Hannah's Journey on 09/13

[Evie Ivy Over]

So the frat parties at UVA are open? Ok, this changes my perspective on this issue. Frat parties at the college where my kids go are closed, mostly for liability reasons. They were open back in the day when I went there, but due to a guy falling off a balcony to his death and numerous issues with local high schoolers, they closed them years ago. If you aren't a member, you have to be on the list to get in. Members add you to the approved list. They provide security as well. It's a school with well over 20,000 students and they have 12 or so fraternities.

https://colleges.niche.com/university-of-virginia/party-scene/

"Party Scene: There is always something to do at night - whether you are a first year/second year looking for a frat party or an upperclassman that wants to go out to a bar with friends. Frat parties can typically be found any Thursday, Friday, or Saturday (and sometimes Wednesdays). They can sometimes be difficult to get into (if you are a guy, or the party is already relatively full - and they start getting selective about who can get in), but for the most part, if you know someone, or are in a group of mainly girls, you should be fine. The corner is always lively at night and is a great place for upperclassmen."

 

[Quill]

No, no one has said that they were open...pretty much the opposite I think. I was thinking perhaps they may have been, but was corrected. However, if closed, then they may indeed hire a doorman or bouncer, yes?

Ok. Thanks. I guess I was just looking for clarification of that. Are the fraternity house off campus or on? The ones that I am referring to on our campus are on, which makes a difference. And yes, they provide some type of security, front and back door. They have bands quite often and those parties draw quite a crowd, so they have the lists to limit the crowds and the fights between competing fraternities. Also, they do have the fire code occupancy limit. They no longer have lawn parties unless they have a fenced back area, which some do have. I'm just curious how similar the UVA parties are to the ones I'm familiar with.

 

[themom]

You know, with all the discussions about drugs, a thought came to me that maybe that's why HG was flying solo that night--possibly she was trying to stay AWAY from them.

I think she just would have gone home, if that were the thought process. Been there, done that...

 

[ThinkHard]

I was pointing out that MM is 1 mile from Tempo. I do believe that it is probably safe to assume that HG had eaten at the MM. Thus, she was not unfamiliar with the area. Tis all....

Mello mushroom is by the corner not the downtown mall...yes it's about a mile on foot...but its a place that's closer to campus and her apartment then the mall....and I think we have well established she was familiar with the corner.

 

[zapped]

I respect your viewpoint but feel that your accusations are a bit misguided. There seems to be this knee jerk reaction at anything that may; however realistic, see a victim as a real person who embraced life as somehow debasing. She was not a soulless Stepford student concerned only with academic achievement. She had hopes, dreams, crushes, and yes flaws. We are not saying she is responsible for what happened that night nor maligning her moral character. We only questioned drug use in the context of helping to fill LE's inadequate explanation of events.

The use of illicit drugs is now "embracing life"??????.... while those of us who chose to live our life sober are now stepford children??????

I agree that UVA and other colleges around the country need to do something about underage drinking but the "logic" behind the statement above totally escapes me.

 

[MJPeony]

https://colleges.niche.com/university-of-virginia/party-scene/

"Party Scene: There is always something to do at night - whether you are a first year/second year looking for a frat party or an upperclassman that wants to go out to a bar with friends. Frat parties can typically be found any Thursday, Friday, or Saturday (and sometimes Wednesdays). They can sometimes be difficult to get into (if you are a guy, or the party is already relatively full - and they start getting selective about who can get in), but for the most part, if you know someone, or are in a group of mainly girls, you should be fine. The corner is always lively at night and is a great place for upperclassmen."

For UVa: This^^

I got into every single one I ever attempted to (girl) and I went to many. They were not closed. There were however occasional "mixers" when a fraternity has a party and invites a specific sorority. Those are for only that sorority, but they usually open up as the night wears on.

The guys did have a harder time getting in when they got to the door (wasn't really a "bouncer"- usually some brothers just hanging at the door, but I now get what you're saying there SteveP). But I rarely had guy friends accompany me to frat parties. Honestly, they didn't want to. It wasn't particularly cool for guys to crash other fraternity parties. I can count on one hand the number of times a guy friend came with me, and they did always get in.

Ahh, memory lane

 

[MJPeony]

No, no one has said that they were open...pretty much the opposite I think. I was thinking perhaps they may have been, but was corrected. However, if closed, then they may indeed hire a doorman or bouncer, yes?

Where were you corrected when you said you thought they were open? (honest question- I read back through the posts and can't find it) They are open, for the most part.

 

[Conductor71]

The use of illicit drugs is now "embracing life"??????.... while those of us who chose to live our life sober are now stepford children??????

