IA IA - Elizabeth Collins, 8, & Lyric Cook, 10, Evansdale, 13 July 2012 - #30

[otto]

I think a lot of us feel the perp is a local, based on him/her/them knowing about both Meyers Lake/Maiden Lane and 7 Bridges.

So do you believe a practiced and experienced child abductor/murderer is living in Evansdale or the surrounding area?

When Morgan Harrington was abducted/murdered, her mother said: No one starts their criminal career with an abduction/murder. DNA was matched to an earlier assault on a woman, so her mother was right. It makes sense, as well.
There has been no arrest in either case. Because Morgan's father is a medical doctor and her mother is a nurse, no one would ever suggest that Morgan's parents had something to do with her murder. If her parents were drug addicts, people would suggest that they were connected with the murder ... but that would be a wild, unsupported connection.

Here we have a double abduction/murder. No one starts their criminal career with a double abduction/murder. Therefore, the person that did this must have prior criminal acts. That does not mean that the murderer has a criminal record.

The person responsible for abducting and murdering the children had a reason to be in Evansdale on July 13. That person lives in Evansdale, lives in the surrounding areas, or is familiar with Evansdale and surrounding areas due to having spent time there in the past.

All this talk about trying to connect the murderer with the family bewilders me. First, fingers were pointed at Dan because he is a drug addict. Misty fell under that same umbrella. Today, given that there is some criticism about the planning of the memorial, we have fingers pointed at Drew and his tree business. It's understandable that there is frustration due to the fact that there is no identifiable suspect, but pointing fingers at the victims - simply because they are easy targets - doesn't make sense. The family members are not considered suspects because they don't fit with the facts of the abduction murder.

Smock made a media statement on April 11, 2013, warning the community that strangers are dangerous, citing the abduction/murder of Lyric and Elizabeth as an example of how "stranger danger" can even happen in Evansdale. We may not see another abduction/murder of two children in Evansdale this coming summer, but I expect that there will be another abduction/murder by the perp. It could be 100 miles away, it could be 20 miles away, but I do think that it will happen again. It may happen to a teenager where there is an assumption that the teen is a runaway ... meaning the investigation will not be as thorough. This perp knows what he's doing and will most likely mix it up next time to avoid detection and avoid being connected with this abduction/murder (in the event that there is an arrest).

 

[otto]

I would love to hear just one family member say "I demand answers". JMO

The family has publicly stated, within a few days of the abduction, that they are waiting for answers. They're still waiting. Do they need to repeat that statement for people to believe that it is true?

 

[Bootsctr]

Elizabeth Collins & Lyric Cook-Morrissey Case Archive:

http://s296.photobucket.com/user/crankycrankerson/library/#/user/crankycrankerson/library/Elizabeth%20Collins%20-%20Lyric%20Cook-Morrissey%20%20-IA-?sort=6&page=1&_suid=136602745802806101869492849459

I would like to take this opportunity Amanda to say THANK YOU for the OUTSTANDING job on Elizabeth and Lyric's "file" record. I am mesmorized by ALL the information you have stored there...

In looking at the pictures from 7-Bridges and specifically the "car tracks", and in referencing back to 3CK's (and Cindersoot) spectacular videos, not only did it remind me of the "car tracks" pictures by local Ollipop at Meyers Lake, it made me think the perp could have been staying at 7-Bridges for a while. The well-used trail seen from the aerial photo AND used by 3CK and Cindersoot to find the site where the bodies were found, make me think this guy/person/persons camped here a while. Could the trail used to go back to the area have been used by a quad? Did you guys get any "feeling" that someone could have been camping there prior to the abduction or even after the abduction?

I also wonder if the girls were kept alive UNTIL right before the start of hunting season? I seriously doubt it because he did want enough time for DNA recovery to be difficult and statistically the girls were probably dead within hours of being abducted. But 3CK - you posted the times when hunting season begins there in Iowa. For hunters under the age of 14 (?) and disabled hunters, I believe it was as early as September ?. I do believe perp wanted the bodies found. He may have some remorse especially if he is following the case closely. Heather's words may have "spoken directly to him" although she doesn't know him.

I also wonder how it would affect the psyche of a hunter age 14 or under to find the girls' bodies? Would they ever want to hunt again? :what:

Alternatively, if this 7-Bridges was the dump site (sorry for the wording), could our perp be disabled and have used the early start of the hunting season for disabled people to place the bodies where they were found?

