ID - DeOrr Kunz Jr, 2, Timber Creek Campground, 10 July 2015 - #20

[Rayemonde]

I think Idaho Falls police has a bit of a reputation for manipulating folks into false confessions, and it was a good idea for IR to lawyer up. At first I thought he might be hiding something, but after watching his interview, I think he has some issues that would make him a very bad liar, not someone capable of coming up with an elaborate plan. He just may be the best witness.

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SB said IR felt like he had been targetted by LE in the past, and also that IR had mistakes on his police record, including one mistake that said he had been charged with something that he was actually a witness to... Plus there have been rumours and speculation going around that IR had something to do with DeOrr's disappearance... I'm not surprised if IR is wary of LE, and I think he was smart to lawyer up.

 

[Rayemonde]

There is still no solid proof that a crime took place. No blood, no body, no marks on anyone. .. for all we know, the baby was left unsupervised, for whatever reason, and he fell in the reservior. Unless they completely drain the reservior, we can't be sure he wasn't missed in the search. We've had bones turn up 20+ years after boating accidents where divers searched extensively. I would hate to see this family be falsely accused because they aren't very sophisticated. Time will tell.

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If that turns out to be the case, then I hope they will be charged with neglect at least, if they were truthful with LE about what happened, and if they weren't truthful with LE then additional charges for wasting police time, collecting money under false pretences etc.

I'm thinking of the Noah Thomas case... His body was found in a septic tank at his house after his parents reported him missing. They were charged with felony homicide, but these charges were dropped after the autopsy showed he drowned in the septic tank. They still face other charges because they lied to LE and said they were home when Noah disappeared, whereas in fact LE found out they had left him home alone.

 

[Timekeeper65]

Coming out of lurkdom to ask a few questions/speculation:

1. Does DK have 2 vehicles? (If so: Since dogs didn’t pickup any scent, did the trip to store involve switching vehicles?)
2. If true, TC stated that she picked up 1 diaper. This would indicate Deorr was there. IMO, there was no morning diaper change. I believe that the diaper came from before he went to bed for the night.
3. Speculation: Is it ‘truthful’ that DK & JM slept in back of truck? Is it possible that they did in fact have a tent after all? If so, would dogs hit on the ground where a tent was?

Just all my thoughts and speculation……….Heading back to lurking now 

Welcome mkids11. Good thoughts and speculation. No need to just lurk.

:Welcome1:

 

[TheTruthWillOut]

Something I'm still unclear on is where they left from to go to the campground. Was it Idaho Falls or could it have been Montpelier (PI Vilt talked about meeting the parents there) or somewhere else?

This article shows a few members of the family at a house in Idaho Falls but don't know if that is where they live and traveled from or not: http://www.eastidahonews.com/2015/10/film-crew-producing-documentary-on-missing-deorr-kunz-jr/

 

[TanTanWawa]

I wouldn't trust Idaho Falls police. <modsnip>

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[bluesneakers]

It's been mentioned a few times that the parents, GGP and IR may have been drinking at the Silver Dollar. I don't see them as drinking buddies in a bar, but I can see them sitting around the campfire just having a few and talking. Did they only go to the bar to buy alcohol to take back to camp? I don't know what the liquor laws are there.
We used to do a lot of camping, and after driving 2 or 3 hours to get to the campsite and setting up, there's no way we would head to the nearest bar to drink, especially with kids. We would all be looking forward to getting the fire going and hanging out. Occasionally we would have to go back to the nearby town to pick up a few things; beer, chips or something we suddenly thought was important, which could have been anything with 2 young boys. (I don't mean beer for the boys, lol).
As to what happened to baby Deorr, I just don't know and my heart still hurts as much as when I learned he was missing.

I'm sure people do it, but possessing or consuming alcohol is forbidden.

http://www.fs.usda.gov/Internet/FSE_DOCUMENTS/stelprd3837688.pdf

These three don't strike me as the sit around the fire and throw back a few cold ones, but that's JMO.

 

[Mickshawn]

There is still no solid proof that a crime took place. No blood, no body, no marks on anyone. .. for all we know, the baby was left unsupervised, for whatever reason, and he fell in the reservior. Unless they completely drain the reservior, we can't be sure he wasn't missed in the search. We've had bones turn up 20+ years after boating accidents where divers searched extensively. I would hate to see this family be falsely accused because they aren't very sophisticated. Time will tell.

