Found Deceased ID - Joshua Vallow, 7, & Tylee Ryan, 17, Rexburg, Sept 2019 *mom arrested* #41

[nodamselindistress]

Ha, that's probably true! It will be interesting to see if she will be called as a witness in any of these cases and how she will respond to direct questioning on the stand.

MOO.

I can't wait to see an attorney ask her a yes/no question....

 

[newsjunkie]

You know, these doomsday folks are already working on an excuse for why the world won’t end in July...

OMG, these nutter butters actually believed it!

If you think about it, Chad’s predictions might come true. If found guilty, it’s the end of the world as they know it!!

 

[diggndeeperstill]

The question that I bolded - reminds me of multiple stories going back for decades of killers showing up at events, just to glorify in what they've accomplished, and how nobody knows....

JMO

In this case, I am going to be the oddball that believes Chad introduced Tammy to Lori. I don’t know what story he used, but I bet he did. I mean he had been on podcasts with her, so she wasn’t a complete unknown. Chad could’ve been building the narrative of her for some time. I can see him trying to make excuses for them being seen together. Saying something like:

“oh this poor woman, just lost her abusive husband and has no money and is coming to Rexburg to focus on her faith. I’m going to start interviewing her for a book on overcoming, let’s have her over for dinner”.

yet, that doesn’t fit the narrative he told his kids “met a widow in Hawaii”.

Sometimes I find in the beginning of case it’s important to take note of interesting things you might find while “digging”. This is one of those topics that hasn’t fully come to light imho.

 

[Colorado303]

ES and JR were not part of Chad's mini cult. They hold a lot of the same beliefs, because they started off together.

In all seriousness, how do we know they weren’t/aren’t part of Chad’s “cult”? If they were they’d be absolute morons to admit it

 

[diggndeeperstill]

If you think about it, Chad’s predictions might come true. If found guilty, it’s the end of the world as they know it!!

I’ll have that song on repeat all day in my head now.

 

[The First Article]

I’m this case, I am going to be the oddball that believes Chad introduced Tammy to Lori. I don’t know what story he used, but I bet he did. I mean he had been on podcasts with her, so she wasn’t a complete unknown. Chad could’ve been building the narrative of her for some time. I can see him trying to make excuses for them being seen together. Saying something like:

“oh this poor woman, just lost her abusive husband and has no money and is coming to Rexburg to focus on her faith. I’m going to start interviewing her for a book on overcoming, let’s have her over for dinner”.

yet, that doesn’t fit the narrative he told his kids “met a widow in Hawaii”.

Sometimes I find in the beginning of case it’s important to take note of interesting things you might find while “digging”. This is one of those topics that hasn’t fully came to light imho.

If he was heading in the direction of polygamy, then he might have hoped he could sell both women on it with him being a prophet.

It is not exactly an uncommon motivation for a schism in this religious group.

Uncovering someone who needs you to hero worship them as a spouse while they abuse you is an incredibly dangerous thing to do. TD being upset the day she died could entirely be her having been introduced to Chad's plans and him killing her for standing up for herself.

And from some other accounts, this wider group did have a tendency to have sudden revelations that they need to sneak into temples and seal themselves to other people who were married so they could have sex with them. So there seems to be some form of acceptable polygamy/polyamory with a spiritual back drop common in this wider cult group.

 

[newsjunkie]

IMO, the doctrine of polygamy within LDS is never received well by full-grown women. It has only been sustained when the wanna-be polygamous man focusses his attention on very young women who are isolated from others, and trained to be subservient to the doctrine through being subservient to the man.

Evidently, LV, CD, and many others, such as their former spouses, are extremely dedicated to monogamy. So much so, that these two preferred to see their previous partners dead, rather than to just add a new one to the mix, happily sharing child custody, alimony, multiple households, jealousy free sex, and all the other complicated arrangements that polygamous people embrace.

I don’t think they were dedicated to monogamy. I think they were dedicated to the payout of insurance policies on dead spouses. MOO

 

[Satchie]

What do you think is the protocol here if Julie and Eric are not sleuthable but keeps inserting themselves into the investigation publicly? JR particularly. There must be some allowance for the parts these people play in relationship to the information they are bringing up and privy too.

