Deceased/Not Found IL - Yingying Zhang, 26, Urbana, 9 June 2017 #10 *Still Missing*

[dm92]

off topic, kinda
The Root of All Cruelty?

As a case study of misogyny, Manne considers strangulation—almost always performed by men on female intimate partners—which she describes as “a demonstration of authority and domination,” a form of torture that often leaves no marks.

The limitations of the dehumanization thesis are hardly good news. There has always been something optimistic about the idea that our worst acts of inhumanity are based on confusion. It suggests that we could make the world better simply by having a clearer grasp of reality—by deactivating those brain implants, or their ideological equivalent. The truth may be harder to accept: that our best and our worst tendencies arise precisely from seeing others as human.


(I'm wondering about the mental state and mood of BC while he engaged in killing YY. was he enraged, strategic or cold?)

FWIW, when I watched the closing arguments on Monday, Miller described BC's strangulation of YY as torture.

Also, rape/sexual assault, IIRC, is not one of the ~16 statutory aggravators listed that elevate a federal offense to death penalty eligibility. However, I know many governmental bodies/NGOs define rape as a form of torture, so I will not be surprised if the government will argue to the jury that BC tortured YY by rape and by strangulation.

 

[kittythehare]

FWIW, when I watched the closing arguments on Monday, Miller described BC's strangulation of YY as torture.

Also, rape/sexual assault, IIRC, is not one of the ~16 statutory aggravators listed that elevate a federal offense to death penalty eligibility. However, I know many governmental bodies/NGOs define rape as a form of torture, so I will not be surprised if the government will argue to the jury that BC tortured YY by rape and by strangulation.

I think they can do more here.
Neither rape nor strangulation will necessarily lead to blood loss. (YY was menstruating)
There is evidence of blood loss, we just do not know quantity.

 

[kittythehare]

Yes that was me that asked that. I understand the confidentiality side but in this instance they were in the midst of plea negotiations. For an attorney to be able to represent someone, the client must be honest and tell them everything. So that is why I am asking this. Has he told them everything?

Eg. What if her body is complete and just buried somewhere? Easily retrievable.

I have a feeling he has not told them everywhere and if her body is ever discovered it may well well show evidence of far more extreme torture than he has ever discussed with anyone.

 

[Laughing]

I have a feeling he has not told them everywhere and if her body is ever discovered it may well well show evidence of far more extreme torture than he has ever discussed with anyone.

Sorry, somewhat graphic: very day, every hour, means less soft tissue, so less evidence

BTW, where did you pick up information about her monthly cycle? Or was that a guess?

JMHO YMMV

RIP, Ms. Zhang

 

[kittythehare]

Sorry, somewhat graphic: very day, every hour, means less soft tissue, so less evidence

BTW, where did you pick up information about her monthly cycle? Or was that a guess?

JMHO YMMV

RIP, Ms. Zhang

not a guess.
In evidence, first day of trial, a description of used sanitary appliance in dustbin in her apartment.

 

[Laughing]

not a guess.
In evidence, first day of trial, a description of used sanitary appliance in dustbin in her apartment.

Thank you! Specifically for that, and generally for reading-for-detail in all the posted documents, and for posting everything you find about this case.

Best, Laughing

 

[Raptors001]

I wonder if he has a belief that by withholding the location of her remains tht he can somehow prove innocence? Is he that insane?
I wonder whether he will say in relation to the dNA evidence that it was michelle who killed her, really?
Down the line, in many years time after years of legal research is he likely to come up with something as strange as that?
It won't wash but just looking at that building and facilities makes me wonder how he will entertain himself?

from your link
https://www.bop.gov/policy/progstat/1315_007.pdf

He kidnapped yyz. So for sure guilty of murder accomplice if Michelle did it. I always suspect she was part of the murder. She jealous of girls that is more beautiful than her is my opinion.

Read up Paul bearnado and Karla homalka

 

[Raptors001]

not a guess.
In evidence, first day of trial, a description of used sanitary appliance in dustbin in her apartment.

Interesting info

 

[kittythehare]

He kidnapped yyz. So for sure guilty of murder accomplice if Michelle did it. I always suspect she was part of the murder. She jealous of girls that is more beautiful than her is my opinion.

