Found Deceased IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, and Liberty (Libby) German, 14/The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #85

[KentuckyMama]

I ruled the others out for one reason or another but this particular case is a speeding ticket for a Thomas J Bruce.

I don't think that's him. It says he 6ft 1in and lives in Bagdad, KY.

Case Search - MyCase

Defendant BRUCE, THOMAS J
Description
Male, White, 6' 1"
Address
1156 BEARDS LANE
BAGDAD, KY 40003

 

[Deleted member 102539]

Is there any video of him walking? Wondering if he is known to be pigeon toed, or have a "duck walk? "

TB is getting a monthly military stipend for "partial disability" ($133,17), so I'm wondering, which body part might be partially disabled: a leg perhaps?

ETA: changed "marine" to "military" and other ... sorry

 

[Jennifer17]

TB is getting a monthly military stipend for "partial disability" ($133,17), so I'm wondering, which body part might be partiallydisabled: a leg perhaps?

ETA: changed "marine" to "military" and other ... sorry

Obviously not all his lower appendages.

 

[margarita25]

Re: Indiana LE specifically saying that they are looking into TB and it’s too early to tell if he’s involved:

We know that LE is generally tight lipped about who all they investigate as potential POIs and suspects. Even with DN, iirc the said something along the lines of they are looking into him but also others (sorry need exact quote), but here are my thoughts re: why they would specifically go out of their way to comment about looking into TB:

We know that Indiana LE has a lot of problems with Facebook rumors, people putting side by sides on SM, etc so first of all they are highly aware of the publicity and SM awareness and involvement surrounding this case (various groups, etc).

I think that if they did not comment specifically on TB that they would be getting a million calls and messages re: this so they decided to nip it in the bud and make a statement, because normally they wouldn’t reveal their POIs, moo.

Additionally, iirc it says upstream that MIssouri authorities contacted Indiana because they noticed similarities, and while I do not want to discredit them if it was them who made the possible connection of the sketch similarity as it very well could have been them, I think chances are that someone(s) in the public may have alerted them also .

ETA: whatever the case TB (and BG for that matter, whether one in the same or not, at the moment I’m more skeptical than I was initially), they both likely have all kinds of sick, violent porn on their computer(s).

 

[margarita25]

We do know that often perps can have multiple MOs (IK, TK for example); however one thing that bugs me, and I know it has been discussed that a perp can be an opportunistic offender as well as a planned hunter predator type, no doubting that, the attack in a secluded bridge wooded area vs more public setting gives me pause. These are obviously both brazen attacks, multiple victims and possible “herding”, however there’s something about the TB attack which has less of the “hunter” vibe, idk how to explain it. I guess each crime does not have to be exactly similar, Travis Forbes is a good example of this...

Whatever the case I’m curious and optimistic about TB, but will not be surprised it is not him, mainly because I’ve realized there can be huge coincidences, as in the case of MJK and even dual SKs operating in the same area at the same time such as RAT/JLM.

 

[Deleted member 102539]

Wait! That is not necessarily a domestic violence case. First of all there is a Petitioner and a Respondent, and it is a "domestic" case, FL40 would likely be "family law". This is not a criminal case but more likely a divorce or separation, perhaps a restraining order. They seem to use the word "domestic" for all family type proceedings, and "civil" is limited to business and property matters.

Could it be, that FL 40 means application for "Sole custody of children because of ie. DV"?

 

[tmar]

Sometimes caricatures make the person more recognisable than a photo.

With well known Cartoonists, they put great emphasis on features that stand out, sometimes 'over exaggerating' them, helping readers see these points ie beady eyes, big fat nose, thin lips etc.
In so doing, these features are highly noted, in that person, by readers.

 

[mtnlites]

We do know that often perps can have multiple MOs (IK, TK for example); however one thing that bugs me, and I know it has been discussed that a perp can be an opportunistic offender as well as a planned hunter predator type, no doubting that, the attack in a secluded bridge wooded area vs more public setting gives me pause. These are obviously both brazen attacks, multiple victims and possible “herding”, however there’s something about the TB attack which has less of the “hunter” vibe, idk how to explain it. I guess each crime does not have to be exactly similar, Travis Forbes is a good example of this...

