IA IA - Elizabeth Collins, 8, & Lyric Cook, 10, Evansdale, 13 July 2012 - #23

[SouthernMom]

hmm...Heather seemed to agree when the interviewer said "I assume the bodies had been there for quite some time". I think I got that quote close to correct.

If the interview started right at 1:30, I missed the 1st half hour of it. I picked up on that right away & thought right away that we just got the answer that we were all wondering about. The newsreporter has been on KWWL for over 30 yrs. so he knows how to interview people in a respectful way & still get the answers the public want to hear. I was actually surprised that they were both as open as they were.

This is interesting. This plus Drew's suspicions that it was an SO, possibly one who had offended before, makes me lean even more towards my theory that this happened quickly and the perp was back home by the time the community was searching for the girls.

 

[SapphireSteel]

BBM

Heather and Drew both stated that they do not want to know every detail, they want LE to focus on solving this case. Drew mentioned that they don't call LE asking questions all the time, they are letting LE do their job.

So, they are just working with what they know, like the rest of us.

They probably know more than us, but way less than LE.

 

[Ms Pragmatic]

I understand and respect the patents not wanting to know the details. This varies from case to case. I have heard parents say they HAVE to know what their son/daughter went through, while others just cannot bear to know the gruesome details. My heart aches for these people.

 

[24Roses]

I think someone mentioned a couple of pages back about Heather wanting the killer to come to the funeral & confess. She & Drew have also questioned if they helped in the searched & came to the vigils.
Also she did say she hasn't been in contact with Misty for quite some time & it's basically because of her lifestyle & she doesn't want that around her children. When asked to go deeper in the discussion about drugs, she didn't really want to say to much & there was alot of bad blood (not her words); I can't remember exactly what she said, but along those lines. Drew agreed with her.

 

[otto]

The girl weighed 145lb.

She may have had another couple of inches left to go, but she was essentially grown.

Remember the perp would have first spotted them from a distance. If you look at the cctv footage, there is a clear disparity in size between the two.

Children do not stop growing at age 10. In fact, barring any genetic abnormality, height growth continues until the early 20s. With a shoe size of women's size 9,I think that Lyric was probably going to get a lot taller.

Lyric and Elizabeth were 8 and 10 years old when they were abducted and I very much doubt that anyone thought they were mother and daughter, or adult and child ... no way that happened.

 

[iamnotagolem]

Can someone please clarify the significance they feel is attributed to Lyric's height and weight?

I think regardless of her being larger than many adult women, I think she clearly had the physique of a little girl. My BFFs niece is probably about the same size/build as Lyric only 6-8 inches taller, but she is clearly still a little girl and not much mistaking her for an adult.

While I am smaller than Lyric, I would never be confused for a 10 y/o (21 y/o yes from time to time). The weight displacement on a child is much different from an adult or even teen who has hit puberty.

 

[SouthernMom]

^^^BBM

But Lyric wasn't an 8 year old girl.

She was a 10 year old girl who resembled an adult in general appearance, height, weight.

Is Drew implying that Lizzie was the target?

This doesn't make much sense to me, as only Lizzie would have been taken.

:cow:

IMO, in the pics I have seen of Lyric, I would never have mistaken her for an adult. I have a grand-daughter about the same age and size who still looks very much like a little girl. I also have a sister-in-law who is 4'9" and weighs 100 lbs. She is 36 and is sometimes mistaken for a child.

 

[iamnotagolem]

Children do not stop growing at age 10. In fact, barring any genetic abnormality, height growth continues until the early 20s. With a shoe size of women's size 9, Lyric think she was probably going to get a lot taller.

Lyric and Elizabeth were 8 and 10 years old when they were abducted and I very much doubt that anyone thought they were mother and daughter, or adult and child ... no way that happened.

Typically women stop growing one year after they begin their menstrual cycle. So Lyric could have been done growing, but I doubt it. She looked very much prepubescent. With a size 9 shoe, I'd guess Lyric would have had several more inches of growing to do.

 

[SouthernMom]

Can someone please clarify the significance they feel is attributed to Lyric's height and weight?

I think regardless of her being larger than many adult women, I think she clearly had the physique of a little girl. My BFFs niece is probably about the same size/build as Lyric only 6-8 inches taller, but she is clearly still a little girl and not much mistaking her for an adult.

While I am smaller than Lyric, I would never be confused for a 10 y/o (21 y/o yes from time to time). The weight displacement on a child is much different from an adult or even teen who has hit puberty.

I don't really understand either. To me she looked young. However, if an SO wants to abduct someone, it doesn't always stop them if a second person is present. There are so many cases of SO's abducting victims at gunpoint and killing the witness or taking the second victim with them. To get hung up on that one detail is to get tunnel vision in my opinion.

 

[24Roses]

Heather also mentioned something about allowing cameras into the service on Thursday night for Elizabeth. She wanted people who couldn't come to be able to take part (something along those lines). Does anyone else think this means that it might be streamed on the KWWL website or on tv? I have not read this anywhere as of yet.

 

[Marilynilpa]

http://www.kwwl.com/category/130142...d=8060551&topVideoCatNo=132414&autoStart=true

Here's the video.

 

[Snufamonbobball]

Heather also mentioned something about allowing cameras into the service on Thursday night for Elizabeth. She wanted people who couldn't come to be able to take part (something along those lines). Does anyone else think this means that it might be streamed on the KWWL website or on tv? I have not read this anywhere as of yet.

