Gilgo Beach LISK Serial Killer, Rex Heuermann, charged with 3 murders, July 2023

[Just K]

Newsday writes in today's paper they are holding hearings on the Spota/Levy deal. Harrison seems to be going off the rails. The whole system in Suffolk has been corrupted almost to the point of being beyond repair

When you say Harrison is “going off the rails,” do you mean losing it or do you mean going against the machine- to expose the corruption or to force an investigation?

 

[Just K]

In my opinion, there was nothing remarkable about Karen's appearance. She wasn't overly heavy or overly skinny...not 6 foot tall or 3 feet tall. She didn't have platinum blond hair, or pink hair. No "droopy" eye, or large birthmark. Just nothing that made her particularly stand out. She looked like a hundred girls I might have run into at a flea market. And yet somehow, this swinger picks her up for just one night, and now can say with certainty that this girl was Karen, 20+ years later ?

I mean...okay. I guess.

ETA: Add in the bullet points of a Christmas tree, a belt , Valentines Day, a sea shell on a shelf, the fire in the back yard...just seems, well, scripted. But that's just me.

Your skepticism gives us balance. Perhaps that entire night was so weird and out her usual wheelhouse that she did remember odd details.

Leaving behind a crying, seemingly scared and naked young woman may have haunted her for years. Maybe she played that night over and over in her head over the years. But, she was willing to file a legal affidavit. I guess time will tell if her story is authentic.

 

[Betty P]

Well... I'm glad you asked. Here is a little interesting detail:

Judge Timothy Mazzei is a former Town of Brookhaven councilman. Brookhaven has had *a ton* of corruption problems over the past 10-15+ years. The current town supervisor for Brookhaven is... Ed Romaine (R). Romaine, who is running for County Executive come November, if elected, will most likely replace Commissioner Rodney Harrison.

Make of that what you will.

Judge Timothy Mazzi was also Assistant District Attorney for Suffolk County... under Thomas Spota. Spota and Mazzei are former law partners. In fact, Mazzei, as ADA, was appointed to the Tankleff murders case - and refused to recuse himself when conflicts were exposed - I'll stop here because this might possibly be @hawkshaw 's wheelhouse, not mine.

Judges can be elected *or* appointed in NY. Mazzei ran unopposed back in 2014 when there were two seats open.

It's very clear John Ray had good reason to hold that press conference the other day. These connections show how close this case could be derailed in court.

Why is Macedonio representing AE? Can any locals shed light on that?

Can Gov. Hochul and Letitia James be of any help in finishing the investigation?

 

[hawkshaw]

It's very clear John Ray had good reason to hold that press conference the other day. These connections show how close this case could be derailed in court.

Why is Macedonio representing AE? Can any locals shed light on that?

Can Gov. Hochul and Letitia James be of any help in finishing the investigation?

What good reason could he possibly have?
Macedonio representing AE. Answer that question and win a free trip to DisneyLand
Hochul and James? Are you crazy?

Why did I say PC Harrison may be "off the rails"? What the heck did a police commissioner had in mind standing around like Charlie McCarthy with John Ray. It is just freaking CRAZY. Harrison is a pretty smart guy but what was he thinking???

 

[hawkshaw]

Did you know RM was told by Burke's lawyer if he wanted his license back he had to promise never to speak to me. He could then file a 440 with Judge Hudson and the felony would be reduced to a misdemeanor. apply to the court for re-instatement. Hudson doesn't seem to be doing real work anymore and seems to be cutting out paper dolls to occupy his time.

Why don't you just google" Curious case of Robert Macedonio". You should get everything you need

 

[Betty P]

What good reason could he possibly have?
Macedonio representing AE. Answer that question and win a free trip to DisneyLand
Hochul and James? Are you crazy?

Why did I say PC Harrison may be "off the rails"? What the heck did a police commissioner had in mind standing around like Charlie McCarthy with John Ray. It is just freaking CRAZY. Harrison is a pretty smart guy but what was he thinking???

John Ray made public the evidence that implicates Rex H in the murders of other victims, including Shannan Gilbert. Because some of those murders were directly or tangentially connected to members of LE, etc., those murders might never have been fully investigated and charged to Rex. The assumption was that, due to the sensitive connections and possible embarrassment to LE, these cases would be swept under the rug.