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How do you KNOW there is NO solid proof that a crime took place? Do you know what LE and the P.I. know? I sure don't......

 

[carbuff]

I'm sure people do it, but possessing or consuming alcohol is forbidden.

http://www.fs.usda.gov/Internet/FSE_DOCUMENTS/stelprd3837688.pdf

These three don't strike me as the sit around the fire and throw back a few cold ones, but that's JMO.

Not accusing anyone of anything, but...that is a rule that is much ignored in the mountain states...just based on my experience.

 

[TanTanWawa]

Investigators decided the timeline wasn't matching up, and that was suspicious in itself. They couldn't keep the timeline straight, and said it was the little things that changed. I'm not sure I would even know the time when I'm camping. I probably wouldn't feel like I lost track of my child for very long. No parent ever does. I have thought that they may well have been near camp, not hiking, but smoking a joint. It would account for not knowing how long they were gone, the confusion of who was watching him, and the chaos after. It's not unusual to go camping and spark one up. They could never come clean about losing the baby when they were off getting stoned. It would still seem like they were being untruthful, although it could have still been an unfortunate accident. Of course, this is all just conjecture. Another way of looking at the testimony and behavior, beyond a murder cover up.

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[Hoosgirl]

JMO but I don't think these hugely oversized boots ever even existed.

Namus has a picture of him with the boots, but it's hard to see:

https://www.findthemissing.org/en/cases/case_report_html/29726

 

[scmom]

Seems like local LE, the FBI and two private investigators agree that the parents are lying. Or to put it less rudely, being less than truthful. Hmm, maybe it's a conspiracy.

 

[Jackeee]

I'm sure people do it, but possessing or consuming alcohol is forbidden.

http://www.fs.usda.gov/Internet/FSE_DOCUMENTS/stelprd3837688.pdf

These three don't strike me as the sit around the fire and throw back a few cold ones, but that's JMO.

Very true, but sometimes you just try to get along. At the recent Christmas dinner in our retirement community, there were just some people that you wished weren't at your table, but they were, so you make the best of it. Maybe they felt the same way. &#55357;&#56841;

 

[TanTanWawa]

How do you KNOW there is NO solid proof that a crime took place? Do you know what LE and the P.I. know? I sure don't......

They would have arrested someone.

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[giagreen]

What ever happen to the documemtry they did?

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[scmom]

What ever happen to the documemtry they did?

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I haven't seen any documentary. Maybe I missed it.

 

[DatelineFan]

They would have arrested someone.

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Not always. I would say there are many cases where LE has plenty of evidence for an arrest, but they wait until they feel they have sufficient evidence for a conviction.

 

[giagreen]

I haven't seen any documentary. Maybe I missed it.

JM and DK took part in a documentary a while back. I don't think they've actually released it yet. I forgot about it. Wondering when it's due out or will even come out at all.

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[Deleted member 718]

I wouldn't trust Idaho Falls police. <modsnip>

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Sorry to hear this. At least with Deorr's case we have other agencies involved. The FBI with several agents and specialists, Idaho Fusion Center with the Idaho Criminal Intelligence Center, National Center for Missing and Exploited Children, Lemhi, Bonneville and Bingham County Sheriffs Offices, two different private investigators and all the Search and Rescue Groups have been involved. It would be hard for the Idaho Falls Police Department to coerce a false confession without scrutiny. I'm not sure I've even seen them listed as an involved agency.

Also it was after hearing the FBI's findings that Sheriff Bowerman elevated the parents as the top suspects in the disappearance of Deorr.

 

[haven71]

Didn't we have a lengthy discussion about this the other night?

Thursday night is part of the overall timeline. Klein's working timeline -- the window when relevant events occurred -- is 8 a.m.-2:26 p.m. It evolved from 17 minutes to four hours, and now 6.5 hours, as new witnesss have come forward. JMO

Yes, I remember your very helpful post.

It's crystal clear now.

 

[TanTanWawa]

Not always. I would say there are many cases where LE has plenty of evidence for an arrest, but they wait until they feel they have sufficient evidence for a conviction.

That would mean it was circumstantial evidence, gathering evidence, which would point them in a direction of a homicide. It can happen without a body, but still, it wouldn't be hard proof. If they had proof of a murder, they would have arrested someone. Right now they're searching for testimony to come up for a narrative. They don't know why they can't find him. That is the big mystery they have to explain at this point.

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