Found Deceased ID - Joshua Vallow, 7, & Tylee Ryan, 17, Rexburg, Sept 2019 *mom, stepfather found* #15

[utahobserver]

That’s awesome. Funny they had access to the gmail account tho, perhaps in his paranoia he shared the password?

Kay said that he had 3 common passwords, she got a hit on the first one. I think he truly trusted his sister

 

[Colorado303]

Travel can't be restricted until one is charged with a crime. We still have a Constitution.

If I’m not mistaken Government can place suspected terrorists on the no fly list based on suspicion alone. For all we know those big green totes housed explosives. Lori and Chad could be plotting to blow up a gov’t building. Or bring down an airliner and say the crash was a sign pointing to end of days. One could argue their distain for government and/or view of death and destruction in conjunction w/their religious beliefs isn’t all that dissimilar to some established terrorist groups. I’m not saying I believe that’s true but if I were a Judge I’d sign that order and sleep just fine.

 

[Minty Fresh]

Duplicate

 

[Minty Fresh]

Not impossible, but a lot more difficult. They need some concrete evidence of death, not just somebody's missing and we think they're dead.

That's why I think LE is taking the time to connect all the dots before moving in on an arrest. They're building their case.

 

[utahobserver]

That’s awesome. Funny they had access to the gmail account tho, perhaps in his paranoia he shared the password?

Kay said that he had 3 common passwords, she got a hit on the first one. I think he truly trusted his sister

I wonder: Under what circumstances - and when - do Federal LE get involved in cases like this? I know the FBI was involved in AZ... but were they running the show, or just providing resources? Obviously the FBI can't respond to every request made by every understaffed or resource-challenged PD and Sheriff's office in every small town in the country. Are the Feds involved in a more significant way in this case now? If not, shouldn't they be?

Given the complications of the case - with now at least 5 or 6 different (relatively small) jurisdictions involved - without some central and very capable and powerful task force providing resources and direction, it seems unlikely that murder or conspiracy charges will ever be brought.

After all, nobody in Chandler really (really) questioned CV's death at the time (maybe for good reason, idk). Nobody in Rexburg really (really) questioned TD's death at the time (maybe for good reason, idk). Nobody in Gilbert seems to have really (really) pursued taking AC into custody or questioning him in the BB shooting (though in my mind there certainly was PC to bring him in - in fact, BB had to hire a PI - but again, idk). And obviously, nobody really (really) questioned JR's manner of death at the time (which, given what we now know about AC...).

I'm not blaming local LE, just saying that now that we can look back and see the number of involved parties, possible crimes, and locations/jurisdictions, the scope of the overall investigation is unbelievably large and complicated. Just compare the potential number of parties, crimes, locations/jurisdictions, and the quantity of digital / IT / SM / technical evidence in this case with that of the Rhoden investigation in OH - an investigation many thought was mind-bogglingly complicated, and one which took several years to complete (the trials may take even longer than that).

The Salt Lake City FBI field office is consulting at the request of the Rexburg police. I'm not sure why. There are 4 resident agencies in Idaho. Could be because of forensic capabilities in SLC. The Utah Medical Examiner is handling toxicology for Tammy as well.

 

[nhmemorymaker]

I think it was here up-thread

Law enforcement officials have said that JJ and Tylee may never be found. There is a lot of evidence.

The storage unit was searched in November by police, there was plenty of information about when Lori goes to storage unit, heavy totes. Man struggling with totes. October 28th, a man puts a bike in storage unit, with Chad.

No totes in the storage unit. Dateline is going through the pictures and stuff in storage unit. Talking about the kids bikes. Ex wife of Alex talking, Tylee's Aunt asks for Lori to do the right thing. Last scene, is Lori and Chad going down an escalator, back to cameras. Lori is definitely not wearing any LDS temple garments, shorts and tank top.

That is all for this edition of "Dateline".

WTH? Where is the new information? Zip.

And all those commercials........they bamboozed everyone with their promo ads...guess they just thought they would be able to grab "newcomers' to all this... who knows.....maybe someone saw the show who didn't realize they knew more. To me this will be the main 'plus' for the Dateline nothing new.

 

[Onsdag]

Kay said that he had 3 common passwords, she got a hit on the first one. I think he truly trusted his sister

And for all that she's been doing for him and his family, I'd say that trust was well placed! Kay and Larry have been champions in this whole ordeal!

 

[BigAl16]

Not true. It's not impossible to prove a homicide without a corpse.

Correct, although obviously (and correctly) harder.

Murder conviction without a body - Wikipedia

 

[KonaHonu]

I'

That's why I think LE is taking the time to connect all the dots before moving in on an arrest. They're building their case.

I'm still hopeful the kids are safe and in hiding.

If they are there is no rush and there is a risk that they could come to harm if LE acts.

If they are dead there is no rush because C&L will eventually be caught. I would imagine if they tried to leave the country by air they would be stopped, just a guess. But as I said, in HNL you don't go through passport control on the way out. The airline just checks that you have a passport and the name matches your ticket. I am sure the feds would know if they bought international plane tickets and could stop them.

As much as I would like to know what is going on, I can understand why LE is in no hurry to act against L&C. While free they could lead LE to the kids through their contacts.

 

[divineappt]

It was mentioned that the reason for the quick marriages was because they all believed sex before marriage is wrong. I can buy that. But it would imply then that they actually had not been having sex before Nov 5 and hence were not technically having an affair. We can debate whether emotionally they were having an affair but that's not how we typical define an affair. If we did, plenty of people, religious or not, are having affairs with close friends of the opposite sex (or same sex) that they just have a close connection with.