Not everyone thinks that's ok. Some might think its ok to say "Well we got Rex on these other murders, so that's enough." Showing that evidence, through those affidavits, shines a light on those cases, making it harder to ignore them.

JMO. You may have more knowledge about this situation, I'm ready to listen.

 

[x_files]

Your skepticism gives us balance. Perhaps that entire night was so weird and out her usual wheelhouse that she did remember odd details.

Leaving behind a crying, seemingly scared and naked young woman may have haunted her for years. Maybe she played that night over and over in her head over the years. But, she was willing to file a legal affidavit. I guess time will tell if her story is authentic.

I think that would be a memorable moment that would imprint in your memory! I know it would in mine!

 

[Betty P]

What good reason could he possibly have?
Macedonio representing AE. Answer that question and win a free trip to DisneyLand
Hochul and James? Are you crazy?

Why did I say PC Harrison may be "off the rails"? What the heck did a police commissioner had in mind standing around like Charlie McCarthy with John Ray. It is just freaking CRAZY. Harrison is a pretty smart guy but what was he thinking???

Re Harrison, sometimes doing the right thing is more important than political expediency.

Why is the governor and AG's involvement crazy? The Rhoden family massacre was a case in corrupt Applachia, murders committed by the offspring of a wealthy, powerful landowner. It took direct involvement of the AG, who was later governor, to make sure the case was thoroughly investigated and tried. There were no defense shenanigans like we've seen with other recent cases. A thorough investigation with clear, safe chain of custody, etc.

Sometimes those higher up the ladder, at the state police, AG level, are needed to make sure things go well. That's what AG's are for.

 

[Deleted member 117884]

In my opinion, there was nothing remarkable about Karen's appearance. She wasn't overly heavy or overly skinny...not 6 foot tall or 3 feet tall. She didn't have platinum blond hair, or pink hair. No "droopy" eye, or large birthmark. Just nothing that made her particularly stand out. She looked like a hundred girls I might have run into at a flea market. And yet somehow, this swinger picks her up for just one night, and now can say with certainty that this girl was Karen, 20+ years later ?

I mean...okay. I guess.

ETA: Add in the bullet points of a Christmas tree, a belt , Valentines Day, a sea shell on a shelf, the fire in the back yard...just seems, well, scripted. But that's just me.

What I find credible is Harrison was at the press conference.

But, I think you bring up great points.

The photo of Karen released last summer was not current to the time she went missing - was she identifiable to a one-night friend by an old photo? It was mentioned in the news that Karen was last heard from on Valentine's Day. I recall seeing photos of the Heurermann living room with a Christmas tree. A belt has been in the news. LE involvement in the case has been long speculated. I recall a neighbor of Heurermann mentioning he once saw Rex start a fire in the middle of the night. Karen running outside a house reminds me of known info about Gilbert. The basement has been in the news. Rex's place of employment in midtown is known info.

Her info could have been gleaned by paying attention to the news coverage. ?

Yeah, I would be skeptical....but would Harrison be at the press conference if the witness wasn't legit? Idk!

jmo

 

[Ruminations]

Re Harrison, sometimes doing the right thing is more important than political expediency.

Why is the governor and AG's involvement crazy? The Rhoden family massacre was a case in corrupt Applachia, murders committed by the offspring of a wealthy, powerful landowner. It took direct involvement of the AG, who was later governor, to make sure the case was thoroughly investigated and tried. There were no defense shenanigans like we've seen with other recent cases. A thorough investigation with clear, safe chain of custody, etc.

Sometimes those higher up the ladder, at the state police, AG level, are needed to make sure things go well. That's what AG's are for.

I think sometimes there is nothing politically expedient to do, so one may as well do the right thing.

I don't believe Harrison would have been there if he thought the evidence presented was not helpful, or if he believed John Ray was not a viable place people who don't trust LE to go to.

MOO

 

[Ruminations]

In my opinion, there was nothing remarkable about Karen's appearance. She wasn't overly heavy or overly skinny...not 6 foot tall or 3 feet tall. She didn't have platinum blond hair, or pink hair. No "droopy" eye, or large birthmark. Just nothing that made her particularly stand out. She looked like a hundred girls I might have run into at a flea market. And yet somehow, this swinger picks her up for just one night, and now can say with certainty that this girl was Karen, 20+ years later ?

I mean...okay. I guess.

ETA: Add in the bullet points of a Christmas tree, a belt , Valentines Day, a sea shell on a shelf, the fire in the back yard...just seems, well, scripted. But that's just me.