It will be livestreamed on KWWL per the girls Facebook site.

 

[Knox]

Heather is truly inspirational.

http://www.kwwl.com/story/20310851/...beth-collins-speaks-about-her-daughters-death

 

[SouthernMom]

I think whomever this was, could not resist the urge to commit this crime. I have been reading over some of the msm articles on Israel Keyes, who had rules for himself, but no specific preferred victim type.
I was interested to learn that he indicated that his last murder, of Samantha Koenig, broke some of those rules because he just couldn't resist the urge to commit the crime.

 

[foxbluff]

IMHO, LE perhaps let the Collins know that bodies had been out there since the beginning due to nature of evidence for ID that LE was presenting to them or they could have been told as a kindness.

And by kindness I mean that the poor parents were worried sick the moment the girls went missing and as the months went by that certainly, IMO, wouldn't have lessened.

Furthermore, even if they confidently thought their child was still alive during the past 4+ mos, I would think they would suffer daily not knowing what kind of torture said child was experiencing. I mean really... they would have to have realized that there was "no good reason" that someone was holding their child.

#1 - they knew their child had been abducted
#2 - they now know that their child is dead
#3 - (and here's the kindness) - IMHO, the best news that LE could have given to these long suffering parents after having to tell them that their child was dead, would be to let them know that their child had not been tortured for 4+ months from #1 - #2.

Other than the above disclosure, I personally don't believe that LE would be making the mistake of giving any family members inside/protected info. Too much of a risk, IMHO, that they would share the info on fb or in front of cameras, etc.

 

[gngr~snap]

Children do not stop growing at age 10. In fact, barring any genetic abnormality, height growth continues until the early 20s. With a shoe size of women's size 9,I think that Lyric was probably going to get a lot taller.

Lyric and Elizabeth were 8 and 10 years old when they were abducted and I very much doubt that anyone thought they were mother and daughter, or adult and child ... no way that happened.

Can someone please clarify the significance they feel is attributed to Lyric's height and weight?

I think regardless of her being larger than many adult women, I think she clearly had the physique of a little girl. My BFFs niece is probably about the same size/build as Lyric only 6-8 inches taller, but she is clearly still a little girl and not much mistaking her for an adult.

While I am smaller than Lyric, I would never be confused for a 10 y/o (21 y/o yes from time to time). The weight displacement on a child is much different from an adult or even teen who has hit puberty.

I am not sure why people think it matters in this case, but I would like to say...
While men may continue to get taller until their early 20's a females height does NOT.

I won't even speculate as to where Lyric was developmentally speaking but...
After the first period a females height typically only increases by +/- 2-3 inches.

The earlier that is the shorter the females stature will be.

"Once girls start to menstruate, they usually grow about 1 or 2 more inches, reaching their final adult height by about age 14 or 15 years (younger or older depending on when puberty began)."

http://kidshealth.org/parent/growth/growth/growth_13_to_18.html

 

[iamnotagolem]

I am not sure why people think it matters in this case, but I would like to say...
While men may continue to get taller until their early 20's a females height does NOT.

I won't even speculate as to where Lyric was developmentally speaking but...
After the first period a females height typically only increases by +/- 2-3 inches.

The earlier that is the shorter the females stature will be.

"Once girls start to menstruate, they usually grow about 1 or 2 more inches, reaching their final adult height by about age 14 or 15 years (younger or older depending on when puberty began)."

http://kidshealth.org/parent/growth/growth/growth_13_to_18.html

Thanks for the link, I was looking for one to back up my post but failed.

 

[Foxfire]

I agree with Chris_Texas, as much as I wish that wasn't the case. Did anyone follow Celina Cass? LE acted confident, it was assumed there would be an arrest within a week. 1.5 years later there still hasn't been an arrest.

I do think the police have worked hard and followed all leads, but they really might be completely clueless about the perp. I really hope I'm wrong and they have had this under their hat all this time and were just waiting for the bodies to sweep in and make an arrest.

Even in the Jessica Ridgeway case, the police basically had nothing until his mom turned him in. How long would it have taken to solve that one without her help?

Police really do need the public's help in these cases. I really hope they get a tip soon that will help solve this case, these girls need justice.

Agree iamnotagolem. We have seen so many missing/murdered person cases grow cold due to the refusal of investigators to utilize their most valuable resource; the American public via ms media & the internet..

RE: Austin Sigg

LE had taken a DNA swab of Sigg, a few days before the phone call. The lab results, once completed, would have pointed back to him as Jessica Ridgeway's abductor/killer, imo. His mom had no choice but to make the phone call, imo..glad she did the right thing...

(snipped)
According to KMGH, our Scripps station in Denver, a woman identifying herself as Sigg's aunt said the teen went to his mother on Tuesday with "disturbing information," and she urged him to call police and turn himself in.

Read more: http://www.kshb.com/dpp/news/national/arrest-made-in-jessica-ridgeway-case#ixzz2Esdav2vY

 

[gngr~snap]

Thanks for the link, I was looking for one to back up my post but failed.

useless knowledge I guess...
:blushing: us TALL girls are typically late bloomers...

 

[epiphany]

I had missed this in the threads...in video linked below, Heather & Drew were shown Elizabeth's shoes and Lyric's flip-flops:

http://www.kwwl.com/category/130142...d=8060551&topVideoCatNo=132414&autoStart=true