Gilgo Beach LISK Serial Killer, Rex Heuermann, charged with 4 murders, July 2023 #10

Status
Not open for further replies.
  • #621
LostGirlsMap1.png
From left to right: Peaches' remains (limbs, I believe, because her bracelets were found with them), Karen's skull, Amber, Melissa, Maureen, Megan, Asian Doe, Jessica's skull and hands and arms, Valerie's head and arms and right foot, Toddler Doe, Shannan, Pura Simancas (accidental OD, not a victim), Valerie's torso, Jessica's torso.

For the record, this is Kolker's interactive map, to be found at lostgirlsbook.com/case-map#
 
Last edited:
  • #622
From left to right: Peaches' remains (limbs, I believe, because her bracelets were found with them), Karen's skull, Amber, Melissa, Maureen, Megan, Asian Doe, Jessica's skull and hands and arms, Valerie's head and arms and right foot, Toddler Doe, Pura Simancas (accidental OD, not a victim), Valerie's torso, Jessica's torso.

For the record, this is Kolker's interactive map, to be found at lostgirlsbook.com/case-map#

Yes, I think so.
 
  • #623
Some of Peaches' remains and Karen's skull were found on Jones Beach. Next beach to the left of Gilgo. Gilgo is actually only a small part of that coast. Toddler Doe wasn't on Gilgo either. That section is Cedar Beach. Fire Island, where Karen's legs were, is further right still.

There are maps out there, some of which are more accurate than others, but I think the most comprehensive I've seen are on Reddit, and even still, one of those doesn't have the Fire Island location for Karen marked despite being wide enough in scope and showing her Jones Beach remains, so it isn't just that they don't count her. Many other maps from MSM haven't been updated with Karen, Valerie, and Jessica's names since their IDs. Despite being a bit older, the Suffolk County official map is great because it has distances marked and it's on a satellite photo that shows the land exactly, but it doesn't include the victims outside the boundaries, including all of Karen's remains, the Manorville remains, and all of Peaches' remains. Despite a few inaccuracies that I've found about the victims and being a bit out of date, Kolker's interactive map is great - except it doesn't work on mobile phones. You can only view it using a computer browser.

Basically, you have to google something like 'lisk victims map' and open a bunch of different ones in tabs and compare them. There's no one resource that covers everything easily and accurately and is also up to date.

MOO
Ok, so my question: Are parts of all the 10 victims along Ocean Parkway? I get that only four are labeled Gilgo Beach.
 
  • #624
Ok, so my question: Are parts of all the 10 victims along Ocean Parkway? I get that only four are labeled Gilgo Beach.
Looks like maybe. But not all parts of them. Manorville (Jessica and Valerie's torsos), Peaches' torso, Karen's legs, those aren't anywhere on the Parkway.

There is a google map that may be useful to you, but I don't think it's linkable. Google 'lisk map of victims' and look down the results a few entries.

MOO
 
  • #625
From left to right: Peaches' remains (limbs, I believe, because her bracelets were found with them), Karen's skull, Amber, Melissa, Maureen, Megan, Asian Doe, Jessica's skull and hands and arms, Valerie's head and arms and right foot, Toddler Doe, Shannan, Pura Simancas (accidental OD, not a victim), Valerie's torso, Jessica's torso.

For the record, this is Kolker's interactive map, to be found at lostgirlsbook.com/case-map#
Just looking at this makes me so sad and sick to my stomach. The were real people, mothers, daughters, sisters, friends, with loved ones who've been left out to rot for years and years because they weren't the 'right type' of victim for most to be concerned about.

Thank goodness for the cold case team that came in and found their monster.

All MOO
 
  • #626
There is a map that shows the distance between them, but they weren’t shoulder to shoulder. Close enough to consider some of them in groups.

I think the Gilgo 4 that RH is charged with killing have been considered by LE, by the killer, by the media and everyone as a "GROUP" with good reason. My feeling, listening to Rifkin and others talk of groups -- wouldn't just along Ocean Parkway generally also count? A common location for disposal?
Looks like maybe. But not all parts of them. Manorville (Jessica and Valerie's torsos), Peaches' torso, Karen's legs, those aren't anywhere on the Parkway.

There is a google map that may be useful to you, but I don't think it's linkable. Google 'lisk map of victims' and look down the results a few entries.

MOO
But that was the point: that reminders/remains of all 10 victims were placed along one stretch of road. How easy and simple for 1 killer to drive down and visit to re-live the events. The Gilgo 4 are an obvious grouping of four. We were told to look for another grouping of four -- and possibly it has been there the entire time.
 
  • #627
I think the Gilgo 4 that RH is charged with killing have been considered by LE, by the killer, by the media and everyone as a "GROUP" with good reason. My feeling, listening to Rifkin and others talk of groups -- wouldn't just along Ocean Parkway generally also count? A common location for disposal?