I agree that UVA and other colleges around the country need to do something about underage drinking but the "logic" behind the statement above totally escapes me.

It is near impossible to use logic when it comes to discussing the victim because people react on an emotional level. We have to walk on eggshells, so it is hard to be blunt.

I did not mean to imply that trying or using drugs is any way superior or preferred, but nor does it mean a person is bad. I was thinking in terms of how when we do read of people like HG, who tragically did fall prey to the heinous acts of another, we end up seeing only the one side portrayed by the media. And, yes, sorry to say, in this case it was a rather one dimensional portrayal. Everything was so centered on her achievements that to even hint she had any ordinary traits or human qualities that made her vulnerable is somehow attacking or blaming her. I was saying she was so much more than this one note, and that maybe in a missing person case it would serve everyone involved to be less concerned with protecting images and more willing to share (selectively) any information that would help. If it were my kid, I would want no stone to go unturned, and if it involved less savory info coming to light, then so be it.

 

[Evie Ivy Over]

And saying a college kid may have used marijuana is light years away from saying she's a back alley crack . Let's be clear that drug use does not equal bad person, unsuccessful person, etc. And that there are varying degrees of how far people take drug use...

By saying she was drinking that night isn't saying she was a raging alcoholic, either.

Just a point of reference...

Drug Use at UVA Increasing
http://wuvaonline.com/drug-use-at-uva-increasing/
Post Published: 19 September 2013

"Drug use permeates college campuses nationwide—the University of Virginia is no exception."

"4th year UVa student who has chosen to remain anonymous sees the drug culture as a world one can choose to see or not see.

“’Seek and ye shall find.’ This is what comes to mind when I think about the drug culture at UVA. There is plenty of drug use here, but the good thing is that it is in the back room and not in your face. If you want to remain naïve, you can, and that’s where I like to be,” she says.

“There is one exception: ‘Molly’. If you are planning on going to a festival or a techno concert, you have to take molly – otherwise you won’t have fun, or at least this is what popular opinion says. This drug that in its purest form makes up the more traditional drug ecstasy has somehow crept onto the scene and appears to be here to stay. This fad has overstayed its welcome.”

"Supposedly a “pure” form of MDMA, drug dealers usually mix ‘Molly’ with other contaminants, making the drug more high-risk than it might outwardly appear to a buyer of the drug."

 

[Evie Ivy Over]

Just posting this because it backs up the Market St. siting by a witness, and also references a video of HG prior to arriving at the DM that I don't think we've seen.

WVIR NBC29
September 17 · Edited ·
https://www.facebook.com/NBC29/posts/10152396502868753

HANNAH GRAHAM CASE UPDATE: Henry Graff reports, a new video places Hannah Graham outside the Shell gas stations on Preston Ave. at 12:55 a.m. on Saturday.
Hannah is seen walking then running in the video. She is by herself. Police don’t know why Hannah starts running. No one is behind her on the tape.
Police say Hannah Graham made it to the Charlottesville downtown mall by 1 a.m. on Saturday. Police say witnesses sitting in a car near Fellini's restaurant saw Graham turn from Market St. on to the downtown mall around 1 a.m. Saturday.
The last video that police have right now saw Graham walking by Citizens Commonwealth Center on the corner of Preston Ave. and Ridge McIntire.
Police say Graham is alone in all the surveillance video and eyewitness reports. Police are now looking for surveillance video from businesses on the mall.
They are searching the downtown mall area and railroad tracks near Garrett Street now (11:40 a.m.)
Police are planning a press conference on the Hannah Graham case. They plan to release some surveillance video at the press conference. The start time is still being decided.

 

[Ollie]

Personally I don't think anyone here believes HG was a druggie;she went to a couple of parties and the appears to go looking for someone. It does not appear to me that she was looking for another party but rather somebody she knew..Maybe an upper classman,since she went to the DM. She must have had reason to think they would be downtown. She was an avid runner so the distance was probably no big deal. From the last video we see of her she appears to have been drugged, we probably will never know if she sent that last message on her phone. I think it would be possible; one of her friends sent a 'taxi driver' to get her(remember he had cards made up advertising his service);it would be a good reason she would have gotten in his car. Her friends thought they were helping her.

 

[Quill]

For UVa: This^^

I got into every single one I ever attempted to (girl) and I went to many. They were not closed. There were however occasional "mixers" when a fraternity has a party and invites a specific sorority. Those are for only that sorority, but they usually open up as the night wears on.