I personally think JR is not stable and the people around her making it worse. Ethically since I think she is deeply unstable and this is making things worse sleuthing her is likely not good for her, however her information and its veracity and timing and motivations of the key players is possibly relevant. Same with this possible other affair - she and her husband (if they are not LVD and CV) is not a sleuthable person but any dates and motivations or theological ideas about why they thought this was okay is possibly relevant information?

Like "affair lady 1 met around 123 date, and discussed polygamy with CD" would be, but "Mrs. Affair Lady and her husband Mr. I'll Beat Your For Talking to My Wife live at Midlifecrisisville, AZ" probably isn't?

If you'll notice in MM, all these kinds of details are always given their source, "according to x", including 'according to LE'. They are not facts, they are assertions of fact by people who may have gotten mixed up, confused, have a strong bias, have jumped to wrong conclusions, have heard the info second or third hand and distorted it, or passed along distortions, forgotten things, etc.

IMO, it is absolutely not the case that people are either telling the plain exact 'facts' or they are deliberately lying. That assumption, the inability of posters to understand the innumerable shades of gray in communication, derails every thread sooner or later. I don't know how people live their lives, if everyone they hear from must be telling either completely true facts, or is a complete bald-faced liar.

Detectives and journalists always keep this ambiguity about statements in mind and WS rules encourage this as well.

 

[The First Article]

If you'll notice in MM, all these kinds of details are always given their source, "according to x", including 'according to LE'. They are not facts, they are assertions of fact by people who may have gotten mixed up, confused, have a strong bias, have jumped to wrong conclusions, have heard the info second or third hand and distorted it, or passed along distortions, forgotten things, etc.

IMO, it is absolutely not the case that people are either telling the plain exact 'facts' or they are deliberately lying. That assumption, the inability of posters to understand the innumerable shades of gray in communication, derails every thread sooner or later. I don't know how people live their lives, if everyone they hear from must be telling either completely true facts, or is a complete bald-faced liar.

Detectives and journalists always keep this ambiguity about statements in mind and WS rules encourage this as well.

That's a good way, "so-and-so asserts X."

 

[indicolite22]

I don’t know. Something about JR’s demeanor makes me think she wanted to be Chad’s side piece, maybe they even had a couple one night stands, but Chad wasn’t interested in pursuing a relationship with her.

If true, I bet that stung. Probably got all happy when she learned AZ gal #1 was gone. Maybe even shopped online for a wedding dress and matching malachite bands. Poor JR.

MOO

I have a feeling that JR didn't like Chad's groupies very much.

 

[Forever Young]

They didn't live in the same area (Rexburg vs Salem). Would they go to the same church?

Also MG mentioned that LV had stopped going to church, but went to the temple almost everyday. JMO

 

[spandangly]

I can't wait to see an attorney ask her a yes/no question....

... and a judge to tell her to answer the question!

MOO

 

[indicolite22]

I don’t think they were dedicated to monogamy. I think they were dedicated to the payout of insurance policies on dead spouses. MOO

Lori would not enjoy being one of many wives to Chad. These two were supposed to be soulmates.

 

[utahobserver]

So let me ask what I hope is an obvious thing to ask... is it possible MG was the original AZ woman? Just sayin'. Complicated people. JMO

I also think it's possible the original Arizona woman was Lori and Julie didn't understand that. I still think Chad and Lori knew each other for longer than we realize. MOO

There were so few women involved in PAP aka “the group that cannot be named”. I am assuming this would be basically where Chad trolled for women. I am also assuming he looked for extreme believers, no dabblers. We know MG and Lori lived in AZ, as did ZP, but on this flyer are 2 women who either live in UT or AZ:

From Gardener’s Media Timeline:
<a href="ID - Joshua Vallow, 7, & Tylee Ryan, 17, Rexburg, Sept 2019 *MEDIA MAPS TIMELINE* NO DISCUSSION">ID - Joshua Vallow, 7, & Tylee Ryan, 17, Rexburg, Sept 2019 *MEDIA MAPS TIMELINE* NO DISCUSSION</a>

Recent post referencing this event:
<a href="Found Deceased - ID - Joshua Vallow, 7, & Tylee Ryan, 17, Rexburg, Sept 2019 *mom arrested* #31">ID - Joshua Vallow, 7, & Tylee Ryan, 17, Rexburg, Sept 2019 *mom arrested* #31</a>

 

[fred&edna]

Is there a MM stating this? If not, you must delete or ask mod to delete this, it is strongly against TOS to print people's names in this manner.

