Holly Bobo, missing from TN 2014 discussion #5 ***ARRESTS***

[sophiebelle]

If I understand correctly, there is no shack, and those words were never said (except on this website, as a somewhat-tongue-in-cheek hypothetical).

Ok, I just saw quotes, and thought somebody said it. Thanks!

 

[OldSteve]

A bit longer article -
http://www.tennessean.com/story/news/local/2014/08/19/judge-upset-holly-bobo-not-in-court/14276581/

The more I read, the more it seems the entire case depends upon that video, which cannot be produced.

 

[ZooSleuth]

A bit longer article -
http://www.tennessean.com/story/news/local/2014/08/19/judge-upset-holly-bobo-not-in-court/14276581/

The more I read, the more it seems the entire case depends upon that video, which cannot be produced.

Off Topic, does the Tennessean have any affiliation with USA Today? If they don't, their website is an absolute clone/rip off of USA Today's.

 

[murphy3k]

Off Topic, does the Tennessean have any affiliation with USA Today? If they don't, their website is an absolute clone/rip off of USA Today's.

They are both owned by Gannett. Gannett owns many newspapers and tv stations around the country.

http://www.gannett.com/section/WHOWEARE11

 

[SteveS]

A bit longer article -
http://www.tennessean.com/story/news/local/2014/08/19/judge-upset-holly-bobo-not-in-court/14276581/

The more I read, the more it seems the entire case depends upon that video, which cannot be produced.

IMO that means LE may have created a huge problem in the Bobo case of their own doing. Not good.

If there ever was a video, they've now forced the ones who they think might have had it to deny its existence and keep it buried, under the penalty of years of prison for ever having had it. In other words, they might be forcing people not to offer testimony, rather than making it easy for them to help. Bass-ackwards.

 

[Suthrnqt]

I have seen it stated repeatedly here that since there is no death certificate for Holly, that the A-train, et al, cannot be found guilty of her death. Is that correct? IIRC, the TBI has already stated that Holly is deceased. So, could someone here please clarify this for me. I am really confused about this issue. TIA

 

[SteveS]

I have seen it stated repeatedly here that since there is no death certificate for Holly, that the A-train, et al, cannot be found guilty of her death. Is that correct? IIRC, the TBI has already stated that Holly is deceased. So, could someone here please clarify this for me. I am really confused about this issue. TIA

TBI cannot simply declare that Holly is deceased. Without a body, "proof of death" will
(a) inevitably have to be part of any trial for killing her,
(b) have to be proved in court Beyond a Reasonable Doubt, and
(c) be necessary for a conviction, as her being dead will be one of the elements of the crime.

Since they'll have to do it in a trial anyhow, I suspect there's no reason to go to court to prove her dead at this point in time. So they haven't. (But, the fact they haven't doesn't tell us anything about the extent and quality of their evidence, or lack of same.)

If they had a body, it would be easy. But they've admitted they don't.

If there wasn't a crime involved, lacking a body, it would still take a court proceeding to have her declared dead.

 

[Migmuu]

Hey guys, I'm still fairly new to this case and I have a few questions you probably know the answers to.

1. Why do people say that the TBI ''botched'' the investigation? What did they do wrong?

2. I know that the ''video'' thing came about because one of the suspect's friends testified that she saw a small portion of a video where Zachary Adams is sexually assaulting Holly. Is this witness credible and, if so, why hasn't this video been recovered yet? You'd think that, with the technology we have today, it wouldn't be too difficult to recover something like that.

3. What does LE think her abductor(s) did to injure her, that caused the large pool of blood found in Holly's driveway?

4. Does LE think Holly's case is related to any other crimes? Abductions, sexual assaults (when attempted or completed), burglaries etc.

Thanks!

 

[SteveS]

1 Just opinions, of some
2 a - Is she credible? A court will probably decide. Perhaps no corroboration for her claims has surfaced, so far.
2 b - Why hasn't the video surfaced? No one knows. Maybe it never existed. Maybe it was destroyed. But they definitely don't have it, at this point.
3 LE has not offered this info, nor have they indicated they have an answer, so far
[note: my understanding is that there was only a "small puddle" or a few drops of blood, not a large pool, but I may be mistaken]
4 LE has not offered this info, nor have they indicated they have an answer, so far

 

[dog.gone.cute]

Hey guys, I'm still fairly new to this case and I have a few questions you probably know the answers to.

Thanks!

Snipped:


:seeya: Hello and Welcome !


:welcome4:

 

[OldSteve]

IMO that means LE may have created a huge problem in the Bobo case of their own doing. Not good.

If there ever was a video, they've now forced the ones who they think might have had it to deny its existence and keep it buried, under the penalty of years of prison for ever having had it. In other words, they might be forcing people not to offer testimony, rather than making it easy for them to help. Bass-ackwards.

Yes, sadly so true! Better would be if a reward was offered.

 

[goldenbear]

It has been a very slow day. My bear is not moving!

 

[goldenbear]

1 Just opinions, of some
2 a - Is she credible? A court will probably decide. Perhaps no corroboration for her claims has surfaced, so far.
2 b - Why hasn't the video surfaced? No one knows. Maybe it never existed. Maybe it was destroyed. But they definitely don't have it, at this point.
3 LE has not offered this info, nor have they indicated they have an answer, so far
[note: my understanding is that there was only a "small puddle" or a few drops of blood, not a large pool, but I may be mistaken]
4 LE has not offered this info, nor have they indicated they have an answer, so far

Good summary! So there are 4 men in jail waiting for court and one fighting to keep his immunity not in jail yet.