Well, a face with a strikingly intense emotion is more likely to be "recorded" and brought back again years later.

All the same, I'm not sure why it would matter much if it the witness were not convinced it was Karen Vergata. If her statement was more like "I have a hunch it was her because it was near Valentine's Day, but I could be wrong," woukd that make all the rest of her narrative uninteresting? Detective and gf go to Rex's house with a homeless and hungry woman just out of jail because they saw an ad placed for swingers on a message board at Le Trapeze?

To me, this is very significant, even without Karen Vergata being the woman brought along.

(I do believe the witness, FWIW. I think Ray would have left that detail out if it were iffy.)

MOO

 

[Baby baby Jane]

What I find credible is Harrison was at the press conference.

But, I think you bring up great points.

The photo of Karen released last summer was not current to the time she went missing - was she identifiable to a one-night friend by an old photo? It was mentioned in the news that Karen was last heard from on Valentine's Day. I recall seeing photos of the Heurermann living room with a Christmas tree. A belt has been in the news. LE involvement in the case has been long speculated. I recall a neighbor of Heurermann mentioning he once saw Rex start a fire in the middle of the night. Karen running outside a house reminds me of known info about Gilbert. The basement has been in the news. Rex's place of employment in midtown is known info.

Her info could have been gleaned by paying attention to the news coverage. ?

Yeah, I would be skeptical....but would Harrison be at the press conference if the witness wasn't legit? Idk!

jmo

It’s all interesting, but other than naming her police officer boyfriend and getting him to talk & confirm info and add, none of her info is likely able to stand up to cross examination nor is it conclusive. Massapequa’s a big place, many similar looking homes in suburban developments with families with similar things, probably got at least a few swinger couples in the 1990s. Driver would have definitely needed a map as pre-GPS, so driver could recall something. It’s not clear if she knew Rex and Asa by name, they have unusual, memorable names but her statement doesn’t state that she knew them by name. Nor does she say if they met at Trapeze before trip to LI (I’ve read what I think is full statement)
This witness would be asked all kinds of questions about remembering addresses, furnishings, couples faces, other couples and other partners from 1995,1996,1997. She says her relationship w RW started “in” or “around” 1996, Valentine’s Day is only 6 weeks into the year …. They swung around holidays and Valentines would be first holiday of that year. If he’s not her only swing partner from the 90s, then her “first” might by be more memorable, or her first swing with RW, on a holiday? There are so many questions she would get asked by defense: How often did you pick up extra women, did you know their names, what did you talk about for an hour long ride, did you use drugs, get high, drink, repeat swings, join other clubs, how many a year, ever get paid. Did you and RW ever talk about your concerns from that night, did he know KV before that night, talk in car on way home, etc etc.
It’s interesting and hopefully it leads to more info, for me the statement poses a lot of questions.

 

[Ruminations]

It’s all interesting, but other than naming her police officer boyfriend and getting him to talk & confirm info and add, none of her info is likely able to stand up to cross examination nor is it conclusive. Massapequa’s a big place, many similar looking homes in suburban developments with families with similar things, probably got at least a few swinger couples in the 1990s. Driver would have definitely needed a map as pre-GPS, so driver could recall something. It’s not clear if she knew Rex and Asa by name, they have unusual, memorable names but her statement doesn’t state that she knew them by name. Nor does she say if they met at Trapeze before trip to LI (I’ve read what I think is full statement)
This witness would be asked all kinds of questions about remembering addresses, furnishings, couples faces, other couples and other partners from 1995,1996,1997. She says her relationship w RW started “in” or “around” 1996, Valentine’s Day is only 6 weeks into the year …. They swung around holidays and Valentines would be first holiday of that year. If he’s not her only swing partner from the 90s, then her “first” might by be more memorable, or her first swing with RW, on a holiday? There are so many questions she would get asked by defense: How often did you pick up extra women, did you know their names, what did you talk about for an hour long ride, did you use drugs, get high, drink, repeat swings, join other clubs, how many a year, ever get paid. Did you and RW ever talk about your concerns from that night, did he know KV before that night, talk in car on way home, etc etc.
It’s interesting and hopefully it leads to more info, for me the statement poses a lot of questions.

IMO, the statement is likely valuable in ID other witnesses who might know quite a lot. Notably RW.

