IA IA - Elizabeth Collins, 8, & Lyric Cook, 10, Evansdale, 13 July 2012 - #31

[foxbluff]

DM had been scheduled today for sentencing on the "old" drug charges to which IIRC he had pleaded guilty.

I'm unable to find anything abt this in the news today, so am suspecting this court case got postponed along w/the others???

Does anybody know?

 

[Dr. Know?]

DM's drug cases all say this:

MOTION FOR CONTINUANCE SCHOEBERL KEVIN EUGENE 05/08/2013 05/08/2013 05/08/2013

https://www.iowacourts.state.ia.us/ESAWebApp/TrialSimpFrame

 

[foxbluff]

DM's drug cases all say this:

MOTION FOR CONTINUANCE SCHOEBERL KEVIN EUGENE 05/08/2013 05/08/2013 05/08/2013

https://www.iowacourts.state.ia.us/ESAWebApp/TrialSimpFrame

Grrrh... for whatever reason I can't open the link... grrrh...

 

[Dr. Know?]

Grrrh... for whatever reason I can't open the link... grrrh...

Google Iowa Courts Online and do a case search. DM has many court dockets. The most current ones have "questionnaire" in the description.

or try this link and search

https://www.iowacourts.state.ia.us/ESAWebApp/DefaultFrame

 

[Bootsctr]

This is from an article about the Cleveland case and missing children:

The Cleveland case also brings hope that if missing children cannot be returned alive, then at least those who did them harm can be brought to justice.

Family, friends and authorities hoped that Evansdale, Iowa, cousins Lyric Cook-Morrissey, 10, and Elizabeth Collins, 8, would be found alive after they disappeared from Meyers Lake in Black Hawk County on July 13, 2012.

But in December, their bodies were found in the Seven Bridges Wildlife Park in Bremer County.

The search for their killers continues.

"We believed they would come home alive until the day we found them," said Evansdale Police Chief Kent Smock. "We were all heartbroken. But this case is still very much alive. We are following leads every day, both from public tips that have come in and things that we have uncovered."

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2013/05/08/missing-children-parents-hope/2144223/

BBM

I still wish we knew why LE thought the girls were alive - was it just LE hoping for the best, or did they have a reason for feeling this way?

To me, why the FBI suddenly announced they had reason to believe the girls were still alive is one of the biggest mysteries about this case. :waitasec:

 

[SapphireSteel]

To me, why the FBI suddenly announced they had reason to believe the girls were still alive is one of the biggest mysteries about this case. :waitasec:

It's not a mystery to me.

I believe LE identified the perp/s in the first week, and a likely motive.

That may mean that the perp was aggressively questioned, hard enough to alert him to stay away from his own crime scene - and possibly, away from wherever the girls were kept.

I'm sincerely hoping this didn't mean they starved to death or died of hypothermia, tied up somewhere.

:cow:

 

[Bootsctr]

It's not a mystery to me.

I believe LE identified the perp/s in the first week, and a likely motive.

That may mean that the perp was aggressively questioned, hard enough to alert him to stay away from his own crime scene - and possibly, away from wherever the girls were kept.

I'm sincerely hoping this didn't mean they starved to death or died of hypothermia, tied up somewhere.

:cow:

That makes two of us...

In going back over the time line posted by WFC Courier:

Saturday, July 14

7 a.m., DCI and FBI arrive and begin interviews. Civilian searches of the area resume until 7:30 p.m. NCMEC sends out an advisory and prepares posters.

8 a.m., Law enforcement continues canvassing the neighborhood. Parents' cell phones and computers are taken for examination. FBI’s Child Abduction Response Team is deployed and remains until July 20.

BBM

8 a.m., STAR-1 sends cadaver dogs to the lake.

maybe it is as simple as the cadaver dogs did not indicate a hit; therefore, LE feels they must assume the girls are alive, or at the very least, they left Meyers Lake alive.

I almost got the feeling the FBI was backing up and saying let's do this again because according to the same time line by WCF Courier:

Monday, July 16

5 a.m., Law enforcement accompanies trash haulers picking up commercial trash.

6:30 a.m., Landfill is asked to set aside special area for Evansdale trash for two weeks.

7 a.m., Interviews and polygraphs continue.

8 a.m., DCI team brought in to locate and interview registered sex offenders.

10 a.m., and 4 p.m., Press briefings.

11 a.m., Draining started at Meyers Lake.

BBM

4 p.m., FBI bloodhounds requested.

FBI either attempted to trace the girls' scent from the lake or to the lake - perhaps both.

http://wcfcourier.com/news/evansdal...tml_c8ef29ca-d077-11e1-8635-001a4bcf887a.html

 

[Bootsctr]

Friday, July 20

7 a.m., Interviews and polygraphs continue.

