Found Deceased ID - Joshua Vallow, 7, & Tylee Ryan, 17, Rexburg, Sept 2019 *mom arrested* #31

[indicolite22]

This explanation does NOT make Lori a saint but it could explain everything. She's still a money-grubbing (word I wont use) but it is consistent with her moving to Idaho and not telling anyone and also with putting the kids in hiding to protect them. It also explains why she would no produce them even for law enforcement.

BBM. So the move had nothing to do with Lori being closer to Chad, her past and future husband? Who did Tylee need protecting from?

 

[indicolite22]

Everyone on that list is 'light. I'm thinking with Tylee being 'dark' he didn't want that in their 'family'.

Edit for typo.

Yes, but he made up that rating. He could have easily made Tylee light as well. I'd like to know when he changed JJ's rating from light to dark.

 

[KonaHonu]

I believe Charles Vallow was no longer living in AZ, and was living in Texas.

Texas is also a community property state.

 

[Tortoise]

Justin Lum Fox 10 Phoenix
1 hr ·
“By looking at it I don’t look at this as someone that kind of threw this together overnight,” said Cristina Rosetti, Ph.D. in Religious Studies.

We have reached out to Mark Means for comment on the religious documents sent by Chad Daybell to Lori Vallow. No response yet.

https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=794342474428639

 

[Diddian]

So I called part of that before I saw the clip. Kay wanted custody and CV's brothers were threatening Lori last fall. That actually supports this being a custody battle. If Lori retained custody of JJ she would have a right, under Arizona law, to most of CV's life insurance, The Arizona lawyer could perhaps clarify but I know that in Arizona, spouses and minor children have rights that supercede beneficiary declarations in many situations.

This explanation does NOT make Lori a saint but it could explain everything. She's still a money-grubbing (word I wont use) but it is consistent with her moving to Idaho and not telling anyone and also with putting the kids in hiding to protect them. It also explains why she would no produce them even for law enforcement.

If we learn one of CV's relatives is an FBI agent or other LEO I think that would have a HUGE impact on my opinion. But we don't have any inkling that that might be the case.

No, it would NOT explain everything. Lori purchased a wedding ring for herself on Charles Vallow's Amazon account PRIOR to Tammy's death. She allowed Chad, a married man, to smack her playfully and familiarly on the butt while the two of them were at her storage unit PRIOR to Tammy's death.

 

[indicolite22]

10 ways to screw up when picking life insurance beneficiaries

According to this article, what CV did is one of the 10 biggest mistakes. In Arizona he could not name Kay as beneficiary without Lori's permission. I suspect JJ also had rights that might follow to another guardian. I'm beginning to believe the custody battle theory. (IMO her interest is in the costody of the $ but that requires maintaining custody of the kids.)

She was so afraid of losing her kids that she did something that would make it easier to lose custody? Was she not aware that she would be required to produce the kids? When she became aware of it, why didn't she comply and remove the threat? Wouldn't her attorney explain to her that she could not lose custody to grandparents as long as she was fit to be a mother?

 

[indicolite22]

Lori Vallow received threats and is protecting her children, according to mom, sister

Here is the 14min version from the evening news. It includes the two shorter teasers from earlier today.

Couple takeaways - not in order:

• They didn't know about Lori's wedding, heard about it on the news
• They found out about AxC death from the police, didn't know he got married or that he'd moved back to AZ
• They don't believe she's been brainwashed
• They don't believe any of the fringe religious beliefs
• Janis suggested that Lori take a picture of the kids with a newspaper - that was her advice (via a friend in HI)
• Kay's/CV's brothers were also threatening (NEW!) at least I'm assuming that's who's brothers are being referred to.
• CV was great - never said a negative thing about Lori until last year
• CV tried to get Lori ex-communicated from the Church
• CV was cheating - filed for divorce, but tried to get her back the whole time

BBM. Regarding Chad and his beliefs, Summer also said that everyone was entitled to believe what they wanted and that that doesn't make them a bad person. She claims she only met Chad once. On the other hand, she vilified Charles and insinuated that Lori and Tylee could have been murdered by him had Alex not been present on July 11. She believes that Charles was lying in his divorce filing about Lori's crazy beliefs. IMO Chad's letters to Lori at that time will prove that Charles wasn't making it up.

 

[KonaHonu]

BBM. So the move had nothing to do with Lori being closer to Chad, her past and future husband? Who did Tylee need protecting from?

Well of course it had to do with moving closer to Chad. "Please Chad, I'm being threatened, I need to be near you so you can protect me..."

