Hailey Dunn General Discussion #2

[ahintexas]

Darlie Routier was found guilty for killing her 2 son's back in the 90's. She is now on death row. Her husband and his family were from Lubbock, but the murders took place in their home in Dallas. Both her boys had their throats slit as did Darlie(cenitmeters from her own jugular). She was covered from head to toe with bruises and superficial stab wounds, but was still charged for their murders. Her youngest son and husband were asleep upstairs while she was asleep in the livingroom with the older 2 boys. She claimed that an intruder broke in and stabbed her and the boys. There was even a finger print on a window or door that matched no one but was never identified. It has been stated that Tommy Lynn Sells even confessed to killing her boys, but this is Texas and we have no problem executing innocent people. That is why Texasmom said she was sentenced to deathrow with much less evidence. She was convicted because of her behavior after the fact. It was the first case that I followed closely and knowing all the evidence that was NOT allowed in, I'm convinced that she is innocent and I'm not one to think that very often. Even thought she was guilty at first myself.

FYI - Tommy Lynn Sells was in prison when Devon and Damon were murdered.

 

[Knox]

I am in Abilene also and I do not know what murders you are talking about. Were these all in Colorado City? Or where? Where was Darlene Routier? (sp?)

[ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=51"]Darlie Routier - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community[/ame]

Link to Darlie's thread. I followed her case way back when, IMO she's guilty as charged. Maybe the discussion should be taken over there, don't want to experience the wrath of Kimster's off-topic stun gun

Anyone know if Clint has been released yet?

 

[Knox]

It's been over a month since remains found in Scurry County were identified as Hailey Dunn's. And since then, no word has come out as to how she died. And while many have their theories, confirmation takes time.

"There could be skull fractures, there could be broken bones. Forensic pathologists can examine those bones and determine whether these are impact wounds or old fractures or new fractures, or if they've healed or if they haven't," said Sgt. Lynn Beard of the Abilene Police Department.

Broken bones, injury to the tissue and bullet fragments fragments are just few of the ways investigators are able to tell if someone was murdered or died of other causes. For example, a cause of death was determined based on only a skull due to the visible fractures.

"Had that been a case where, for example, the victims wrists had been cut and they bled to death, then there was no hard-bone injury, it was all soft tissue type injury, and that tissue is gone because of animal activity and decomposition and that certainly makes it more problematic," said Sgt. Beard.

http://bigcountryhomepage.com/fulltext?nxd_id=598232

 

[ahintexas]

It's been over a month since remains found in Scurry County were identified as Hailey Dunn's. And since then, no word has come out as to how she died. And while many have their theories, confirmation takes time.

"There could be skull fractures, there could be broken bones. Forensic pathologists can examine those bones and determine whether these are impact wounds or old fractures or new fractures, or if they've healed or if they haven't," said Sgt. Lynn Beard of the Abilene Police Department.

Broken bones, injury to the tissue and bullet fragments fragments are just few of the ways investigators are able to tell if someone was murdered or died of other causes. For example, a cause of death was determined based on only a skull due to the visible fractures.

"Had that been a case where, for example, the victims wrists had been cut and they bled to death, then there was no hard-bone injury, it was all soft tissue type injury, and that tissue is gone because of animal activity and decomposition and that certainly makes it more problematic," said Sgt. Beard.

http://bigcountryhomepage.com/fulltext?nxd_id=598232

IRC, weren't they done with Caylee fairly quick? Not sure why its taken so long on Hailey.

 

[Knox]

Waiting is so difficult, but I'm still hopeful. IMO, the fact LE has not contacted a certain someone other than to notify them of identity speaks volumes. Why wouldn't investigator's want to ask if Hailey had ever been to the Lake, and with whom?

Someone upstream said the FBI is investigating this case differently than CCPD or SCSO. I completely disagree ...

 

[For The Kids]

It's been over a month since remains found in Scurry County were identified as Hailey Dunn's. And since then, no word has come out as to how she died. And while many have their theories, confirmation takes time.

"There could be skull fractures, there could be broken bones. Forensic pathologists can examine those bones and determine whether these are impact wounds or old fractures or new fractures, or if they've healed or if they haven't," said Sgt. Lynn Beard of the Abilene Police Department.

Broken bones, injury to the tissue and bullet fragments fragments are just few of the ways investigators are able to tell if someone was murdered or died of other causes. For example, a cause of death was determined based on only a skull due to the visible fractures.

