Found Deceased ID - Joshua Vallow, 7, & Tylee Ryan, 16, Rexburg, Sept 2019 *Arrests* #47

[DI_Isokawa]

Agreed. The FBI has reopened the death investigation of JR. All of these elements are crucial to understand. Given the custody battles, multiple assaults that occurred through out the custody battles, etc, one must ask how and why LVD still had Tylee in her care and how and why LVD and CW were allowed to adopt JJV. These children could have and should have been given safety long before the present day circumstances. MOO.

Respectfully disagree. It's a matter of how we spend our time (opportunity cost). If we're going to go haring off in a "woulda coulda shoulda" direction, IMHO a far more relevant one is why Lori was treated with such unnatural respect by the Gilbert PD and Lori and Alex ditto by the Chandler PD, because that speaks to the existence or otherwise of more associates.

Frankly, the only question all the fooferaw about earlier divorces answers for me was the possibility that Lori had some kind of psychological turning point in January 2019. The answer is no, she was always the Manic Pixie Dream Girl From Hell. Issue resolved.

 

[Nikynoo]

I don't mean this as argumentative but people can think they'd know how they'd feel and/or act but the reality is very few understand what it's like to find out your dad had dead children buried in his backyard in an international news story. You can say you'd do this or that but I'd guess very few of us would know how we'd actually respond. You don't know what their lawyers are telling them. You don't know where LE stands with each individual.

So, unless you really know what each of these individuals are going through personally, what impact they're feeling from their family, what their legal counsel's recommendations are and a billion other factors to take into account. I just don't think it's fair to make some generalization based on what you think you might do. I would hope there would be a wide spectrum of responses because each individual's situation is probably different.

People tend to think they'd do handle it one way, but it rarely works out like that for numerous variables.

I truly feel bad for many family members and friends involved whom I'm sure have had their lives uprooted and then placed under a microscope by people who typically don't know even what they're talking about.

Brilliant post, and applicable to many WS threads!

I respectfully disagree that these court docs - and many more not yet available on WS--don't tie in to a greater understanding of how Tylee and JJ ended up dead along with others. IMO, they are a window into the early and ongoing manipulation and disregard for the welfare of the kids in Lori's orbit. Perversely, they masqueraded as the opposite. The immense drama, conflict, manipulation, and partner degradation embodied by Lori was toxic for all involved, IMO.

Yes, but the question is, will this information be put before the jurors? Is it relevant to securing a conviction? IMO, it is best to keep the story simple for the jury to secure a conviction. If you start bringing in historic information (which to be honest, some of which cannot be ascertained as fact) - the jury concentrates on the wrong information.

 

[CSIDreamer]

I understand feeling uncomfortable. Having read them all, I was disputing their relevance to the deaths of Tylee and JJ. Anyone uncomfortable with the scope of the content (custody battles, sexual abuse allegations) should pass.

I will. That's why I'm also hoping for a sub forum. That way people that want to read it can. And I can avoid it. Win, win. jmo

 

[Nikynoo]

I'm not picking on you. I've voiced this opinion before.

I'm extremely uncomfortable with this new unredacted info. I have no idea if it could be used in the current (and future) cases against LVD or not. It certainly can't be held against CD. Jmo

I also have doubt whether some or any of it can be used in the present cases(s).

 

[wenwe4]

For me to know the bigger picture of LVD's life and lifestyle helps to put it in perspective. For decades she has been accused of having "fanatical religious" views, alleging some of the most heinous crimes against her ex husbands (when children are involved), and convincing those around her to commit crimes because these alleged acts are so heinous.

I am remembering when her sister & mother said they "read the emails" that were so threatening that LVD needed to keep the kids safety paramount. There was the email that Charles found where LVD purported to be CV and sent to CD asking him to come to their home and stay. This makes me wonder how many fake emails, phone calls, voice messages, etc. that LVD may have fabricated to fool AC, CV, and others to pull off her fun and games.

This puts evidence of these behaviors into the hands of criminal profilers and psychologists who may be brought into the case. If we are better able to understand how LVD has acted & functioned in the past we have a window into how she may act in the future. "The best predictor of future behavior is past behaviors".
JMO

 

[GoBuckeyes]

Definitely not seeing the Tony Robbins charisma here, that's for sure!

Can we talk about his shirts for a minute, though? This has been bugging me for a while, because there are so many photos of him wearing clothes similar to the shirt/tie combo in the linked video. Are past-the-elbow short sleeves for men a thing now? Did I miss that trend? I've had this persistent image of CD as an overgrown child in my head for some time, and I am starting to realize the oddly-fitting clothing is driving part of it. The more I look at stuff like this, the harder it is to think of him as this suave, manipulative lothario.

