IA IA - Elizabeth Collins, 8, & Lyric Cook, 10, Evansdale, 13 July 2012 - #4

[nikb]

I thought sister Tammy said the bikes were found leaning up against a fence when LE arrived. (A reporter on live chat said the bikes were found by fire personnel.) If they were on the path and found against the fence, someone moved them.

Yes... I think the question is WHO moved them, and when? The why is pretty obvious, it sounds like they were a hazard for other bikers. I can imagine the guy that nearly crashed into them initially thinking "damn kids leaving their bikes all over the place" and then hearing later the girls were missing. If it were me I wouldn't think twice about moving the bikes off the trail. But I don't recall him saying he moved them.

 

[Pensfan]

Grandma said Lyric dropped her back pack and she hugged her and said everything will be OK - maybe Grandma never told Misty and Dan about this potential run away scene - if they did not know about this event then they would not be lying. Lyric did not runaway.

Maybe Grandma told them, but for some reason, they were unable to comprehend it. :silenced:
http://itunes.apple.com/us/album/ice-ice-baby/id302777938

 

[GrainneDhu]

They were advised by an attorney on Wednesday to stop talking with the press, discontinue television interviews and to stop taking polygraph tests, Brousseau said Thursday, though she said she's not aware that either had failed a test.

Misty Morrissey, 34, pleaded guilty in 2003 in federal court to conspiracy to manufacture and distribute methamphetamine, court documents show, and also has theft and alcohol violations in state court. Last September, she also had her probation revoked for violating terms of her probation, including use of illegal drugs, excessive use of alcohol and failure to comply with drug tests - and is now on supervised release.

Court records show that Elizabeth's father, 40-year-old Drew Collins, has been convicted of fifth-degree theft.
http://www.myfoxphilly.com/story/19066697/family-of-missing-iowa-cousins-consults-attorney

I wish the paper had provided more context for the information about Drew Collins. Specifically, when was he charged? Because it's one thing if he was charged when he was 18 and quite something else if he was charged when he was 38.

Theft in the fifth degree is the lowest degree (least serious):

5. The theft of property not exceeding two hundred dollars in value is theft in the fifth degree. Theft in the fifth degree is a simple misdemeanor.

http://coolice.legis.iowa.gov/cool-...llinfo&service=iowacode&ga=83&input=714#714.2

 

[Mimiof8]

Well this clothing thing is always baffling to me. If she changed out of the green shirt then it would be at the house. If it's not at the house then that must be what she's wearing. How difficult is that?

And how many pairs of pants/shorts or capri's do these girls have that no one can determine what clothing is missing. Was Heather at home when her daughter got dressed that day?

No wonder LE are baffled. :waitasec:

MOO

I'm not surprised about the clothing. I'm a mom to 4 girls, 23, 22, 18, and 13. They all would change clothes numerous times a day. My 13 yr old will also go to bed wearing pjs and when I get her up she'll have something completely different on or even a combination of the pjs with something else.

 

[Considering]

How old are the other children that were being watched by Grandma at the Collins home?

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Tammy said that Elizabeth's older brother is 12. There are two other girls in the family, both younger than Elizabeth. I can't recall how old they were said to be. It seems like the oldest of the little sisters is six.

And Heather doesn't know what they were wearing either? Or the other siblings? Or Grandma? Or Misty?

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If Heather left shortly after after Grandma and Lyric arrived, Elizabeth may still have been in her pajamas or maybe not out of bed yet. If Lyric didn't wear anything out of the ordinary (nothing that stood out), Heather probably didn't pay any attention if she was leaving or preparing to leave. Misty would have only seen Lyric (and Grandma) that morning and when Misty left for work Lyric was still in her pajamas. A twelve year old boy noticing what his little sister and his cousin were wearing? I very much doubt that. Elizabeth's sisters are younger and probably didn't pay much attention. Since they were at Elizabeth's house, Elizabeth may not have gotten out of her pajamas until they planned to go ride the bikes. Last of all, I think Grandma was too busy taking care of all five of them to notice.

 

[mrsu]

I hate to rehash this again...BUT...if they were last seen at 12:15 near the clothing store (pretty much Elizabeth's house), and the biker saw the bikes at approx. 12:20. How can that be? Is that even possible? 5 minutes to get to the lake, ditch the bikes, and not be seen by the biker that passed? I wonder WHY the police are insistent on the 12:15 and where the 11:30 time that Tammy stated on JVM came from?

