IA IA - Elizabeth Collins, 8, & Lyric Cook, 10, Evansdale, 13 July 2012 - #25

[alliemay]

Unless I missed something, I don't recall LE making any statements that Seven Bridges was a dump site. The only place I ever saw that was on the Nancy Grace show and I took that to be the opinion of one of her experts, not neccessarily fact.

I agree with you, I saw nothing that would indicate that LE made that statement. I did think longer on the topic though, if they had been shot at the 7 Bridges location there would have been blood splatter, if they had been stabbed there would have been traces of blood on the ground, twigs, etc. (sorry so graphic). Did they release how the children were killed yet? If they had been strangled, no one would be able to determine if it was at that location or another.

In other thoughts, I think, like quite a few on here, that they knew this person, I also think like some others that this person was familiar with the 7 bridges park. Looks like at some point in the past it was a nice spot to visit, then afterwards, it became a teenage party place. I noticed on the 7 bridges video, that there was one rock along the creek where someone spray painted their initials. Wonder if there is any other signs of vandalism at the park.

In the 20 mile stretch between Myers Lake to 7 Bridges, has there been anyone who has sold their house and moved. IIRC, It was mentioned in one post about Elizabeth visiting the farmers market, not familiar with the area, but for that 20 stretch, how many farms are working farms.

 

[Bootsctr]

Cause of Evansdale cousins' deaths will be kept confidential

Smock and other officials are still waiting for information from the Iowa state medical examiner’s office, and the case has not legally been ruled homicide, though Smock said investigators are treating it as one. http://www.desmoinesregister.com/ar...aths-will-be-kept-confidential?nclick_check=1

I don't understand why this has NOT been ruled as a homocide yet. Maybe it is just me, but I don't think the girls got lost and ended up in 7-Bridges and died from exposure from the elements. I don't think they drowned either. If strangled and the remains were skeletonized I realize the chance of finding the hyoid bone might be slim to none.

 

[Marilynilpa]

I don't understand why this has NOT been ruled as a homocide yet. Maybe it is just me, but I don't think the girls got lost and ended up in 7-Bridges and died from exposure from the elements. I don't think they drowned either. If strangled and the remains were skeletonized I realize the chance of finding the hyoid bone might be slim to none.

Black Hawk County Sheriff Tony Thompson told the Associated Press via telephone, “We’re going to be extremely meticulous and we’re not going to apologize for that… We’ve got the opportunity to find a killer.”

http://www.examiner.com/article/pol...iowa-cousins-lyric-cook-and-elizabeth-collins

BBM

It hasn't officially been ruled a homicide, but LE is obviously investigating it as such.

 

[Bootsctr]

Waiting for those results can sometimes be detrimental to an investigation, as was the case in a Polk County murder about 25 years ago, Moulder said. Authorities had a suspect in custody but had to wait for confirmation that DNA evidence found on the victim’s body was that of the killer. http://www.desmoinesregister.com/ar...aths-will-be-kept-confidential?nclick_check=1

Does anybody have an idea to which murder case retired Des Moines police chief and consultant, William Moulder, is referring to?

 

[Bootsctr]

Black Hawk County Sheriff Tony Thompson told the Associated Press via telephone, “We’re going to be extremely meticulous and we’re not going to apologize for that… We’ve got the opportunity to find a killer.”

http://www.examiner.com/article/pol...iowa-cousins-lyric-cook-and-elizabeth-collins

BBM

It hasn't officially been ruled a homicide, but LE is obviously investigating it as such.

Thank you.

We finally have something we can sink our teeth into.

I hope they find him. lease: Maybe someone will come forward soon or has and LE is just getting their proverbial ducks in a row.

 

[roseofsharon]

If you take sexual predator and drug related crime out of the equation, what other motives are there, what person(s) had the opportunity and what person(s) had so much to lose, they had to murder L and E.

MOO

 

[iamnotagolem]

If you take sexual predator and drug related crime out of the equation, what other motives are there, what person(s) had the opportunity and what person(s) had so much to lose, they had to murder L and E.

MOO

Jealousy, hate, revenge, thrill

 

[MNDad]

Black Hawk County Sheriff Tony Thompson told the Associated Press via telephone, “We’re going to be extremely meticulous and we’re not going to apologize for that… We’ve got the opportunity to find a killer.”

http://www.examiner.com/article/pol...iowa-cousins-lyric-cook-and-elizabeth-collins

BBM

It hasn't officially been ruled a homicide, but LE is obviously investigating it as such.

I am not allowed to nor am I trying to sleuth any family members for deliberately committing an abduction or homicide, but what if it wasn't a homicide and it was a horrible accident and poor decision cover up caused by panic and it got out of control.

 

[GrainneDhu]

I agree with you, I saw nothing that would indicate that LE made that statement. I did think longer on the topic though, if they had been shot at the 7 Bridges location there would have been blood splatter, if they had been stabbed there would have been traces of blood on the ground, twigs, etc. (sorry so graphic). Did they release how the children were killed yet? If they had been strangled, no one would be able to determine if it was at that location or another.

In other thoughts, I think, like quite a few on here, that they knew this person, I also think like some others that this person was familiar with the 7 bridges park. Looks like at some point in the past it was a nice spot to visit, then afterwards, it became a teenage party place. I noticed on the 7 bridges video, that there was one rock along the creek where someone spray painted their initials. Wonder if there is any other signs of vandalism at the park.

In the 20 mile stretch between Myers Lake to 7 Bridges, has there been anyone who has sold their house and moved. IIRC, It was mentioned in one post about Elizabeth visiting the farmers market, not familiar with the area, but for that 20 stretch, how many farms are working farms.

Good point about potential blood spatter evidence.

