Gilgo Beach LISK Serial Killer, Rex Heuermann, charged with 7 murders, July 2023 #15

[wcasewatch]

There is no reference to John Bittrolff in the affadavit and no mention of Burke or Heuermann smoking crack, it doesn't even have them in the same room together. Are you getting Alice Poe confused with someone else?

Poe's affidavit mentions that Burke and Heuermann were at the party. It says that Burke attempted to give her crack cocaine, and that he was offering people hits from a crack pipe. <modsnip - no link> Bittrolff and Macedonio were not mentioned in the affidavit. Either because she added that part later when talking with others or because Ray realized it sounded too ridiculous, even for his standards.

Not that any of this matters. The affidavit is far too detailed for someone who is supposedly remembering an event from 30 years ago. She said that Heuermann was leaning against a wall at a 45-degree angle... That's a very flexible man.

 

[FromGermany1]

I come to the conclusion, that RH must be a genius. How did he find time to work as an employed or self-employed architect besides his mannny "hobby interests"?? It seems, he would have needed at least 2 lives for all his stuff and duties.

 

[snarast]

I come to the conclusion, that RH must be a genius. How did he find time to work as an employed or self-employed architect besides his mannny "hobby interests"?? It seems, he would have needed at least 2 lives for all his stuff and duties.

Yeah. Or perhaps he memorized 1000+ codes to impress people - and is good at weeding out sociopaths when he was hiring. So that they would actually do their jobs instead of spending their time playing manipulative games. You know, like having Ivy league females cleaing toilets.

But yes, he seems to be rather unique in this sense among serial killers.

 

[james.coff]

<modsnip - discussing moderation>

Example: Ray once went live on air and claimed that Shannan may have had a neat hole drilled into her hyoid. He stated that the SC medical examiner didn't know what had caused the hole. This was false, as the medical examiner theorized that it had been caused by a relatively common cyst that often goes unnoticed. Michael Baden (who Ray hired), did not dispute this. In fact, Baden didn't even mention the small hole.

Two medical professionals saw nothing suspect about this hole, yet Ray ran with the theory that someone, for reasons unknown, had gone through the effort of drilling a hole into her hyoid.

Bizarre and irresponsible conspiracy peddling.

The SC autopsy report said "The body of the hyoid contains a small, circular lesion, which may be the result of a thyroglossal cyst or other pathology." The photo in that report looks like it is a hole, but that could have been the way the copy came out. I can't find any video of John Ray saying "Shannan may have had a neat hole drilled into her hyoid". DO you know what live video it was?

 

[james.coff]

I appreciate all Tierney has done since Rodney Harrison assembled the awesome task force.

But it remains strange and forced when he blows off the biggest witnesses he has!

Just because Rex appears to have hidden his activities, that does not mean the family has no information. Maybe the notorious slob scrubbed the bathroom often when they went on vacation. That would be extremely helpful information to prosecutors. The family does not have to be involved to be witnesses. While it is probable they were not criminally involved it is not probable or even possible that they are not witnesses.

MOO

 

[wcasewatch]

The SC autopsy report said "The body of the hyoid contains a small, circular lesion, which may be the result of a thyroglossal cyst or other pathology." The photo in that report looks like it is a hole, but that could have been the way the copy came out. I can't find any video of John Ray saying "Shannan may have had a neat hole drilled into her hyoid". DO you know what live video it was?

A lesion can be a hole. It's basically just a catch-all term for damage to human tissue. In this case, the cyst would have replaced the bone tissue in her hyoid with fluid, blood, etc. Then, after she died, it left behind a hole.

As for Ray's statement, he said it in a press conference (comment made at 6:22):

He also spoke about it on LI In The AM.

It is referenced in this article: Gilgo Beach victim attorney denies police claims of 'tragic accident'

He ran with this theory for a while and then dropped it.