 

[Arod]

As far as I'm concerned this investigation was botched from day one. LE assumed way too much. The thought of asking an entire community for volunteers to comb the assumed area where the girls were missing is absolutely ridiculous. Panic set in, cooler heads were needed to assess the situation. Sadly, I think the window of opportunity to catch this perp has passed.

 

[threecrazykids]

When Morgan Harrington was abducted/murdered, her mother said: No one starts their criminal career with an abduction/murder. DNA was matched to an earlier assault on a woman, so her mother was right. It makes sense, as well.
There has been no arrest in either case. Because Morgan's father is a medical doctor and her mother is a nurse, no one would ever suggest that Morgan's parents had something to do with her murder. If her parents were drug addicts, people would suggest that they were connected with the murder ... but that would be a wild, unsupported connection.

Here we have a double abduction/murder. No one starts their criminal career with a double abduction/murder. Therefore, the person that did this must have prior criminal acts. That does not mean that the murderer has a criminal record.

The person responsible for abducting and murdering the children had a reason to be in Evansdale on July 13. That person lives in Evansdale, lives in the surrounding areas, or is familiar with Evansdale and surrounding areas due to having spent time there in the past.

All this talk about trying to connect the murderer with the family bewilders me. First, fingers were pointed at Dan because he is a drug addict. Misty fell under that same umbrella. Today, given that there is some criticism about the planning of the memorial, we have fingers pointed at Drew and his tree business. It's understandable that there is frustration due to the fact that there is no identifiable suspect, but pointing fingers at the victims - simply because they are easy targets - doesn't make sense. The family members are not considered suspects because they don't fit with the facts of the abduction murder.

Smock made a media statement on April 11, 2013, warning the community that strangers are dangerous, citing the abduction/murder of Lyric and Elizabeth as an example of how "stranger danger" can even happen in Evansdale. We may not see another abduction/murder of two children in Evansdale this coming summer, but I expect that there will be another abduction/murder by the perp. It could be 100 miles away, it could be 20 miles away, but I do think that it will happen again. It may happen to a teenager where there is an assumption that the teen is a runaway ... meaning the investigation will not be as thorough. This perp knows what he's doing and will most likely mix it up next time to avoid detection and avoid being connected with this abduction/murder (in the event that there is an arrest).

Exellent points, otto. So do you think that LE has reason to believe that although there MAY be a serial killer on the loose that there is no reason to think it wouldn't happen again in the immediate area?

I just am completely bewildered by the lack of urgency by LE. They don't seem to be portraying (to me anyway) that they are on a serious manhunt. I guess I expected that if the community (near or far) need to be aware of this person they would be making sure that ANY evidence they had to support a random abduction/double murder would be portrayed to as many news outlets as possible. I'm not saying release evidence...I'm saying notify that they have reason to believe this could very well happen again.

That's where I struggle with their press releases. It all seems very calm and controlled. And I admire that, but it makes ME feel as if there really isn't any real concern about this happening again.

I guess I'm just looking for black and white from LE and you'd think by now I'd learn that this investigative team certainly isn't able to provide that for me.

 

[RNER]

Practice and experience

With the "practice and experience" theory wouldn't there would be other victims or cases both before and after? Are there any RECENT similar cases in which 2 girls disappeared out of thin air for 5 months before being found dead, with no credible witnesses, evidence, information released to the public? Are we to assume that the "experienced" abductor just happened to be at Meyers Lake in Evansdale, Iowa in July and came upon the "perfect" victims for the crime that he had been previously "practicing"? And after perfectly executing this abduction and disposing of the bodies, he vanished without a trace, feeling such gratisfaction that he never committed another crime of similar or escalated nature (for at least the last 9 months)?

 

[threecrazykids]

The family has publicly stated, within a few days of the abduction, that they are waiting for answers. They're still waiting. Do they need to repeat that statement for people to believe that it is true?

I don't think Heather wants ANY answers. She doesn't want to know who, where, or what happened to her daughter. She has made it very clear that Drew is the person who wants to find out who did this, take preventative measures, and bring this person to justice.

 

[Bootsctr]

I really believe that LE knows a stranger did this, and that is why they are telling the people of Evansdale to explain to their children about stranger danger. The warm weather means more children will be out and about and it is their way of giving a warning, yet in a calm way. What makes me angry is the way it is being sugar coated. What if this summer brings another abduction?

