Harley in the Hangar: Chop Shop?

[bessie]

Huh???

 

[swedie]

Here's a photograph of the hangar interior dated January Feb 5th 2013. Looks quite pristine to my untrained eye. There must have been a flurry of "giant chop shop" and or slaughtering activity going on in the following 3 months. IMO. MOO. IMHO.

Carli do you have a photo of the rest of the hangar? TIA.

A stolen HD is one too many stolen vehicles IMHO. I guess we could also count the trailer and TB's truck also. That make three stolen vehicles. At least two in the hangar and one found inside a trailer in MB's driveway.

Sucks for MS as he's looking at probably 50 years and DM probably 75. Guess they are doing a whole lot of thinking when there is nothing better to do confined to a small jail cell. Probably asking themselves WTF was I thinking and how am I going to get out of this? I guess the drug withdrawals are long behind them now. But that's JMO.

 

[SnooperDuper]

True. Once you have the VIN number, it's not hard to get a blank fob programmed. But I have to wonder if they'd even bother if they were just going to chop it up for parts.

Hello Dodge? I need a new key. I'll give you my VIN and if you can just ignore the fact that the vehicle has been reported stolen...

 

[SnooperDuper]

You own a trailer. You and your buddies push the truck into the trailer. You either already own or later purchase a replacement key fob. You can get 'em from the manufacturer. You can even buy 'em on ebay. People who own vehicles with this security key fob function do lose their keys from time to time. It doesn't mean they have to throw away their truck.

Uh, unless the truck is in neutral with the parking brake off, you aren't pushing it anywhere without a tow truck. And you can't program and cut a new key without reporting the VIN to someone who would be aware of what VINs relate to stolen vehicles.

Thanks for clarifying why DM and MS did what they did, though. Their plan to hijack a truck makes sense in light of the difficulties that arise in just taking it.

 

[Juballee]

I find it difficult to follow your logic ..... after being charged with three counts of murder I do not think police would need to toss in some stolen parts charges in order to "publicly Incriminate DM further" ... and we know LE towed away another trailer besides the Harley one so it could have been stolen too ..... plus police said several vehicles in the hangar were repainted and had serial numbers filed off .... and If I could place a bet I would say the repainted grey woodchipper was the one stolen from Oakville.

I suspect LE have priorities such as
1. The murder of Mr Bosma
2. The murder of Ms Babcock
3. The death of Wayne M.
4. Illegal firearm
5. Anything else ... stolen goods etc.

I admire your loyalty to DM .... and maybe he simply purchased those (stolen) goods from someone else , but possession is 9/10ths of the law in those situations unless he can show they were purchased under circumstances that appeared completely legitimate at the time , including legible receipts and prices reasonably close to market value..

.


http://www.thestar.com/news/crime/2..._attempted_third_test_drive_of_dodge_ram.html


http://www.therecord.com/news-story/3250211-stolen-vehicles-found-inside-millard-s-airport-hangar/


http://collisionrepairmag.com/news/...estigate-possible-chop-shop-at-millard-hangar


http://www.thespec.com/news-story/3250204-murder-suspect-s-waterloo-hangar-set-up-as-chop-shop-/

This is my favourite chop shop quote from MSM:

"Sources say hundreds of vehicles have been found in a hangar."

http://www.torontosun.com/2013/05/30/stolen-harley-found-on-property-of-accused-tim-bosma-killer

Yet I don't remember them pulling hundreds of vehicles out of the hanger in trailers, does anyone else? Even if they pulled one other trailer out of the hanger, it doesn't mean that the trailer or anything inside it was illegal. Remember how many barrels they pulled out of the barn? And how many had bodies, or even chopped vehicle parts in them? Not everything the police handled was stolen or will definitively be used as evidence of a crime.