I do not think the bikes were staged as the girls' scent was on the rock jetty, near the bikes, and also into the wooded trail. I believe they were there and the purse was simply left behind on accident. Perhaps they left in a hurry. I think either #1. Someone came along and leaned the bikes against the fence after almost running into them like the first biker had. In that case I wish they would come forward and say so!! I find it hard to believe nobody else saw the bikes there in the 3 hour time span before they were found since it's a regularly traveled path. OR #2. The fireman had already leaned the bikes against the fence before the LE guy got there. In that case I HOPE that pictures were taken before anything was moved!!

Where is Ollipop?? We need to know what's happening locally!

 

[Mjskit]

I thought sister Tammy said the bikes were found leaning up against a fence when LE arrived. (A reporter on live chat said the bikes were found by fire personnel.) If they were on the path and found against the fence, someone moved them.

True. I am thoroughly confused.

Grandma, Tammy, and Elizabeths brother drove to the lake looking for the girls. Tammy asked people if they had seen the girls. They searched the trail ( dogs had to smell family so as not to track them) yet didn't see the bikes? Didn't Tammy say the family searched the area the dogs tracked into the woods? Isn't that close to where the bikes were found? I must be losing my mind. I think I need a timeline myself. lol

 

[sreshowtime]

Wonder if Collin's business associates and workers are on the up & up, if any grievances there or any discord...if LE is looking at one side, they should look at the other, no?

 

[Considering]

Whose bike was Lyric riding? Did she have her own bike there? How did it get there? Does Grandma drive a big vehicle?

:waitasec:

Someone on TV (NG, maybe) showed a photograph of bikes said to be similar looking to what the girls were riding. One bike was described as a mountain bike. I have wondered if this may have been Elizabeth's older brother's bike and Lyric rode it when she went to Elizabeth's house. I don't believe anyone has actually said anything about whether it was Lyric's bike or not.

 

[nskapbt]

Would anyone be so kind to give this very tired momma a Cole's Notes version of what has happened today? I can't read 20 pages worth of updates...just the major highlights, no details...TIA! =)

 

[Jules71]

7-8 minute ride from Collins house to lake via Google maps bike route.

And aunt T is saying they left at 11:30.

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[mrsu]

7-8 minute ride from Collins house to lake via Google maps bike route.

And aunt T is saying they left at 11:30.

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Agreed. But now to only know WHY LE is so insistent on the 12:15 last sighting time?? :banghead:

 

[sreshowtime]

Would anyone be so kind to give this very tired momma a Cole's Notes version of what has happened today? I can't read 20 pages worth of updates...just the major highlights, no details...TIA! =)

my synopsis in a nutshell- nothing

 

[Jules71]

True. I am thoroughly confused.

Grandma, Tammy, and Elizabeths brother drove to the lake looking for the girls. Tammy asked people if they had seen the girls. They searched the trail ( dogs had to smell family so as not to track them) yet didn't see the bikes? Didn't Tammy say the family searched the area the dogs tracked into the woods? Isn't that close to where the bikes were found? I must be losing my mind. I think I need a timeline myself. lol

Two things this made me think of...
If grandma, aunt T, and E's big brother looked for the girls at the lake - who was watching the younger Collins kids in the home? At that same time it was said Heather went into Pd to report girls missing.

Also I keep asking this but why didn't aunt, brother, grandma find the bikes between the time they arrived at the lake at 2:45 and an hour and 15 mins later when they were found by LE?

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[Pensfan]

Would anyone be so kind to give this very tired momma a Cole's Notes version of what has happened today? I can't read 20 pages worth of updates...just the major highlights, no details...TIA! =)

Lyric's parents lawyered up. LE was leaning on the father very hard. It was revealed that Lyric's mom had her parole revoked and is on supervised release for drinking excessively and failing to show up for her drug tests.

Elizabeth's parents are attempting to distance themselves from Lyric's parents and are pizzed at them for getting an attorney.

No clues were found that LE revealed to the press. FBI divers are at the lake right now with lights and sonar checking the deepest areas.

