George Zimmerman/Trayvon Martin General discussion

[corundogs]

Under Florida law, one only has to be in reasonable fear of their live in order to use self defense.

GZ should not have to wait until he was nearly killed before pulling out his gun in order to save his life.

You are absolutely right!

However, I am talking about GZ's own words. And the evidence we have been presented this morning (well, I assume the fact that Guy said that TM had no DNA or injuries to his hands will be proven with evidence)

Those injuries and evidence don't add up IMO to GZ's words.

 

[cityslick]

Unless you innocently just shot someone??? I would be like "OMG! I was being attacked and I shot someone! GET HELP NOW!!!!!!!!!"

Well, if I remember what happened, someone did go up to him right after the shot and he said to call 911.

 

[Karmady]

Under Florida law, one only has to be in reasonable fear of their live in order to use self defense.

GZ should not have to wait until he was nearly killed before pulling out his gun in order to save his life.

They don't even have to fear for their life OR have any injuries at all under the Florida law. It's a reasonable belief of death or great bodily harm, iirc.

 

[katiewonders]

I have to comment about the defense atty's opening statement: Yawn! Oh my gosh, right out of the gate he is boring the jury; telling an absolutely stupid - and irrelevant - joke that shows the jury "what, this is funny to you?"; showing his thoughts are scattered; not knowing evidence (the street is named this or that), can't find his exhibit. It looked like RZ was fighting to stay awake, and I'll bet he wasn't the only one.

Is it just me, or do I like my attorneys coming out of the gate on opening confident, direct, succinct, respectful....with just a slight touch of arrogance?

I like the judge, she seems no nonsense and really, a lunch "hour". Luv it.

 

[iluvmua]

You are absolutely right!

However, I am talking about GZ's own words. And the evidence we have been presented this morning (well, I assume the fact that Guy said that TM had no DNA or injuries to his hands will be proven with evidence)

Those injuries and evidence don't add up IMO to GZ's words.

They will eventually.

All the discovery by the defense is online if you want to look at at, as well as TM's tweets and facebook page.

 

[IzzyBlanche]

I wish we could have a "no discussion" live trial thread for those of us who are at work and would simply like to know what is going on at the trial because we can't listen to it live.

Just saying.

 

[SilkySifaka]

He wasn't told - it was a suggestion. And probably because it was his neighborhood, I guess he felt some responsibility as a part of a watch group, and the person looked very suspicious. Oh, and there had been a break-in recently.

I still don't get what makes Trayvon suspicious. Wearing a hoodie is not suspicious. Being black is not suspicious. He had every right and reason to be in that townhouse complex, he was visiting his dads girlfriend and son.

WHAT made him suspicious. I didn't get it on the tape and i don't get it now. Unless it simply came down to color which i don't want to believe.

 

[Karmady]

I don't know? I can not say why or why not people did something that night. What I can do is go off the arguments and evidence we get from the case.

Right now, I have more questions about TM than I do about GZ.

I know I've heard that they did exchange a few words. Possibly the girlfriend? So I'll guess we'll find out when she takes the stand.

 

[iluvmua]

I still don't get what makes Trayvon suspicious. Wearing a hoodie is not suspicious. Being black is not suspicious. He had every right and reason to be in that townhouse complex, he was visiting his dads girlfriend and son.

WHAT made him suspicious. I didn't get it on the tape and i don't get it now. Unless it simply came down to color which i don't want to believe.

It was how he was behaving when GZ saw him.

That is what made him suspicious

 

[LaLaw2000]

You are absolutely right!

However, I am talking about GZ's own words. And the evidence we have been presented this morning (well, I assume the fact that Guy said that TM had no DNA or injuries to his hands will be proven with evidence)

Those injuries and evidence don't add up IMO to GZ's words.

I agree with you 100%, corundogs. Thanks!

 

[Night-owl]

Just wanted to say to the Websleuth moderators, thank you for creating this thread. This case is tragic in many different ways. And it's not one where there are heroes and villains. There's not an obvious "right" and "wrong", outside of individual perspectives. Hopefully everyone can keep their emotions from driving their posts. The death of Trayvon Martin has already caused a huge riff in our society. It's tragic, and it never should have happened. Please don't let that riff extend to the great community here.