In my opinion, this is a reminder that none of these MSM quotes can be taken as fact until we hear the actual evidence at trial. Plenty of other MSM sources have corrected or refuted the "hundreds of vehicles" claim, but since this one article still says it, it must be true. Logically, when you consider the size of a headline compared to the size of a correction in a newspaper, it's not hard to understand why most people remember the headline and miss the correction.

I personally have a differing opinion of the "possession is 9/10th of the law in those situations" idea. I think that is a very old adage that was meant to convey an interest in something owned, when in dispute, and not in reference to borrowed or stolen items. But then again, I'm not a lawyer, that is just the way it was always explained to me. So, being curious, I looked it up:

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Possession_is_nine-tenths_of_the_law

Regardless, the point I was making was that if the police have enough evidence to charge someone with a crime, that they generally do, even when they have charges of a higher priority as well. I would even think that the insurance companies of all of the hundreds of recovered stolen vehicles would insist on charges being brought against the criminals responsible. So why is it so hard to imagine that if there are not charges that there wasn't a crime, I wonder?

 

[Arnie M]

.

"Hundreds of vehicles in the hangar"

Maybe a bit of an exaggeration .... but apparently CM also had an extensive Classic car collection .... maybe DM brought them to the hangar for storage .... and we know DM had quite a few cars , trucks , and Jeeps of his own , not to mention all his personal watercraft and ATV's .... just the few we have seen add up to over 30

.

 

[Sillybilly]

Regardless, the point I was making was that if the police have enough evidence to charge someone with a crime, that they generally do, even when they have charges of a higher priority as well. I would even think that the insurance companies of all of the hundreds of recovered stolen vehicles would insist on charges being brought against the criminals responsible. So why is it so hard to imagine that if there are not charges that there wasn't a crime, I wonder?

<rsbm>

A charge related to possession of stolen goods wrt a potential chop shop would not be taken to Superior Court but could/would be pursued (at the discretion of the Crown) in a lower level court. The theft over $5000 that DM is facing in Superior Court is necessary as part and parcel to support the forcible confinement > 1st degree murder charges that will be tried in the higher level court.

ETA: FWIW, an insurance company has no authority to dictate whether criminal charges are laid.

 

[Alethea Dice]

Uh, unless the truck is in neutral with the parking brake off, you aren't pushing it anywhere without a tow truck. And you can't program and cut a new key without reporting the VIN to someone who would be aware of what VINs relate to stolen vehicles.

Thanks for clarifying why DM and MS did what they did, though. Their plan to hijack a truck makes sense in light of the difficulties that arise in just taking it.

Uh, you can get in the door, you just can't start it. A google search will tell you of others who have programmed a blank fob from a website or the owners manual without needing to go to the dealer.

 

[SnooperDuper]

Uh, you can get in the door, you just can't start it. A google search will tell you of others who have programmed a blank fob from a website or the owners manual without needing to go to the dealer.

With what, and uncut key and a fob that has been reprogrammed based on the info locked inside the truck in the owner's manual?

 

[Carli]

Huh???

Just trying to channel MWJ. LOL. Sounds like my rappin' ain't zappin'. So? You expected maybe something better from an aged beatnik? :dance:

 

[Juballee]

.

"Hundreds of vehicles in the hangar"

Maybe a bit of an exaggeration .... but apparently CM also had an extensive Classic car collection .... maybe DM brought them to the hangar for storage .... and we know DM had quite a few cars , trucks , and Jeeps of his own , not to mention all his personal watercraft and ATV's .... just the few we have seen add up to over 30

.

We already know that they were being stored in the hanger when WM was alive, according to that ex-employee, AS.

And if we can agree that "hundreds of vehicles" may be an exaggeration, perhaps the idea that the whole chop shop story was also an exaggeration based on a wrong first impression can be discussed.

If I recall, the story first came out just when the general public was questioning why a rich kid with enough money to buy several new vehicles would possibly steal an old used one, and at the time, the chop shop story made the pieces of the puzzle fit better in most people's minds, in my opinion.

