Found Deceased ID - Joshua Vallow, 7, & Tylee Ryan, 16, Rexburg, Sept 2019 *Arrests* #52

[Nikynoo]

BBM. Lori's neighbor informed police that JJ told him that he and his sister were going to visit grandma soon. IMO both murders were planned. I think they picked days and times deliberately (Sunday evening - Monday night) so everyone else was at work when the burials took place. They had two more murders in the works (BB, Tammy) and the children were in the way of preparations for those.

ETA: If Lori killed JJ in a rage in her own appartment, that would have alerted MG and possibly DW who were staying at her place. I think Lori lied that JJ was climbing the cabinets (in the middle of the night?) so she could justify taking him to Alex's appartment where he was murdered IMO.

BBM or to use that noise as cover for what was really going on?

 

[JolietJake]

The Church doesn't want to be legally culpable if someone was acting as one its agents, especially if they choose not check with the legal department.



The Church wants the public to know it is separate from fringe groups and does not condone those teachings, so the members must be called something besides Mormon or LDS.

Both of these examples, to me, is the Church sending a message: "we're not responsible and we won't be held responsible". IMO

@Forever Young I don't want to cause any misunderstanding. I wasn't referring to any church, belief system, religion, or how they choose to operate at all. I was responding in agreement to the post that was referring to the term "doomsday cult mom" that's being so widely and annoyingly used in the main stream media.

 

[RexburgSleuth]

Maybe this was another "miracle" in our case--this visit by LE just before they were leaving town (though it seemed as if this visit was way overdue from when Kay contacted LE, after her own sleuthing to "find her" in Rexburg). Kay is miracle #1, Brandon driving a fraction faster than that bullet is miracle #2. This visit might be in the Miracle column as well.

My list includes:
the gun failure during attack on Tammy
Colby's feeling that it wasn't Tylee on text
<modsnip: at member request due to unverified information>
The COVID issue keeping everything televised
<modsnip: at member request due to unverified information>
The FARO scanner and dogs that found the bodies

And a million other things I can't share yet.

 

[indicolite22]

BBM or to use that noise as cover for what was really going on?

It doesn't seem that MG or DW heard any noise that night. I wonder if Alex's neighbors heard anything. IMO there's a good chance that the children were drugged first.

 

[Diddian]

Just watched Profiling Evil YouTube channel. New video up with Dr Amy Salermo, discussing deaths and causes for Joe Ryan, Charles Vallow and Tammy Daybell and Alex Cox. Was just posted this afternoon. Very good information!

I’m going to report my post to the Mods to ask if Profiling Evil is accepted here to post. I know it can be posted at the Suzanne Morphew thread. You guys will learn a lot from it.

Thank you! That video was very interesting, educational, and informative.

From her perspective as a former ER physician with 30+ years of experience, Dr. Salerno noticed and addressed many important considerations (placement and unnatural symmetric layout of CV's body and its relation to the found shell casings and bat, lack of anything more than a cursory autopsy without internal examination of Joe Ryan's body, possibility of relationship between the pulmonary embolisms found in AxC's lungs and relationship to his underlying conditions or to a possibly inherited coagulant condition or to some poisons incl. malachite which some have mentioned here and how that mechanism might also operate on TD).

But, I also found the contributions of one of the hosts, Chris McDonough, really interesting, particularly his notice of CD's use of us/we/them statements, which draw other individuals in to explain away his exclusive relationship to events (thus nullifying personal guilt) as that is something I've been attentive to.

I think CD commonly uses outside drivers/agents to explain his acts (e.g. his visions of TD's deceased maternal grandmother to motivate TD to change her behavior instead of just discussing it with her as an adult; his "glimpses through the veil" designed to motivate the behavior or insist upon the attention of others; his estate hierarchy to sort through people and rate them in a way that matches what he or Lori believed anyway). By using these outside drivers, CD can continue his innocently humble, simple religious man persona, and attribute his rigidness, bossiness, exploitation of fears of others, and hostility toward more conventional authorities to these outside drivers. He is just a channel.

McDonough also mentioned notice of WHO attended AxC's autopsy, important details that I had completely missed in my focus upon the cause of death. These individuals' attendance at the autopsy clearly indicates LE's belief/concern that this was no ordinary death.

Well worth watching.

 

[Love Never Fails]

My list includes:
the gun failure during attack on Tammy
Colby's feeling that it wasn't Tylee on text
<modsnip: at member request due to unverified information>
The COVID issue keeping everything televised
<modsnip: at member request due to unverified information>
The FARO scanner and dogs that found the bodies

And a million other things I can't share yet.

