ID - 4 University of Idaho Students Murdered - Moscow # 7

[SMK777]

link?

From latest Daily Mail:

1891-C272-8344-427-F-9-D20-4-AEEE5-B9-B61-B hosted at ImgBB

Image 1891-C272-8344-427-F-9-D20-4-AEEE5-B9-B61-B in SM Kovalinsky's images album

ibb.co

 

[nightowl2728]

I don't websleuth as much as I imagine many people on here do (just made an account), but how likely is it that LE really have *no* leads? I think with the majority of cold cases I do see in the news, etc., if a perp is caught later on (sometimes years later), there are usually signs pointing to them earlier on, but not enough for LE to make an arrest or release related info publicly. Which is part of why I think so many of us are reading deeply into LE's statements. Because there could be clues there to deduce why and when certain things are said (or not said). It's unquestionable that LE has much more info than they are telling us (whether they have a POI or not) for many possible reasons, and they are obviously privvy to so much more evidence/conversations/records, etc. than what has been released to the public.

 

[happyday]

Exactly, I don't see how killing a rabbit, dog and escalating to 4 people. It doesn't make sense to me.

Isn’t the trifecta for serial killers mutilating/torturing animals, head injuries and bedwetting?

 

[diggndeeperstill]

Idaho Murders: What We Know

Bryan Kohberger, who was studying criminology at another university nearby, faces trial later this year in the stabbing deaths of four University of Idaho students.

www.nytimes.com

Madison Mogen, who went by Maddie, was a senior from Coeur d’Alene who was majoring in marketing. Her grandmother, Kim Cheeley, said Ms. Mogen had always been a gentle and caring person who kept many long-term friendships and close ties with an extended family.

Kaylee Goncalves, who was from Rathdrum, Idaho, had been set to graduate early in December and planned to move to Austin, Texas, with one of her close friends in June. The friend, Jordyn Quesnell, said Ms. Goncalves had secured a position with a marketing firm and was excited to explore more of the country.

“We wanted that adventure,” Ms. Quesnell said. “I would be like, ‘Let’s go do this,’ and she’d be like, ‘Down!’”

Ethan Chapin, from Conway, Wash., was one of three triplets and had spent much of Nov. 12, the day before the killings, with both of his siblings, who are also University of Idaho students, said their mother, Stacy Chapin. In the evening, they had all attended a dance together held by his sister’s sorority, she said.

“My kids are very thankful that it was time well spent with him,” Ms. Chapin said. “He was literally the life of the party. He made everybody laugh. He was just the kindest person.”

Xana Kernodle grew up in Idaho but had spent time in Arizona in recent years, according to an interview that her father, Jeffrey Kernodle, gave to an Arizona TV station.

Mr. Kernodle told the station that his daughter was strong-willed and had enjoyed having an independent life in college.

He said his daughter had appeared to try to fight her attacker, an account backed up by Ms. Mabbutt, the coroner. Mr. Kernodle expressed shock that she could be killed while being with friends at home, and said he, too, had no idea who could have committed the attacks.

 

[Manwel]

I wish I could find Justice 101’s last post and copy it. I am fully in agreement with his theory.

We need more details but if in fact this was worse than a random stabbing of sleeping people (such as mutilation) I just don’t see an angry friend or ex boyfriend committing this crime.

For the experienced posters here what in your opinion is the chances of us hearing the whole entire story as it happened once there is an arrest and conviction?

Once there is an arrest? Not likely. Maybe info about the perp but not "what happened."

If the Delphi Murders case is any indication, they'll keep it all sealed until trial. People would learn details in the court room.

 

[Manwel]

Isn’t the trifecta for serial killers mutilating/torturing animals, head injuries and bedwetting?

Arson, not head injuries.

But it's arguable they don't all fit that perfect triangle.

Dahmer did animal torture, I don't think they ever had him down for arson.

It's an outdated theory that I doubt has any substantial clinical truth.