I think that when we add this to the fact that we have seen all the vehicles from the hanger being sold on Kijiji, (which I am pretty sure that they would not be allowed to do if they were stolen) and the lack of further charges related to it, it all seems to suggest that the chop shop story may be just that, a story, in my opinion.

 

[Carli]

Parking brakes lock rear wheels only, I understand, and it's a simple matter to either snip the cable from the outside, or loosen it so the vehicle can be more easily moved.

 

[Variant]

Parking brakes lock rear wheels only, I understand, and it's a simple matter to either snip the cable from the outside, or loosen it so the vehicle can be more easily moved.

The steering and transmission are both locked, not the parking brakes.

 

[Alethea Dice]

With what, and uncut key and a fob that has been reprogrammed based on the info locked inside the truck in the owner's manual?

Most car thieves don't need a key to get in a door. From what I read, you don't need the owner's manual either. That's why so many still want alarms installed too.

 

[Carli]

I'm sure there will soon be loud knocking at my door since I just searched for how to enter, start and drive a 2007 Ram 2500 without a key. There are just oodles of ways, apparently, including some remote method of jigging the electronics that bypasses the system altogether. As someone observed these security measures are very successful in keeping honest people out of their own vehicles, after they've lost their keys, but do very little to deter a thief. I'm pretty sure anybody running a chop shop would have all the necessary tools of the trade. MOO. IMHO.

 

[Alethea Dice]

.

"Hundreds of vehicles in the hangar"

Maybe a bit of an exaggeration .... but apparently CM also had an extensive Classic car collection .... maybe DM brought them to the hangar for storage .... and we know DM had quite a few cars , trucks , and Jeeps of his own , not to mention all his personal watercraft and ATV's .... just the few we have seen add up to over 30

.

A bit of an exaggeration??? According to Kavanagh, the actual number was "way less than 10".

&#8220;We&#8217;re still investigating, trying to find owners,&#8221; said Staff Sergeant Matt Kavanagh, who put the number of vehicles at &#8220;way less than 10.&#8221;

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/police-use-heavy-machinery-to-dig-on-farm-owned-by-suspect-in-bosma-slaying/article12258800/

The Harley and the trailer could count as 2 of those "way less than 10". I can't remember how many were sold on kijiji, but that would likely take us to the "way less than 10".

 

[Tamarind]

Most car thieves don't need a key to get in a door. From what I read, you don't need the owner's manual either. That's why so many still want alarms installed too.

I've read that a screwdriver and/or a pair of snippers works. I actually had a car stolen where they removed the drivers window and climbed inside. Where there's a will there is a way, as they say.

 

[Sillybilly]

Timely warning I received recently ... when locking your vehicle, use the door button instead of the fob becuz thieves can sit in parking lots and somehow intercept the fob's wireless signal that unlocks your vehicle.

I continue to use ye olde club in addition to the installed security system.

 

[SnooperDuper]

Vehicle thefts don't seem to be a part of any of the cases.

I wonder why DM got charged for theft over $5k for stealing a truck if vehicle thefts don't seem to be a part of any of the cases.

Maybe if you have forgotten the basic details, you can catch up by reading the last 5-1/2 months of posts first before posting again.

 

[Tamarind]

I wonder why DM got charged for theft over $5k for stealing a truck if vehicle thefts don't seem to be a part of any of the cases.

Maybe if you have forgotten the basic details, you can catch up by reading the last 5-1/2 months of posts first before posting again.

With the constant unnecessary (IMO) focus on an apparently non existent chop shop, it often becomes negligible when talking about the black pickup belonging to TB. JMO. Thank you for the invite to read past posts but I have done already, without the prompt. The word used was thefts not theft on my part as it followed on from Swedies post which also said thefts (plural) HTH
We also have no idea whether the TB truck was stolen by DM or by who. The focus always seems to be on DM, but I believe there is another accused and a felon sitting in the wings selling everything from drugs to guns. I guess the details will be revealed in due course. JMO