I'll have to look again, but (from memory) it seemed to me to be a long sleeve shirt with the sleeves rolled up to just below the elbow.

 

[WTAF Wicked Truths]

Exactly. That is why I believe so very important at this time to ready for so much information to dive into the tangential areas of background with subthreads.

I see that you are new to WS. When cases get complex and large, WS usually does "subthreads" to dive in and discuss different areas.

It may not come into trial all of this, as did not much we discussed during the Cayleee Anthony case and others... but it was publicly discussed here.

I anticipate from reading here that your documents are one of the subthreads when that happens.

WTAF is a new profile to websleuths. The WTAF team members are not. We have been around WS for years and chose to use WTAF for the Vallow case in order to secure our anonymity on personal WS profiles.

 

[Shadow@light]

As a mother of four children who are now in their twenties and thirties I have only one question: knowing what we have all seen and read would any of you put your children in the hands of Chad’s, and they aren’t children, offspring, as educators, for six or more hours every day? And this question includes knowing about the very house they live in now. All apologies to those who find this question abrasive but no way. Hope I’m not in trouble for this.

As a mother of four children who are now in their twenties and thirties I have only one question: knowing what we have all seen and read would any of you put your children in the hands of Chad’s, and they aren’t children, offspring, as educators, for six or more hours every day? And this question includes knowing about the very house they live in now. All apologies to those who find this question abrasive but no way. Hope I’m not in trouble for this.

I understand how you feel Alwayshare,for Chad Daybell's children even though they are adults would had thought their home life was normal.
Seeing the world with rose coloured glasses.
Keeping the house is the link to their love for their Mother and memories/belief of their ' happy normal home'
It is going to be a long hard journey for them, past,now and after the trial to come to terms in what has happened.
They may never come to terms. IMO
What ever Chad's children do in their lives we cannot judge them by the sins of the Father.
We need to give them that chance in life and understanding of the burden they will have to carry in their lifetimes due to the actions of Chad and Lori Daybell.

 

[Sorelle19]

Brilliant post, and applicable to many WS threads!

Yes, but the question is, will this information be put before the jurors? Is it relevant to securing a conviction? IMO, it is best to keep the story simple for the jury to secure a conviction. If you start bringing in historic information (which to be honest, some of which cannot be ascertained as fact) - the jury concentrates on the wrong information.

So, this is a discussion group, where members seek to understand motive, etc. In that vein, these documents are helpful and relevant. As far as whether some of this will come before a jury, that depends on a number of factors, including where defense attorneys go, future charges, etc. IMO.

 

[Sorelle19]

Respectfully disagree. It's a matter of how we spend our time (opportunity cost). If we're going to go haring off in a "woulda coulda shoulda" direction, IMHO a far more relevant one is why Lori was treated with such unnatural respect by the Gilbert PD and Lori and Alex ditto by the Chandler PD, because that speaks to the existence or otherwise of more associates.

Frankly, the only question all the fooferaw about earlier divorces answers for me was the possibility that Lori had some kind of psychological turning point in January 2019. The answer is no, she was always the Manic Pixie Dream Girl From Hell. Issue resolved.

I think it speaks mostly to Lori's ability to disarm and charm. And if you read the court docs, you will recognize the same dynamic at work.

 

[wenwe4]

WTAF is a new profile to websleuths. The WTAF team members are not. We have been around WS for years and chose to use WTAF for the Vallow case in order to secure our anonymity on personal WS profiles.

Aw that is comforting to me - thanks for letting us know that we are all "WS family".

 

[dixiegirl1035]

Brilliant post, and applicable to many WS threads!

Yes, but the question is, will this information be put before the jurors? Is it relevant to securing a conviction? IMO, it is best to keep the story simple for the jury to secure a conviction. If you start bringing in historic information (which to be honest, some of which cannot be ascertained as fact) - the jury concentrates on the wrong information.

Yes, in so very many cases we see so much background (OMG, Casey Anthony and her hanging bears etc we saw on social media, never at trial etc) that never gets into the court case.

It's just confusion delight right now vs. focus on the MURDER OF JJ and TYLEE

MOO

Again, hoping we get subthreads also

 

[GoBuckeyes]

They may. They may not. If they are like other families, I'd imagine a mix of both. Harder to imagine would be all 5(?) adult children unquestioningly believing whatever their father tells them. I can't even get a smaller number of my own on the same page half the time.

