If you believe the Ramsey's did it please answer this for me...

[s_finch]

Again, I'd like to ask, what is the "melatonin tablet". Also, someone on here (can't find it now) said Patsy had Pam remove John's golf clubs?? Is there a link for that?? Who in the world would be worried about golf clubs at such a time!! Unless of course they were used in the commission of the crime.

 

[newtv]

Again, I'd like to ask, what is the "melatonin tablet". Also, someone on here (can't find it now) said Patsy had Pam remove John's golf clubs?? Is there a link for that?? Who in the world would be worried about golf clubs at such a time!! Unless of course they were used in the commission of the crime.

i think it aids sleeping naturally or is a natural antidepressant?
i think.

 

[LinasK]

i think it aids sleeping naturally or is a natural antidepressant?
i think.

Melatonin is a hormone the body produces to regulate your sleep clock, like when you have jet lag. I take it occasionally when I have insomnia. It's also the pigment found in your skin when you tan/freckle.

 

[s_finch]

THanks Newtv and LinasK. I was referring to the quote by Trex that said:

I always thought the "Melatonin tablet" John mentioned was a tacit agreement between him and Patsy that he wasn't responsible for what happened during the night.

Is there somewhere that John used the phrase "melatonin tablet"?? TIA

 

[southcitymom]

THanks Newtv and LinasK. I was referring to the quote by Trex that said:

Is there somewhere that John used the phrase "melatonis tablet"?? TIA

I believe he says it in his first statement to the investigators in Boulder.

 

[Jolynna]

"the other thing with the pineapple-who's to say that she didnt get up and feed it to herself?"

Patsy said in one of her interviews that Jonbenet could not reach where they kept the pineapple on her own.

 

[Jolynna]

"My point had nothing to do with being able to predict that people who have problems will become murderers or who will snap....just that murdering mothers will have a history of problems...."


I think there WERE signs of problems.

Both Jonbenet and BURKE wet their beds according to the housekeeper. The housekeeper said that the bedwetting was getting worse, not better.

JonBenet also soiled herself regularly.

JonBenet also continued to need a bottle until after she was 4 years old.

 

[icedtea4me]

Melatonin is a hormone the body produces to regulate your sleep clock, like when you have jet lag. I take it occasionally when I have insomnia. It's also the pigment found in your skin when you tan/freckle.

The other one is melanonin, not melatonin. The two words are very similar, aren't they?


-Tea

 

[T-Rex]

Here's one link to JR talking about taking Melatonin. It's something you'd get at the health food store, and some people take it to fight jet lat. JR used it as an explanation for sleeping really soundly.
http://thewebsafe.tripod.com/03202000ramseytodaypt1.htm

 

[Jolynna]

Among the neighbor's interviewed:

Dog That Didn't Bark. "A third neighbour, to the West, said that her dogs who barked at anyone in the alley, just as they did when the police came to question her, made no noise Wednesday night." [Note: Wednesday refers to the night of Christmas, i.e., the night JBR died] (Thomas 2000a:49).

 

[Maybe So]

I get what you're trying to say and it's been a sore spot for me too. In most of the cases I've read about where a mother kills her child/ren, even if there weren't obvious signs prior to the murder, after the fact people close to the individual who look back and more closely analyze their behavior, find red flags that weren't interpreted as red flags at the time. Or perhaps in hindsight a motive (boyfriend doesn't want woman w/kids) comes to light.
In order to really believe it was Patsy, I want to hear SOMETHING ANYTHING that indicates that she was at the end of her ropes and not coping well. I want someone to come forward and say that Patsy had a hot temper, even if that person never thought it crossed the line into abuse. I want to hear SOMETHING that indicates that Patsy could be capable of defiling her daughter's poor damaged body even as a staging attempt because IMO it's one thing for a mother to shut her eyes and shoot or drive her car into a lake and another to have the capacity to savage your child's body after an accident *even to save yourself*. It's about degree not ability - she may have had the ability to kill probably accidentally, but the ability to do the multiple brutal things that were done to that little girl is a whole other realm of evil. That takes a sadist not simply someone who has the ability to fly into a momentary rage. So I do understand what you're saying. What makes it so hard to hang this on Patsy is *the degree of the brutality involved*.

I'm still so confused about this case myself. I've never thought it was the Ramsey's and after reading here, I'm now swaying from "they couldn't have" to "maybe they did". Everyone's got such valid points to make on both sides, it seems impossible to come to a firm conclusion.

Hey, I hear ya. Exactly how I feel about the case is what you just wrote. And I too have a "maybe they did" attitude most of the time....but something just doesn't add up for me and it bugs me to not be able to figure it out.

