If Misty were to lead LE to Haleigh....

[Emeralgem]

This is a great discussion. Y'all have raised some interesting questions and made good points. I think that guy Brown, the PI who worked for Tommy's lawyer, was talking to Tommy and Misty, if not directly then through their lawyers. I wonder if that's how Misty found out about the search. IDK.

I'm looking over notes from the phone calls between Tommy and his parents around the time of the search. Remember when Tommy told H and L that Joe was going to be arrested, and Joe had a knife to his throat when he saw Haleigh in the van. I'm pretty sure that was the week before the search. Tommy was sure Joe's arrest was imminent. He didn't expect them to search the dock at that point. The tapes aren't in sequence, so it's hard to tell the dates. Anyway, at one point Tommy mentions Brown and that everything is confidential with him. He also says his lawyer is going to meet with Misty "about something" on Monday. Brown also claimed to be the guy who solved the case.

LOL..Wonder if he got the memo stating he didn't solve anything..JMHO

 

[bessie]

LOL..Wonder if he got the memo stating he didn't solve anything..JMHO

I forgot to put the behind that last statement, Em. I don't think he cracked the case, but he might've screwed it up a bit.

 

[bessie]

actually, I've been thinking a lot about Steve Brown lately. maybe because Joe seems to be in the clear, (at least for now), & Misty's pointing at Tommy. All of this has made me wonder exactly how Brown, who was working for Crystal, got mixed up with Werter & Tommy. Honestly, I think if there was an overlooked detail in an LDT, Tommy freaked because he knew it pointed to him, so he either swapped roles with Joe, or added him, to his own doings. MOO. & As for Misty giving GGS a heads up, I just thought she was letting them know because they were Haleigh's family, & she knew they'd want to know. If LE didn't want her blabbing, they should've monitored her calls a little closer.

I question the relationship between Werter and Brown. There seems to be a conflict of interest, and I can't imagine any honest attorney allowing his client to talk to a PI who for months worked for another party involved in the same case with an opposing position. Seems irregular. I'm going to take another look at the situation leading up to the dock search. In the tapes, you hear Tommy talk about how much he trusts Brown, and everything is confidential with him. And he says Werter has talked to him about putting his life in order and going back to school; and Werter was going to explain everything to Lindsy. One day, he's certain that Joe's going to be arrested, and he's going to be cleared, and the next thing you know, he's said to have failed a LDT and becomes a main POI. That's got stink all over it, IMO.

I think this guy Brown is full of it, and I wouldn't be at all surprised if Misty learned of the dock search through him. No matter how she found out, it's interesting that she felt inclined to let GGS and TN know. And why in the world did they feel inclined to snoop around before LE got there? Do we know if GGS and TN knew what time the search would begin? Perhaps they thought the search was going on during the day, and would already be in progres when they arrived.

 

[suspicious1]

This is a great discussion. Y'all have raised some interesting questions and made good points. I think that guy Brown, the PI who worked for Tommy's lawyer, was talking to Tommy and Misty, if not directly then through their lawyers. I wonder if that's how Misty found out about the search. IDK.

I'm looking over notes from the phone calls between Tommy and his parents around the time of the search. Remember when Tommy told H and L that Joe was going to be arrested, and Joe had a knife to his throat when he saw Haleigh in the van. I'm pretty sure that was the week before the search. Tommy was sure Joe's arrest was imminent. He didn't expect them to search the dock at that point. The tapes aren't in sequence, so it's hard to tell the dates. Anyway, at one point Tommy mentions Brown and that everything is confidential with him. He also says his lawyer is going to meet with Misty "about something" on Monday. Brown also claimed to be the guy who solved the case.

About Steve Brown...it could be possible that either Misty or her lawyer found out through him....WTH did this Steve guy come from? It's like he just dropped down out the sky and said "I solved the case". LOL I know he was supposedly working for Crystal...but that whole situation just confuses me...

Tommy seemed somewhat surprised that LE were searching that dock...I wonder why?

 

[suspicious1]

I question the relationship between Werter and Brown. There seems to be a conflict of interest, and I can't imagine any honest attorney allowing his client to talk to a PI who for months worked for another party involved in the same case with an opposing position. Seems irregular. I'm going to take another look at the situation leading up to the dock search. In the tapes, you hear Tommy talk about how much he trusts Brown, and everything is confidential with him. And he says Werter has talked to him about putting his life in order and going back to school; and Werter was going to explain everything to Lindsy. One day, he's certain that Joe's going to be arrested, and he's going to be cleared, and the next thing you know, he's said to have failed a LDT and becomes a main POI. That's got stink all over it, IMO.