I knew someone who had a multi-generation hold over his children, their spouses and children. Although, the individual was never involved in anything like this! For that family, each of the 5 kids struggled for months to years to come to terms with the person they thought they knew so well and the reality of the situation. I hope his children find skilled therapists, understanding of their religious beliefs, but who are not a part of that particular culture or offshoot church. (Not sure how to phrase that.) MOO

 

[WTAF Wicked Truths]

For me to know the bigger picture of LVD's life and lifestyle helps to put it in perspective. For decades she has been accused of having "fanatical religious" views, alleging some of the most heinous crimes against her ex husbands (when children are involved), and convincing those around her to commit crimes because these alleged acts are so heinous.

I am remembering when her sister & mother said they "read the emails" that were so threatening that LVD needed to keep the kids safety paramount. There was the email that Charles found where LVD purported to be CV and sent to CD asking him to come to their home and stay. This makes me wonder how many fake emails, phone calls, voice messages, etc. that LVD may have fabricated to fool AC, CV, and others to pull off her fun and games.

This puts evidence of these behaviors into the hands of criminal profilers and psychologists who may be brought into the case. If we are better able to understand how LVD has acted & functioned in the past we have a window into how she may act in the future. "The best predictor of future behavior is past behaviors".
JMO

Absolutely, without a doubt. To be able to understand how a heinous crime came for be, one must understand the psychology of the perpetrator(s). JMO.

 

[Sorelle19]

Yes, in so very many cases we see so much background (OMG, Casey Anthony and her hanging bears etc we saw on social media, never at trial etc) that never gets into the court case.

It's just confusion delight right now vs. focus on the MURDER OF JJ and TYLEE

MOO

Again, hoping we get subthreads also

But, we know who murdered JJ and Tylee. One is dead and two are behind bars. LE probably know exactly who, what, when, where, how but we won't for a while. For me, right now, the big unanswered is why.

 

[GoBuckeyes]

Brilliant post, and applicable to many WS threads!

Yes, but the question is, will this information be put before the jurors? Is it relevant to securing a conviction? IMO, it is best to keep the story simple for the jury to secure a conviction. If you start bringing in historic information (which to be honest, some of which cannot be ascertained as fact) - the jury concentrates on the wrong information.

However, we aren't a jury. So, why not explore the patterns that can be found, illuminated by previous court records?

 

[Nikynoo]

So, this is a discussion group, where members seek to understand motive, etc. In that vein, these documents are helpful and relevant. As far as whether some of this will come before a jury, that depends on a number of factors, including where defense attorneys go, future charges, etc. IMO.

Yes, it is and I agree to understanding motive. I also agree that the prior information shows that in no way was LVD under the influence of CD and IMO, that is the only use of some of these documents. IMO caution should be used in regards to the statements of the parents involved in the respective divorce cases, these are not facts but allegations made by the respective parties. They may be true or they may not be true.

 

[Nikynoo]

However, we aren't a jury. So, why not explore the patterns that can be found, illuminated by previous court records?

Because some of us are uncomfortable about some of the information contained in those documents, hence the request for a sub forum.

If people want to explore and understand, kudos to them.

I tend to see things in an evidence based point of view and whether its relevant to the result that should be obtained. I can only see this information being relevant if the prosecution does not have direct evidence of LVDs involvement in the murders of JJ and Tylee.

IMO the documents should have been redacted prior to release by the court and if not, then they should have been redacted by the purchaser before sharing on public platforms OR the purchaser only needed to publish what was relevant.

MOO etc

 

[nyvictoria]

the hairstyle seems to have showed up at her wedding; Wedding photos show Lori Vallow's and Chad Daybell's ceremony just 6 weeks after kids go missing

and her part flips to the opposite side of her head from where it was in
her older pictures :
إخطار إعادة التوجيه

people do change hair styles, but it just stands out to me somehow.
outward manifestation of something? IMO.

The new hairstyle could be due to the weather in Hawaii. Humidity will wreak havoc with hair.

 

[Sorelle19]

Yes, it is and I agree to understanding motive. I also agree that the prior information shows that in no way was LVD under the influence of CD and IMO, that is the only use of some of these documents. IMO caution should be used in regards to the statements of the parents involved in the respective divorce cases, these are not facts but allegations made by the respective parties. They may be true or they may not be true.

I don't think the prior court documents show that LV wasn't under the influence of CD. Just because she is manipulative as evidenced by these docs doesn't mean she also wasn't susceptible to control. They're not mutually exclusive, IMO.