, but if I'm not mistaken ICSI would incur other costs beyond just the ICSI, right? Since the embryo would then have to be implanted?

ETA: I found these figures from a clinic in the DFW area:

Timed IUI global discount

$900 (including sonograms and lab work / covers the patient up to the first pregnancy test)
Clomid IUI global discount

$950 (including sonograms and lab work / medication not included / covers the patient up to the first pregnancy test)
FSH Intrauterine Insemination

1 cycle - $1,815 (With Prepayment Discount)

(This includes the cost of semen analysis, sperm prep, and insemination. Also included are all sonograms and hormonal tests required for monitoring). Prescribed medication (FSH injections) are not included.
In Vitro Fertilization

1 cycle - $8,500 (With Prepayment Discount) Included Services: Management services, sonograms, hormone testing, anesthesia, oocyte retrieval, oocyte identification from follicular fluid, IVF culture & fertilization, intracytoplasmic sperm injection (ICSI), preparation of embryo transfer, facility fees, cryopreservation of embryos or oocytes, and first pregnancy test. Also included in this fee is cryopreservation of semen for an IVF specimen. Medication not included (Pricing adjustments will be made for patients who receive cycle monitoring at one of our designated CARE Partner Programs.)

That's a big difference in price - maybe he thought it wouldn't work any way and would get her to put a baby on the back burner. Site I used: http://www.embryo.net/fertility-cost/infertility-treatment-cost

 

[SuperTmo]

Me, too. I am paranoid about my blind spot!


Looking at the photos that have been posted of the interior of this vehicle and thinking about his height - I assume he would have to move the driver's seat back. With the car seat in the center seat - I am imagining that his head was only inches (not feet) from the baby's head. It is not a very spacious vehicle.

Do we know what kind of car seat Cooper was riding in? He was too big for an infant seat length wise from the looks of it, so I assume he was in a convertible seat for toddlers, but maybe they didn't buy him a properly fitting seat. I find it hard to believe the dad could forget Cooper in such a small car, such a short distance, etc. etc. etc.*

I have a CRV which is not much bigger than their car, and a convertible carseat would NOT fit rear facing in the center seat with the driver seat all the way extended in my CRV. The same goes for my large roomy sedan. If you tried, the drivers seat would push into the carseat which wasn't safe or recommended by the car seat tech that installed it. My ex is 6'4" and the baby's seat had to be turned around forward facing if kept in the center seat, or moved to the passenger side rear seat to make it work rear facing. Once our daughter was moved from her infant seat into a convertible seat, she had to sit on the passenger side rear seat because we wanted her rear facing still.

 

[JLSChook]

No he wasn't. I don't think many thought he was THAT weird that he would murder so many women, but not many people had nice things to say about him, expressed any surprise whatsoever, and he had no family or friends attend his court appearances. The nicest thing that was said about him in this article is that he was "generally liked" in school but too awkward to function socially.

It's an interesting thing to think that someone could be a monster and keep it hidden, but in fact, it doesn't happen. You just don't get murderers with a throng of well-adjusted normal people standing there saying that can't be true.

http://crime.about.com/od/serial/p/tedbundy.htm

It happens in almost every single case. (that 'almost' is for Judicious )

I'm going to repost something I posted on one of the last threads and then I'm done with this issue.

I can't believe there are still people that think because friends, family, or neighbors think someone is a good person, great parent, wonderful family man, etc....means they aren't capable of something horrific.

If anyone is being honest with themselves, what is the most prominent thing we hear from people wrt people who commit murder, even serial killers?

**He/she was such a nice guy/gal, I can't believe it**

**He/she was a great neighbor, always helpful, and loved playing with the kids**

**I'm in shock. I never thought 'insertnamehere" would do something like this**

Every. Single. Case.

By the way, Ted Bundy and John Wayne Gacy were both pillars of their community, and described as pleasant, kind, nice, generous and NORMAL.

Until they weren't.

 

[popsicle]

Not very often, really.

There are very few cases where people are fooled by murderers - besides acquaintances I mean.

I know it's been said here that Harris must be a narcissist - but wives KNOW that. Acquaintances don't - but close family and wives do.

If someone is roundly beloved by family and live long friends, you can believe it. IMHO.

So Scott Peterson's family all knew/know?

 

[newone]

Not very often, really.

There are very few cases where people are fooled by murderers - besides acquaintances I mean.

I know it's been said here that Harris must be a narcissist - but wives KNOW that. Acquaintances don't - but close family and wives do.

If someone is roundly beloved by family and live long friends, you can believe it. IMHO.

Mark Hacking devout man came from a loving large family of medical professionals, large community support all supported him and he murdered his wife and unborn child ((lied about it of course)) and she ended up in landfill

he fooled everyone

 

[Nana46]

Mark Hacking devout man came from a loving large family of medical professionals, large community support all supported him and he murdered his wife and unborn child ((lied about it of course)) and she ended up in landfill

he fooled everyone

I am trying to remember if he ever gave a reason....I remember Lori's mom was the epitome of a wonderful person...no hatred from her.

 

[JeannaT]

Is this another one from today? It's in Philly

http://www.nbcphiladelphia.com/news...1.html?_osource=Newltr_Station_Hdlines_Philly

2 Infants, 3 Kids Left in Car, Woman Facing Charges

ETA--Kids are all fine, thank God!