I agree! I believe it is a stranger who lives among the people of Evansdale. He could be in a position that he would be "known" by a lot of children, either from church or even school. He is familiar, but still a stranger. . . does that make sense? Sort of the odd person out you really would not expect of luring and killing to young girls, but yet when revealed as the killer, people think "you know he always was strange." I think this killer is a planner and a lurer. I don't think he would snatch a child from a yard, he's not that desperate yet. He could even be that "person next door." I think he was very aware of Elizabeth and Lyric being on a rather loose leash and I am in no way criticizing the parents. Elizabeth and Lyric should have been able to ride to Meyers Lake without fear or consequence of their lives being taken that fateful day. Unfortunately, that is no longer an option in Evansdale. Parnts take heed and be mindful of where your children are at all times! The killer has been successful in taking the innocence of a small town of two children riding their bikes on a warm summer day to one of abduction and death!

 

[otto]

With the "practice and experience" theory wouldn't there would be other victims or cases both before and after? Are there any RECENT similar cases in which 2 girls disappeared out of thin air for 5 months before being found dead, with no credible witnesses, evidence, information released to the public? Are we to assume that the "experienced" abductor just happened to be at Meyers Lake in Evansdale, Iowa in July and came upon the "perfect" victims for the crime that he had been previously "practicing"? And after perfectly executing this abduction and disposing of the bodies, he vanished without a trace, feeling such gratisfaction that he never committed another crime of similar or escalated nature (for at least the last 9 months)?

The fact that the perp must have some criminal history does not mean that this perp committed this exact type of double murder/abduction in the past. Why would anyone assume that?

 

[georger]

Because Morgan's father is a medical doctor and her mother is a nurse, no one would ever suggest that Morgan's parents had something to do with her murder. If her parents were drug addicts, people would suggest that they were connected with the murder ... but that would be a wild, unsupported connection.

.[/quote]

I have no dog in this fight but it's a little more than 'addicts' isn't it? Sale and
manufacture ? Facts matter.

 

[otto]

I don't think Heather wants ANY answers. She doesn't want to know who, where, or what happened to her daughter. She has made it very clear that Drew is the person who wants to find out who did this, take preventative measures, and bring this person to justice.

Heather has said that she doesn't want to know how her daughter suffered in the last minutes of her life, not that she doesn't want justice for her daughter. She wants justice and she wants harsher penalties for sex offenders.

 

[Marilynilpa]

When Morgan Harrington was abducted/murdered, her mother said: No one starts their criminal career with an abduction/murder. DNA was matched to an earlier assault on a woman, so her mother was right. It makes sense, as well.
There has been no arrest in either case. Because Morgan's father is a medical doctor and her mother is a nurse, no one would ever suggest that Morgan's parents had something to do with her murder. If her parents were drug addicts, people would suggest that they were connected with the murder ... but that would be a wild, unsupported connection.

Here we have a double abduction/murder. No one starts their criminal career with a double abduction/murder. Therefore, the person that did this must have prior criminal acts. That does not mean that the murderer has a criminal record.

The person responsible for abducting and murdering the children had a reason to be in Evansdale on July 13. That person lives in Evansdale, lives in the surrounding areas, or is familiar with Evansdale and surrounding areas due to having spent time there in the past.

All this talk about trying to connect the murderer with the family bewilders me. First, fingers were pointed at Dan because he is a drug addict. Misty fell under that same umbrella. Today, given that there is some criticism about the planning of the memorial, we have fingers pointed at Drew and his tree business. It's understandable that there is frustration due to the fact that there is no identifiable suspect, but pointing fingers at the victims - simply because they are easy targets - doesn't make sense. The family members are not considered suspects because they don't fit with the facts of the abduction murder.

Smock made a media statement on April 11, 2013, warning the community that strangers are dangerous, citing the abduction/murder of Lyric and Elizabeth as an example of how "stranger danger" can even happen in Evansdale. We may not see another abduction/murder of two children in Evansdale this coming summer, but I expect that there will be another abduction/murder by the perp. It could be 100 miles away, it could be 20 miles away, but I do think that it will happen again. It may happen to a teenager where there is an assumption that the teen is a runaway ... meaning the investigation will not be as thorough. This perp knows what he's doing and will most likely mix it up next time to avoid detection and avoid being connected with this abduction/murder (in the event that there is an arrest).