 

[snarast]

A lesion can be a hole. It's basically just a catch-all term for damage to human tissue. In this case, the cyst would have replaced the bone tissue in her hyoid with fluid, blood, etc. Then, after she died, it left behind a hole.

As for Ray's statement, he said it in a press conference (comment made at 6:22):

He also spoke about it on LI In The AM.

It is referenced in this article: Gilgo Beach victim attorney denies police claims of 'tragic accident'

He ran with this theory for a while and then dropped it.

The hyoid bone is 1 cm thick so you couldn’t hang anybody up using that bone alone. So the significance of drilling into it is unclear to me. Unless there are similar looking holes in other bones.

Sorry for going there but putting it into the suspension torture context seems relevant.

 

[james.coff]

A lesion can be a hole. It's basically just a catch-all term for damage to human tissue. In this case, the cyst would have replaced the bone tissue in her hyoid with fluid, blood, etc. Then, after she died, it left behind a hole.

As for Ray's statement, he said it in a press conference (comment made at 6:22):

He also spoke about it on LI In The AM.

It is referenced in this article: Gilgo Beach victim attorney denies police claims of 'tragic accident'

He ran with this theory for a while and then dropped it.

Thank you so much! I don't put much value in the hole meaning anything regarding her manner of death, but the first autopsy report doesn't really point to a cyst as a strong possibility, the way it was stated was very passive "may be......or other pathology" I don't think they had a clue, but didn't think it was significant, so didn't try to figure it out. JMO. I see what you mean by JR stating "drill hole or hole poked through it", I think he was theorizing but wasn't sure. he was asking for a more impartial investigation and calling out the LEO who had put that notice in the paper about SG's 911 call, which turned out to be a total lie. I feel like he gets very emotional when he discusses the outward disregard for Shannan's case and it comes across a certain way, but he seems so upset about it and continuously asked for an outside investigation. He def does not trust SC to divulge what they know. I don't think it is the police though, I think many of them wanted to do more and still do, but they take orders from above and even Tierney takes orders from above, so I worry they will never be held accountable for what happened to Shannan

 

[james.coff]

The hyoid bone is 1 cm thick so you couldn’t hang anybody up using that bone alone. So the significance of drilling into it is unclear to me. Unless there are similar looking holes in other bones.

Sorry for going there but putting it into the suspension torture context seems relevant.

I didn't know that, thank you for pointing that out!

 

[Forest_Wood]

She said that Heuermann was leaning against a wall at a 45-degree angle... That's a very flexible man.

A person doesn't need flexibility to lean into a wall at a 45-degree angle. Basically someone leaning back onto a wall.

 

[snarast]

A person doesn't need flexibility to lean into a wall at a 45-degree angle. Basically someone leaning back onto a wall.

That angle needs to be specified. 45- degrees where. Leaning on your shoulder? On your back?

 

[wcasewatch]

A person doesn't need flexibility to lean into a wall at a 45-degree angle. Basically someone leaning back onto a wall.

This is a 45 degree angle.

This only works if his legs were at a 45 degree angle.

The angle isn't even the issue.

Here, we have a witness who has provided a highly detailed recollection of an event that happened 30 years ago.

At this event, the witness allegedly encountered two high-profile POIs with separate and independent links to the Gilgo case. There is no other known connection between the POIs in question. Furthermore, the witness has since elaborated on this memory to include two other high-profile POIs.

 

[snarast]

This is a 45 degree angle.

View attachment 525189
This only works if his legs were at a 45 degree angle.

The angle isn't even the issue.

Here, we have a witness who has provided a highly detailed recollection of an event that happened 30 years ago.

At this event, the witness allegedly encountered two high-profile POIs with separate and independent links to the Gilgo case. There is no other known connection between the POIs in question. Furthermore, the witness has since elaborated on this memory to include two other high-profile POIs.

Well forget bendy this is gravity defying. And isn’t that guy at 35-degrees? At least the arrow is.

I’m thinking this position is not what she meant….

