ID - DeOrr Kunz Jr, 2, Timber Creek Campground, 10 July 2015 - #22

[Jackeee]

"I know that they know where the little boy is..." Not he knows or she knows, but 'they'. That's chilling.

 

[K.L.Puyallup]

If the truth is ever going to come out, I imagine we're pretty close. JM and VDR have both been named suspects. They've both been called liars by LE, outright. They both know what's at stake here. I think they've protected each other up until this point, but I'd be surprised to see that shabby house of cards continue to stand now that they're both within spitting distance of serious charges. I think- I hope- these two are going to stop protecting each other, and start talking a bit more openly and independently to LE.

 

[Lilibet]

LYING
Finally...Amen.

Thank you Sheriff Bowerman! But couldn't you have put this thread out of its misery a just a little teeny tiny bit sooner? Or did your staff WS readers find the endless discussion too hilarious to stop? :floorlaugh:

All right, I'll forgive you because you're such a nice guy and it's been a rough year. But please don't let it happen here again, OK?

 

[Rayemonde]

Thank you Sheriff Bowerman! But couldn't you have put this thread out of its misery a just a little teeny tiny bit sooner? Or did your staff WS readers find the endless discussion too hilarious to stop? :floorlaugh:

All right, I'll forgive you because you're such a nice guy and it's been a rough year. But please don't let it happen here again, OK?

:laughing:

 

[fiBreeze]

Probably not a popular opinion, but there should be a de facto charge like child endangerment or neglect in some of these cases. Parents should be held responsible for making sure their children are monitored. Maybe the stress of the arrests would make one talk.

 

[PainExpress]

If the truth is ever going to come out, I imagine we're pretty close. JM and VDR have both been named suspects. They've both been called liars by LE, outright. They both know what's at stake here. I think they've protected each other up until this point, but I'd be surprised to see that shabby house of cards continue to stand now that they're both within spitting distance of serious charges. I think- I hope- these two are going to stop protecting each other, and start talking a bit more openly and independently to LE.

Is the death penalty an option here?

 

[leep]

I guess none of us know. The parents have never mentioned whether he was planned or not, so we have no way of knowing for sure.

It's not something you want to put out on the internet anyway to have to admit your child was an "accident". It's a private matter surely JMO.


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[pepelepolecat]

Totally out of left field, but I wonder why no one on this camping trip had a dog with them? I understand that renting may not allow for a dog. I also understand that some people have allergies & limited budgets & maybe Fido just passed away & I'm sure there are 5 other reasons. But in my opinion camping without a dog is unusual. I have friends who borrow dogs for weekends 1) because it's fun for the dog 2) it lets them get the whole dog experience without the commitment & 3) dogs are excellent at being aware of wild animals & alerting/scenting camping areas. I may be biased as I'm currently sharing a bed with my three mutts, but anyone else picking up on a hinky-vibe?

Um ... unless they actually had a dog, I can't imagine why they would just randomly pick up a dog to take with them. We never camp with dogs because we have no dogs (and also, one of my spawn is allergic, so that's kind of a big reason we don't have a dog and certainly don't want one around).

That said, I've no idea if they have a dog or regularly camp with a dog. If they do, then I, too, would wonder where it was during this little excursion.

 

[pepelepolecat]

I'll raise you a "Guppy"

Late to the party tonight. LOL

Great news about the sheriff putting things out on the table.

I like the idea of searchers going up there after the spring thaw with cadaver dogs and trying again. Maybe with a little luck the dogs could find him. Running them up and down the roads leading to and from the campground is a good idea. If it was a quick pullover and get rid of body attempt then he may not be too far off of a road. If dogs could be run up and down some of the back roads they may get lucky to get a scent.

bbm -- ideally. But what keeps going through my mind is all those "searches" the couple performed outside the official search perimeter. It wouldn't be hard to "haul" a tiny body onto an ATV and take it even further into the wilderness.

 

[mrsNKY]

I was thinking of posting the same as kammiemc, I think neglect not physical abuse. IF he has many pictures with bruises and there is a hint of drug abuse, at his age and if they consistently let his wear boots that are too large, I can see the neglect as he may be an adventurous type who with little supervision can fall and sustain bruises and injuries.

I don't recall, but will check back in: but, wasn't the father in maybe the first interview saying something about his walking, which sounded to me like he may be a little unsteady on his feet. I can't swear to it but, I am pretty certain that, it was eluded to early on. I think it was during the time the "boots were to big. story came out. Does anyone remember that or am I thinking of another case?

Also, with the picture of his legs looking a little odd may also make sense, but really I think maybe they wanted to show him in an outdoor/camping scenario. It may even be close to the same area with the large lake behind him. Even though it appears to be a year or so off, maybe they are hoping people may remember seeing a boy that looks like him in those surroundings. It is not a good picture of him, but maybe at the time it made sense to them as a way to jog a memory or two.

 

[Deleted member 102539]

bbm -- ideally. But what keeps going through my mind is all those "searches" the couple performed outside the official search perimeter. It wouldn't be hard to "haul" a tiny body onto an ATV and take it even further into the wilderness.

Maybe, someday the parents brought little Deorr (back) to the area being searched already - and now, surprise!, same area will searched again. IF little Deorr will be found there, then I wouldn't think of him being there before also, on the contrary I would suspect. IMO only

 

[Deleted member 102539]

If the truth is ever going to come out, I imagine we're pretty close. JM and VDR have both been named suspects. They've both been called liars by LE, outright. They both know what's at stake here. I think they've protected each other up until this point, but I'd be surprised to see that shabby house of cards continue to stand now that they're both within spitting distance of serious charges. I think- I hope- these two are going to stop protecting each other, and start talking a bit more openly and independently to LE.