I would not go so far as assuming that meant they did not have sex before marriage. There lives (if together) before that was secretive, not known to anyone but them and God. It would only be what was visible to family and followers when Tammy’s death allowed them to be together, that would matter. MOO

 

[nhmemorymaker]

Much of the same questions and answers as we've heard before. But it was interesting to me to pick up on some of the subtleties - facial expressions, the way answers were worded or given, insights about the community and how people are reacting to the case, etc. I think I learned a lot more about the case from seeing and hearing these subtleties, even if nothing new was shared, so I thought it was worthwhile. MOO.

And my takeaway was that none of these people are speaking out. This type of case brings out folks who want a bit of the limelight (this is really how I feel about CR), but no....none of these folks have stepped forward... pretty amazing control if you ask me..

 

[justice be served]

On one hand, it appears that LE has been somewhat slow to respond on this case but, on the other hand, the complexities of it and broad geography present so many difficulties. Monday morning quarterbacking is very easy and we surely know only a fraction of what investigators are working on. Particularly when it comes to missing juveniles, I know in my heart there are some dedicated professionals wading their way through this. But the frustration of knowing it has been almost five months of those two innocent children missing is just jarring. Why in the world can't Lori simply give a short video of them to prove they are alive?

 

[jjenny]

On one hand, it appears that LE has been somewhat slow to respond on this case but, on the other hand, the complexities of it and broad geography present so many difficulties. Monday morning quarterbacking is very easy and we surely know only a fraction of what investigators are working on. Particularly when it comes to missing juveniles, I know in my heart there are some dedicated professionals wading their way through this. But the frustration of knowing it has been almost five months of those two innocent children missing is just jarring. Why in the world can't Lori simply give a short video of them to prove they are alive?

You can only produce a video of them to prove they are alive if they are actually alive.

 

[nhmemorymaker]

I would not go so far as assuming that meant they did not have sex before marriage. There lives (if together) before that was secretive, not known to anyone but them and God. It would only be what was visible to family and followers when Tammy’s death allowed them to be together, that would matter. MOO

LDS followers have been wonderful contributors to certain beliefs, doctrines, disciplines that must influence some of the main characters. So I think their background is still guiding them with their crazy stuff. And more specifically believe it has even more to do with the "rules" of afterlife after the apocalypse. Wish we had some "former AVOW believers" chime in. It would really help.

 

[sgjsnow]

What if Lori wasn't an instructor - what if Lori took the same class? I found a Zumba class given at Tammy's school - Central Elementary on Wednesdays at 4PM. Seems like it would be open to anyone.... What if Chad told Lori where and when this class was?

There is a dance studio in Sugar City which neighbors Rexburg that offers adult Zumba and clogging classes. I assume that is most likely where Tammy was attending. MOO

 

[Minty Fresh]

You can only produce a video of them to prove they are alive if they are actually alive.

Right. That smug look on Lori's face seems to say that our concern for the safety of her children is funny because she's already ensured their place in the afterlife and we are mere mortals. MOO

 

[Onsdag]

The Salt Lake City FBI field office is consulting at the request of the Rexburg police. I'm not sure why. There are 4 resident agencies in Idaho. Could be because of forensic capabilities in SLC. The Utah Medical Examiner is handling toxicology for Tammy as well.

SBM.

Your comment just sparked a thought. I don't know if it's even feasible or not... I'm probably pretty far out in left field with this... And these are admittedly some pretty crazy questions... But is there any laws against crossing state lines to hide evidence of the commission of a crime in another state? Could Tammy's body be considered physical evidence if she's been found to have been poisoned? And the act of transporting her body from Idaho to Utah for burial could be considered as Chad trying to hide said evidence, making it harder for LE to investigate the commission of a crime? And would that advance jurisdiction from a local/county/state to a federal level because it's transporting criminal acts/things across state lines?

 

[divineappt]

What if Lori wasn't an instructor - what if Lori took the same class? I found a Zumba class given at Tammy's school - Central Elementary on Wednesdays at 4PM. Seems like it would be open to anyone.... What if Chad told Lori where and when this class was?

It’s obvious she knows how to spin a story! It’s even questionable if she even knows how to tell the truth! MOO

 

[Portiz34]

I have a question, if you are LDS dont you attend the nearest ward? Hanalei would be closer to them if they are/were in Princeville, why wouldnt they go to that one?

 

[KonaHonu]

On one hand, it appears that LE has been somewhat slow to respond on this case but, on the other hand, the complexities of it and broad geography present so many difficulties. Monday morning quarterbacking is very easy and we surely know only a fraction of what investigators are working on. Particularly when it comes to missing juveniles, I know in my heart there are some dedicated professionals wading their way through this. But the frustration of knowing it has been almost five months of those two innocent children missing is just jarring. Why in the world can't Lori simply give a short video of them to prove they are alive?

I agree. And there is likely a mountain of information LE has access to - cell records, traffic cams, and far more, possibly even AVOW insiders if this group had raised any red flags before. But a mountain of information does not necessarily mean it is useful. We've been able to piece together their movements almost daily. We probably have a few errors but I think Gardeners timeline is substantially correct. But it still doesn't tell anyone where the kids are. And the evidence for murder is pretty sparse. And even if the autopsies reveal poison, there is still scant evidence for who gave it.