Plenty of arsonists never torture animals.

 

[diggndeeperstill]

This thread’s getting posts fast and furious, so I apologize if I missed this over the weekend; has anyone mentioned the police bringing tracking dogs in? I don’t remember anything on it last week and it seems crazy to me they wouldn’t have brought them in quickly after the crime.

They did. Check the first page of this thread for a link to the media thread and timeline. The was a picture of a dog in one of the first articles. I posted it myself.

 

[AngTxGal]

Not to mention that Buddy was tiny—Mini Australian, not regular. Look at the picture of him sitting next to his master.

So, if a coyote had gotten him, I think it’d be more likely that all that was left of him was his collar.

No way another animal did what is described. They describe someone cutting his throat, field dressing, and skinning Buddy. Disgusting and sick
Problem is, it may not be related to these murders, so Moscow has another psycho on their hands to worry about.
IMO
Daily Mail- there are pictures of the dog Buddy, owners and a sideways map of location where he was found- North is on the map left, look for stadium to find bearings in pic
Edit- wrong article I think this is it
Scroll to the bottom and look at the pictures in the gallery

Woman living close to scene of Idaho murders says her dog was FILLETED

Pam and Jim Colbert's dog Buddy, a Mini Australian Shepherd, was filleted and skinned on October 21, weeks before four Idaho college students were murdered.

www.dailymail.co.uk

 

[wary]

Possible that the times are coming from the medical examiner's time of death. Even if police consider it unlikely that any of the murders occurred prior to the calls, they can't technically rule it out.

Right—there’s scientific time of death, what digestion of food, liver temperature, etc. can tell the ME,

and then there’s ‘practical time of death,’ considering when someone was last seen alive, etc.

 

[NickoD]

Does anyone have a timeline for this case? Do we have an approx. window for the murders?

The time of death is estimated to be around 3am to 4am.

 

[mry123]

Also from a medical perspective and being purely speculative - (I've done around a year of forensics medicine in med school - so I'm not v experienced in this regard), but it's possible that some of the victims did not die immediately. Depending on the # of wounds/depth/location, they could've been *alive(in the clinical sense - but unable to move)* for a while. I wish someone had come by the scene earlier and maybe there would've been a chance for even one of them?
My personal opinion is that someone had been watching them that day after 1am. I believe the surviving room mates were home by 1am and he may not have seen them entering. He was probably watching the house sometime after 1am and saw the 4 victims enter, waited for lights out and then entered.
Again this is purely speculative and just my personal opinion.

 

[wary]

Was the white hoodie guy hanging out at the food truck in the back by himself watching the girls cleared?

Yes. Yesterday’s press conference.

 

[Ontario Mom]

Isn't it widely known that killing animals is often a precursor to murdering humans? To me that makes alot of sense..

Torturing and killing animals can be a precursor to an individual's crimes against humans, yes.
Can be, but not always.

Also, it's a gradual progression of violence.
Not: kill animal on Tuesday - kill person on Sunday.

I've never seen a case like that.

jmo, FWIW

 

[Manwel]

Also from a medical perspective and being purely speculative - (I've done around a year of forensics medicine in med school - so I'm not v experienced in this regard), but it's possible that some of the victims did not die immediately. Depending on the # of wounds/depth/location, they could've been *alive(in the clinical sense - but unable to move)* for a while. I wish someone had come by the scene earlier and maybe there would've been a chance for even one of them?
My personal opinion is that someone had been watching them that day after 1am. I believe the surviving room mates were home by 1am and he may not have seen them entering. He was probably watching the house sometime after 1am and saw the 4 victims enter, waited for lights out and then entered.
Again this is purely speculative and just my personal opinion.

This is the part I wondered about their phones. Did the killer take their phones or move them so that they couldn't try to get to their phones to call for help?