I am NOT saying Lori is honorable, just that the pieces may be falling together and making sense to me. What has bothered me from the start is that none of the behavior has ever made sense. Pieces falling together could very well mean a criminal conspiracy. But at least I'm beginning to have a theory that makes sense.

 

[Diddian]

BBM. Regarding Chad and his beliefs, Summer also said that everyone was entitled to believe what they wanted and that that doesn't make them a bad person. She claims she only met Chad once. On the other hand, she vilified Charles and insinuated that Lori and Tylee could have been murdered by him had Alex not been present on July 11.

I think Summer is all “warriored up,” just like her sister who is in jail.

 

[spandangly]

Thanks! I have to figure out how to properly post the video.

My thoughts:
They don't address

Well of course it had to do with moving closer to Chad. "Please Chad, I'm being threatened, I need to be near you so you can protect me..."

I am NOT saying Lori is honorable, just that the pieces may be falling together and making sense to me. What has bothered me from the start is that none of the behavior has ever made sense. Pieces falling together could very well mean a criminal conspiracy. But at least I'm beginning to have a theory that makes sense.

I understand what you're saying about beneficiary in a community property state, but I don't understand how moving to Idaho or hiding the kids intersects? Could you spell it out for me, please?

 

[KonaHonu]

She was so afraid of losing her kids that she did something that would make it easier to lose custody? Was she not aware that she would be required to produce the kids? When she became aware of it, why didn't she comply and remove the threat? Wouldn't her attorney explain to her that she could not lose custody to grandparents as long as she was fit to be a mother?

What has she done to make her lose custody? If the threats are true and she put them in hiding with a trusted associate she is not guilty of any crime except the misdemeanor of defying an Idaho judge and lying to police, none of which are much more than a speeding ticket. If she is convicted she has already served her time. If a Charles-brother turns out to be a LEO I think she will get off based on reasonable fear. If one is an FBI agent I think her defense is a slam dunk...assuming the kids are alive and in hiding.

 

[indicolite22]

Well of course it had to do with moving closer to Chad. "Please Chad, I'm being threatened, I need to be near you so you can protect me..."

I am NOT saying Lori is honorable, just that the pieces may be falling together and making sense to me. What has bothered me from the start is that none of the behavior has ever made sense. Pieces falling together could very well mean a criminal conspiracy. But at least I'm beginning to have a theory that makes sense.

Wasn't Alex sufficient for her protection? I don't see how Chad was protecting her from perceived threats. He was sneaking around her behind his wife's back.
Where does Chad's "seven goals to accomplish together" fit in your theory? A manifesto was sent by him to Lori in early 2019. It looks like they were on a mission. Disappearing the kids would be much easier in Idaho. It could have been part of a plan.

 

[KonaHonu]

My thoughts:
They don't address

I understand what you're saying about beneficiary in a community property state, but I don't understand how moving to Idaho or hiding the kids intersects? Could you spell it out for me, please?

It doesn't intersect. At the time of Charles's death they were married and both residents of a community property state (Texas or Arizona). My guess is that Arizona law applies even if CV changed his residency because he filed for divorce in AZ and therefore declared himself under Arizona jurisdiction (that is literally a declaration you must make to file for divorce). The Idaho move is irrelevant. At CV's death, Arizona law governed his estate regardless of where Lori or any other relative became a resident. Once he died, she and the kids had beneficiary rights that were based on his and their state of residence.

I'd love to hear from AZ lawyer that I'm wrong because I think this is a fundamental fact we must consider. If I'm right, this is a $1,000,000 custody fight and the story Lori/Chad have hinted at make sense. Lori would be well-advised to hide the kids, even from LE. Remember, EVERYTHING you tell law enforcement in the US is intended to be used AGAINST you by law. Weigh that against the misdemeanor of lying to cops and it's a no-brainer I'd take.

My biggest problem with this theory is that it's very expensive for them!

 

[indicolite22]

What has she done to make her lose custody? If the threats are true and she put them in hiding with a trusted associate she is not guilty of any crime except the misdemeanor of defying an Idaho judge and lying to police, none of which are much more than a speeding ticket. If she is convicted she has already served her time. If a Charles-brother turns out to be a LEO I think she will get off based on reasonable fear. If one is an FBI agent I think her defense is a slam dunk...assuming the kids are alive and in hiding.

If she never produces the kids and there's no proof she's providing for them, shel'll be convicted of child abandonment and will lose custody. She could get up to 14 years per child for that. It would be very easy to prove that the kids are alive without disclosing their location. That would help her a lot. She choses not to go that route. In the meantime, documents are coming out about the kids being labeled dark spirits by Chad. Do you think he would put in an effort to protect those?