I agree with all and especially CR’s feeling that Tylee was not doing the texting. We learn the way people speak in their texts, their little habits and ways of talking to us. He knew in his gut it was not Tylee. Yet he couldn’t imagine his own mother being the monster that she is. Looking back now, I am sure he can testify to many things that were questionable during the years he lived with his mother.

 

[887sMtreme]

“Juries aren’t dumb.” Amen.

 

[Love Never Fails]

Thank you! That video was very interesting, educational, and informative.

From her perspective as a former ER physician with 30+ years of experience, Dr. Salerno noticed and addressed many important considerations (placement and unnatural symmetric layout of CV's body and its relation to the found shell casings and bat, lack of anything more than a cursory autopsy without internal examination of Joe Ryan's body, possibility of relationship between the pulmonary embolisms found in AxC's lungs and relationship to his underlying conditions or to a possibly inherited coagulant condition or to some poisons incl. malachite which some have mentioned here and how that mechanism might also operate on TD).

But, I also found the contributions of one of the hosts, Chris McDonough, really interesting, particularly his notice of CD's use of us/we/them statements, which draw other individuals in to explain away his exclusive relationship to events (thus nullifying personal guilt) as that is something I've been attentive to.

I think CD commonly uses outside drivers/agents to explain his acts (e.g. his visions of TD's deceased maternal grandmother to motivate TD to change her behavior instead of just discussing it with her as an adult; his "glimpses through the veil" designed to motivate the behavior or insist upon the attention of others; his estate hierarchy to sort through people and rate them in a way that matches what he or Lori believed anyway). By using these outside drivers, CD can continue his innocently humble, simple religious man persona, and attribute his rigidness, bossiness, exploitation of fears of others, and hostility toward more conventional authorities to these outside drivers. He is just a channel.

McDonough also mentioned notice of WHO attended AxC's autopsy, important details that I had completely missed in my focus upon the cause of death. These individuals' attendance at the autopsy clearly indicates LE's belief/concern that this was no ordinary death.

Well worth watching.

Great post.

First, I apologize for spelling Dr. Salerno’s name wrong. I did think it was Salermo. She is clearly very credible.

Yes, the autopsy of Charles being attended by the police AND FBI was something never caught before. I do believe the FBI has been pushing the local LE there for a long time. LE really botched the case but the FBI can recreate the crime scene.

I liked that Dr. Salerno even questioned the death of Joe Ryan.

The PE guys mentioned using we/them by the perps during a video on Barry Morphew as well and how that says the perp is distancing himself from the crime. So many things we tend to overlook, or I do anyway.

Great interview.

 

[887sMtreme]

I really wish the media would stop with the “doomsday cult mom” and similar descriptors. It feels like excuse-making. It’s also sounds ridiculous, when this case should be taken very seriously. Maybe it’s just me but I don’t like it.

I know! It reminds me of Nancy Grace’s “Tot Mom” and other inappropriately cutesy word games.

 

[Love Never Fails]

How do I post the PE video here? I tried. It it just brought the you tube address over and then it won’t open.

 

[indicolite22]

 

[887sMtreme]

<snipped for focus>
Chad has killed before meeting Lori I am sure. Lori killed Joe Ryan I am sure.

Are you saying there are mysterious deaths in Chad Daybell’s backstory, prior to those we’ve been discussing?

 

[Love Never Fails]

Are you saying there are mysterious deaths in Chad Daybell’s backstory, prior to those we’ve been discussing?

It’s not known. Just speculation because of his obsession with death.

The book he wrote about beyond the grave or something of that nature, the interview he gave to local news about being a grave digger (sexton) and posing in front of a tombstone with his book.

Additionally, Redvines (poster here) has known him for years. Redvines also said he is a master manipulator and serial killer.

 

[Love Never Fails]

The more I ponder this case the more I truly believe LVD is the one who did the actual murders...I don’t think Alex could do it, he was just the clean up guy and Chad, well he was just clean up guy #2.... the “overkill” aspect means someone was extremely angry. Her rage at not getting the insurance payment she had planned for set off her rage against the children...

I believe it was Lori and Chad who murdered the kids. I think Alex was their clean up guy. I look for LE to prove Chad was in Gilbert the morning CV was murdered. I even think Lori helped kill Tammy and Alex.