Read up Paul bearnado and Karla homalka

There is NO evidence connecting Michelle to any of his deeds and reading anything will not prove otherwise.
Nor is there any evidence of her jealousy. Why even pursue this train of thought?
There's plenty to read about BC's actual doings and sayings without adding an entirely new killer.

 

[Raptors001]

off topic, kinda
The Root of All Cruelty?

As a case study of misogyny, Manne considers strangulation—almost always performed by men on female intimate partners—which she describes as “a demonstration of authority and domination,” a form of torture that often leaves no marks.

The limitations of the dehumanization thesis are hardly good news. There has always been something optimistic about the idea that our worst acts of inhumanity are based on confusion. It suggests that we could make the world better simply by having a clearer grasp of reality—by deactivating those brain implants, or their ideological equivalent. The truth may be harder to accept: that our best and our worst tendencies arise precisely from seeing others as human.


(I'm wondering about the mental state and mood of BC while he engaged in killing YY. was he enraged, strategic or cold?)

Cold is my opinion.not human thing to do.

 

[Webthrush]

He kidnapped yyz. So for sure guilty of murder accomplice if Michelle did it. I always suspect she was part of the murder. She jealous of girls that is more beautiful than her is my opinion.

Read up Paul bearnado and Karla homalka

Pretty certain it’s against the terms of service here to even make such an accusation, especially since there’s NO evidence whatsoever of MZ’s involvement, nor of YY even being alive when MZ arrived back in town on Mon. (unless you’re going to argue that her entire story of being out-of-a-town for the weekend is a lie though it’s pretty well confirmed).
There's lots of questions/uncertainty about what happened here, but Michelle's actions probably aren't among them.

 

[dm92]

I think they can do more here.
Neither rape nor strangulation will necessarily lead to blood loss. (YY was menstruating)
There is evidence of blood loss, we just do not know quantity.

I have seen mentioned in some reports that he stabbed her in the bedroom as well, but I am not sure about that. Without reading the trial transcript, we cant be sure. I still havent brought myself to listen to the vigil recording, so I dont know if he describes stabbing her in the bedroom.

 

[dm92]

Sorry, somewhat graphic: very day, every hour, means less soft tissue, so less evidence

BTW, where did you pick up information about her monthly cycle? Or was that a guess?

JMHO YMMV

RIP, Ms. Zhang

Very difficult to determine this now. Only evidence of extreme torture that would be visible now would be that which would result in broken bones, and that would be masked itself by him dismembering her post morten, and environmental effects on the skeleton

 

[dm92]

I think they can do more here.
Neither rape nor strangulation will necessarily lead to blood loss. (YY was menstruating)
There is evidence of blood loss, we just do not know quantity.

Rape very much can, depending how it is done. He also could have cut her when he was cutting her clothes off....

 

[kittythehare]

I have seen mentioned in some reports that he stabbed her in the bedroom as well, but I am not sure about that. Without reading the trial transcript, we cant be sure. I still havent brought myself to listen to the vigil recording, so I dont know if he describes stabbing her in the bedroom.

Her blood was found in his bedroom. Vigil tape just seems to say 'did some stuff to her' before he relates bringing her to the bedroom. It's difficult to discern what exactly he is saying. Transcript was withheld from the jury because the defense objected so they have no more than we do.
This all depends upon the quantity of blood estimated in the bedroom.

 

[kittythehare]

I cannot open this 'cos Europe.
https://www.tribpub.com/gdpr/chicagotribune.com/
FTribute be Column: Don’t reward #YingyingZhang killer for hiding her body from this tweet ui7news on Twitter

 

[Laughing]

Here's a bit:

Column: Don’t reward Yingying Zhang’s killer for hiding her body


Her body has not been found, and Christensen appears intent on using its location as a chit to bargain for a lesser sentence.

And yes, extortion of this sort pales in gravity to the heinous crime he committed, but it is an additional, aggravating offense nevertheless, one that causes additional, gratuitous pain to his victim’s family.