IIRC there has been info posted about that particular person on these threads previously. Hmmm

 

[Satchie]

I don’t think they were dedicated to monogamy. I think they were dedicated to the payout of insurance policies on dead spouses. MOO

Yes, that probably was a motive but there's no evidence the plan was to share the insurance payouts with others in a polygamous group.

The Nxivm cult around Keith Raniere that was busted in 2018 was clearly polygamous, although that hasn't been emphasized. Raniere lived with several women, and they arranged to supply him with other women, and to brand them as his possessions, etc.

 

[wenwe4]

I have a feeling that JR didn't like Chad's groupies very much.

OR he is just trying to distance himself as much as possible right now from anything that might reside within the "Daybellion lore".

 

[tresir2012]

What do you think is the protocol here if Julie and Eric are not sleuthable but keeps inserting themselves into the investigation publicly? JR particularly. There must be some allowance for the parts these people play in relationship to the information they are bringing up and privy too.

I personally think JR is not stable and the people around her making it worse. Ethically since I think she is deeply unstable and this is making things worse sleuthing her is likely not good for her, however her information and its veracity and timing and motivations of the key players is possibly relevant. Same with this possible other affair - she and her husband (if they are not LVD and CV) is not a sleuthable person but any dates and motivations or theological ideas about why they thought this was okay is possibly relevant information?

Like "affair lady 1 met around 123 date, and discussed polygamy with CD" would be, but "Mrs. Affair Lady and her husband Mr. I'll Beat Your For Talking to My Wife live at Midlifecrisisville, AZ" probably isn't?

It's difficult but we cannot sleuth any of these players connected to the "cult". ZP, IP, MBP, MG, DW, JR, ES, HS, CP and others on the periphery like CP and JM. We can only discuss what becomes available in MSM or via LE. It does make it difficult.

 

[dixiegirl1035]

BBM

Moreover, she created an impression (purposely IMO) that her contact with LVD was limited to few visits until she moved.

From interview (SBM, BBM):

“Eaton: Did you visit Lori in Rexburg before you moved there?
Melani: I did I think on a weekend. My ex, Brandon Boudreaux, and I have 50/50 custody, and so anytime it wasn’t my time with my kids, I was a wreck and just missed my kids. I tried to go hike in Arizona or go on a trip, and I did go visit Lori for a weekend up there (in Rexburg). She said, “Just come. Try out somewhere new and come see if you like it up here.”
…
So if I saw Lori, she was still moving in and getting situated, so I didn’t spend a lot of time over there. I did see some of their things, and she had a room set up perfectly for Tylee and JJ, and it didn’t seem strange to me.
…
Eaton: There are going to be people that say when they get together with relatives, the talk instantly turns to our kids — soccer games, piano recitals, whatever. So when you actually would see her, did that sort of conversation ever come up? I could maybe understand a day or two but if you’re going on weeks, and you haven’t seen them, did you say, “Where’s JJ been?” – especially because he has special needs?
Melani Right. Yeah. So she would tell me things like, one of the neighbor boys next door, I forget his name, but she would tell me all his friends and how funny they were. JJ was very high energy, and sometimes he’d be in other people’s space, and I think sometimes that bothered some other people, so she would say, “These are the friends that are not judgmental, and they’ll just let JJ come in.” She said that he loved his school there.”

ETA: I guess HI trip would explain why she missed her divorce proceeding. This would also be an indication of her priorities (her own children vs being with LVD in HI)

Not one answer to a direct question!!!

Spin to the talking points she goes.....

What a waste, what a huge waste (yep, even our infamous Jodi Arias has a quote that targets this situation)

 

[indicolite22]

In all seriousness, how do we know they weren’t/aren’t part of Chad’s “cult”? If they were they’d be absolute morons to admit it

Because they explanied the differences in their beliefs and because Chad distanced himself from them (on AVOW) for fear of excommunication. Unlike him, they are very public about what they believe in. Timewise, they started diverging a while ago.