I think this guy Brown is full of it, and I wouldn't be at all surprised if Misty learned of the dock search through him. No matter how she found out, it's interesting that she felt inclined to let GGS and TN know. And why in the world did they feel inclined to snoop around before LE got there? Do we know if GGS and TN knew what time the search would begin? Perhaps they thought the search was going on during the day, and would already be in progres when they arrived.

BBM
That does seem a little weird...Do we know for a fact that STeve Brown was working for Crystal? or had he been hired by Kim P? I would image that if he was hired by her attorney....when Crystal stop working with Kim P...would that mean Steve Brown no longer worked for her? How does that work?

You raised a good point, Bes...perhaps GMSykes and Teresa thought the search was going on during the day and would already be in progress when they arrived....that's possible...but then that makes me wonder.....when they arrived and saw that LE was not there.....did they say "oh well since no one is here, let's just look around and see if "we" find anything...." Everyone knows how much Misty lies....why not think that Misty had just given them wrong information? Unless they knew that Misty would NOT lie to them.....

 

[lil momma]

just jumping in here.....

My opinion on the matter is that (maybe i am hoping more then anything) it was a set up by LE, just like the drug bust. I think LE told someone, who told Misty and they wanted to see where Misty sent that information to. When the ladies (i know, silly word to describe these two..lol) arrived at the dock, i betcha there were cops watching, b/c they wanted to see who was going to show up and what they were going to do. IOW, if TN and GGS would have picked something up and walked off with it, what would LE do? Would it be considered a crime scene yet, as it wasn't searched by LE at this point, but what would the LE do, if they actually witnessed TN and GGS pick something up and remove it from that area?

I am not sure anymore, LE should just round em all up, put them in a room together, and LISTEN to what is / is not being said. let them sweat it out a bit. someone would slip up and maybe give that one piece that would break this case wide open.

I am trying to keep this word in the back of my mind, b/c this is exactly how they all are.. learned this from my Dad!

KISS = Keep It Simple Stupid

JMO

 

[Crosby87]

I have a feeling/opinion..the LE know...all about Ron.....

He still ...IMO...has not been cleared...all in my own opinion...

JVM reported on April 21,2010 LE checked Ron's phone records and they believe he has absolutely nothing to do with this.

<snipped> April 21, 2010

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Now, I want to stress again that law enforcement has said that Ron Cummings is not a suspect. They have investigated. They`ve cleared him. They`ve said they`ve checked his phone records, they`ve checked everything, and they really believe he has absolutely nothing to do with this.

Haleigh Cummings: Flora Hollars Weighs In On Her Grandchildren on JVM - Crimeseekers


<snipped> April 21, 2010

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Yes. Because I think you`re saying that Ron may have at least some knowledge of what happened, even though I have to stress investigators have cleared him as a suspect.

http://archives.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1004/21/ijvm.01.html


<snipped> August 20, 2010

RON CUMMINGS, FATHER OF HALEIGH: They told me that their main focus is not one of putting me in jail but finding Haleigh. They already know I know nothing else about Haleigh`s disappearance. Nothing else, otherwise I`d already been in DOC.

JEFF BROWN, CRIMINAL DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Yes. There`s charges such as aiding and abetting. There`s a federal charge called misprison (ph) of a felony in which you don`t report a crime that you know to have occurred.

But to say that Ronald Cummings is not a suspect, I have to disagree with Art. State attorneys and prosecutors are always cutting deals with people that are involved maybe to a lesser degree, but that`s the nature of the game. They cut deals with people, because they need certain gaps of evidence filled.

So just because he signed -- he did a plea agreement, and he`s willing to testify against others doesn`t mean that there isn`t some responsibility on his part criminally. They may have already cut a deal with him for that.

http://archives.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1008/20/ijvm.01.html

 

[Crosby87]

bolded by me...