"Had that been a case where, for example, the victims wrists had been cut and they bled to death, then there was no hard-bone injury, it was all soft tissue type injury, and that tissue is gone because of animal activity and decomposition and that certainly makes it more problematic," said Sgt. Beard.

http://bigcountryhomepage.com/fulltext?nxd_id=598232

I think from something CL said LE have probably determined cause of death by now. There have been talks of Shawn trying to get a plea deal though I don't know if that is true but if it is maybe that's why theres been no arrests yet?

 

[Tugela]

The initial investigation by CCPD/MCSD had a single minded focus on SA. And most of that yielded nothing, there has been pretty much no follow up on their original disclosures. Possibly because there is nothing to follow up.

Jurisdiction has shifted to different agencies now. They will look at the case from the beginning and reach their own conclusions. That is a probably a good thing, I don't think the local LE is really equipped to handle cases like this.

IMO the investigation up to now has been inadequate, and after all this time it is going to be extremely difficult to get definitive evidence. It is possible that the case will never be solved.

 

[Tugela]

I think from something CL said LE have probably determined cause of death by now. There have been talks of Shawn trying to get a plea deal though I don't know if that is true but if it is maybe that's why theres been no arrests yet?

The law doesn't work like that. Arrests come before plea deal negotiations.

 

[For The Kids]

The initial investigation by CCPD/MCSD had a single minded focus on SA. And most of that yielded nothing, there has been pretty much no follow up on their original disclosures. Possibly because there is nothing to follow up.

Jurisdiction has shifted to different agencies now. They will look at the case from the beginning and reach their own conclusions. That is a probably a good thing, I don't think the local LE is really equipped to handle cases like this.

IMO the investigation up to now has been inadequate, and after all this time it is going to be extremely difficult to get definitive evidence. It is possible that the case will never be solved.

For some reason I doubt that LE would tell you what evidence they have in this case so I am not sure how you can say it yielded nothing. Do you have a link that states that? Just recently one of the searchers commentated how a specific detective had worked on the case daily for over two years and that's just one person. Those detectives want Justice for Hailey and will make sure she gets it

 

[curiousc]

The initial investigation by CCPD/MCSD had a single minded focus on SA. And most of that yielded nothing, there has been pretty much no follow up on their original disclosures. Possibly because there is nothing to follow up.

Jurisdiction has shifted to different agencies now. They will look at the case from the beginning and reach their own conclusions. That is a probably a good thing, I don't think the local LE is really equipped to handle cases like this.

IMO the investigation up to now has been inadequate, and after all this time it is going to be extremely difficult to get definitive evidence. It is possible that the case will never be solved.

Would like to know why you say the investigation has been inadequate?

We certainly do not know what LE knows or has for evidence and because they remain quiet in this case doesn't mean they don't have anything.

As for the inadequacies, those came from BD and SA who haven't given a truthful story.

 

[For The Kids]

Would like to know why you say the investigation has been inadequate?

We certainly do not know what LE knows or has for evidence and because they remain quiet in this case doesn't mean they don't have anything.

As for the inadequacies, those came from BD and SA who haven't given a truthful story.

I wonder how much time LE wasted due to Billie and Shawns lies?

 

[passionflower]

Over 2 months and not a word on how she was murdered.....my guess is it was horrific.

 

[dog.gone.cute]

Over 2 months and not a word on how she was murdered.....my guess is it was horrific.

I agree that it was horrific ... only a "monster" could do this to a 13 year old who had her whole life ahead of her ...

:furious: It is absolutely despicable !

:moo:

 

[Knox]

The initial investigation by CCPD/MCSD had a single minded focus on SA. And most of that yielded nothing, there has been pretty much no follow up on their original disclosures. Possibly because there is nothing to follow up.

Jurisdiction has shifted to different agencies now. They will look at the case from the beginning and reach their own conclusions. That is a probably a good thing, I don't think the local LE is really equipped to handle cases like this.

IMO the investigation up to now has been inadequate, and after all this time it is going to be extremely difficult to get definitive evidence. It is possible that the case will never be solved.

Once again you are making assumptions. You have no idea what type of evidence LE has not disclosed.

I do agree with you on this point. The FBI has investigated Hailey's murder, and came to the same conclusion local law enforcement did two years ago. I'm not sure the FBI is the lead agency on this case, seems it is them and the Texas Rangers now. That in itself may be meaningful ...

 

[Knox]

The law doesn't work like that. Arrests come before plea deal negotiations.