In order to be charged with a crime you have to commit one.

This isn't a good situation, for sure, and it's more of a concern that she's a day care owner.

BUT, in Pennsylvania it's legal to leave kids 6 and older in an unattended car, and it's legal to leave babies in a car if they're "attended". There is no minimum age for babysitters in the state.

This probably won't be followed by the media, but I'd like to see what law she violated, since it's technically legal to do what she did.

 

[newone]

betrayal of our faith in another human's character is very painful

 

[Chewy]

The Blagg family on and on, I think I'm just going to ignore some discussions LOL

 

[Lovejac]

I think some people might be scared to think that they could be fooled by someone they think they know well. I don't blame them though. It's very frightening to think you could be fooled and become a victim, but it happens. And it happens a lot.

 

[JeannaT]

So Scott Peterson's family all knew/know?

Most of his friends and family deserted like rats.

On second thought, I don't want to get into Scott Peterson here. I'm bowing out of the "discuss Scott Peterson" topic.

So, carry on.

 

[laceandruffles]

Asking someone else to call 911 could be out of consciousness of guilt. 911 calls are usually admitted at trial. By getting someone else to make it, his demeanor and words on the call were avoided. What this jerk didn't expect was the negative opinions of people who were there which are far more damaging than any performance on a 911 call.

JMO

I don't think asking someone else to call 911 is all that odd. What is odd is that RH was on the phone when LE arrived. So he was of sound mind to make calls. I wouldn't be surprised to find out he had called LH.

 

[MyBelle]

Not very often, really.

There are very few cases where people are fooled by murderers - besides acquaintances I mean.

I know it's been said here that Harris must be a narcissist - but wives KNOW that. Acquaintances don't - but close family and wives do.

If someone is roundly beloved by family and live long friends, you can believe it. IMHO.

BBM. [modsnip]. Wives are usually in denial and think the controlling actions are out of love and thus don't figure it out until the narcissist finally turns on them.

From her remarks at the funeral, the wife in this case is still in the denial stage.

JMO

 

[JeannaT]

Mark Hacking devout man came from a loving large family of medical professionals, large community support all supported him and he murdered his wife and unborn child ((lied about it of course)) and she ended up in landfill

he fooled everyone

I remember that story, and thought people VERY quickly said oh wow, we didn't expect him to be a murderer.

No one said he couldn't possibly be a murderer.

And really, I think his wife was more beloved than he was. It does seem she didn't know.

But it became clear immediately that his character was terribly flawed. He was leading a life of a lie all along. Whether they knew it or not, it was very clear immediately what he was - a fraud.

I don't see that here in this case. There is no dog mean enough to bite him.

 

[newone]

I am trying to remember if he ever gave a reason....I remember Lori's mom was the epitome of a wonderful person...no hatred from her.

he had lied about being accepted at med school ((they were moving to NC because he lied about being accepted -- his wife found out about it after she was given big send off party by coworkers -- she was the breadwinner )0

he had lied to his parents about attending school ((they funded it)) for several years -- to cover up the lie he said he was accepted at NC -- wanted the geographic cure?

he couldn't risk being found out that he was lying....

 

[JeannaT]

BBM. Nonsense. Wives are usually in denial and think the controlling actions are out of love and thus don't figure it out until the narcissist finally turns on them.

From her remarks at the funeral, the wife in this case is still in the denial stage.

JMO

That's not my experience in life.

My experience is that there are a lot of guys who are glib, generally well-liked and do fairly well in sales or politics.

But they have few really true long term friends and their wives say after the divorce "you didn't really know him".

 

[Lovejac]

Shouldn't we be getting a new thread soon?

 

[newone]

I remember that story, and thought people VERY quickly said oh wow, we didn't expect him to be a murderer.

No one said he couldn't possibly be a murderer.

And really, I think his wife was more beloved than he was. It does seem she didn't know.

But it became clear immediately that his character was terribly flawed. He was leading a life of a lie all along. Whether they knew it or not, it was very clear immediately what he was - a fraud.

I don't see that here in this case. There is no dog mean enough to bite him.

Mark also ''stuck by'' his story that she went missing while jogging.....

those horrendous days in the landfill etc -- those could have been eliminated if he had told the truth....

not sure if anyone has the whole truth in this case YET MOO....

 

[Karmady]

The security guards, cameras and swiping to me was no surprise as he works for HD. And I think his location was the main headquarters. It is one of the largest corporations in the US.

Right? I doubt it's a surprise to the defendant, either.

 

[jjenny]

No he wasn't. I don't think many thought he was THAT weird that he would murder so many women, but not many people had nice things to say about him, expressed any surprise whatsoever, and he had no family or friends attend his court appearances. The nicest thing that was said about him in this article is that he was "generally liked" in school but too awkward to function socially.

It's an interesting thing to think that someone could be a monster and keep it hidden, but in fact, it doesn't happen. You just don't get murderers with a throng of well-adjusted normal people standing there saying that can't be true.

http://crime.about.com/od/serial/p/tedbundy.htm

I don't think anything can be further from the truth.
In plenty of cases murderers were described as wonderful people by friends and family.
In Scott Peterson's case, Laci's family believed him to be the perfect husband.
Never mind his own family.