 

[The First Article]

The more I ponder this case the more I truly believe LVD is the one who did the actual murders...I don’t think Alex could do it, he was just the clean up guy and Chad, well he was just clean up guy #2.... the “overkill” aspect means someone was extremely angry. Her rage at not getting the insurance payment she had planned for set off her rage against the children...

I actually wonder if she did it too. She is so giddy I think she did it and liked it possibly.

 

[The First Article]

I think CD commonly uses outside drivers/agents to explain his acts (e.g. his visions of TD's deceased maternal grandmother to motivate TD to change her behavior instead of just discussing it with her as an adult; his "glimpses through the veil" designed to motivate the behavior or insist upon the attention of others; his estate hierarchy to sort through people and rate them in a way that matches what he or Lori believed anyway). By using these outside drivers, CD can continue his innocently humble, simple religious man persona, and attribute his rigidness, bossiness, exploitation of fears of others, and hostility toward more conventional authorities to these outside drivers. He is just a channel.

CD is triangulating with the "spirit world" and his "god". Narcissistic behaviour includes this form of passive aggressive communication style, and he seems to do it incessantly.

Triangulation (psychology) - Wikipedia.

 

[The First Article]

Are you saying there are mysterious deaths in Chad Daybell’s backstory, prior to those we’ve been discussing?

**edit for continuity with the above. This is in regards to speculation CD may have committed murder prior to Lori. ****

I can see where someone would get this idea. This level of depravity that he has here that he is clearly unmoved by as a normal person would be suggests he has committed depraved acts before. He seems comfortable with depraved acts and even enjoys it.

This is why I've speculated that some of the bodies he has dealt with in his job may have been where he's gotten satisfaction for this depravity before. There is certainly an excellent chance he has buried people he didn't like and had plenty of opportunity to invest in this. He seems utterly unphased by dismembering a child. And since he has been sexually aggressive with women, I'd speculate Tammy's sex life could have been unpleasant. And Tammy was being encouraged to submit further to it as a good religious woman - hence the apparent depression.

So while I don't know that he has murdered before, I am confident that there are acts of depravity fairly consistently in his life. Where he has been getting that sadistic feed from is the question.

**
Lori on the same matter: I guessed she was abusive and likely medically abusive to her children, and it looks like that might be correct. So she got her small constant sadistic feed from her children. Though she seems to have enjoyed jerking around the men in her life too, and I'd not be surprised to find out that she regularly bullied other women in social settings that she thought she had other women like her on board for. She had outlets for her sadism.

 

[CSIDreamer]

I can see where someone would get this idea. This level of depravity that he has here that he is clearly unmoved by as a normal person would be suggests he has committed depraved acts before. He seems comfortable with them and even enjoys it.

This is why I've speculated that some of the bodies he has dealt with in his job may have been where he's gotten satisfaction for this depravity before. There is certainly an excellent chance he has buried people he didn't like and had plenty of opportunity to invest in this. He seems utterly unphased by dismembering a child. And since he has been sexually aggressive with women, I'd speculate Tammy's sex life could have been unpleasant. And Tammy was being encouraged to submit further to it as a good religious woman - hence the apparent depression.

So while I don't know that he has murdered before, I am confident that there are acts of depravity fairly consistently in his life. Where he has been getting that sadistic feed from is the question.

BBM. I'm sorry I'm not following. What is this about?

 

[The First Article]

BBM. I'm sorry I'm not following. What is this about?

The above discussion about a few people thinking CD may have murdered people before. I can see why they think this as he is clearly quite comfortable with his depravity and unmoved by things that would deeply disturb a normal person.

Instead of him murdering others previously, I'm giving examples of things that I speculate he may have done to satisfy his sadistic tendencies. His depravity is too facile for this to have just sprung up the day that he burned Tylee's dismembered body. It is even too easy and practiced on him when sexually assaulted JRowe.

I can see why someone would speculate he murdered before, it may be though that he had outlets for depravity in other areas that were available to him.

 

[CSIDreamer]

The above discussion about a few people thinking CD may have murdered people before. I can see why they think this as he is clearly quite comfortable with his depravity and unmoved by things that would deeply disturb a normal person.

Instead of him murdering others previously, I'm giving examples of things that I speculate he may have done to satisfy his sadistic tendencies. His depravity is too facile for this to have just sprung up the day that he burned Tylee's dismembered body. It is even too easy and practiced on him when sexually assaulted JRowe.

I can see why someone would speculate he murdered before, it may be though that he had outlets for depravity in other areas that were available to him.

No I mean her depression that you're talking about. The part I bolded.