 

[callyn]

I hate to rehash this again...BUT...if they were last seen at 12:15 near the clothing store (pretty much Elizabeth's house), and the biker saw the bikes at approx. 12:20. How can that be? Is that even possible? 5 minutes to get to the lake, ditch the bikes, and not be seen by the biker that passed? I wonder WHY the police are insistent on the 12:15 and where the 11:30 time that Tammy stated on JVM came from?

I do not think the bikes were staged as the girls' scent was on the rock jetty, near the bikes, and also into the wooded trail. I believe they were there and the purse was simply left behind on accident. Perhaps they left in a hurry. I think either #1. Someone came along and leaned the bikes against the fence after almost running into them like the first biker had. In that case I wish they would come forward and say so!! I find it hard to believe nobody else saw the bikes there in the 3 hour time span before they were found since it's a regularly traveled path. OR #2. The fireman had already leaned the bikes against the fence before the LE guy got there. In that case I HOPE that pictures were taken before anything was moved!!

Where is Ollipop?? We need to know what's happening locally!

IIRC The biker said he saw the bikes, had to swerve around them or one of them, at about 12:27. He could be off a minute or two, maybe a little more. The 11:30 time is when they left grandma's I think and then she saw them behind the store at (about) 12:15. But that time could be a little off also. It wouldn't take very long to ride to the lake at all. This is what I recall, please someone correct me if I'm mistaken.:moo: MOO

 

[Dr. Know?]

Courier Photo Staff
‏@CourierPhoto 5m Heather Collins and Drew Collins comfort one another during a prayer vigil for daughter Elizabeth #evansdalesearch pic.twitter.com/hKYl8J0T

https://twitter.com/CourierPhoto/status/226168447996944386/photo/1

 

[mrsu]

SO curious about the calls on DM's cell! I wonder what time? Wouldn't that be interesting if it was shortly after she was reported missing and he was calling people that he thought may be capable of doing so? I wonder if he had been threatened? Owed money to someone? Ratted someone out, or was about to? If he knows or has some idea I can see why he would look absolutely devastated and pained in the interviews. Knowing this happened because of him but being totally helpless at the same time. If he tells of this person, the girls could be harmed...

I can't imagine how that scenario would end? Both girls alive and they could identify the person. Both girls deceased and that's one sick individual. I'm so sad for these girls.

 

[GrainneDhu]

Well this clothing thing is always baffling to me. If she changed out of the green shirt then it would be at the house. If it's not at the house then that must be what she's wearing. How difficult is that?

And how many pairs of pants/shorts or capri's do these girls have that no one can determine what clothing is missing. Was Heather at home when her daughter got dressed that day?

No wonder LE are baffled. :waitasec:

MOO

I think WS'ers went around and around on this one in connection to the Sierra LaMar case. You've stated pretty well the case for those who found it unbelievable that her mother could not figure out what she was wearing the day she disappeared.

I don't find it unbelievable. A lot of kids have so many clothes that their families cannot tell from examining the clothing left at home, etc, what the child was wearing that day.

It has nothing to do with income level, either. Iowa is garage sale territory and a lot of kid's clothing can be had extremely cheaply because the original child outgrew it before it got noticeably worn.

For example, a friend of mine was crowing the other day about picking up 30 different pieces of clothing for her 5 year old granddaughter for less than $10. Some of them had small holes and stains but they were all wearable and good for a kid to get hot and sweaty in (we're having horrid high temps this summer and getting hot and sweaty is rarely far from an Iowan's mind... with nothing unfit for a family publication in mind!).

If her granddaughter was my kid and those 30 items of clothing were the only clothing she had, I would be hard put to figure out what she was wearing by looking at what was left at home.

Shoes are easier because most kids don't have that many pairs. Both girls' footwear has been described by their families.

 

[Kamille]

Agreed. But now to only know WHY LE is so insistent on the 12:15 last sighting time?? :banghead:

Perhaps because that is the written witness statement that they have to work with and Grandma has not contacted them to change anything. The only person that I'm aware of who has actually stated the 11:30am time is TB in the media and she is not a witness to anything prior to 2pm that I'm aware of.

It is always a little suspect when people start altering times shortly after an independent witness comes forward and narrows the timeline down to about 5-10 minutes. But I hope that Grandma herself has sat down with LE to explain this possible change in timeline. If not, I hope she does if she is sure that the original time given may be incorrect. LE need the most accurate info that they can get.

MOO