Assuming that prosecutors don’t take Christensen up on this vile offer and that his sentencing hearing begins on schedule July 8, Christensen’s attorneys don’t want it mentioned.

and

the evidence revealed beyond any doubt that Christensen is sociopathically evil and killed Zhang in such a heinous manner that I won’t repeat it here. And given how even mildly attentive jurors will realize without being told that every day he doesn’t point authorities to Zhang’s remains is a new offense that makes him that much more deserving of death.


BTW this Opinion writer (who essentially titles his column Don't Reward This Killer) suggests that part of the defense's strategy is to get the case moved to a State of Illinois court -- a court without the death penalty. Suggests that the only reason this is in Federal court to reach a DP sentence.

YMMV

 

[dm92]

I cannot open this 'cos Europe.
https://www.tribpub.com/gdpr/chicagotribune.com/
FTribute be Column: Don’t reward #YingyingZhang killer for hiding her body from this tweet ui7news on Twitter

Not that good. He gets a couple facts wrong, then spends time bitching about how it isn’t right that the Feds can execute him when Illinois abolished the death penalty* -when his title basically says they shouldn’t reward him for hiding her by taking death off the table.

* I hate this argument. The US Federal government has jurisdiction in all 50 states and is the highest authority in the land. A federal crime in Idaho is a federal crime in Iowa is a federal crime in New Jersey is a federal crime in Alaska, and so on. If you’re charged by the feds, you are tried by the feds, and if guilty you are punished by the feds. Illinois has no say in this, other than they could try him for kidnapping and murder, too, if they want -but they won’t because the Feds have taken care of it and there is no reason to waste taxpayer money on it.

 

[kittythehare]

Here's a bit:

Column: Don’t reward Yingying Zhang’s killer for hiding her body


Her body has not been found, and Christensen appears intent on using its location as a chit to bargain for a lesser sentence.

And yes, extortion of this sort pales in gravity to the heinous crime he committed, but it is an additional, aggravating offense nevertheless, one that causes additional, gratuitous pain to his victim’s family.


Assuming that prosecutors don’t take Christensen up on this vile offer and that his sentencing hearing begins on schedule July 8, Christensen’s attorneys don’t want it mentioned.

and

the evidence revealed beyond any doubt that Christensen is sociopathically evil and killed Zhang in such a heinous manner that I won’t repeat it here. And given how even mildly attentive jurors will realize without being told that every day he doesn’t point authorities to Zhang’s remains is a new offense that makes him that much more deserving of death.


BTW this Opinion writer (who essentially titles his column Don't Reward This Killer) suggests that part of the defense's strategy is to get the case moved to a State of Illinois court -- a court without the death penalty. Suggests that the only reason this is in Federal court to reach a DP sentence.

YMMV

Thanks for doing that, Laughing..
I wonder whether a plea contingent on finding her entire body is still an option for him at the sentencing phase? I think it's unlikely but I haven't looked up the laws or precedence...
I hate the thought of them going home with nothing, yet again.
Their lawyer seems to be good and solid, I think they have good support from the little publicity they have received.

That's fine while they are in US, could be an awful lot harder when they return to their own life in their own farm in their own community. They could face a tidal wave of depression and anguish as the facts come home to them...

What a legacy!

And I'm furious because he seems to take pleasure in the pain he is causing still and into the future...
Justice is a myth, isn't it?

 

[Webthrush]

If possible, I presume the Defense will still be calling for a mistrial (on various grounds) through the penalty phase, OR, is that something that cannot be brought up during the penalty phase of a trial?

I also presume that there will be another plea attempt to settle on LWOP if BC tells what he did with the body, and it will be the agonizing decision of the Zhang family if they want that info, knowing it may not lead to retrieval of any remains.

Lastly, just as a caution, I’ll reiterate that all we know from the forensic evidence is that YY was present, harmed, and likely dead in BC’s apt. That’s it! Specifically, what BC did to her there (choking, strangling, raping, stabbing, hitting with baseball bat, decapitating) we DON’T HAVE any direct evidence of, other than his own words on tape — the FBI says his casual claim of 12 other victims is likely a complete fabrication, yet we’re s’posed to assume everything else he says on that tape is 100% true/accurate — very fishy to me; IF mentioning 12 other victims is false, I suspect other parts are false as well.