The guys did have a harder time getting in when they got to the door (wasn't really a "bouncer"- usually some brothers just hanging at the door, but I now get what you're saying there SteveP). But I rarely had guy friends accompany me to frat parties. Honestly, they didn't want to. It wasn't particularly cool for guys to crash other fraternity parties. I can count on one hand the number of times a guy friend came with me, and they did always get in.

Ahh, memory lane

Thanks for clarifying the way it is at UVA. I'm trying to get a view of that as opposed to what I'm familiar with. Our own experiences color so much of what we think. The parties at our campus were completely open at one time, as I explained above. Girls certainly have an easier time getting in, as you said above, but they are supposed to check ID and only 18 & over should get in. They play fast & loose with this one if it's a family member. But honestly the only non-greek girls that really go are girlfriends or sisters of the members. Non-greek guys usually don't unless they have a buddy and it's a popular band.(and the frats don't mix either-ever). Edited for clarification.

Someone way up thread had mentioned Hannah not having a purse and maybe not having any ID on her. I just wanted to throw out there that my daughter has a phone case that has a slot that will hold an ID and a credit card. I Have had this on my mind ever since I first saw the videos.

 

[Steleheart]

Personally I don't think anyone here believes HG was a druggie;she went to a couple of parties and the appears to go looking for someone. It does not appear to me that she was looking for another party but rather somebody she knew..Maybe an upper classman,since she went to the DM. She must have had reason to think they would be downtown. She was an avid runner so the distance was probably no big deal. From the last video we see of her she appears to have been drugged, we probably will never know if she sent that last message on her phone. I think it would be possible; one of her friends sent a 'taxi driver' to get her(remember he had cards made up advertising his service);it would be a good reason she would have gotten in his car. Her friends thought they were helping her.

Thanks for that info. Do you have any links that mention the friends sending her a taxi? First I have heard of it, THANKS!

:cow:

 

[SteveP]

Where were you corrected when you said you thought they were open? (honest question- I read back through the posts and can't find it) They are open, for the most part.

Sorry, was judging by another poster's experience at another school, but I suppose UVA would not necessarily have the same policies.

 

[Evie Ivy Over]

I don't remember about the pizza restaurant:

Search for missing University of Virginia student Hannah Graham continues
September 18
http://www.techtimes.com/articles/1...-virginia-student-hannah-graham-continues.htm

"Police said that Hannah and her friends had a drinking party and became intoxicated on Friday. Graham was reportedly seen at a pizza restaurant with a classmate. From there, the two left and headed to another party. Hannah was said to have left the party at 12:15 a.m. She had gone walking home by herself."

 

[ILOKAL]

I do not have the link, but very early on it was referenced here that according to her twitter, she had made one or two statements about drugs that would lead one to believe that she wasn't into them. Maybe it's a stretch, but I think that coupled with her lifestyle of being an athlete at the college level is enough for me. JMO

I would like to see those statements from her Twitter account. Are they still available?

 

[Skigirl]

Same for me/us. First born was considering attending UVA four years ago - we ate at MM. I'm sure HG was just posting the menu. It's good pizza!

BTW there were tons of undergrads in MM when we ate...but that was an accepted students weekend, so, not sure it that means anything regarding location of undergrads in general.

Whoever eats Cherry Garcia/Ben & Jerry's must be a drug addict and a bad person!!!!

 

[ILOKAL]

I don't remember about the pizza restaurant:

Search for missing University of Virginia student Hannah Graham continues
September 18
http://www.techtimes.com/articles/1...-virginia-student-hannah-graham-continues.htm

"Police said that Hannah and her friends had a drinking party and became intoxicated on Friday. Graham was reportedly seen at a pizza restaurant with a classmate. From there, the two left and headed to another party. Hannah was said to have left the party at 12:15 a.m. She had gone walking home by herself."

It was reported Hannah went to dinner. I hadn't read where or what type of restaurant until reading this.

 

[ThinkHard]

Personally I don't think anyone here believes HG was a druggie;she went to a couple of parties and the appears to go looking for someone. It does not appear to me that she was looking for another party but rather somebody she knew..Maybe an upper classman,since she went to the DM. She must have had reason to think they would be downtown. She was an avid runner so the distance was probably no big deal. From the last video we see of her she appears to have been drugged, we probably will never know if she sent that last message on her phone. I think it would be possible; one of her friends sent a 'taxi driver' to get her(remember he had cards made up advertising his service);it would be a good reason she would have gotten in his car. Her friends thought they were helping her.

Where are you getting this information from?

 

[Coldpizza]

Hey everyone, please be respectful of your fellow posters.

Also, posting screen shots is against the rules.

Social Networks

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http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?65798-Etiquette-amp-Information

Thank you