 

[Nymeria]

However I think the one thing that has slanted this story is that when it came out--pics of Martin were showing a young kid in a pop warner uniform when in actuality Martin was a 6'1" high school football player and in excellent shape who quickly got the upper hand in this fight.

*Respectfully Snipped*

Just want to point out in opening State said TA was 5'11 and weighed 158 lbs.
I know that is close to 6'1, but he was no heavyweight.

ETA- adding that they said GZ was 5'8 and 180 lbs, I believe. Feel free to correct me if I am off!

 

[kaRN]

Its tough. AS a mother of sons, I have that ache in my heart for this kid. But on the other hand this was a big dude even at 17. He was not walking on the sidewalks but lurking on the property of home owners. If I saw a person in a hoodie standing on my neighbors lawn, That I knew did not belong there, I would have been suspicious too. Especially if we had break ins recently.

To me in this respect, GZ is acting just as I would. I would have been suspicious and called the police, I would have been looking for him so I could tell Police where he went.

I go to this.. If he was just wanting to hurt the kid, Or get back at all the kids causing trouble in the neighborhood, He would not have called police until after the event. Not before. Not calling them to come..

I wish he'd listened to their advice though. That's my big problem here. This entire situation may have been avoided if he had.
I do applaud GZ for getting involved though. In my downtown neighborhood people get shot in front of dozens of witnesses and somehow it's only a one or two of us who manage to 'see' anything.

 

[corundogs]

George was not on NW that night, He was going to Target on a personal errand.

<modsnip>

Cause you just helped prove my case. He wasn't even "on duty". So the fact that he is following someone, with a loaded gun, for "not appearing right" in his eyes...and then killed them...when he wasn't even on the job so to speak?

Where is the personal responsibility to NOT PUT YOURSELF IN A SITUATION WHERE YOU MIGHT BE HURT OR HAVE TO DEFEND YOURSELF???

You don't get to pass judgment on someone and decide they are doing something wrong...and then approach them for what you think is wrong...unless you have been given the authority to do so!!!

 

[ScarlettScarpetta]

I still don't get what makes Trayvon suspicious. Wearing a hoodie is not suspicious. Being black is not suspicious. He had every right and reason to be in that townhouse complex, he was visiting his dads girlfriend and son.

WHAT made him suspicious. I didn't get it on the tape and i don't get it now. Unless it simply came down to color which i don't want to believe.

HE was standing on the lawn of a neighbor of Georges. GZ knew he did not belong there. HE knew he did not live there yet there he was on a rainy night, Standing on his friends property. That is suspicious. It would be to me if I looked out and say someone standing on my neighbors lawn that did not belong there.

There were also recent break ins. It makes sense.

 

[Jane Jetson]

I actually have put dinner in the crock pot, put a load of laundry in the wash and hung up a shower curtain in the kids bathroom. Not too shabby

You're rocking it out! :smile: I wasn't even thinking of what I've done, but I guess I'll share: worked out, load of laundry, a shower and a refreshing mud pack (once a year whether I need it or not :wink!

Am I on double-secret smiley restriction? :sad:

 

[iluvmua]

I know I've heard that they did exchange a few words. Possibly the girlfriend? So I'll guess we'll find out when she takes the stand.

her testimony should be very interesting to say the least.

 

[ScarlettScarpetta]

I wish he'd listened to their advice though. That's my big problem here. This entire situation may have been avoided if he had.
I do applaud GZ for getting involved though. In my downtown neighborhood people get shot in front of dozens of witnesses and somehow it's only a one or two of us who manage to 'see' anything.

What advice? Because from what I understand he had already stopped following and was heading back to his car. I don't see how this could have been anything but following instructions.

 

[cinsbythesea]

Starting ON TIME...what a concept!

 

[SilkySifaka]

It was how he was behaving when GZ saw him.

That is what made him suspicious

He was standing around! I stand around all the time outside my place, walk on the road looking about. imo