 

[Mr. Noatak]

Good summary! So there are 4 men in jail waiting for court and one fighting to keep his immunity not in jail yet.

My opinions only, no facts here:

A grand jury proceeding allows the presentation of hearsay evidence by the prosecution. What is hearsay? Think of "The Camping Episode" of Spongebob Squarepants. Hearsay is a friend of a friend of a friend of a friend of a friend of a friend, whose cousin said....... and so on. There is a darn good reason that so-called "evidence" in a grand jury proceeding is commonly NOT ADMISSIBLE in a real criminal trial. Frankly, using grand juries only, I am comfortable that the the suspect count in the Holly Bobo case could be increased even more.

I have followed criminal cases for about forty years. Simple female abduction cases that involve oodles of perpetrators and after-the-fact conspirators/witnesses are the exception and not the rule (but possible). More importantly, abduction cases that involve more than two perpetrators + independent witnesses + after-the-fact conspirators, are typically solved quickly. In the Holly Bobo case we are told that there are multiple kidnappers and after-the-fact conspirators/witnesses, yet it took three years to 'solve'.

On a side-note I just love The Musgrave Ritual with Jeremy Brett as Sherlock Holmes. The entire poetic ritual is wonderful, including these investigative parts:

'Whose was it?'
'His who is gone.'
'Who shall have it?'
'He who will come.'

AND

'What shall we give for it?'
'All that is ours.'
'Why should we give it?'
'For the sake of the trust.'

Quoting from 'The Adventure of the Naval Treaty' episode of Sherlock Holmes (Jeremy Brett), after picking up and examining a single red rose, Sherlock says something that makes me think of Holly Bobo: "There is nothing in which deduction is so necessary as in religion. It can be built up as an exact science by the reasoner. Our highest assurance of the goodness of Providence seems to me to rest in the flowers. All other things, our powers, our desires, our food, are all really necessary for our existence in the first instance. But this rose is an extra. Its smell and its color are an embellishment of life, not a condition of it. It is only goodness which gives extras, and so I say again that we have much to hope from the flowers."

In my sole opinion, there is one man we still need to hear from and one place we still need to look.

Sleuth On!

 

[SteveS]

In my sole opinion, there is one man we still need to hear from and one place we still need to look.

And in your opinion, who is this person, and where is that place?

 

[Suthrnqt]

And in your opinion, who is this person, and where is that place?

That's what I'd like to know. If nothing else Mr. Noatak, give us a breadcrumb or three.
I have read and reread your wonderful timeline. I know you hint at the Bible Hill (Gooch Rd) evidence as being significant, but that's all I've got. TIA

 

[spooky24]

Some things may be-emphasizing the 'may be'-moving on this-as I believe the TBI will have a press conference Monday or Tuesday. I will be down Parsons way this afternoon on unrelated business and-although the heat makes difficult to do much even for those who are used to it-going to check out all the digging someone has been doing for the Sheriff.

There is no shame in wanting to stay indoors after the past few days-pull up light as the country boys call it. Even back in the 30's out here on these late August days they would not work that much. Sit under a shade tree and string hot pepper. Sometimes people would gather with all their leather tack and help each other re loop it since the heat and humidity made it pliable. I still have some of the mule traces and and block tack from that era. When the heat index gets around 110-like yesterday-the leather feels like biscuit dough.

What that has to do with this case I don't have the foggiest-must be the 89 degrees at sunrise.

 

[pearl]

Some things may be-emphasizing the 'may be'-moving on this-as I believe the TBI will have a press conference Monday or Tuesday. I will be down Parsons way this afternoon on unrelated business and-although the heat makes difficult to do much even for those who are used to it-going to check out all the digging someone has been doing for the Sheriff.

There is no shame in wanting to stay indoors after the past few days-pull up light as the country boys call it. Even back in the 30's out here on these late August days they would not work that much. Sit under a shade tree and string hot pepper. Sometimes people would gather with all their leather tack and help each other re loop it since the heat and humidity made it pliable. I still have some of the mule traces and and block tack from that era. When the heat index gets around 110-like yesterday-the leather feels like biscuit dough.

What that has to do with this case I don't have the foggiest-must be the 89 degrees at sunrise.

Would this be recent digging?

 

[OldSteve]

I have followed criminal cases for about forty years. Simple female abduction cases that involve oodles of perpetrators and after-the-fact conspirators/witnesses are the exception and not the rule (but possible). More importantly, abduction cases that involve more than two perpetrators + independent witnesses + after-the-fact conspirators, are typically solved quickly. In the Holly Bobo case we are told that there are multiple kidnappers and after-the-fact conspirators/witnesses, yet it took three years to 'solve'.

Yes, this is exactly what makes this case so unusual, strange, and perplexing - and on top of everything, the linch pin (perhaps better spelled as lynch pin) is a video that was on a cellphone and now seems lost...

 

[SteveS]

Would this be recent digging?

I suspect that the "digging" that was mentioned was metaphorical terminology, not an actual use of shovels, spades, back-hoes, and the like. But I may be wrong.