Found Deceased ID - Joshua Vallow, 7, & Tylee Ryan, 17, Rexburg, Sept 2019 *mom arrested* #30

[Tortoise]

So it wasn't MG on the Ring doorbell footage of 29th October. She has shortish blonde hair in the police interview in January.

 

[AmandaSkis]

I'm missing something. He took her phone, her purse, all her money. How did SHE buy a burner phone? Jmo

And the car door was locked...wait, no, for the first time ever, the door was unlocked...wait, now she doesn’t know if the door was locked.

I couldn’t read any more.

The lies just flow out of her, even in one conversation.

 

[AmandaSkis]

DBM duplicate post

 

[Tortoise]

I'm still trying to figure out the story given by MG. She said she went to the house thinking Lori texted her, and only when she got there she realized it wasn't Lori. But then she asked him if he would be willing to give her Lori's purse. So supposedly without communicating with Lori beforehand she was trying to negotiate for Lori's purse.

I do know I do NOT believe that Jason was just wandering past by sheer happenchance.

So in that respect I wouldn't rely on what any of them said. I think Lori said she bought a throwaway phone and then in the second part she says something about it being her mother's old phone?

 

[mrjitty]

Thank you, and yes I understand the adversarial system very well. The burden of proof is upon the state to prove the alleged charges and the burden is upon the defense to introduce reasonable doubt. Hypothetically, if you were on this jury, I wonder how you would feel about the state putting on a lot of evidence to support the allegation that the children are dead, if she did and said absolutely nothing to show the court that this is not the case.

Exactly this.

We need to be realistic about how unusual this case really is to date. Normally in a missing kids case, the defence creates doubt by offering some plausible explanation that cannot be dismissed. i.e. wandering or abduction. While the accused may not testify, the defence will offer a theory and point to circumstantial evidence that may support such a theory. Of course in all the cases I can remember, the accused will have communicated the theory to witnesses pre-trial. We don't know if LV has done this.

The state will of course point to a wealth of circumstantial evidence and invite the jury to make obvious and natural inferences. If the defence simply offers nothing, I can't imagine that I would take more than 5mins to infer that the kids are dead based on what we currently know. This is particularly because the defence must know what happened and can introduce evidence other than testimony from the accused to raise a version.

I wonder if one purpose of these initial charges is precisely to force the defence to disclose a theory?

And in that regard I wonder if Chad has been manufacturing witnesses who will say he told them the kids were safely placed with 3rd parties.

I am presuming in this context, Chad may need to plead the 5th

 

[Mystery22]

BODY CAM: Gilbert PD asks Lori Vallow to go to CBI

More footage

At 3:56 into the video, I love how Tylee says - you are going to get a padded room. JMO

 

[Anonymous91]

Found this article very interesting: If male serial killers “hunt” their victims, what do female serial killers do?

This is based on an extensive study between men and Women serial killers, and what motivates them. Below I've included some of the interesting parts of this article:

- Male serial killers, according to the researchers’ theory, are “hunters,” who follow their prey as they did in nomadic communities. Female serial killers, meanwhile, are “gatherers,” fitting in with their role in these societies, according to the article published in the journal Evolutionary Behavioral Sciences.

- Harrison thinks there are probably more female serial killers than have been recorded, or even caught. Just as society tends to underestimate women, it also tends to be dismissive of female serial killers, giving them silly nicknames like “Jolly Jane” or “The Giggling Grandma.” Media accounts focus on their looks. “Society tends to believe that women can’t do such heinous things. Women are thought of as caregivers and kind,” she said.

- While men largely attack strangers, previous studies have shown that about 80% of women serial killers know their victims. They “gather” them around, Harrison and her colleagues argue—although while men’s “hunting” is essentially literal, the researcher told Quartz that women’s “gathering” is more figurative. They also take care of others: 72% killed at least one person in their care, and nearly half of them have killed their children.

The researchers found that men usually hunt women to gain some sort of sexual satisfaction (49% killed exclusively women in the researchers’ sample, and 75% killed for sexual gratification). Women don’t discriminate as much in terms of gender, but they will kill for financial gain (16.7% of the men and 51.9% for women murdered for money).

Some stats between men and women (Study was taken from 55 men serial killers & 55 women serial killers):

Related to Victim = 9.1% for Men, 58.2% for Women
Motive:financial = 16.7% for Men, 51.9% for Women
Nickname shows Brutality= 78.1% for Men, 53.3% for Women

Now who wants to come up with a name for LVD?

