Greece - Caroline Crouch, 20, Murdered, Athens, May 11, 2021

[Winterbells]

Another discrepancy, could all the media just be making things up?
<modsnip>
As far as he could tell it was only a robbery, (but a serious one).
A robbery is trivial, no amount of money can replace the love of your life, nor the love between a mother and child.
jmo
I hope justice is served to her murderer soon.

Agree.

Plus, both tied up, both gagged, inches apart....the robbers having left, I wonder why he didn't try to communicate with CC to rouse her from her silence, to see if they could manage to untie each other?

 

[Winterbells]

I dont understand why to open the basement window at all (shutters left open). Wasn't money in the basement? Shutters should be closed permamently if you keep valuables there. JMO

Would shutters perhaps need to be opened in order to let light in (whilst hiding money in the Monopoly box?). Most careless though, to not close them again.

 

[Jenesaisquoi]

Do you have home insurance covering cash in Greece? I guess if you do it doesn’t cover monopoly boxed cash anyway. I was wondering if a certain amount could be insured and stolen which may not match the actual amount stolen, if the amount taken out were higher. This is me going off on a thought tangent, not suggesting this happened in this particular situation.

 

[Dotta]

Would shutters perhaps need to be opened in order to let light in (whilst hiding money in the Monopoly box?). Most careless though, to not close them again.

Never open them! Put bars in the windows there! It seems to be the weakest link in security of this house. If Its too dark put strong light inside. I would never live in a place where anybody could just crawl inside. Brrr!

 

[Tortoise]

From what I can tell the basement seems to be at least part garage too, underneath the balcony on the left.

Pictures of house from DM Greece burglary murder: Woman's daughter was 'trying to wake her up' as police arrived | Daily Mail Online

Video which seems to show the underground garage in the background

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[Winterbells]

From what I can tell the basement seems to be at least part garage too, underneath the balcony on the left.

Pictures of house from DM Greece burglary murder: Woman's daughter was 'trying to wake her up' as police arrived | Daily Mail Online

Video which seems to show the underground garage in the background

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So, in that last photo, where there's forensic powder all over the door, are the two shuttered windows to the right of that door the basement windows? and if so, it appears that the shutters open from the outside, right? I'm really confused. I thought a pane of glass was removed from the window they used to gain entry, which fell to the ground. Which window was that from? And why are those shutters now closed and why is there no forensic powder on them? Sorry, but I really don't understand what's what here

 

[Dotta]

In Poland windows of basements are very narrow and horizontal. No way anybody could crawl through - there is barely space to put your arm into.

 

[Patrick Jane]

So, in that last photo, where there's forensic powder all over the door, are the two shuttered windows to the right of that door the basement windows? and if so, it appears that the shutters open from the outside, right? I'm really confused. I thought a pane of glass was removed from the window they used to gain entry, which fell to the ground. Which window was that from? And why are those shutters now closed and why is there no forensic powder on them? Sorry, but I really don't understand what's what here

The shutters open from the inside. According to the husband, the alleged perpetrators entered from the window to the right, closest to the empty lot. Early reports said the shutter might have been broken, and that's why it was open. Current media reports are now saying the husband supposedly told police said he might have forgotten to close it. (I'm referring to media posts already posted in this thread)

There appears to be forensic powder around this shutter, but it looks more faint than the other shutter.

 

[Dotta]

The shutters open from the inside. According to the husband, the alleged perpetrators entered from the window to the right, closest to the empty lot. Early reports said the shutter might have been broken, and that's why it was open. Current media reports are now saying the husband supposedly said he might have forgotten to close it.

There appears to be forensic powder around this shutter, but it's looks more faint than the other shutter.

But the police went through this window too as I read. They might have destroyed any forensic evidence because of it.

 

[Polly Graf]

I may be wrong but whenever I’ve seen shutters in France they’re just there for sunlight, not security. The window behind should be perfectly secure in itself regardless whether there’s a shutter or not?!

 

[Patrick Jane]

But the police went through this window too as I read. They might have destroyed any forensic evidence because of it.

Yes, I believe that's correct that, according to the reporting, the police went through this window.

 

[Patrick Jane]

I may be wrong but whenever I’ve seen shutters in France they’re just there for sunlight, not security. The window behind should be perfectly secure in itself regardless whether there’s a shutter or not?!

This shutter, like many throughout Greece, is made out of aluminum. They are primarily thought of as "storm shutters" because Greece gets a lot of rain. But they can also be thought of as "security shutters" because they are very secure. Criminals have ways of bypassing them, but they need special tools to do so.

The best comparison I can give you is to Florida where they have a similar type of aluminum shutters because of the weather.

 

[Dotta]

I may be wrong but whenever I’ve seen shutters in France they’re just there for sunlight, not security. The window behind should be perfectly secure in itself regardless whether there’s a shutter or not?!

Yeah, but nevertheless it is another difficulty for criminals to overcome. Better closed than open in invitation.

 

[Winterbells]

The shutters open from the inside. According to the husband, the alleged perpetrators entered from the window to the right, closest to the empty lot. Early reports said the shutter might have been broken, and that's why it was open. Current media reports are now saying the husband supposedly told police said he might have forgotten to close it. (I'm referring to media posts already posted in this thread)

There appears to be forensic powder around this shutter, but it looks more faint than the other shutter.

Thanks @Patrick Jane
I found more pics of the shuttered windows online and yep, I now see there's forensic powder around them.
All this shutters open/closed/broken talk reminds me of another mysterious case which baffled the police.

 

[Patrick Jane]

Yeah, but nevertheless it is another difficulty for criminals to overcome. Better closed than open in invitation.

Of course. Because special tools are needed to defeat the shutter, if this shutter had been locked, there would have been evidence of forced entry if the alleged perpetrators entered here.
In this case, however, there's no evidence of forced entry. That's very odd.

 

[Winterbells]

Of course. Because special tools are needed to defeat the shutter, if this shutter had been locked, there would have been evidence of forced entry if the alleged perpetrators entered here.
In this case, however, there's no evidence of forced entry. That's very odd.

Oh... I thought a pane of glass was forced out of a window (presumably one of the open shuttered basement windows) no?

 

[Patrick Jane]

Oh... I thought a pane of glass was forced out of a window (presumably one of the open shuttered basement windows) no?

Yes, I've seen those reports. I meant no forced entry from the shutter.
However, for the window, I don't know what to believe as I've heard conflicting reports.

 

[Patrick Jane]

this is a policeman on a segment of a Greek morning show

around 6:00 the policeman rejects the journalist's statement that "no DNA has been found" and corrects him to say we can't say for sure that "no DNA has been found" as apparently "a little (bit of) DNA" was found

at 2:30 they discuss that, as of yesterday, the husband has returned to live at the house

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[Patrick Jane]

It's been widely reported in Greek media that the husband has seen the alleged murderer's face and has provided a sketch to police. If there's a murderous gang on the loose, shouldn't the husband be in hiding? In some kind of witness protection program? Definitely not returning to the same house, right? Seems odd. Very odd.

 

[Winterbells]

Yes, I've seen those reports. I meant no forced entry from the shutter.

snipped for focus

Sorry, yes, I realised that's what you meant, but too late to edit.