John Ray and Rodney Harrison both are going to be pulled through the mud at any opportunity . (Rodney will be okay if he is leaving quietly, but this presser suggests he may be willing to stir things up outside of the SCPD kitchen on his way out, so I expect the dirt slinging and rumors posted on Newsday articles to commence shortly after he gains traction.)

The last thing they need is to drop this affidavit and for their enemies to have a valid reason to debunk it. I think the odds of the witness conflating her memories with news stories and/or lying are slim to none. The witness, too, could be making statements RW wishes to keep quiet, or that might anger the old guard anti-investigation detectives.

This is not a risk John Ray or Harrison would take. And the witness is the most vulnerable of all.

It seems to me that being busted for perjury and filing a false statement would be the least of her worries. She has nothing to gain.

MOO

 

[sds71]

Lawyers involved in suspected serial killer Rex Heuermann's case share close connections to each other:​

Michael J. Brown, the lead defense attorney representing Heuermann, is a veteran lawyer whose connections in the Suffolk legal community run deep. Brown, who has been in private practice since 1995, started his legal career as an assistant district attorney in the Suffolk District Attorney's Office with Ray Tierney, now the elected district attorney. Tierney, a former federal prosecutor who is leading the team of prosecutors trying the case against Heuermann, will likely square off against Brown in a Riverhead courtroom if the case eventually goes to trial.

Also in the mix is Robert Macedonio, a longtime criminal defense attorney and matrimonial lawyer who shared a legal practice with Brown for a decade, and is now representing Heuermann's estranged wife, Asa Ellerup, in her divorce action.

Justice Timothy Mazzei, as a prosecutor in 1989, Mazzei lead the prosecution effort in the retrial of the John Pius murder case. Pius was the 13-year-old whose body was found behind a Smithtown elementary school in 1979 with stones crammed down his throat.

A key witness in the Pius case was ex-Suffolk Police Chief James Burke, a convicted felon for beating a handcuffed prisoner inside a police precinct in 2012 and then conspiring to cover it up. Burke has gotten into more legal trouble recently, with his August arrest for sexual misconduct at a county park. His case is pending…

Vess Mitev, the Stony Brook-based defense attorney and Ray's former law partner — the relationship apparently ended acrimonously, though neither side would discuss the details publicly — is representing Ellerup's two adult children.

"We just went our separate ways business-wise," said Mitev, when asked about leaving Ray's firm in 2020. "Business partnerships, like any relationship, sometimes work out and sometimes end. And this one had run its course."

Ray, for his part, called the parting "a terrible thing that happened" and added: "I don't really care about him at all. I don't really think about him. My tendency is when people hurt me, I just leave them alone."

Gilgo Beach killings: Lawyers involved in suspected serial killer Rex Heuermann's case share close connections to each other

Dissecting the connections in the Gilgo Beach case among Suffolk's legal community.

www.newsday.com

 

[girlhasnoname]

Lawyers involved in suspected serial killer Rex Heuermann's case share close connections to each other:​

Michael J. Brown, the lead defense attorney representing Heuermann, is a veteran lawyer whose connections in the Suffolk legal community run deep. Brown, who has been in private practice since 1995, started his legal career as an assistant district attorney in the Suffolk District Attorney's Office with Ray Tierney, now the elected district attorney. Tierney, a former federal prosecutor who is leading the team of prosecutors trying the case against Heuermann, will likely square off against Brown in a Riverhead courtroom if the case eventually goes to trial.

Also in the mix is Robert Macedonio, a longtime criminal defense attorney and matrimonial lawyer who shared a legal practice with Brown for a decade, and is now representing Heuermann's estranged wife, Asa Ellerup, in her divorce action.

Justice Timothy Mazzei, as a prosecutor in 1989, Mazzei lead the prosecution effort in the retrial of the John Pius murder case. Pius was the 13-year-old whose body was found behind a Smithtown elementary school in 1979 with stones crammed down his throat.

A key witness in the Pius case was ex-Suffolk Police Chief James Burke, a convicted felon for beating a handcuffed prisoner inside a police precinct in 2012 and then conspiring to cover it up. Burke has gotten into more legal trouble recently, with his August arrest for sexual misconduct at a county park. His case is pending…

Vess Mitev, the Stony Brook-based defense attorney and Ray's former law partner — the relationship apparently ended acrimonously, though neither side would discuss the details publicly — is representing Ellerup's two adult children.