But that was the point: that reminders/remains of all 10 victims were placed along one stretch of road. How easy and simple for 1 killer to drive down and visit to re-live the events. The Gilgo 4 are an obvious grouping of four. We were told to look for another grouping of four -- and possibly it has been there the entire time.
But it's all about interpretation. What about Asian Doe? Asian Doe is placed very close to the Gilgo four. Very close. They're the same distance from Megan as Amber is, 0.28miles. They're intact (not dismembered). They're wearing clothing that suggests a gender identity that is marginalised and has a high correlation with survival sex work, especially in people of colour. Their PMI of five to ten years could place their death as early as around the time of Valerie Mack's or as late as only a year before Maureen. Given the close placement to the GB4, the chances of a correlation are high.

What if it isn't the GB4, but the GB5? What if Asian Doe was first?

That's what I mean about interpretation. It's all about what people decide is connected because of certain reasons.

What about Cherries, what about Sugar Bear? They were both dismembered and scattered around the LI area, too.

I think it's a very hard thing, with multiple known (and possibly unknown) offenders active in the area over decades, to know what should be grouped together and what shouldn't. I'm glad I'm not responsible for trying it in court.

MOO
 
  • #628
But it's all about interpretation. What about Asian Doe? Asian Doe is placed very close to the Gilgo four. Very close. They're the same distance from Megan as Amber is, 0.28miles. They're intact (not dismembered). They're wearing clothing that suggests a gender identity that is marginalised and has a high correlation with survival sex work, especially in people of colour. Their PMI of five to ten years could place their death as early as around the time of Valerie Mack's or as late as only a year before Maureen. Given the close placement to the GB4, the chances of a correlation are high.

What if it isn't the GB4, but the GB5? What if Asian Doe was first?

That's what I mean about interpretation. It's all about what people decide is connected because of certain reasons.

What about Cherries, what about Sugar Bear? They were both dismembered and scattered around the LI area, too.

I think it's a very hard thing, with multiple known (and possibly unknown) offenders active in the area over decades, to know what should be grouped together and what shouldn't. I'm glad I'm not responsible for trying it in court.

MOO
We agree, it is all about interpretation. I must confess, my focus and knowledge are much more narrow than yours. I'm discussing only the 10 bodies discovered about the same time along Ocean Parkway.

Recently, I have come to believe RH is responsible for them all and the differences in the MOs comes down to Rex's "problem solving"; perhaps his anger at the Asian male; and being surprised with a baby by Peaches.

The others aren't even on my radar at this time.
 
  • #629
We agree, it is all about interpretation. I must confess, my focus and knowledge are much more narrow than yours. I'm discussing only the 10 bodies discovered about the same time along Ocean Parkway.

Recently, I have come to believe RH is responsible for them all and the differences in the MOs comes down to Rex's "problem solving"; perhaps his anger at the Asian male; and being surprised with a baby by Peaches.

The others aren't even on my radar at this time.
There are also the unfound. I think it likely Jamie Diane Seymour fits as a possible victim. Small build, went missing in the summer, etc. etc. Fits neatly between Jessica and Maureen, bridging the interval between them. Went missing from the Port Authority like Jessica did. Is she out there somewhere in the brambles and dunes, as yet unfound? I don't know. But I think it's a serious possibility that she and others like her are.

We're dealing with a puzzle that isn't just missing the box lid, it's only got half the pieces and half of those might belong to another puzzle altogether.

MOO
 
  • #630
But it's all about interpretation. What about Asian Doe? Asian Doe is placed very close to the Gilgo four. Very close. They're the same distance from Megan as Amber is, 0.28miles. They're intact (not dismembered). They're wearing clothing that suggests a gender identity that is marginalised and has a high correlation with survival sex work, especially in people of colour. Their PMI of five to ten years could place their death as early as around the time of Valerie Mack's or as late as only a year before Maureen. Given the close placement to the GB4, the chances of a correlation are high.

What if it isn't the GB4, but the GB5? What if Asian Doe was first?

That's what I mean about interpretation. It's all about what people decide is connected because of certain reasons.

What about Cherries, what about Sugar Bear? They were both dismembered and scattered around the LI area, too.

I think it's a very hard thing, with multiple known (and possibly unknown) offenders active in the area over decades, to know what should be grouped together and what shouldn't. I'm glad I'm not responsible for trying it in court.

MOO
Suffolk and Nassau Counties, among others need to do their homework to identify these anonymous victims, then conduct investigations through the task force.
 
  • #631
Suffolk and Nassau Counties, among others need to do their homework to identify these anonymous victims, then conduct investigations through the task force.
I nominate the FBI, calling in Rodney H as a consultant team leader, plus the bring in the trooper who crunched the data and ID the suspect.