 

[MntnHiker]

Yeah I'm also curious about where K's dog was. Knowing that she was just there for the long weekend, I was wondering if it was at her parents' house. And then after she was murdered, because ownership was "split" with her and J, maybe it was returned to J to live with him. But I could also see her bringing it with her for the long weekend since it was her dog, and not her parents'.

If the dog was at the home, it's possible the killer let it out into the yard so they didn't have to deal with it. It could have been a friendly dog that didn't bark or growl at guests (yes, this was an intruder, but the dog may not be able to differentiate). Especially since it was a party house with people in and out what sounds like frequently. Then either the killer let the dog back in when they left so as not to arouse suspicion or maybe the dog was even found in the yard in the morning. All speculation.

 

[kathym1950]

Hopefully it's ok to post this, more information on the 911 caller.

MSN

www.msn.com

 

[ConcernedAtWork]

Torturing and killing animals can be a precursor to an individual's crimes against humans, yes.
Can be, but not always.

Also, it's a gradual progression of violence.
Not: kill animal on Tuesday - kill person on Sunday.

I've never seen a case like that.

jmo, FWIW

Right, that's why I said often a precursor.

Wasn't the dog found skinned weeks ago? it wasn't like both of these crimes were in a couple day span, as you seem to be suggesting.

 

[CedarRain]

This may have been discussed already in one of the threads (unable to find specific posts). My partner is a former cop and CID agent, and he always jokes about there being no such thing as a coincidence.

What do people make of the separate violent knife related incidents? This thread has been discussing the pet skinning and killings. There was another incident on September 12th, where a white male 18-22 dressed in all black threatened a group of students with a large knife. Local news story linked. Seems from the follow up that the man turned himself in to law enforcement but was released to the public. These incidents of violence with “large knives” are odd to occur in a single town without being related. It’s possible, but detectives operate believing there are no such things as coincidences.

IMO: It would not be a good look for a murderer to turn himself in to law enforcement, only to be released to the public so 2 months later could kill. The extreme speculation, but it’s hard to overlook and dismiss as coincidence.

 

[diggndeeperstill]

I wish I could find Justice 101’s last post and copy it. I am fully in agreement with his theory.

We need more details but if in fact this was worse than a random stabbing of sleeping people (such as mutilation) I just don’t see an angry friend or ex boyfriend committing this crime.

For the experienced posters here what in your opinion is the chances of us hearing the whole entire story as it happened once there is an arrest and conviction?

I think it depends on the case. There was one horrific story many of us followed here and thankfully the perp pled guilty so not a trial for family to live through. Many details were shared and learned but not all, thankfully. GUILTY - UT - MacKenzie "Kenzie" Lueck, 23, Salt Lake City, 17 June 2019 *ARREST* #20

 

[Finders_Keepers]

I think regardless of who did it or their motivation I think we can assume now nearly 10 days in that it was orchestrated with a degree of capability.

I know one of the parents said that they created a mess and lots of evidence. That doesn’t necessarily translate to reckless and poorly executed.

After 10 days and with no arrests or even suspects it suggests there is no incriminating phone pings, no clear cut cctv or video evidence of them entering or leaving the scene in a highly populated urban area. Probably no definitive finger prints or dna to easily match the perpetrator (Perhaps suggests no previous record to), and with 500 tips not yet eliciting a suspect their post murder behaviour has also probably been controlled - I.e no breaking down and confessing, or the other end of the scale - boasting. Which considering the horrific murder of 4 people maybe suggests a certain type of personality.

The individual has either got very lucky or planned extensively to avoid the usual digital and physical mistakes that lead to quick identification and apprehension. And you feel after 10 days if any of those mistakes had been obvious we would probably already have seen the result.

Not sure we can conclude anything definitive but it’s another sign to me that this wasn’t spur of the moment, or even quickly planned after something that had happened earlier in the evening or within the last few days. I’m sure behavioural analysts would also suggest it’s someone who is thinking about the process and not just purely acting out of rage.