7 a.m., FBI dive team examines Meyers Lake.

BBM

8 a.m., Law enforcement searches specific areas within 15 mile radius.

8 a.m., DCI team continues with sex offenders.

10 a.m. and 4 p.m., Press briefings.

Noon, Vehicle checkpoints.

5 p.m., Focus turns fully to abduction as other causes were eliminated.
http://wcfcourier.com/news/evansdal...tml_c8ef29ca-d077-11e1-8635-001a4bcf887a.html

Another woulda, coulda, shoulda case, if only LE had expanded their search of specific areas to include 7-Bridges. . .

Not blaming LE. They obviously put their heart and souls into searching for the girls. It was already too late. I feel the girls were at 7 Bridges very soon after being taken from Meyers Lake.

 

[Bootsctr]

Okay, I'm reading the time line and thinking the bloodhounds were searching by Monday at 4:00. They were requested at 4 p.m. on Monday. It looks like the blood hounds did not start their search until 8 p.m. Tuesday.

Tuesday, July 17

5 a.m., Law enforcement accompanies trash haulers picking up commercial trash.

7 a.m., Interviews and polygraphs continue.

8 a.m., Law enforcement teams search specific areas. DCI team continues with sex offenders.

9 a.m. Sewer lines examined with TV cameras.

10 a.m. and 4 p.m., Press briefings.

BBM

8 p.m., FBI bloodhounds search the area.

 

[Darcyline]

I have seen other cases where they have stated the same sentiment-no reason to believe they are dead and sometimes it is seen as a way to keep the case fresh or make sure people are still looking. However, they worded it incorrectly. What I suspect happened is they just slipped a bit and said it in a way that made it seem different from other cases where they say "no evidence the person or people are deceased" I don't believe they had actual evidence the girls were still alive and I do believe the girls were deceased pretty quickly after being taken.

 

[Bootsctr]

I have seen other cases where they have stated the same sentiment-no reason to believe they are dead and sometimes it is seen as a way to keep the case fresh or make sure people are still looking. However, they worded it incorrectly. What I suspect happened is they just slipped a bit and said it in a way that made it seem different from other cases where they say "no evidence the person or people are deceased" I don't believe they had actual evidence the girls were still alive and I do believe the girls were deceased pretty quickly after being taken.

Thank you Darcyline! I appreciate your response and your expertise.

 

[Squeeze]

BBM
That's the part I don't understand.
The bridge going out didn't prevent access to the park. It just prevented people from crossing the river. Why would that stop people from going there?

Could there have been some other reason people quit going there? Did the river change course? Did the park flood out? Did someone drown or get snake bitten?
Does anyone have an access to maps of the park and bridges from before and after?

I haven't read ahead yet, don't know if this has been addressed. The bridge being out just makes it much more inconvenient to get there unless, you are coming from Readlyn. But from any other direction, lots of twists and turns. When I went there, I came from the northeast and it was a little hard to find. Then again, if you were local, you'd still know where it was regardless of the bridge.

 

[Squeeze]

I think it is done much more often than non-campers realize. I grew up camping in campgrounds. I haven't camped in a campground save once in the last 12 years. None of our friends or families camp in campgrounds. We hit the mountains and camp on forest land.

For us camping is cheap recreation, spending $20+ night on a campsite that eats into the cheap factor, not to mention you are feet away from hundreds of strangers with nothing by nylon to provide protection and privacy.

For the young tent camper, it would probably be the ideal spot. But most of the people I know prefer campers and electricity!! Like me!! and a real bathroom!!

 

[watcher9]

Another woulda, coulda, shoulda case, if only LE had expanded their search of specific areas to include 7-Bridges. . .

Not blaming LE. They obviously put their heart and souls into searching for the girls. It was already too late. I feel the girls were at 7 Bridges very soon after being taken from Meyers Lake.

I believe the girls were there all along too.
I wish LE would release some info.

At the time, LE did not believe the girls were even dead, let alone in some obscure park nearly 24 miles away in another county.

I found a neat site that lists parks in each county. It includes map, facilities, activities, etc. It shows that Blackhawk County alone has a list of 45 parks of some sort, some of them probably in name only. Bremer County has 23 parks. I cannot even imagine the logistics of searching that many parks when there were fields, ditches, ponds, rivers and lakes, caves and woods to search also. And, then why limit it to one or two counties? Iowa is beautiful country but sadly, with plenty of places to put two small bodies.

http://www.mycountyparks.com/Parks/Default.aspx?keyword=&County=Black Hawk

 

[SapphireSteel]

I believe the girls were there all along too.
I wish LE would release some info.

At the time, LE did not believe the girls were even dead, let alone in some obscure park nearly 24 miles away in another county.