MOO
 
  • #632
I nominate the FBI, calling in Rodney H as a consultant team leader, plus the bring in the trooper who crunched the data and ID the suspect.

MOO
Speaking of which, is the FBI still part of the Task Force? NY State police? Now that Rodney is gone, you never hear ANYTHING about the Task Force's activities. Its like it disappeared. I wish someone from the governor's office would get involved. If I were a taxpayer living in NY, I would certainly be calling my Reps to learn the status of the investigation. JMO
 
  • #633
Agreed on the Task Force sort of receding into the background since RHarrison left. Hoping things don't fall apart without Rodney Harrison, and holding out hope he'll come back.

Really grateful for that map posted here because I saw that one before, had looked again for it, and could not locate it again. When I look at all these maps of the parkway, agreed they really, really are conflicting. Some have to be wrong. Some are at least incomplete. With that said, I saw one where Jessica Taylor appeared to be almost direct center in terms of the overall geography of the graveyard. To the east of Jessica Taylor, all the victims (exception of Peaches' baby) are dismembered. To the west, all victims are not dismembered, until you reach partial remains of the earliest victims (Peaches and Karen Vergata). So here's the theory on this, MOO. He killed Peaches and baby and Karen Vergata very early, these were the first victims (in relation to the Ocean Parkway graveyard) and he used the remains of these victims to mark the parameters/boundaries for himself. The westernmost end of the graveyard is pretty much directly south of his own home. This was going to be his graveyard. He then moved pretty much east to west, moving towards the western outer boundary initially established. (Doesn't include SG, but even if SG is a victim, she made a 911 call and had been screaming and drawing attention, so her case would be entirely different.) Looking at it with this theory, it makes me (MOO) almost certain Asian Male was killed in 2005. I also believe that RH's Avalanche is probably a 2004 and he purchased it to be used as a mobile murder station. I saw a video where they discussed all the features of this vehicle, it is truly "tricked out." And his methods reflect that change in vehicles (MOO).

On the Cottingham note, I don't think RH knew Cottingham. But LISK's methods as they appear (MOO) sometimes strongly resemble Cottingham's, JMO. These SKs have little fan bases and followers, and I'd guess RH would identify strongly with Cottingham. He'd undoubtedly heard a lot about him in that region. Cottingham has confessed to a lot of killings over the years, and he fairly recently (I think like spring 2021) said he might have picked up Jeannette DePalma (never solved) hitchhiking and killed her. I think spring 2021 is right around the time RH started using a fake email ("Thawk") with the dob 080672, which would be the day before Jeannette DePalma disappeared. I'm trying to figure out if RH had used the same August dob with prior aliases, but I can't tell in terms of the way the bail document is worded. Agreed Cottingham is truly frightening. I watched an interview of Cottingham and he was (very casually) noting how the last meal for a lot of these girls was pizza, I really did start getting almost ill watching him, and did have nightmares.
 
  • #634
And here's what I could find on his vehicle:
"Longer than a Suburban, the Chevy Avalanche combines the passenger-pampering comfort of a Tahoe with the load-hauling capability of a long-bed Silverado pickup. Continues: Offers the "utility of an eight-foot bed yet needs seating for four, five or six people...The key to its versatility is its clever Midgate, which is like having a second tailgate between the cabin and the pickup box. Normally, the Avalanche can carry five adults in comfort and a large amount of cargo in a covered, 5-foot 3-inch indestructible bed. But when you need more space, the rear seats fold down, the Midgate folds forward, and voila! You have an eight-foot bed capable of hauling 4x8-foot sheets of plywood. And your plywood, or drywall, stays dry inside the covered bed, out of the rain....The people who designed this truck were into fishing, hunting and boating; they knew the needs of outdoor enthusiasts, and they have provided for those needs with flush-mounted cargo lights that illuminate the bed, foldaway tie-down hooks, and footholds and handholds for climbing onto the bed. The hard cargo cover over the bed is made of a highly rigid material that can easily support your weight."

Okay, and as I look, I did find this:
This is like a demonstration of the size expansion.

Here's another video similar to this: https://gmauthority.com/blog/2019/0...olet-avalanche-mid-gate-transformation-video/

And I can't include this other link because it's too lengthy a URL, but it notes how they used this feature to turn the truck into a stealth camper with the lid on. However, that's a 2012, and not sure if that would work with this vehicle.