<snipped BM>

If Ron was seen the next day in the jumpsuit and Junior was there also...wouldn't Junior have recognized Ron as the one he saw???......
When they all went to the police station the next day, weren't they all together..Misty Ron and Junior????...then they separated Junior??

questions...not many answers

MO is when Ron entered the bedroom he purposely walked in sideways so his back would be facing Junior and Misty. There is no reason why Ron would walk straight into the bedroom and risk exposing himself to those sleeping in the big bed. The reason Junior didn&#8217;t recognize his father was because Ron never turned and faced the bed. He walked into the room with his back facing JR and Misty, he bent down to pick up HaLeigh and he walked out sideways.

Maybe that's the reason Ron placed HaLeigh's mattress there. It does serve a purpose for being in that location.

Anyways a child predator does not want to be recognized and AFAIK, most predators act alone and keep their intentions secret. Ron does not like people sticking their nose in his personal life.

 

[Baznme]

JVM reported on April 21,2010 LE checked Ron's phone records and they believe he has absolutely nothing to do with this.

<snipped> April 21, 2010

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Now, I want to stress again that law enforcement has said that Ron Cummings is not a suspect. They have investigated. They`ve cleared him. They`ve said they`ve checked his phone records, they`ve checked everything, and they really believe he has absolutely nothing to do with this.

Haleigh Cummings: Flora Hollars Weighs In On Her Grandchildren on JVM - Crimeseekers


<snipped> April 21, 2010

VELEZ-MITCHELL: Yes. Because I think you`re saying that Ron may have at least some knowledge of what happened, even though I have to stress investigators have cleared him as a suspect.

http://archives.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1004/21/ijvm.01.html


<snipped> August 20, 2010

RON CUMMINGS, FATHER OF HALEIGH: They told me that their main focus is not one of putting me in jail but finding Haleigh. They already know I know nothing else about Haleigh`s disappearance. Nothing else, otherwise I`d already been in DOC.

JEFF BROWN, CRIMINAL DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Yes. There`s charges such as aiding and abetting. There`s a federal charge called misprison (ph) of a felony in which you don`t report a crime that you know to have occurred.

But to say that Ronald Cummings is not a suspect, I have to disagree with Art. State attorneys and prosecutors are always cutting deals with people that are involved maybe to a lesser degree, but that`s the nature of the game. They cut deals with people, because they need certain gaps of evidence filled.

So just because he signed -- he did a plea agreement, and he`s willing to testify against others doesn`t mean that there isn`t some responsibility on his part criminally. They may have already cut a deal with him for that.

http://archives.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1008/20/ijvm.01.html

I think we have to consider that looking at someone as a "suspect" as opposed to "a person of interest" are two different things. A person of interest may or may not have info related to a crime or incident. A suspect is someone they have reason to believe are directly or indirectly involved. That's my take on it and I believe LE uses these terms carefully. We don't know what kind of deals RC's made with LE but it's my suspicion is that whatever those may be are for the purpose of coming to a solid conclusion to Haleigh's case when or if someone breaks.

 

[Crosby87]

I know my answer is a repeat but I'm saying it again: I want to see the dang video of Ron stopping by the convenience store to buy beer and nuts. I want to see what Ron is wearing..............I really, really do.

Didn't LE ever reveal whose fingerprints were found on the cinderblock? If the person who placed it there wore gloves would they be able to conceal their fingerprints? Common sense says yes. I bet Ron wore gloves at work.

<snipped>

Officers also were looking at a cinder block that apparently had been used to prop open the back door, according to officers.

http://www.gainesville.com/article/20090211/ARTICLES/902111012/1002/NEWS01?p=4&tc=pg


<snipped>

The Putnam County Sheriff's Office says a rear door to the trailer was found open. The girl's father, Ronald Cummings, told First Coast News the door was forced open.

Investigators said there's no sign that someone forced their way into the home, but they did find a door open.

http://www.firstcoastnews.com/news/local/news-article.aspx?storyid=131034&catid=3

http://www.wftv.com/news/18689215/detail.html


Why did Ron say HaLeigh was abducted from his bed? That makes no sense since Jr and Misty were sleeping there. Later Ron told investigators his bed wasn't slept in. This guy must by lying to protect himself. No wonder Misty gave conflicting stories about where HaLeigh was sleeping. Ron said HaLeigh was sleeping in his bed when she was snatched. Yeah right Ron, who are you trying to fool?