 

[Diddian]

At 3:56 into the video, I love how Tylee says - you are going to get a padded room. JMO

This is unbelievable. A legitimate official had legally authorized Lori's petition for commitment for psychological observation and despite this rookie police officer's spoken claim not to be taking sides between Charles and Lori, he is actively advocating for her, coaching her (wink, wink) about how to make herself scarce after Charles shows up with her purse/phone but before LE can verify the petition for her commitment by telling her the window of time in which she could just leave without them stopping her. And then he tells her how to avoid LE enforcing the commitment at Community Bridges by just showing up at the place without being brought in OR by refusing to answer the door if officers are sent to collect her. He has NO IDEA what the official who authorized Lori's commitment knows. He has NO IDEA what he is enabling or not enabling.

Were police officers as accommodating to Charles when Charles spoke with police, or does he lack the requisite characteristics (blond, petite, female, flirty, friend of JM)? (ETA: One wonders what that rookie police officer's supervisor said to whoever he spoke with when he verified the authorization of the petition for commitment and whether what that officer said played a role in Community Bridges allowing Lori to leave so quickly after she checked in.)

LE's behavior begs rigorous investigation.

Combine the fact that a court had in the past ordered video surveillance whenever Charles's sons from a prior marriage were in the home with Lori, the commitment petition that was legitimately authorized whatever the rookie police officer personally thought about it based on a half-hour in the presence of its subject, this police report experience that appears completely unprofessional, biased, and bizarre in so many respects, and the fact that Charles was shot in Lori's presence less than five months later and there is plenty of reason that the killing of Charles Vallow should have raised immediate and substantial suspicion among LE that a self-defense claim was complete baloney and the place was a serious crime scene that should have been properly processed and the witnesses should have been considered potential perpetrators who should have been properly and separately questioned (incl. Tylee). Add in the life insurance claim four days later and the utter lack of suspicion on LE's part begins to make them look like they abandoned the law and allowed Lori her way with Charles, whatever that might be.

Lori takes Tylee along as a witness and for moral support when making the police report about her stolen purse/phone, but she beats feet out of there with both kids in tow "for their own protection" when the father they have lived with for many years is murdered while they are at the home. "Get the hell out of here," JJ repeatedly shouted when playing with his friend in the center lawn at Rexburg. It doesn't take much imagination to figure out when JJ heard those words and they made such an impression on him. Clearly the reason he couldn't be trusted to privately FaceTime with his grandparents either. Also clearly the reason he and Tylee can't be found today.

It is also sickening watching the jovial atmosphere in this room, like this is all a big joke and Charles is the butt of it. And as I've said before, it is beyond disgusting that Tylee is in that room at all. Lori treated her like an appendage and she deserved a life valued as its own.

 

[Deerrun]

Dbm

 

[Diddian]

Found this article very interesting: If male serial killers “hunt” their victims, what do female serial killers do?

This is based on an extensive study between men and Women serial killers, and what motivates them. Below I've included some of the interesting parts of this article:

- Male serial killers, according to the researchers’ theory, are “hunters,” who follow their prey as they did in nomadic communities. Female serial killers, meanwhile, are “gatherers,” fitting in with their role in these societies, according to the article published in the journal Evolutionary Behavioral Sciences.

- Harrison thinks there are probably more female serial killers than have been recorded, or even caught. Just as society tends to underestimate women, it also tends to be dismissive of female serial killers, giving them silly nicknames like “Jolly Jane” or “The Giggling Grandma.” Media accounts focus on their looks. “Society tends to believe that women can’t do such heinous things. Women are thought of as caregivers and kind,” she said.

- While men largely attack strangers, previous studies have shown that about 80% of women serial killers know their victims. They “gather” them around, Harrison and her colleagues argue—although while men’s “hunting” is essentially literal, the researcher told Quartz that women’s “gathering” is more figurative. They also take care of others: 72% killed at least one person in their care, and nearly half of them have killed their children.

The researchers found that men usually hunt women to gain some sort of sexual satisfaction (49% killed exclusively women in the researchers’ sample, and 75% killed for sexual gratification). Women don’t discriminate as much in terms of gender, but they will kill for financial gain (16.7% of the men and 51.9% for women murdered for money).

Some stats between men and women (Study was taken from 55 men serial killers & 55 women serial killers):

Related to Victim = 9.1% for Men, 58.2% for Women
Motive:financial = 16.7% for Men, 51.9% for Women
Nickname shows Brutality= 78.1% for Men, 53.3% for Women

Now who wants to come up with a name for LVD?

Prisoner #88573. Life plus 50 for each murder.