The parents and grandparents could do something to shake up JM/VDK and they could ask for the truth, not only protect the poor "kids" (parents of 1-3), which are "not monsters" (but liars).

 

[courtneyb]

It's not something you want to put out on the internet anyway to have to admit your child was an "accident". It's a private matter surely JMO.


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I think people unwittingly put that info out there on SM all the time. When they announce they are expecting, I see a lot of "he/she was a 'surprise'" talk either in the announcement itself or in the host of usual comments below.

I think that is probably what the poster was referring to.


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[mrsNKY]

I wonder why afaik these parents did not take one photo of this baby on this trip. Maybe it's just me and my hubby, but out phones are full of pics of us and our boys on any type of trip. I am sure their phones have cameras as most do now. Especially at his age, photos are taken of them the most. Excitement or taking him down to the lake. I just found it odd unless I missed this pictures along the way, that they didn't take not ONE pic of him on this little trip. Maybe if they arrived after dark I understand, but none the next morning? Again maybe it's just my families quirkiness. lolz

 

[neesaki]

Of course. They gave up all pretense it seems months ago. That is one of the most frustrating things about people "not wanting to convict them in the court of public opinion" they aren't trying to keep up the charade so why should we give them the benefit of the doubt. I hope someone watched them when they were "searching" just in case they returned to the scene. I know next to nothing about cadaver dogs but I sure hope LE goes nuts with armies of them up there on that mountain.

I have had concerns that if little Deorr ended up there initially, that they may have gone back at some point and moved him elsewhere.

 

[Deleted member 102539]

The thing is, we just don't know how or why JM's children ended up with their father, or what the legal situation is with them. It might be relevant to what happened to DeOrr. It might not. We just don't know. There's not enough to go on.

bbm

...... because the link to information is gone, unfortunately. I bet, it is relevant, but IMO.

 

[neesaki]

LYING
Finally...Amen.

It's good to see that Sheriff B's decided to tell it like it is, no more kid gloves for these two LIARS who FAILED nine polygraphs.

 

[Rayemonde]

I was thinking of posting the same as kammiemc, I think neglect not physical abuse. IF he has many pictures with bruises and there is a hint of drug abuse, at his age and if they consistently let his wear boots that are too large, I can see the neglect as he may be an adventurous type who with little supervision can fall and sustain bruises and injuries.

I don't recall, but will check back in: but, wasn't the father in maybe the first interview saying something about his walking, which sounded to me like he may be a little unsteady on his feet. I can't swear to it but, I am pretty certain that, it was eluded to early on. I think it was during the time the "boots were to big. story came out. Does anyone remember that or am I thinking of another case?

Also, with the picture of his legs looking a little odd may also make sense, but really I think maybe they wanted to show him in an outdoor/camping scenario. It may even be close to the same area with the large lake behind him. Even though it appears to be a year or so off, maybe they are hoping people may remember seeing a boy that looks like him in those surroundings. It is not a good picture of him, but maybe at the time it made sense to them as a way to jog a memory or two.

Yeah, let me see... The original article's not working any more, but luckily someone copied and pasted the quote into an earlier thread (please always copy the full 10% we are allowed into threads, because the news articles quickly disappear and important information can be lost).
The quote was From Vernal's father, DeOrr's grandfather:

"If he's in the water up there he was taken up there. He cannot walk on level ground without falling down. His little, short legs they can't walk up hill, he can't walk on level ground. He would have fallen and if he would have fallen he would have been crying. He didn't get up there by himself," DeOrr Kunz said.

"They weren't up there very long when this all happened, and what they came down with is that it was 4 minutes that someone wasn't watching him," Kunz said.

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...Timber-Creek-Campground-10-July-2015-1/page52

Sure, the bruises and marks on DeOrr in the pictures may be accidental, or they may not. It does seem suspicious that he has bruises that look like a hand mark, for instance. Maybe he fell into a railing or something, or maybe someone hit him. There's no way of knowing.

BTW, I happened across another case where the parents posted photos of their child with bruises on facebook. Alexis Long, murdered by her mother Jennifer Long. The Facebook photos were shown in court as evidence of past abuse after Alexis was murdered.

[The mother] also shared pictures that inadvertently showed many of Alexis’ earlier injuries.

The DFCS case summary says, “No one who responded to the photos and comments on Facebook questioned the (wounds) on the child.”

http://www.myajc.com/news/news/a-dangerous-life-mysterious-death-highlight-child/nbRRT/

The prosecution also showed the jury social media photos of Alexis and posts from Jennifer Long’s Facebook page. The doctor pointed out bruises and marks to the child in those photos.

Read more here: http://www.ledger-enquirer.com/news/local/crime/article48611070.html#storylink=cpy

 

[Rayemonde]

I wonder why afaik these parents did not take one photo of this baby on this trip. Maybe it's just me and my hubby, but out phones are full of pics of us and our boys on any type of trip. I am sure their phones have cameras as most do now. Especially at his age, photos are taken of them the most. Excitement or taking him down to the lake. I just found it odd unless I missed this pictures along the way, that they didn't take not ONE pic of him on this little trip. Maybe if they arrived after dark I understand, but none the next morning? Again maybe it's just my families quirkiness. lolz

Because he was dead. JMO.

 

[leep]

O/T If you remember back we talked a lot about the Jaryd Atadero case if anyone's interested i listened to a really good podcast about the case last night.
It was on The Generation Why Podcast http://thegenerationwhypodcast.com/ the interveiw is with Jaryd's Father so its not a specualtive peice.