<snipped>

"Somebody stole my child out of my bed. I came home from work, and my child was not there. That's it. That's all there was to it," Haleigh's father said. "Gone -- just like that."

http://www.news4jax.com/news/18690324/detail.html

 

[my_tee_mouse]

Why did Ron say HaLeigh was abducted from his bed? That makes no sense since Jr and Misty were sleeping there. Later Ron told investigators his bed wasn't slept in. This guy must by lying to protect himself. No wonder Misty gave conflicting stories about where HaLeigh was sleeping. Ron said HaLeigh was sleeping in his bed when she was snatched. Yeah right Ron, who are you trying to fool?

Did Misty herself not first say that Haleigh was in the same bed with her? If that is the case, why are we faulting RC for repeating what he, along with the rest of us, was first told? Since we have all, at one time or another, repeated some of Misty's later versions of events, does that make us all suspects?

 

[kant]

Did Misty herself not first say that Haleigh was in the same bed with her? If that is the case, why are we faulting RC for repeating what he, along with the rest of us, was first told? Since we have all, at one time or another, repeated some of Misty's later versions of events, does that make us all suspects?

I see what you're saying.

However, I'm confused as to how RC would know anything of who was where and when and in what bed with whom with what covers or no covers or under the covers with the bed that was positioned this and that many inches away from the mattress..... unless he was there.

But... no, what am I saying?

...He was at work.

 

[Emeralgem]

Did Misty herself not first say that Haleigh was in the same bed with her? If that is the case, why are we faulting RC for repeating what he, along with the rest of us, was first told? Since we have all, at one time or another, repeated some of Misty's later versions of events, does that make us all suspects?

Problem as I see it Ron C is being faulted due to the fact within 24 hours after the 911 call was made Ronald Cummings stated on NG's show Haleigh was abducted from his bed..Of course he changed the story when he and Misty were inteviewed by GVS three days later and claimed she was sleeping on her toddler mattress and even proclaimed to high heaven he knew exactly where those beds were located that night.. eventhough he claims he was at work..
That all took place in February, now lets see what he said on the NG show on March 16 when he was asked HOW the story got so bassackwards..
In this video you can tell he is setting up Misty to take tha fall...And they had only been married for five days...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=83RvM4gXrOU


Now, lets move forward to August 2009. when Ronald Cummings and his family started revving up that bus to run over Misty and the Croslins...
After Misty's LVA Ronald Cummings stated to Tim Miller the bed was never slept in that night.
One question..IF when he supposedly got home from work the morning of February10, 2009 at 3:27 and noticed the bed was never slept in that night WHY in the HELL-O didn't he say so at that time instead of waiting over six months later to say anything...Does his inconsistencies, manipulative tactics and his lies make him a suspect? In my book...YES....JMHO

 

[lil momma]

I see what you're saying.

However, I'm confused as to how RC would know anything of who was where and when and in what bed with whom with what covers or no covers or under the covers with the bed that was positioned this and that many inches away from the mattress..... unless he was there.

But... no, what am I saying?

...He was at work.

ITA kant! the thing about Ron that makes me angry is when it is convenient for him to answer the question he does, when he feels threatend by a question his reply has always been "i don't know, i was at work" that just makes me so :furious: :furious:

how very convenient for Mr. Cummings

JMO

 

[Emeralgem]

I see what you're saying.

However, I'm confused as to how RC would know anything of who was where and when and in what bed with whom with what covers or no covers or under the covers with the bed that was positioned this and that many inches away from the mattress..... unless he was there.
But... no, what am I saying?

...He was at work.

Plain and simple... He was orchestrating, directing and controlling everything that needed to be done and writing the script in reference to everything that needed to be said and told..JMHO

 

[dodie20]

Problem as I see it Ron C is being faulted due to the fact within 24 hours after the 911 call was made Ronald Cummings stated on NG's show Haleigh was abducted from his bed..Of course he changed the story when he and Misty were inteviewed by GVS three days later and claimed she was sleeping on her toddler mattress and even proclaimed to high heaven he knew exactly where those beds were located that night.. eventhough he claims he was at work..
That all took place in February, now lets see what he said on the NG show on March 16 when he was asked HOW the story got so bassackwards..
In this video you can tell he is setting up Misty to take tha fall...And they had only been married for five days...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=83RvM4gXrOU


Now, lets move forward to August 2009. when Ronald Cummings and his family started revving up that bus to run over Misty and the Croslins...
After Misty's LVA Ronald Cummings stated to Tim Miller the bed was never slept in that night.
One question..IF when he supposedly got home from work the morning of February10, 2009 at 3:27 and noticed the bed was never slept in that night WHY in the HELL-O didn't he say so at that time instead of waiting over six months later to say anything...Does his inconsistencies, manipulative tactics and his lies make him a suspect? In my book...YES....JMHO

You're right about his inconsistencies. An innocent man wouldn't have a need to change his story...unless he was covering for someone else. & I don't think Ron, covering for Misty can be ruled out. (at least from what we know). I wouldn't necessarily understand that, but women do it for boyfriends all of the time, so it is a possibility.