I saw some other discussion on video for the vehicle and I think it was directly in conjunction with RH, but I cannot find it anywhere. But based on watching a few of these videos, use of the midgate could (I would think maybe, but still watching videos) give him the possibility of at least some climate control in the bed. And just located this: "2004 Chevrolet Avalanche 5.3L specs: mpg, towing capacity, size ... Built on the Silverado chassis and powered by either a 5.3L or 8.1L V-8 engine, the Avalanche is a four-door vehicle capable of seating six in its SUV-like interior, while still providing a 5ft. truck bed. Or, by folding down the Midgate and rear seating, one person can reconfigure the cargo area in seconds to provide either an open, or fully enclosed and lockable 4ft. x 8ft. cargo box."

I'm wondering if he could have done very long distance trips on this and disposed of remains en route from Las Vegas. Also still wondering how this vehicle would stack up against his prior vehicle.
 
Last edited:
  • #635
Exact locations where they were found (and were last seen). Hit the [ ] icon in the top right-hand corner to view it in fullscreen mode.

 
  • #636
Came across this creepy doll from the 1960s, I’m not sure if it’s been discussed here yet but the similarities to this case cannot be overlooked!

‘Little Miss No-Name’ HASBRO 1965

“The impoverished doll came without shoes and dressed in a burlap sack with patches and a safety pin holding the outfit together.

With large sad brown eyes, a drooping mouth, and mop of unkempt blond hair, Little Miss No-Name’s piteous state was accented by a large plastic teardrop that could be inserted into a hole under her one of her eyes. Adding to her plight, the doll’s hand was molded such that, when her arm was extended, she appeared to be begging.”

The doll looks EXACTLY like the drawing of the sad girl taken from RH’s house. I hope the URL posted works, I haven’t attached one before!



Little Miss No-Name from Hasbro (1965) | Toy Tales
 
  • #637
Came across this creepy doll from the 1960s, I’m not sure if it’s been discussed here yet but the similarities to this case cannot be overlooked!

‘Little Miss No-Name’ HASBRO 1965

“The impoverished doll came without shoes and dressed in a burlap sack with patches and a safety pin holding the outfit together.

With large sad brown eyes, a drooping mouth, and mop of unkempt blond hair, Little Miss No-Name’s piteous state was accented by a large plastic teardrop that could be inserted into a hole under her one of her eyes. Adding to her plight, the doll’s hand was molded such that, when her arm was extended, she appeared to be begging.”

The doll looks EXACTLY like the drawing of the sad girl taken from RH’s house. I hope the URL posted works, I haven’t attached one before!



Little Miss No-Name from Hasbro (1965) | Toy Tales
OMG, this puts those (insert curse here) "time-out" dolls back in my head. I just hated the sight of those flipping dolls.

I can see why you're noting this, seriously, with this poor little burlap clad doll. This was one freakish, morbid killer. And here's an equally freakish, morbid doll. Did anybody catch that they removed an art exhibition poster from his home for the Liechtenstein Princes collection? Was at Metropolitan Museum in like 1985. Link:

 
  • #638
Came across this creepy doll from the 1960s, I’m not sure if it’s been discussed here yet but the similarities to this case cannot be overlooked!

‘Little Miss No-Name’ HASBRO 1965

“The impoverished doll came without shoes and dressed in a burlap sack with patches and a safety pin holding the outfit together.

With large sad brown eyes, a drooping mouth, and mop of unkempt blond hair, Little Miss No-Name’s piteous state was accented by a large plastic teardrop that could be inserted into a hole under her one of her eyes. Adding to her plight, the doll’s hand was molded such that, when her arm was extended, she appeared to be begging.”

The doll looks EXACTLY like the drawing of the sad girl taken from RH’s house. I hope the URL posted works, I haven’t attached one before!



Little Miss No-Name from Hasbro (1965) | Toy Tales
Considering how some kinks work, there might be something to this. Also...unfortunately it's easy to take advantage of impoverished ladies of the night.
 
  • #639
Came across this creepy doll from the 1960s, I’m not sure if it’s been discussed here yet but the similarities to this case cannot be overlooked!

‘Little Miss No-Name’ HASBRO 1965

“The impoverished doll came without shoes and dressed in a burlap sack with patches and a safety pin holding the outfit together.

With large sad brown eyes, a drooping mouth, and mop of unkempt blond hair, Little Miss No-Name’s piteous state was accented by a large plastic teardrop that could be inserted into a hole under her one of her eyes. Adding to her plight, the doll’s hand was molded such that, when her arm was extended, she appeared to be begging.”

The doll looks EXACTLY like the drawing of the sad girl taken from RH’s house. I hope the URL posted works, I haven’t attached one before!



Little Miss No-Name from Hasbro (1965) | Toy Tales
Is there a pic of the sad girl drawing in the group anywhere?
 
  • #640
Status
Not open for further replies.

Staff online

Members online

Online statistics

Members online
125
Guests online
2,735
Total visitors
2,860

Forum statistics

Threads
632,216
Messages
18,623,622
Members
243,059
Latest member
mirandajuly4th
Back
Top