There are always exceptions to every general rule ...

Some of the best opportunities for effective criminal defense work occur at the earliest stages of a case. If you consult with a criminal defense attorney before charges are filed, or at the earliest opportunity after an arrest, you may be able to position yourself for a better resolution.

Negotiating a Dismissal - If there is a patent problem with the case that is being brought against you, a criminal defense attorney may be able to contact the prosecutor before charges are authorized, explain the problem with the case, and secure a dismissal of the charge before the case begins. This becomes more difficult after charges are filed, as the charges may be authorized by a different attorney than the one handling the file, the case will be progressing through the court system, and a prosecutor might prefer to see how the case plays out through that system instead of offering a quick resolution.

Negotiating a Favorable Plea Bargain - Even when charges are valid, it is sometimes possible for a criminal defense attorney to speak with a prosecutor before charges are authorized, and to work out a deal whereby a client will enter a guilty plea to a specified charge, perhaps with an associated agreement as to the sentence recommendation that the prosecutor will make.

Assisting the Police or Prosecutor - If you have information or evidence that may help the police or prosecuting attorney in other cases, you may be able to arrange to offer that evidence or to otherwise work with the police in ongoing criminal investigations. Such cooperation will often help a defendant at sentencing, and may also be helpful to obtain a good plea bargain or in some cases an agreement that charges won't be filed.

Avoiding "Policy" Problems - Some prosecutor's offices have "no plea bargain" policies for certain charges. Once those charges are authorized by the prosecutor, it is usually extremely difficult to convince a prosecutor to deviate from the policy. However, if a criminal defense attorney contacts the prosecutor before the charge is authorized, it may be possible to arrange for a charge with does not implicate a department policy, and leaves the prosecutor with greater flexibility to plea bargain.

http://www.expertlaw.com/library/criminal/criminal_attorney.html

 

[liltexans]

Over 2 months and not a word on how she was murdered.....my guess is it was horrific.

I hope LE can determine COD. I have doubts since poor Hailey was left out in the woods for over 2 years apparently. And we don't know how much of her skeleton was recovered as well as her clothing/shoes.

Even if they know COD, they may not reveal it to the public. In the case of the murdered cousins (Lyric & Lizzie) in Evansdale, IA, LE has not released COD and no one has been arrested yet in that case either.

 

[For The Kids]

I hope LE can determine COD. I have doubts since poor Hailey was left out in the woods for over 2 years apparently. And we don't know how much of her skeleton was recovered as well as her clothing/shoes.

Even if they know COD, they may not reveal it to the public. In the case of the murdered cousins (Lyric & Lizzie) in Evansdale, IA, LE has not released COD and no one has been arrested yet in that case either.

Based on something CL ( the man who found the remains) said I do think LE will be able to determine the cause of death.

 

[clarabelle]

How sure are you that they were talking about the same day though? How sure are you they did not mean Tuesday when they said Monday? After all, it is years after the event, it is easy to get days mixed up.

After all, at one point Naomi was saying that HD visited their house on the day she disappeared, and CD once said that DD came looking for her on that day as well. And they said these things days/weeks after the event, not years.

Then they were corrected and they changed their mind. You are ok with that, and accept it as a mistake in conversation.

But you are not willing to accept that SA and/or BD could do the same thing. No, they must have been lieing.

I followed this case from the beginning and have been checking in for updates.

I distinctly remember seeing an interview with Clint and Naomi where she said Hailey stopped by the morning she disappeared and Clint corrected her with (paraphrasing) "don't you remember, that was the day before". The comment and the way he said it struck me as really odd and I have searched for the video and have not been able to find it. So I have no link to back this up but I KNOW I saw it.

I know they changed their story and can't help but wonder why they did.

 

[katydid23]

I followed this case from the beginning and have been checking in for updates.

I distinctly remember seeing an interview with Clint and Naomi where she said Hailey stopped by the morning she disappeared and Clint corrected her with (paraphrasing) "don't you remember, that was the day before". The comment and the way he said it struck me as really odd and I have searched for the video and have not been able to find it. So I have no link to back this up but I KNOW I saw it.

I know they changed their story and can't help but wonder why they did.

Clint corrected her because it was the day before that she was thinking of.

 

[SurfieTX]

The law doesn't work like that. Arrests come before plea deal negotiations.

I thought that too, but how things were handled with Rachel Shoaf's arrest for Skylar's murder has changed my mind. It might be state specific or ?