IA IA - Elizabeth Collins, 8, & Lyric Cook, 10, Evansdale, 13 July 2012 - #28

[SapphireSteel]

I am seriously starting to wonder what is going on in that town.

The BHCSO's public meeting attracted the grand total of 8 attendees.

When you consider the unique circumstances in Evansdale lately, this seems an inexplicably apathetic response.

We have two little girls abducted and murdered for the first time in town history.

Where were all the concerned parents and relatives of Evansdale's other little girls? Why was no one concerned enough even to attend and ask questions about the safety of their own children?

We also have the 110 house blitz in late October. Where are all the angry residents who want answers for being kept up half the night, or even to question the outcome of the blitz or just be mildly interested in the followup?

Is Evansdale a virtual criminal enclave? Is the town full of methed out ferals who have zero interest in or support for local Law Enforcement, and really couldn't care less about the girls or anything else really, as long as their supply is intact?

Because that's what it's starting to look like.

 

[SapphireSteel]

Yes exactly. They stated that the girls were last seen riding their bikes on brovan and they have information stating that the girls were seen on gilbert from 12:30-1p

Since they were so specific about the bikes and the brovan sighting, why not the gilbert sighting?

That with the Abben's statement that finding the bikes at the lake does not prove the girls were at the lake.

The dogs found the girls scent at the lake though.

I can't explain that away so easily.

 

[Aymstriss]

They must really believe and have full proof that the girls were at the lake or I wouldn't think they would erect a gazebo in their names.

I don’t have a strong belief one way or the other if the girls were actually at the lake, but even if it turns out that they were not there, I think most people are going to relate Meyers Lake with this case.

 

[foxbluff]

I am a lurker...been reading here for quite a while. I found this site by googleing the girls because of lack of “conversations/posts” on newspaper/TV News stories.

I live in Waterloo, just north of Evansdale, I drive through Evansdale everyday to get to work.


FYI, I have a theory or two, I just don’t think I am able to discuss it here due to TOS. Also I’ll just be honest....I don’t KNOW what happened.

I will say that I find it hard to believe that I can not really recall an abduction recently of 1 child, and I think it would be difficult that a first time abductor would take two. I do think the abductor is local, as a person passing through would probably not be familiar with 7 bridges.

From some of the comments, it appears that some people believe that this crime is a result of a message/retaliation connected with Lyric’s parents and their drug habit/people they may be associated with. For some of the reasons people oppose this is because, wouldn’t they leave the bodies somewhere so they are found sooner, why take them 20 miles away, etc.

What if...maybe the took the girls as a message, but did not think that it would escalate the way it did, that fast. Maybe the abductor(s) didn’t think that some of the particular family members would not want to contact the police....

Once it became so big the only saw one way out, unfortunately.

Like I said....I have a few theories ...but I go back a forth a lot.

Yesss... I know you've been a member/lurker here as I've seen your name pop-up so many times before... so many times that I actually have a nic name for you. <gads, I guess that would be a nic-of-a-nic??> At any rate, rest assured there is nothing bad/negative in said nic.

Given that I can't say my usual "welcome aboard," I'll settle for "welcome to taking the plunge !!"

P.S. Wow... WSers has yet another local... and speaking of locals, welcome back, Chels... until yesterday, I was abt to send the posse out !!

 

[Aymstriss]

Thank you!

 

[threecrazykids]

The dogs found the girls scent at the lake though.

I can't explain that away so easily.

Correct! Which COULD mean, that TG's sighting of the BIKES ONLY was valid...and the girls were still at the park, just NOT in view of TG.

Possibly playing over in the wooded area...OR they simply didn't catch the attention of TG...wherever they were, possibly playing at the edge of the lake, just not within the line of sight from TG! Snuck off into the woods to go potty?

THEN, maybe someone else stopped and talked to them and said "meet me in the parking lot" or something along those lines...I don't know what.

They then (for whatever stinkin' reason) WALK over to the parking lot/entrance to park area which then someone may have seen them "between 12:30 -1:00".

MAYBE one of the girls had a flat tire so they were going to walk. Or maybe someone flattened their tire while they were playing by the lake and then "offered them a ride home".

This makes sense that the girls would be playing by the lake when TG rode by, he just didn't see them...and still account for the 12:30-1:00 sighting at the entrance.

 

[otto]

Correct! Which COULD mean, that TG's sighting of the BIKES ONLY was valid...and the girls were still at the park, just NOT in view of TG.

