Hurricane Katrina Disaster Updates

[SieSie]

Just on FOX News, reported that 50-100 firefighters, families and children are stuck in the BellSouth building - unable to leave because they are being fired on by snipers.

I just don't understand what they have to gain by not allowing others to be rescued. The looting mentality was bad enough, but I just don't comprehend this.

 

[DEPUTYDAWG]

I just don't understand what they have to gain by not allowing others to be rescued. The looting mentality was bad enough, but I just don't comprehend this.

These aren't people desparate for assistance or evacuation, are they?

 

[Dara]

Dara, at first I added a sentence that said, "This may be considered finger-pointing, LOL" And then I took it out, as I was afraid it would start snide comments. I knew I was at risk for stating what I did about the State level. I'm trying hard to remain neutral, I really am. I've been trying to post legitimate information, maybe y'all don't care about it. Then I put in my opinion, and I guess I'm going to be eating my words.

I definitely don't want to make you eat your words and I don't want either of us to be snide. I used the winky icon hoping you'd get that I was mostly trying to point out that you were doing what most of us have been. It's great that you're trying to be neutral. I think there's the misconception that those who are saying there are big problems here are somehow faulting specific people (or faulting them without reason). I think the words "bashing" and "fingerpointing" are overused and misused in general to trivialize and/or discredit people's posts (that is not directed at you in specific).

I will say I think the President should have stepped in earlier and that unfortunately I am not surprised. I have big concerns about Michael Brown of FEMA. In both cases, I feel there is enough documentation to justify my opinion (which is just my opinion).

I have agreed with you a lot, and some of your articles, etc. have been both interesting and informative. I just hate throwing a lot of blame around in the middle of a crisis, when we don't have all the facts, etc. I can fling with the best of them later!

Thank you for the nice words. I can say a hearty "backatcha." I understand. But, really, I think most of us have just been acknowledging the problem without blaming anyone specifically. I haven't known who to blame (except as stated above), but I know there are people who screwed up. I don't see myself as fllinging blame. But I do think there will be adjustments to the history of this crisis and I want to be able to go back and say, "Hey, wait a second, the mayor said they needed troops on Tuesday morning (thanks to whoever posted that).

You say you are trying to be neutral. I think I'm pretty neutral, too. My opinions are formed by what I have seen and heard and read. If I think Bush (for example) screwed up, it's not because I am not neutral; it's because based on what I know I think he screwed up. Now, if I weren't neutral or maybe objective, I'd be agreeing with those criticizing his comments that the response was "unacceptable." He's catching heat for that, with some saying he's disrespecting those who did go in and help. I don't think he meant that. I think he meant what has happened so far isn't enough, and it wasn't done right. I hope he's big enough to see his own culpalbility, and he may even mean that as well. He didn't single anyone out, and I can't stand the man, but I do NOT think he would criticize those who have tried to go in and save lives.

Sorry that's so long.

 

[Dara]

Dara, I heard from a co-worker who had been watching the news here (I missed it), that a general stepped off a helicopter and met with the mayor. The general cursed worse than the mayor, but the mayor said something about thank goodness help had arrived in the form of someone who could take command.

True or not? Anyone heard or seen this?

I haven't heard it. I'm going to see if I can find a reference.

Just to clarify: I don't have a problem with anyone cursing. I would. I am. And I'm not there. I find the mayor's emotion and frustration to be appropriate. When I read that he broke down in tears, I wanted to share that, because he was the single consistent voice that has spoken for the victims and asked for what they needed, and imo he went largely unheard.

 

[SieSie]

These aren't people desparate for assistance or evacuation, are they?

DeputyDawg - I understand that they're desperate for assistance and wanting to evacuate, I never questioned that. I'm sure the anger and frustration is very high.... I don't, however, understand why someone who is desperate for help would be shooting at other people who also want help. They aren't able to go help rescue people who want rescued if they are afraid for their lives.

 

[tipper]

Don't know if this has already been posted.