"We just went our separate ways business-wise," said Mitev, when asked about leaving Ray's firm in 2020. "Business partnerships, like any relationship, sometimes work out and sometimes end. And this one had run its course."

Ray, for his part, called the parting "a terrible thing that happened" and added: "I don't really care about him at all. I don't really think about him. My tendency is when people hurt me, I just leave them alone."

Gilgo Beach killings: Lawyers involved in suspected serial killer Rex Heuermann's case share close connections to each other

Dissecting the connections in the Gilgo Beach case among Suffolk's legal community.

www.newsday.com

Oh, this case is starting to sound like the Murdaugh coverup and corruption saga. Wowzers.

MOO

 

[Baby baby Jane]

It’s all interesting, but other than naming her police officer boyfriend and getting him to talk & confirm info and add, none of her info is likely able to stand up to cross examination nor is it conclusive. Massapequa’s a big place, many similar looking homes in suburban developments with families with similar things, probably got at least a few swinger couples in the 1990s. Driver would have definitely needed a map as pre-GPS, so driver could recall something. It’s not clear if she knew Rex and Asa by name, they have unusual, memorable names but her statement doesn’t state that she knew them by name. Nor does she say if they met at Trapeze before trip to LI (I’ve read what I think is full statement)
This witness would be asked all kinds of questions about remembering addresses, furnishings, couples faces, other couples and other partners from 1995,1996,1997. She says her relationship w RW started “in” or “around” 1996, Valentine’s Day is only 6 weeks into the year …. They swung around holidays and Valentines would be first holiday of that year. If he’s not her only swing partner from the 90s, then her “first” might by be more memorable, or her first swing with RW, on a holiday? There are so many questions she would get asked by defense: How often did you pick up extra women, did you know their names, what did you talk about for an hour long ride, did you use drugs, get high, drink, repeat swings, join other clubs, how many a year, ever get paid. Did you and RW ever talk about your concerns from that night, did he know KV before that night, talk in car on way home, etc etc.
It’s interesting and hopefully it leads to more info, for me the statement poses a lot of questions.

The other detail about the “brought her from her country”? Media says she was born on LI, NY making her a US citizen, high school on LI, hardly needing to be brought to the US. If she has been US citizen since birth, her son is also US citizen (subject to paperwork) even if he was born in Iceland. I doubt there would be a conversation about Asa needing Rex to get to America if she was born 5 miles away in Farmingdale as reported in media.

 

[Justice101]

thanks for the updated people!

 

[Betty P]

Exclusive: Suffolk County sheriff says potential key witnesses in Gilgo Beach murders case are in same jail as suspect Rex Heuermann

The investigation into the Gilgo Beach serial killer has followed suspect Rex Heuermann behind bars.

www.cbsnews.com

"My staff has interviewed 141 sex workers so far," Suffolk County Sheriff Errol Toulon said.

"So far we've had 12 women that have claimed interactions with Rex Heuermann," Toulon said.

"Whether they actually had a physical encounter, was it a phone call, was it through social media. Anything we can gather from them will be very helpful," Toulon said.

I think if they work hard enough, they will be able to validate many of these stories about Rex H.

OTOH, it might work best if these sex workers tell their stories to someone like John Ray, then have the details validated by LE. Given the history of the system in Suffolk Co, etc. JMO

Incidents that took place in the late 1990's and early 2000's aren't ancient history. There's a lot of information/data that can still be accessed to verify witness statements. JMO

 

[Bree1950]

Maybe, unknown to the witness, everything was planned by her former Narcotics cop boyfriend and RH. Maybe it was the boyfriend who lied about seeing the ad for the swingers party. And maybe had arranged to collect KV, making out it was random?

I’m not sure it wasn’t someone just saying they were a Cop?!

 

[Bree1950]

LOL, I'm thick; I need a less subtle hint. Who was covering for RH?

I feel Shannon saw Rex arrive at Brewer’s and was terrified from her earlier encounter with him at the Hotel as described in the affidavit from the cab driver. This is what makes sense to me in regard to her sounding so frightened and terrified during the 911 Call. If RH and his wife were swingers and used to having couples come and go a lot from the house, his wife, most likely, wouldn’t think anything was awry for home to have girls coming and going. Some people can deceive people - it happens every day! It would not surprise me if RH had plausible stories for his behavior and was believed by those around him.