I cannot see either of them covering for the other without horrible resentment for the rest of their lives and I can't see them covering for Burke..not in is such a brutal way....after all even they must have known that someday Burke would read about the horrible way JBRs body was abused for the staging and how that would affect him. If Burke killed her he would have felt some sort of guilt and when he heard the other things done to her body I can imagine that it would be horribly disturbing to him to know that his parents did those things to his sister on his behalf. I can't imagine they would not have thought about that.

 

[lovebites]

Hey, I hear ya. Exactly how I feel about the case is what you just wrote. And I too have a "maybe they did" attitude most of the time....but something just doesn't add up for me and it bugs me to not be able to figure it out.

I cannot see either of them covering for the other without horrible resentment for the rest of their lives and I can't see them covering for Burke..not in is such a brutal way....after all even they must have known that someday Burke would read about the horrible way JBRs body was abused for the staging and how that would affect him. If Burke killed her he would have felt some sort of guilt and when he heard the other things done to her body I can imagine that it would be horribly disturbing to him to know that his parents did those things to his sister on his behalf. I can't imagine they would not have thought about that.

You're echoing my thoughts too. The only way I can even possibly conceive of the Ramsey's being involved, and I've never been willing to consider it until reading here, is if they were protecting another of their children. IMO that would be the ONLY way they'd cover for one another because I believe as you do - that it's so unlikely that John and Patsy would have covered for the other. I do believe that they truly loved JonBenet and wouldn't be able to forgive the other for her death. I feel guilty for starting to think of the various possible scenarios involving Burke, but it would explain the fervent cover up by his parents to protect him.
What I can imagine is he and JonBenet waiting until both parents are in bed so they can get up and keep playing with their new toys - they must be excited and have had very little time with their new gadgets as they were whisked away to go visiting. So they get up and are playing and at some point they go to the kitchen to get a snack - Burke reaches the pineapple for JonBenet that she couldn't reach and also makes himself a cup of tea. As they sit and snack and giggle. Perhaps, as kids do, JonBenet got up and playfully made a move to run, telling Burke that she was going to go "touch" his Nintendo. If their was an object nearby (maybe the flashlight) he could have picked it up saying "don't you dare or I'll hit you with it" and in the excitement of the moment she lunges in the direction of his toy and he, without even thinking, reacts and ends up really whacking her. This would truly be an accident - God I've seen kids do that exact same thing many times in innocent playfulness, except in this case there were deadly consequences with the use of the object that struck JonBenet.
I've talked about other scenarios, but in truth this is the one I lean toward whenever I entertain the RDI theory. Patsy and John convinced that JonBenet was already dead - staged the rest as convincingly as they could (with their limited knowledge of such things) in an effort to spare their son. Willing to do anything it took to at least keep him safe from what was to ensue. Maybe they didn't know he couldn't be convicted.
It's such a strange case.

 

[newtv]

Melatonin is a hormone the body produces to regulate your sleep clock, like when you have jet lag. I take it occasionally when I have insomnia. It's also the pigment found in your skin when you tan/freckle.

thats what i said-its used for sleeping-often prescribed by doctors who have clients on meds that cause insomnia or for people with mild depression who wake up in the night-i dont resonate with the jet lag but i am sure its used to help the person sleep -anyhow
I have used it as well- and i did not find it worked-it sure didnt knock me out or make me drowsy-it had no effect.
I do not believe it works the same way in all people.

 

[BBB167893]

"the other thing with the pineapple-who's to say that she didnt get up and feed it to herself?"

Patsy, that's who! She said JonBenet couldn't reach the tabletop. And only her prints and Burke's prints were found on the bowl.

 

[julianne]

I know I'll catch hell for this, but there is evidence that she (Patsy) was molested as a child and that she was having problems with her perscriptions.

.

SuperDave,

Can you direct me to this evidence that shows that Patsy was molested as a child? And the evidence that shows she was having problems with her prescriptions? "Problems" is very vague...what "problems" specifically?

 

[BBB167893]

Okay, julianne. Now, mind you, this is nothing concrete, but on a visceral level, it rings a few bells. I should have said that in the first place, but I didn't. That fault is mine.

But here goes:

During the '98 interviews, Haney asks her flat-out if she was molested. She says no, but her physical reaction is troubling. Up to this point, she's been a spitting cat ready to fight. But all the spirit goes out of her. She cringes, shrinking back into the chair, her voice barely audible. She has become a child again, pleading for mercy.

Also, her father was always very strong in her life. He even lived in Boulder for a while with Nedra back in Georgia. Something odd about that to you?

Jamie Turndorf is a therapist. She said that Patsy had sexual issues she had never faced and that she was trying to resolve through JonBenet by turning her into a sex object.

Also, if you watch some of her interviews, she's very clearly not in the best of shape. She sways, slurs her words, and looks like she can barely stay awake. Something's wrong there. Very wrong.