The situation she described was scary and memorable. But it is also…..salacious in the extreme. Unfortunately, it could still be true.

 

[wcasewatch]

Well forget bendy this is gravity defying. And isn’t that guy at 35-degrees? At least the arrow is.

I’m thinking this position is not what she meant….

The situation she described was scary and memorable. But it is also…..salacious in the extreme. Unfortunately, it could still be true.

The arrow in the graphic is incorrect, but the figure is lined up. If you visually adjust 10 degrees anticlockwise, you'll see that it's still stretching the norms of human physics. Heuermann is roughly 6' 4", and on the heavy side. If he leaned against a wall at a 45 degree angle, he'd probably need someone to help him up.

People are free to believe the affidavit, but there are obvious reasons why many don't.

 

[Forest_Wood]

The arrow in the graphic is incorrect, but the figure is lined up. If you visually adjust 10 degrees anticlockwise, you'll see that it's still stretching the norms of human physics. Heuermann is roughly 6' 4", and on the heavy side. If he leaned against a wall at a 45 degree angle, he'd probably need someone to help him up.

People are free to believe the affidavit, but there are obvious reasons why many don't.

You dont believe she got her story straight after all these years and yet you do believe she must recall the exact angle someone was leaning. She experienced something that night and she came forward. If even one of her memories is correct, it may have helped in the investigation IMO.

 

[Betty P]

It’s up to the Task Force to investigate the claims and make the connections between Rex and the victims. Like it or not, they’ve been able to do that. Some of LE may not be happy about doing that, but it seems it’s much harder than before to keep Rex’s crimes covered up.

As others have pointed out, it’s not just Rex’s activities, but the subculture that allowed them to continue that’s part of the problem. So far, the task force has been able to link Rex and solve these cases without any local LE or investigators. I don’t think anyone expects individuals to be held accountable beyond those who’ve already been adjudicated.

JMO, the goal of victims families and advocates is to see that the victims have justice and those responsible are prosecuted, questions answered where possible. IMHO, anger against the advocates and victims families is misplaced. No one in LE is going to lose their job or pension. AFAIK, there are no victims in Suffolk County LE or prosecutors office, retired or active duty.

 

[wcasewatch]

You dont believe she got her story straight after all these years and yet you do believe she must recall the exact angle someone was leaning. She experienced something that night and she came forward. If even one of her memories is correct, it may have helped in the investigation IMO.

I don't see how doubting her story and the angle that he was standing at have to be mutually exclusive. Why would she add something so specific to an affidavit if she wasn't 100% certain? That's my entire point.

There's nothing to suggest that this story aided the investigation in any way. I would be extremely surprised if the task force took it seriously. Seasoned investigators would have reacted to these claims with amusement and raised eyebrows. JMO.

 

[Betty P]

I don't see how doubting her story and the angle that he was standing at have to be mutually exclusive. Why would she add something so specific to an affidavit if she wasn't 100% certain? That's my entire point.

There's nothing to suggest that this story aided the investigation in any way. I would be extremely surprised if the task force took it seriously. Seasoned investigators would have reacted to these claims with amusement and raised eyebrows. JMO.

That's up to the Task Force. We're not privy to the evidence they do have. But now there's enough oversight the public can be assured important information and tips will be followed. There's not much point in attacking someone who came forward with information they think is helpful with no expectation of a reward or favors. These people don't have to do this and for some its probably a little traumatic having to relive the experience. They're not seeking fame or monetary compensation, they're just providing information they think is relevant and helpful.

 

[Maat99]

Other examples of leaning against a wall at a 45 degree angle

 

[cenazoic]

And of course, she likely didn’t have a protractor with her at the time, so “45 degree angle” is not mathematically “true” regardless, even assuming she knows what a 45-deg angle is. It was likely just meant as a description of his posture; ie, something like the pics @Maat99 posted above.

(Note: not making an argument about whether her overall story is true or not.)