I found a neat site that lists parks in each county. It includes map, facilities, activities, etc. It shows that Blackhawk County alone has a list of 45 parks of some sort, some of them probably in name only. Bremer County has 23 parks. I cannot even imagine the logistics of searching that many parks when there were fields, ditches, ponds, rivers and lakes, caves and woods to search also. And, then why limit it to one or two counties? Iowa is beautiful country but sadly, with plenty of places to put two small bodies.

http://www.mycountyparks.com/Parks/Default.aspx?keyword=&County=Black Hawk

Also, Bremer County is not in Evansdale LE's jurisdiction, they had to ask for help from Bremer County LE to search 7 bridges.

 

[SapphireSteel]

I have seen other cases where they have stated the same sentiment-no reason to believe they are dead and sometimes it is seen as a way to keep the case fresh or make sure people are still looking. However, they worded it incorrectly. What I suspect happened is they just slipped a bit and said it in a way that made it seem different from other cases where they say "no evidence the person or people are deceased" I don't believe they had actual evidence the girls were still alive and I do believe the girls were deceased pretty quickly after being taken.

Investigators say they have reason to believe the girls were abducted and remain alive, but they will not elaborate.


http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/201...girls-case-mom-says-she-passed-polygraph?lite

 

[georger]

To me, why the FBI suddenly announced they had reason to believe the girls were still alive is one of the biggest mysteries about this case. :waitasec:

It could have been nothing more than a 'profile' agents were using at the
time. In other words, no hard evidence, or lack of evidence of a killing ...
father involved in a legal matter, etc ...

 

[SapphireSteel]

It could have been nothing more than a 'profile' agents were using at the
time. In other words, no hard evidence, or lack of evidence of a killing ...
father involved in a legal matter, etc ...

FBI spokeswoman Sandy Breault stood by her assertion, first made Saturday, that investigators believe the girls are alive.
“They are not going to reveal the reasons why. You wouldn’t want them to do that. It would jeopardize the investigation and the children,” she said.
David Finkelhor, director of the Crimes Against Children Research Center at the University of New Hampshire, said that claim means investigators could “have something quite important” for evidence.
He said cases of two children being abducted by a stranger were rare since it would be hard for one person to control both, which makes the common motive of sexual gratification less likely in this case.
He said it makes sense to look into whether the abduction is linked to pending drug charges against Daniel Morrissey, Lyric’s father, a habitual felon facing decades in prison on charges of conspiracy to manufacture methamphetamine.
In other cases, children have been kidnapped by rivals out of retaliation or held hostage to prevent incriminating testimony, he said.
“If they do think the dynamics are primarily around the drug cases, investigators might be more likely to think the girls are alive. They lose their value if they have been murdered,” he said.


http://www.desmoinesregister.com/ar...onfirms-missing-Iowa-girls-timeline?Frontpage


I too believe that the "dynamics are primarily around the drug cases".

FWIW :twocents:

 

[georger]

FBI spokeswoman Sandy Breault stood by her assertion, first made Saturday, that investigators believe the girls are alive.
“They are not going to reveal the reasons why. You wouldn’t want them to do that. It would jeopardize the investigation and the children,” she said.
David Finkelhor, director of the Crimes Against Children Research Center at the University of New Hampshire, said that claim means investigators could “have something quite important” for evidence.
He said cases of two children being abducted by a stranger were rare since it would be hard for one person to control both, which makes the common motive of sexual gratification less likely in this case.
He said it makes sense to look into whether the abduction is linked to pending drug charges against Daniel Morrissey, Lyric’s father, a habitual felon facing decades in prison on charges of conspiracy to manufacture methamphetamine.
In other cases, children have been kidnapped by rivals out of retaliation or held hostage to prevent incriminating testimony, he said.
“If they do think the dynamics are primarily around the drug cases, investigators might be more likely to think the girls are alive. They lose their value if they have been murdered,” he said.


http://www.desmoinesregister.com/ar...onfirms-missing-Iowa-girls-timeline?Frontpage


I too believe that the "dynamics are primarily around the drug cases".

FWIW :twocents:

and of course that was a first-theory given the circumstances, except of
course that has to be fairly clear to the victims (Dan & family) and
apparently it wasn't? The girls were killed. So whatever the value of
kidnapping the girls might of been its gone (with a vengeance) once the
girls are dead ... I wonder if any drug traces were found in the remains of
the girls? We probably will never know.

:banghead:

 

[Aymstriss]

OK...so I was talking to a friend of mine, and we were discussing LE, crimes and stuff, and he mentioned that FBI goes mainly by statistics. So possibly the reason they felt that the girls were still alive is because they had not found their remains in a certain radius of where they were taken....and according to their statistics they would have.

Just throwing that out