BBM

I agree with you about this.

In answer to the question about how this crime could have happened, you said "practice and experience".

What kind of practice and experience do you think enabled this perp to commit double abduction/double murder? What prior criminal acts would lead up to him feeling confident enough to snatch two little girls in broad daylight?

Also, do you believe this perp has abducted/killed children before?

 

[otto]

Exellent points, otto. So do you think that LE has reason to believe that although there MAY be a serial killer on the loose that there is no reason to think it wouldn't happen again in the immediate area?

I just am completely bewildered by the lack of urgency by LE. They don't seem to be portraying (to me anyway) that they are on a serious manhunt. I guess I expected that if the community (near or far) need to be aware of this person they would be making sure that ANY evidence they had to support a random abduction/double murder would be portrayed to as many news outlets as possible. I'm not saying release evidence...I'm saying notify that they have reason to believe this could very well happen again.

That's where I struggle with their press releases. It all seems very calm and controlled. And I admire that, but it makes ME feel as if there really isn't any real concern about this happening again.

I guess I'm just looking for black and white from LE and you'd think by now I'd learn that this investigative team certainly isn't able to provide that for me.

Police have warned the public to educate their children about the danger of strangers and they have warned parents to be attentive to their children. At the same time, they have told the public not to panic and not to go overboard.

If there was no concern about another child abduction/murder, police would not have issued a statement a couple of weeks ago about being more cautious as the summer months approach.

 

[RNER]

The fact that the perp must have some criminal history does not mean that this perp committed this exact type of double murder/abduction in the past. Why would anyone assume that?

Why would anyone assume that I SAID that?

 

[Bootsctr]

Practice and experience

just to add:

patience and planning too :moo:

 

[otto]

BBM

I agree with you about this.

In answer to the question about how this crime could have happened, you said "practice and experience".

What kind of practice and experience do you think enabled this perp to commit double abduction/double murder? What prior criminal acts would lead up to him feeling confident enough to snatch two little girls in broad daylight?

Also, do you believe this perp has abducted/killed children before?

Let's take the example of Austin Sigg. Leading up to the abduction/murder of Jessica Ridgeway, there were a number of usual activities and criminal acts. He was known to play hide and seek in the evening with the 11-12 year old girls that played soccer. Who knows what sort of grooming he was doing with the girls at that time. We have his interest in and mortician work. We know that his mother identified problems (don't know all the details) and that Sigg had psychological counselling. There was an attempted abduction months earlier in a park. He was frightened when the woman fought back and he ran away. We have the mutilated cat that was left behind the owners home - near Sigg's home. Finally, we have the abduction, murder and dismemberment of Jessica. I haven't followed the case closely since the arrest, but I suspect that there is a long trail of "connect the dots" between the time that Sigg's behavior first caused concerns and the murder of Jessica. Furthermore, it has long been understood that serial murderers often start with torturing animals.

No one starts their criminal career with the abduction and murder of two victims.

 

[cluciano63]

I don't think LE can know if the perp(s) is a stranger or a local, unless they find a suspect. Issuing warnings about stranger/danger is not indicative to me that LE thinks a stranger killed these girls; just that they don't know and are advising caution.

I really wonder if this case will be solved.

 

[Marilynilpa]

The family has publicly stated, within a few days of the abduction, that they are waiting for answers. They're still waiting. Do they need to repeat that statement for people to believe that it is true?

I am not asking anyone to repeat a statement made in July, nor do I feel that a comment made several months ago is untrue.

But out of all the family members impacted by this horrible crime, I find it unusual that not one of has come forward to demand answers, or to indicate any dissatisfaction with how the investigation has gone to date. JMO

 

[otto]

just to add:

patience and planning too :moo:

I'm of the opinion that people that commit crimes like this spend a lot of time fantasizing about it, waiting for the right opportunity.

 

[RNER]

Police have warned the public to educate their children about the danger of strangers and they have warned parents to be attentive to their children. At the same time, they have told the public not to panic and not to go overboard.

If there was no concern about another child abduction/murder, police would not have issued a statement a couple of weeks ago about being more cautious as the summer months approach.

A similar statement was issued to our community this week as children are more likely to be outdoors and unsupervised since the weather is warmer. There are no reported child abductions or unsolved child murders in our community however!