I can guarantee that all the farms between Evansdale and 7 Bridges are working farms. Iowa is blessed with some of the most fertile soil on earth; abandoned farms are just not a feature of the Iowa landscape. Even if a house is abandoned, the fields around it will be worked. There's just too much money to be made from crops to let an entire farm fall fallow.

If you see unworked fields in Iowa, they are always conservation acreage, where farmers are paid by the government not to farm those acres.

 

[Just Pat 22]

Did you get the impresssion that police are also seeing problems with the timeline?

Otto A Charris Paulson Assistant Dierctor ofThe Iowa Investigation Wrote an e mail to LE and Enforcement Officials and state employees on Sept 12th2012 in the Demoines Register That They MAY have a video of the girls being abductive a video on the abductors vehicle .Just spotted this today .

 

[Marilynilpa]

Does anybody have an idea to which murder case retired Des Moines police chief and consultant, William Moulder, is referring to?

Not sure, but I'm looking for something. So far I have found this:

http://www.radioiowa.com/2012/07/11/appeals-court-orders-review-of-two-teen-murder-sentences/

One of these crimes occurred in 1985, and one in 1988.

I'll keep looking.

ETA: I think I've found it, but nothing I can link. For those who are interested, the case is State of Iowa v. Brown, August 1988. DNA evidence admitted. Defendant convicted of first-degree murder.

Now I'll try to find newspaper articles.

 

[carbuff]

Jealousy, hate, revenge, thrill

protecting self (if the girls knew something that could send him/her/them to jail, for instance)

money (sell for drugs, collect on insurance policy)

 

[Bootsctr]

I am not allowed to nor am I trying to sleuth any family members for deliberately committing an abduction or homicide, but what if it wasn't a homicide and it was a horrible accident and poor decision cover up caused by panic and it got out of control.

I think that would explain a lot. LE is being extremely lenient in allowing someone time to come forward and explain theirselves and I think the clock is ticking. It's only a matter of time... tick... tock!

 

[Bootsctr]

Not sure, but I'm looking for something. So far I have found this:

http://www.radioiowa.com/2012/07/11/appeals-court-orders-review-of-two-teen-murder-sentences/

One of these crimes occurred in 1985, and one in 1988.

I'll keep looking.

ETA: I think I've found it, but nothing I can link. For those who are interested, the case is State of Iowa v. Brown, August 1988. DNA evidence admitted. Defendant convicted of first-degree murder.

Now I'll try to find newspaper articles.

Wow! Thank you!

 

[Bootsctr]

Otto A Charris Paulson Assistant Dierctor ofThe Iowa Investigation Wrote an e mail to LE and Enforcement Officials and state employees on Sept 12th2012 in the Demoines Register That They MAY have a video of the girls being abductive a video on the abductors vehicle .Just spotted this today .

Thank you Pat! I bet this is what LE is waiting on. It would take a while to go through hundreds of hours of video they must have amassed.

 

[Marilynilpa]

I am not allowed to nor am I trying to sleuth any family members for deliberately committing an abduction or homicide, but what if it wasn't a homicide and it was a horrible accident and poor decision cover up caused by panic and it got out of control.

If anyone can come up with a plausible explanation for how both girls died in an accident, I'd be interested in hearing it. I could see this being a case of poor decision, panic and covering up if only one girl had died, but I can't think of a reasonable explanation for both girls dying in an accident.

 

[Bootsctr]

protecting self (if the girls knew something that could send him/her/them to jail, for instance)

money (sell for drugs, collect on insurance policy)

I agree, but that only explains the reason for one child. Why the second child? Was it to totally skew the investigation?

 

[carbuff]

If anyone can come up with a plausible explanation for how both girls died in an accident, I'd be interested in hearing it. I could see this being a case of poor decision, panic and covering up if only one girl had died, but I can't think of a reasonable explanation for both girls dying in an accident.

I don't think any of these are likely, but:

Took them out fishing and they all fell in a deep pool and the girls drowned?

They were riding side by side as they crossed a driveway and somebody backed out too fast and didn't see them?

Taken out to the park by older boys wanting to play a mean prank and left there to be frightened in the woods, and died of exposure before anybody came back? Or alternately, the perp raped them and left them the way the Wyoming guy did, and they died of exposure/beating/animals?

Wonder if the Wyoming rapist has been ruled out. He had family in the Midwest somewhere.

 

[roseofsharon]

Jealousy, hate, revenge, thrill

To respectfully respond ... jealousy (of what) hate (why), revenge (for what) ... they were only very young children and as far as thrill, just moo, but thrill murder would be more spontaneous, a fantasy of a psychopath and I think these murders were well planned, but I am no expert, so again just moo.

 

[iamnotagolem]

I don't think any of these are likely, but:

Took them out fishing and they all fell in a deep pool and the girls drowned?

They were riding side by side as they crossed a driveway and somebody backed out too fast and didn't see them?

Taken out to the park by older boys wanting to play a mean prank and left there to be frightened in the woods, and died of exposure before anybody came back? Or alternately, the perp raped them and left them the way the Wyoming guy did, and they died of exposure/beating/animals?

Wonder if the Wyoming rapist has been ruled out. He had family in the Midwest somewhere.

People call 911 when there is an accident. An accident is not even in the realm of possibilities, IMO. I see it mentioned in every case. I think it is so hard to believe the cruelty involved in killing children, that every case there is hope that it was an accident.

If they were left alive at 7bridges and died of exposure, I'd be shocked. There are probably half a dozen houses within a mile of where their bodies were found.
We believe they rode their bikes to Meyers lake but couldn't walk 3/4 of a mile to a house after being abandoned? Not likely IMO.