 

[justus4all]

IF TRUE......That Ron picked up Haleigh that day at the bus stop...

I believe that whoever was in the car with Ron....the day he picked up Haleigh at the bus stop.....was the one babysitting the kids....and if wasn't Misty....then WHO WAS IT????? WHO WOULD IT HAVE BEEN...???? go down the list...imo

 

[my_tee_mouse]

Problem as I see it Ron C is being faulted due to the fact within 24 hours after the 911 call was made Ronald Cummings stated on NG's show Haleigh was abducted from his bed..Of course he changed the story when he and Misty were inteviewed by GVS three days later and claimed she was sleeping on her toddler mattress and even proclaimed to high heaven he knew exactly where those beds were located that night.. eventhough he claims he was at work..
That all took place in February, now lets see what he said on the NG show on March 16 when he was asked HOW the story got so bassackwards..
In this video you can tell he is setting up Misty to take tha fall...And they had only been married for five days...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=83RvM4gXrOU


Now, lets move forward to August 2009. when Ronald Cummings and his family started revving up that bus to run over Misty and the Croslins...
After Misty's LVA Ronald Cummings stated to Tim Miller the bed was never slept in that night.
One question..IF when he supposedly got home from work the morning of February10, 2009 at 3:27 and noticed the bed was never slept in that night WHY in the HELL-O didn't he say so at that time instead of waiting over six months later to say anything...Does his inconsistencies, manipulative tactics and his lies make him a suspect? In my book...YES....JMHO

I still don't see where anything you've mentioned supports him actually knowing where anyone slept as opposed to him parroting what Misty told him and then retold him and everyone else. You see this as proof that he orchestrated everything. I see it as an indication that he believed everything Misty was telling him until he learned otherwise from LE or other sources.

 

[dodie20]

I still don't see where anything you've mentioned supports him actually knowing where anyone slept as opposed to him parroting what Misty told him and then retold him and everyone else. You see this as proof that he orchestrated everything. I see it as an indication that he believed everything Misty was telling him until he learned otherwise from LE or other sources.

Well, if Misty changed her story, why didn't he say, 'Woa, back up here'. That should've made him hightail it away from her & take his suspicions to the cops. but he did the opposite. married her & cut off cooperation with LE. I don't think Ron is gullible or stupid.

 

[dodie20]

I question the relationship between Werter and Brown. There seems to be a conflict of interest, and I can't imagine any honest attorney allowing his client to talk to a PI who for months worked for another party involved in the same case with an opposing position. Seems irregular. I'm going to take another look at the situation leading up to the dock search. In the tapes, you hear Tommy talk about how much he trusts Brown, and everything is confidential with him. And he says Werter has talked to him about putting his life in order and going back to school; and Werter was going to explain everything to Lindsy. One day, he's certain that Joe's going to be arrested, and he's going to be cleared, and the next thing you know, he's said to have failed a LDT and becomes a main POI. That's got stink all over it, IMO.

I think this guy Brown is full of it, and I wouldn't be at all surprised if Misty learned of the dock search through him. No matter how she found out, it's interesting that she felt inclined to let GGS and TN know. And why in the world did they feel inclined to snoop around before LE got there? Do we know if GGS and TN knew what time the search would begin? Perhaps they thought the search was going on during the day, and would already be in progres when they arrived.

I too question why Werter seemed so eager to join forces with Brown, because there doesn't seem to have been anything it it for Tommy...except an attempt to divert attention from himself to Joe? I don't think Werter is crooked. Actually, I think he's the exact opposite, but I could see him falling for an underhanded trick, if he thought it was on the up & up, & would help solve the case. I'm not convinced that Brown wasn't 'working' for LE. If he wasn't, he sure inserted himself in a big way, & would LE just let somebody waltz in & interfere like that? There was so much information coming out & so much activity going on, & then the horror of the stories kind of diverted attention from what may have been going on behind the scenes.