 

[Anonymous91]

BODY CAM: Gilbert PD asks Lori Vallow to go to CBI

More footage

LEO says he is not going to take sides (cough* yea right*Cough), he is full of something and it stinks.

Then he proceeds to take her side, and coach her through what she can do to make this all go away.

She is a master manipulator though, she should have worked for CNN. She can take Jim Acosta's job, she would be much better at the spin doctoring.

You can tell she is very comfortable and she is used to manipulating people, this is not her first rodeo.

You notice how she tells both LEO, I am confused how someone even gets this type of order in the middle of the night...

She is betting that this is going to garner sympathy for her, and that they are going to help her circumvent the system. Then the LEO falls for the trap.

Then she uses her friend JM because she knows that they will treat her as family. She is good at what she does.

Based on my life experience she has been doing this for most of her life, and she has this down to a science. These are the type of people who truly terrify me. They take advantage of good people, and use their good hearts, trust, empathy, and morals against them.

You'll notice how comfortable LVD is, she doesn't show the slightest amount of being nervous, or even concerned. In fact, she shows that she is excited, and seems to be in complete control of her environment.

Being a former victim of Domestic Abuse, all kinds of red flags were going off for me, but you have to know what your looking for. If you don't have life experience with this, it's easy to miss.

It would probably be wise for LEO to be trained in some basic Psychology, to learn to watch out for these red flags. I am sure that they would be able to be more successful at their jobs, at the very least.

I bet you those LEO are cringing that this is on the news now, wondering what were they thinking? The plain truth is they just didn't know any better. I think it will be a wake up call for them though.

MOO

 

[Alpha Bravo]

MOO - I'm really hoping that MG is charged as an an accompliance for failing to notify the police that both Chad and Lori called her and asked her to lie about the children's whereabouts. She waited 11 days. For 11 days she thought about herself, how her silence would implicate her. She most likely enjoyed a Thanksgiving meal with her family. She most likely had to retain an attorney for advice. It took 11 days for her to realize what she had become involved in. If she talks, it will be because she does not want to end up in jail, not because she cares for JJ and Tylee - both of whom she knows. She knows these children and did not immediately call the police back or notifiy them when they contacted her that Chad and Lori asked her to become part of their conspiracy. She waited 11 days.

26 Nov 2019, about 9:30 pm - Rexburg PD have not heard from MG so they call Gilbert PD. LE in Arizona go to MG’s home but she is not there. GPD reaches MG by phone; She tells them JJ has not been there for several months. (Affidavit of Probable Cause Doc; East Idaho News)

6 Dec 2019 - RPD is contacted by Melanie Gibb. MG says that both Chad Daybell and Lori Vallow called MG on Nov 26, 2019, at separate times and asked her to tell police that she had JJ even though JJ was not with her. “Melanie informed RPD that she declined Chad’s and Lori’s requests.”

Well she took it upon herself to come clean which is a redeeming factor, but they may be able to get her to testify for the State. I really hope so. The scope of this cult should be exposed as well.

 

[mickey2942]

LVD, is pure evil. The swath of dead bodies, and missing children that are directly connected to her is beyond a coincidence.

This took deliberate planning, and actions. I am just glad that LVD was too stupid to go some place that has no extradition to the United States. She seems to think that she is so clever.

CD better be careful, before LVD flips on him.

 

[Drc40]

I imagine both these cops are embarrassed and humiliated at being played like chumps. Lolo easily lured them in and spun her web on unsuspecting fools who should know better. I hope they received proper constructive criticism and won’t make these rookie mistakes again.

 

[Diddian]

I imagine both these cops are embarrassed and humiliated at being played like chumps. Lolo easily lured them in and spun her web on unsuspecting fools who should know better. I hope they received proper constructive criticism and won’t make these rookie mistakes again.

5 people have likely died in the wake of those mistakes, 4 of them complete innocents. That is not a light matter.

The witness who Charles had listen in on his phone call with Lori might be forgiven for not more seriously relaying what he had heard to the police officer who called him. He was being careful not to accuse LV of more than he knew, but in doing so he seemed to understate the factors that were a real concern (her irrational, possibly delusional beliefs that had overtaken her life).

Law enforcement officers who assisted Lori in finagling her way out of a stay at Community Bridge? More law enforcement officers who did not seriously secure a scene where a man was shot to death and where witnesses/potential perpetrator(s) (one of them the estranged wife of the victim who was separated from him and who had a record of contentious relations with him) subsequently fled the scene? Heads should roll.

 

[MTW2011]

The second video clip, where the one officer mentions “Just talking to you, I mean, I don’t see you being a danger to anyone else or yourself. You got your kids to school.”