Possibly playing over in the wooded area...OR they simply didn't catch the attention of TG...wherever they were, possibly playing at the edge of the lake, just not within the line of sight from TG!

THEN, maybe someone else stopped and talked to them and said "meet me in the parking lot" or something along those lines...I don't know what.

They then (for whatever stinkin' reason) WALK over to the parking lot/entrance to park area which then someone may have seen them "between 12:30 -1:00".

MAYBE one of the girls had a flat tire so they were going to walk. Or maybe someone flattened their tire while they were playing by the lake and then "offered them a ride home".

This makes sense that the girls would be playing by the lake when TG rode by, he just didn't see them...and still account for the 12:30-1:00 sighting at the entrance.

Police have said that the children were at Brovan at 12:15, at Brovan at 12:23 and somewhere along Elmer/Gilbert/Arbutus between 12:30 and 1:00. Therefore, their bikes were not at the SE tip of the lake at 12:20.

The fact that the dogs indicated that the scent went from the bikes to the lake, about 10 feet away, does not mean that the cyclist saw the children's bikes. In fact, I don't think any conclusion can be drawn about the cyclist based on where the dogs tracked.

Is there any reason why we should ignore information that has been released by police?

 

[otto]

They must really believe and have full proof that the girls were at the lake or I wouldn't think they would erect a gazebo in their names.

The children were seen cycling near the lake between 12:30 and 1:00, then their bikes were found at 2:00 at the gate. That suggests that the girls cycled there, parked their bikes, and vanished ... most likely in the Maiden Lane area (where a vehicle could easily be hidden).

 

[otto]

Maybe a video captured them in a vehicle? Or maybe even them walking somewhere? Is there anywhere in that area that could possibly have a camera that could have captured them?

Nothing says they had to be on their bikes just because they were at the lake parking lot.

:waitasec:

We know that they were cycling on Brovan at 12:15, that they were still on Brovan at 12:23 and that they were somewhere along Elmer/Gilbert and Arbutus between 12:30 and 1:00. How did they get there without their bikes and where did their bikes go?

 

[otto]

I don't recall LE saying the girls AND their bikes were seen between 12:30 and 1:00 . Iirc only the girls were mentioned.

The girls were cycling on Brovan at 12:23. How did the girls get to Gilbert at 12:30 without their bikes and how did their bikes get to the SE tip of the lake?

What is the reason for trying to separate the girls from their bikes ... to include the cyclist's story?

The cyclist claims he saw the bikes at the SE tip of the lake at 12:20. That's when the girls and their bikes were still on Brovan.

 

[threecrazykids]

Police have said that the children were at Brovan at 12:15, at Brovan at 12:23 and somewhere along Elmer/Gilbert/Arbutus between 12:30 and 1:00. Therefore, their bikes were not at the SE tip of the lake at 12:20.

The fact that the dogs indicated that the scent went from the bikes to the lake, about 10 feet away, does not mean that the cyclist saw the children's bikes. In fact, I don't think any conclusion can be drawn about the cyclist based on where the dogs tracked.

Is there any reason why we should ignore information that has been released by police?

Ok, so ignore the cyclist's statement altogether. They still could have rode their bikes from 12:23 on Brovan...went to the edge of the lake and were still seen (with or without their bikes) between 12:30 -1:00.

We've concluded someone can ride that trip in 8 minutes. From 12:23-1:00 they've got MORE than ample time to do it.

The only time I believe LE has shown the girls were seen with their bikes was the video. We are reading into that statement assuming they were still ON their bikes at any other point after that video.

LE didn't say they were seen with their bikes at the Elmer/Gilbert/Arbutus sighting. Maybe someone called in saying they saw them walking with an adult, or even getting into a car but couldn't recall the vehicle at all. Maybe that is the "little piece" that LE needs to review any of the other video they claim they have, but they don't know what they are looking for.

 

[otto]

Ok, so ignore the cyclist's statement altogether. They still could have rode their bikes from 12:23 on Brovan...went to the edge of the lake and were still seen (with or without their bikes) between 12:30 -1:00.

We've concluded someone can ride that trip in 8 minutes. From 12:23-1:00 they've got MORE than ample time to do it.

The only time I believe LE has shown the girls were seen with their bikes was the video. We are reading into that statement assuming they were still ON their bikes at any other point after that video.

LE didn't say they were seen with their bikes at the Elmer/Gilbert/Arbutus sighting. Maybe someone called in saying they saw them walking with an adult, or even getting into a car but couldn't recall the vehicle at all. Maybe that is the "little piece" that LE needs to review any of the other video they claim they have, but they don't know what they are looking for.