Foreign aid pours in to help Katrina victims
Fri Sep 2, 2005 3:22 PM ET
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By Sue Pleming

WASHINGTON, Sept 2 (Reuters) - The United States has not actively sought foreign aid following Hurricane Katrina but dozens of countries lined up on Friday to help with rescue efforts, from hefty cash donations to tents and helicopters.

The State Department said more than 40 governments and international organizations had made generous offers and the list was growing by the hour after Katrina devastated New Orleans and other parts of the U.S. Gulf Coast, killing hundreds and possibly thousands of people.

"We are not formally requesting assistance but anything that can materially benefit folks in need is something that we will accept," said a State Department official, who spoke on condition of anonymity.

Countries were very generous after the Sept. 11, 2001, attacks on the United States but officials said they could not remember this kind of outpouring of sympathy and aid for any other natural disaster on U.S. soil.

Singapore sent helicopters, Israel offered medical teams within 24 hours and European oil producers responded to a formal U.S. request to release gasoline stocks.

Help was not limited to allies and opponents of U.S. policy such as Cuba and Venezuela put aside their political differences to join the chorus of nations offering help.

Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez offered to send cheap fuel but the State Department said a decision had not been made on whether to accept this offer.

Poor nations that usually turn to the United States for assistance, such as Honduras, offered to become donors as did Sri Lanka and Indonesia, countries that benefited from U.S. assistance after last year's Indian Ocean tsunami.
[...]

 

[T'sNana]

I have goosebumps!! Maybe we can even make new friends or at least agree to disagree with some countries and be civil! Thanks!

Don't know if this has already been posted.


Foreign aid pours in to help Katrina victims
Fri Sep 2, 2005 3:22 PM ET
Printer Friendly | Email Article | Reprints | RSS

By Sue Pleming

WASHINGTON, Sept 2 (Reuters) - The United States has not actively sought foreign aid following Hurricane Katrina but dozens of countries lined up on Friday to help with rescue efforts, from hefty cash donations to tents and helicopters.

The State Department said more than 40 governments and international organizations had made generous offers and the list was growing by the hour after Katrina devastated New Orleans and other parts of the U.S. Gulf Coast, killing hundreds and possibly thousands of people.

"We are not formally requesting assistance but anything that can materially benefit folks in need is something that we will accept," said a State Department official, who spoke on condition of anonymity.

Countries were very generous after the Sept. 11, 2001, attacks on the United States but officials said they could not remember this kind of outpouring of sympathy and aid for any other natural disaster on U.S. soil.

Singapore sent helicopters, Israel offered medical teams within 24 hours and European oil producers responded to a formal U.S. request to release gasoline stocks.

Help was not limited to allies and opponents of U.S. policy such as Cuba and Venezuela put aside their political differences to join the chorus of nations offering help.

Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez offered to send cheap fuel but the State Department said a decision had not been made on whether to accept this offer.

Poor nations that usually turn to the United States for assistance, such as Honduras, offered to become donors as did Sri Lanka and Indonesia, countries that benefited from U.S. assistance after last year's Indian Ocean tsunami.
[...]

 

[DEPUTYDAWG]

I will say I think the President should have stepped in earlier and that unfortunately I am not surprised. I have big concerns about Michael Brown of FEMA. In both cases, I feel there is enough documentation to justify my opinion (which is just my opinion). Thank you for the nice words. I can say a hearty "backatcha." I understand. But, really, I think most of us have just been acknowledging the problem without blaming anyone specifically. I haven't known who to blame (except as stated above), but I know there are people who screwed up. I don't see myself as fllinging blame. But I do think there will be adjustments to the history of this crisis and I want to be able to go back and say, "Hey, wait a second, the mayor said they needed troops on Tuesday morning (thanks to whoever posted that).

You say you are trying to be neutral. I think I'm pretty neutral, too. My opinions are formed by what I have seen and heard and read. If I think Bush (for example) screwed up, it's not because I am not neutral; it's because based on what I know I think he screwed up. Now, if I weren't neutral or maybe objective, I'd be agreeing with those criticizing his comments that the response was "unacceptable." He's catching heat for that, with some saying he's disrespecting those who did go in and help. I don't think he meant that. I think he meant what has happened so far isn't enough, and it wasn't done right. I hope he's big enough to see his own culpalbility, and he may even mean that as well. He didn't single anyone out, and I can't stand the man, but I do NOT think he would criticize those who have tried to go in and save lives.