I can’t imagine how those original officers feel now considering all that has happened and how they acted in these interactions with them. I thought it was very interesting to hear Lori, Melani and Tylee all together with the police. You can hear Lori laugh at the idea of her going to Community Bridges Behavioral Health but takes down the information. Tylee Ryan says she’s working at this time but wants to take community college classes and possibly become a police officer.

Link to video: BODY CAM: Gilbert PD asks Lori Vallow to go to CBI

 

[Anonymous91]

The second video clip, where the one officer mentions “Just talking to you, I mean, I don’t see you being a danger to anyone else or yourself. You got your kids to school.”

I can’t imagine how those original officers feel now considering all that has happened and how they acted in these interactions with them. I thought it was very interesting to hear Lori, Melani and Tylee all together with the police. You can hear Lori laugh at the idea of her going to Community Bridges Behavioral Health but takes down the information. Tylee Ryan says she’s working at this time but wants to take community college classes and possibly become a police officer.

Link to video: BODY CAM: Gilbert PD asks Lori Vallow to go to CBI

...and I don't think that LEO are trained as professional Psychologists.

Another interesting fact, not all Psychologists are trained in the same areas. As manipulative as LVD has shown to be, I can see her easily fooling someone not trained with her particular psychosis.

I've seen it first hand, sadly. My ex had court mandated family counseling, and both her and the psychologist tag teamed me, and put all of the blame and responsibility on me. Never once did he make her take responsibility for anything that she was doing wrong, looking back at it now, it really ticks me off. He caused me a lot of unintentional stress and depression, that I am still dealing with. It wasn't until years later, I found out what I was dealing with, in her particular case BPD and Narcissism. I found out that not a lot of Psychologist don't like to deal with the whole "crazy spectrum", so they know very little about it, and most of them refuse to label any of their clients with any of these disorders.

For all we know poor Charles may have went to counseling, and had a similar experience. If he thought he was the problem, and both the psychologist and LVD ganged up on him, he may have felt that maybe they are right. After all the Psychologist is a professional, Right? That would explain why CV had dropped the divorce, and was trying to mend the marriage. We'll probably never know though, just me thinking out loud here. JMO

So not all psychologists are created equal. We already know that LVD had been committed in the past, and was released within 48 hours. I don't recall if that was once, or twice though. She could have easily fooled the psychologist, if they didn't know what to look for, and they are supposed to be the professionals.

MOO

 

[Drc40]

5 people have likely died in the wake of those mistakes, 4 of them complete innocents. That is not a light matter.

The witness who Charles had listen in on his phone call with Lori might be forgiven for not more seriously relaying what he had heard to the police officer who called him. He was being careful not to accuse LV of more than he knew, but in doing so he seemed to understate the factors that were a real concern (her irrational, possibly delusional beliefs that had overtaken her life).

Law enforcement officers who assisted Lori in finagling her way out of a stay at Community Bridge? More law enforcement officers who did not seriously secure a scene where a man was shot to death and where witnesses/potential perpetrator(s) (one of them the estranged wife of the victim who was separated from him and who had a record of contentious relations with him) subsequently fled the scene? Heads should roll.

You can’t lay those deaths on “these two” cops. They were investigating a stolen purse and a civil order. You can’t directly tie their actions to any deaths whatsoever. Incompetent yes, guilty of anything beyond that no. Other cops in that department in those other matters I agree. Just not these two guys.

 

[indicolite22]

I can’t imagine how those original officers feel now considering all that has happened and how they acted in these interactions with them. I thought it was very interesting to hear Lori, Melani and Tylee all together with the police. You can hear Lori laugh at the idea of her going to Community Bridges Behavioral Health but takes down the information. Tylee Ryan says she’s working at this time but wants to take community college classes and possibly become a police officer.

Link to video: BODY CAM: Gilbert PD asks Lori Vallow to go to CBI

BBM. I think the fact that three people were painting Charles as the bad guy contributed to the police bias.

 

[fuzzybutter]

Interesting. I'm trying to trace the vehicles in the case. Could you tell me where you learned that? Not disputing, just very curious.

Well, I am glad you asked that because I think I am wrong. I started searching here in old messages and on MSM sites and could not find any confirmation. And then, I was looking pics from the LE body cams when CV was shot and the truck was in the driveway of the Gilbert rental house. CVs truck was in Texas. He had a rental car the day he died. Perhaps I was confusing the jeep that Tylee was driving since it was titled in CVs name. I don't know where I got that from. I apologize for the brain fart and thanks for holding my feet to the fire!