They were on Brovan at 12:23, and in the area of Elmer/Gilbert/Arbutus between 12:30 and 1:00 - which very likely corresponds to the lawn watering man's tip (who saw the girls cycling), and perhaps information from others that live in the area and on Lake Avenue. At no time did anyone say that they saw the girls walking in that area. At no time have police asked for information of the two girls without bikes.

What is the purpose of trying to separate the chidren from their bikes other than at the time that they were abducted?

 

[threecrazykids]

They were on Brovan at 12:23, and in the area of Elmer/Gilbert/Arbutus between 12:30 and 1:00 - which very likely corresponds to the lawn watering man's tip (who saw the girls cycling), and perhaps information from others that live in the area and on Lake Avenue. At no time did anyone say that they saw the girls walking in that area. At no time have police asked for information of the two girls without bikes.

What is the purpose of trying to separate the chidren from their bikes other than at the time that they were abducted?

Correction...at no time did LE make a msm statement that anyone saw the girls walking without their bikes in that area. Where was it stated by LE hat no one called in any information about seeing the girls not on their bikes? According to the link I read LE stated they wanted anyone to call if they saw the girls in that area...they didnt say "dont bother calling if you saw them off their bikes because that doesnt work with our theory of a man who said he saw them sometime between 12 and 3 on their bikes"

 

[cindersoot]

Correct! Which COULD mean, that TG's sighting of the BIKES ONLY was valid...and the girls were still at the park, just NOT in view of TG.

Possibly playing over in the wooded area...OR they simply didn't catch the attention of TG...wherever they were, possibly playing at the edge of the lake, just not within the line of sight from TG! Snuck off into the woods to go potty?

THEN, maybe someone else stopped and talked to them and said "meet me in the parking lot" or something along those lines...I don't know what.

They then (for whatever stinkin' reason) WALK over to the parking lot/entrance to park area which then someone may have seen them "between 12:30 -1:00".

MAYBE one of the girls had a flat tire so they were going to walk. Or maybe someone flattened their tire while they were playing by the lake and then "offered them a ride home".

This makes sense that the girls would be playing by the lake when TG rode by, he just didn't see them...and still account for the 12:30-1:00 sighting at the entrance.

I just don't think they walked over to the parking lot, not when they have bikes available. jmo

 

[Squeeze]

They need to find the killer or killers first before any child or person will feel safe in that park again or at Seven Bridges. They can make all the beatifications they want to the park, but it isn't going to change the fact that they have a killer or killers out there that can strike again. Maybe they ought to devote their efforts and energy to finding out who did this rather than having another fund raiser.

The ones behind the fundraiser are an entirely different group of people. They are as frustrated as much as we are, but going to LE and stomping their feet is not going to help find the killer. LE is doing everything they can. I firmly believe that. The people who want to update the park feel the need to do something, anything, to keep the girls memory alive. I personally see nothing wrong with it. The island was scarey anyway in my opinion, and if it draws people to the park for them to enjoy it, I'm all for that. What is the point of a park if everyone is afraid of a boogeyman hiding in the bushes??

Sent from my Kindle Fire using Tapatalk 2

 

[cindersoot]

I'm just going to take TG's statement and timeline completely out of the picture just like Abben did. I don't think he saw the bikes, I don't think he rode his bike that day. I think Abben and others denied his statement because his statement is simply not true. Now I really hope I don't end up on the naughty chair again, I'm just agreeing with Abben.

 

[Marilynilpa]

I'm just going to take TG's statement and timeline completely out of the picture just like Abben did. I don't think he saw the bikes, I don't think he rode his bike that day. I think Abben and others denied his statement because his statement is simply not true. Now I really hope I don't end up on the naughty chair again, I'm just agreeing with Abben.

And I agree with you and Abben. Whether deliberate or not, I don't feel TG was right about what he saw/when he saw it. JMO.

 

[tlcya]

I hate to say it, staunch supporter of LE that I am, but I am beginning to wonder if LE in this instance knows its arse from a hole in the ground.

Their timeline is sketchy at best. So yeah, I am open to the timeline they present not being accurate.

I never thought I would say it, but there it is.

 

[cindersoot]

If it doesn't fit you must aquite.

 

[carbuff]

And I agree with you and Abben. Whether deliberate or not, I don't feel TG was right about what he saw/when he saw it. JMO.

Which is very very common with eyewitness reports. Honest people doing the best they can for the best of reasons are frequently mistaken. It doesn't mean there's anything wrong with the witness.