:blowkiss:

Fair enough. I guess I figure there will be PLENTY of blame to go around, from the local city level on up to Bush and his Admin. (For example, I don't think the Mayor and his Admin did such a swell job...and they live there! They should know much more of the ins and outs of the City's resources, transportation sources/manpower, utilities, hospital capacities - and lack thereof - than feds sitting/planning in D.C. And then on the other side of that, I feel sorry for the Mayor and his staff, as I'm sure they've asked for years for improvements, more resources, etc. and of course, there's always the lack of funds. So, he's stuck. And I don't know about NO itself, but in many cities, the Mayor is basically a figure head with not a lot of power. Who's the City Manager? And, I could go on and on up the ladder to FEMA, etc. and Bush.) But, I don't know, really, who did/didn't do what and when, so I am interested to see/hear all about it when things mellow over the course of some time.

I understand we've all got opinions and I'm sorry if I got frustrated earlier in the day. I'm just as frustrated as y'all, probably.

I'll probably write more later, but gotta go for now.

Thanks

 

[Beyond Belief]

Fox is announcing something about firefighters and their families being held hostage. Did anybody hear what this was about? Sorry I just didn't get what they were talking about or where.

 

[shopper]

I have a question. WTH are there still thousands outside the Superdome on that ramp? This is the second full day in a row (or has it been longer now) that they've been sitting there. Where are the buses, aren't some supposed to be on the way? Have all the people at the convention center been bussed out? I'm confused now, sorry.

 

[Dara]

:blowkiss:

Fair enough. I guess I figure there will be PLENTY of blame to go around, from the local city level on up to Bush and his Admin. (For example, I don't think the Mayor and his Admin did such a swell job...and they live there! They should know much more of the ins and outs of the City's resources, transportation sources/manpower, utilities, hospital capacities - and lack thereof - than feds sitting/planning in D.C. And then on the other side of that, I feel sorry for the Mayor and his staff, as I'm sure they've asked for years for improvements, more resources, etc. and of course, there's always the lack of funds. So, he's stuck. And I don't know about NO itself, but in many cities, the Mayor is basically a figure head with not a lot of power. Who's the City Manager? And, I could go on and on up the ladder to FEMA, etc. and Bush.) But, I don't know, really, who did/didn't do what and when, so I am interested to see/hear all about it when things mellow over the course of some time.

I understand we've all got opinions and I'm sorry if I got frustrated earlier in the day. I'm just as frustrated as y'all, probably.

I'll probably write more later, but gotta go for now.

Thanks

:blowkiss:

Hey, I disagree with you fairly often, but every time I do, I seriously consider your point of view because I respect you. I learn from you. I really hope as more information comes out, we can continue to discuss this. For example, I'm reacting emotionally to the mayor because of his pleas, but you bring in some points I haven't given much thought to about him and his office.

Have a good evening!

 

[Dara]

Fox is announcing something about firefighters and their families being held hostage. Did anybody hear what this was about? Sorry I just didn't get what they were talking about or where.

Oh, no!

I still can't find out what happened to the prison guard and his family who were held hostage in one of the prisons (I think this happened Tuesday). Does anyone have an update on them?

 

[Beyond Belief]

St Bernard Parish Snipers outside the building of the firefighters.

 

[concernedperson]

I haven't heard it. I'm going to see if I can find a reference.

Just to clarify: I don't have a problem with anyone cursing. I would. I am. And I'm not there. I find the mayor's emotion and frustration to be appropriate. When I read that he broke down in tears, I wanted to share that, because he was the single consistent voice that has spoken for the victims and asked for what they needed, and imo he went largely unheard.