 

[Tmw821]

Can we entertain the idea that Lori may actually have been threatened? Who might do that and why? Here's my list:

- CV's siblings because, well, she killed him
- past AVOW/PAP members who spent a lot of money
- fellow podcasters who may have somehow been swindled or left out
- others involved in things we have not even discovered

If it is any of those they would likely be in the Phoenix area otherwise why would she flee that area. They might have some connection with LE. I wonder who fits those criteria? I'm not pointing fingers or even saying I believe that defense. I'm just saying that it might be a plausible theory based on other things uncovered.

I was just wondering what happened to you. So happy to see that you are joining us again. I am curious as to what has been "uncovered"? Besides what Summer and Janis claim?

 

[indicolite22]

I think Summer is all “warriored up,” just like her sister who is in jail.

I'm wondering about the ratios of truth, delusions and lies in that interview. In general I agree with Summer's statement on religious freedom. Chad's fringe beliefs aren't on trial here per se (there are others with similar beliefs), unless when they become used as justification for murder.

 

[indicolite22]

Can we entertain the idea that Lori may actually have been threatened? Who might do that and why? Here's my list:

- CV's siblings because, well, she killed him
- past AVOW/PAP members who spent a lot of money
- fellow podcasters who may have somehow been swindled or left out
- others involved in things we have not even discovered

If it is any of those they would likely be in the Phoenix area otherwise why would she flee that area. They might have some connection with LE. I wonder who fits those criteria? I'm not pointing fingers or even saying I believe that defense. I'm just saying that it might be a plausible theory based on other things uncovered.

I wasn't aware that Charles had any brothers. It is extremely far fetched IMO that a PAP/AVOW member would have a personal grudge against Lori. She was not a major figure in either. Why wouldn't she turn to police to report the threat? She reported Charles immediately for taking away her purse. Her fellow podcasters are only a handful and none seem overly unbalanced. Her role there was peripheral as well.

 

[LDS social scientist]

https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=794342474428639

“By looking at it I don’t look at this as someone that kind of threw this together overnight,” said Cristina Rosetti, Ph.D. in Religious Studies.

I apparently went beyond the TOS in my last couple of posts. I apologize for that.

Since Rosetti's name is now out there in MSM, I assume it's safe to endorse her insight on how Chad/Lori's ideas may or may not intersect with mainstream Mormonism and the many versions of LDS "fundamentalisms." What she says in the Jason Lum interview seems sound.

 

[indicolite22]

Another thought on the custody battle theory. Even if Lori stood the chance of getting awarded by court that $1 mil from Charles' life insurance instead of Kay, she'd have to produce the kids. No kids, no money. Independently, Kay and Larry declared in an interview a few weeks ago: "We'll give you the money, just show us the kids."

Lori can't win her "fight for money" by sitting in jail and refusing to talk. She's losing money as we speak. Why would she wait until the trial to produce the kids? Is her position going to improve? If she doesn't talk then, we'll know the reason. If the kids are dead, her best chance is to keep schtum and hope for lack of evidence (not a problem in child abandonment case).

I can imagine Chad planning in advance to deny everything and blame it on the grandparents if his dark spirit theory got out. Melanie Gibb's testimony in court will be very interesting.

 

[tresir2012]

It doesn't intersect. At the time of Charles's death they were married and both residents of a community property state (Texas or Arizona). My guess is that Arizona law applies even if CV changed his residency because he filed for divorce in AZ and therefore declared himself under Arizona jurisdiction (that is literally a declaration you must make to file for divorce). The Idaho move is irrelevant. At CV's death, Arizona law governed his estate regardless of where Lori or any other relative became a resident. Once he died, she and the kids had beneficiary rights that were based on his and their state of residence.

I'd love to hear from AZ lawyer that I'm wrong because I think this is a fundamental fact we must consider. If I'm right, this is a $1,000,000 custody fight and the story Lori/Chad have hinted at make sense. Lori would be well-advised to hide the kids, even from LE. Remember, EVERYTHING you tell law enforcement in the US is intended to be used AGAINST you by law. Weigh that against the misdemeanor of lying to cops and it's a no-brainer I'd take.

My biggest problem with this theory is that it's very expensive for them!

Charles did not die but was set up and murdered by Lori and Alex. Charles changed his life insurance beneficiary to someone he trusted and had already predicted his murder and who would do it. Lori could easily provide evidence the kids are OK, if they are safe and this would then go away. So why doesn't she do that?