It was me that posted about Mayor Nagin. I believe he was truly aware early on and so stated. The rest of the politicos were doing their normal, deny the problem and things will work out. I was also a doomsayer early on if anyone remembers.

I have been cursing like the devil....words I haven't used in years. I also have been crying a lot. I have had giant arguments with my daughter because she was taking the middle road and then the next day everything we talked about happened.It is the frustration when no one listens. Now we will get the problems solved throughout the south....people are listening.

 

[Dara]

It was me that posted about Mayor Nagin. I believe he was truly aware early on and so stated. The rest of the politicos were doing their normal, deny the problem and things will work out. I was also a doomsayer early on if anyone remembers.

I have been cursing like the devil....words I haven't used in years. I also have been crying a lot. I have had giant arguments with my daughter because she was taking the middle road and then the next day everything we talked about happened.It is the frustration when no one listens. Now we will get the problems solved throughout the south....people are listening.

I remember!

I was out earlier and the radio station was doing their daily theme lunch hour. So, first I heard "Yellow Moon" by the Neville Brothers, then "Home" by Marc Broussard, and then I realized they were doing a tribute to music from LA artists. And it just hit me and I sat in my car and cried. I wasn't crying about the songs or anything in specific. Just the whole thing.

 

[mysteriew]

More than 7,600 prisoners were transported out of the New Orleans (search) area to state prisons and local jails, signaling the start of major changes for the criminal justice system in Louisiana.

The district attorney's office in New Orleans is near the jail where thousands of inmates were still being evacuated Thursday
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,168320,00.html

 

[concernedperson]

More than 7,600 prisoners were transported out of the New Orleans (search) area to state prisons and local jails, signaling the start of major changes for the criminal justice system in Louisiana.

The district attorney's office in New Orleans is near the jail where thousands of inmates were still being evacuated Thursday
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,168320,00.html

David Dugas was a childhood friend of mine. He is pretty good on the judicial level. Maybe they should send them all to Angola.....the hell on earth prison.

As an aside these traveling looters with automatics on a truck that caused NOPD to turn in their badges should be shot on sight.

 

[DEPUTYDAWG]

DeputyDawg - I understand that they're desperate for assistance and wanting to evacuate, I never questioned that. I'm sure the anger and frustration is very high.... I don't, however, understand why someone who is desperate for help would be shooting at other people who also want help. They aren't able to go help rescue people who want rescued if they are afraid for their lives.

Oh SieSie, I think maybe you took my comment the wrong way...I was agreeing with you. If you took it the other (sarcastic) way, I am sorry! I haven't been very good at expressing myself here today :slap:

No, I meant it that those who have the time, capability and means to be snipers and shooting at rescue workers and aid, REALLY do not seem to be desperate for aid. Obviously the copters are around/above them, and rather than flagging them down begging for a drop of water supply or food, they're making a conscious choice of making them retreat, so others who are law-abiding, desperate citizens can't get help.

Sorry if I was unclear earlier...DD

 

[DEPUTYDAWG]

:blowkiss:

Hey, I disagree with you fairly often, but every time I do, I seriously consider your point of view because I respect you. I learn from you. I really hope as more information comes out, we can continue to discuss this. For example, I'm reacting emotionally to the mayor because of his pleas, but you bring in some points I haven't given much thought to about him and his office.

Have a good evening!

Fairly often? Dang, say it ain't so! LOL

I share the same sentiments with you, as above.

ETA: For example, you comment about the disparity between the private hospital and the county-run hospital. OMG, I'm TRYING to figure out WHY there would be such a disparity as to why one can be evacuated so much more efficiently than the other...but unless it's sheer number of patients and staff, or patient/staff ratios, I don't know how it could be justified. Anyone know? Is one considerably larger than the other?

 

[Details]

I'm thinking those snipers don't want rescue or assistance. Sounds like it's the gangs, and they think they've got a pretty nice situation right now - they can steal, murder, rape, do whatever they want - the city is theirs. Gangs always look at their territories as their property, they figure now they can have it without the competition from the government. I really think they like this. That's why they fire on rescuers and anyone governmental - to keep them out.