Whatever the case I’m curious and optimistic about TB, but will not be surprised it is not him, mainly because I’ve realized there can be huge coincidences, as in the case of MJK and even dual SKs operating in the same area at the same time such as RAT/JLM.

Yes, the attacks seem very different. I've never been sold on the idea of him being a "hunter". I've always thought that it was a crime of opportunity, that BG was there in the park for a specific reason and attacked when he saw the chance. It's possible that TB did the same. Still, big difference between fairly isolated park that one must intentionally find their way to and a business.

The discrepancy in ages is what is standing out to me the most. I realize that some perps are indiscriminate and will attack a female regardless of age, but the bodies of 13/14 year old girls are generally different from the bodies of grown women. Still, they're closer to the bodies of adults than if A&L had been much younger.

It would be great if BG has been found, but I'm not sold on it. Still, something piqued someone's interest to make the connection.

 

[inmyhumbleopinion]

“The man accused of sexually assaulting three women and murdering another at the Catholic Supply store is expected in court this morning. Thomas Bruce faces 1st degree murder charges and 16 felonies @ksdknews #TISL”

Jenn Sullivan on Twitter

ETA: I’m sorry if this has already been posted.

 

[oceanblueeyes]

I am glad TB is being investigated to see if he is linked to the murders of Abby and Libby.

It's good to know they are keeping all of the possibilities open that BG may have committed other crimes in other states.

However I will not be shocked if TB doesn't turnout to be connected.

Unfortunately there are many creeps like these two running around still uncaught. I am glad at least TB is one of the caught ones now.

But by them saying they are investigating him in this case it has to mean both Abby and Libby were victims of sexual assault before BG cruelly took their precious lives sway.

If not there wouldnt be any reason for them to investigate the two different cases if they have no familiarity to each other.

They investigate links to other unsolved cases where the crimes and what was done to the victims are similar in nature.

So by LE releasing to the public that they are investigating him to see if he is the one who may be involved in this case they have inadvertently also released that the girls were also brutally assaulted before BG murdered them both.

Imo

 

[Inthedetails]

Yes, the attacks seem very different. I've never been sold on the idea of him being a "hunter". I've always thought that it was a crime of opportunity, that BG was there in the park for a specific reason and attacked when he saw the chance.

Snipped.

To me, that is a hunter. My cat is just wandering around my home right now, but if she saw a mouse, she would instantly turn into a hunter. (I use the "cat" instead of "cats" because my second cat is a completely useless hunter. She once ran away from a mouse in the house!)

I think he is capable of walking around like a regular person, but when prey appears, he turns into a hunter. His plan and weapons are always handy....though sometimes he just goes to the store to pick up milk and nothing weird happens at all.

The timing of Delphi and STL makes me think the dates were significant. Maybe he wasn't purposely on the hunt, but his frame of mind those days was on committing a crime.

Yuck. Gross to think about it. So glad he's caught at least for STL crime. Future victims are saved.

jmo

 

[mtnlites]

Snipped.

To me, that is a hunter. My cat is just wandering around my home right now, but if she saw a mouse, she would instantly turn into a hunter. (I use the "cat" instead of "cats" because my second cat is a completely useless hunter. She once ran away from a mouse in the house!)

I think he is capable of walking around like a regular person, but when prey appears, he turns into a hunter. His plan and weapons are always handy....though sometimes he just goes to the store to pick up milk and nothing weird happens at all.

The timing of Delphi and STL makes me think the dates were significant. Maybe he wasn't purposely on the hunt, but his frame of mind those days was on committing a crime.

Yuck. Gross to think about it. So glad he's caught at least for STL crime. Future victims are saved.

jmo

Maybe I wasn't clear in what I was trying to say. Sometimes it makes more sense in my head.

I meant "hunter" in the way of pre-planned. I'm a hunter. My family is big into deer hunting. When I go out to deer hunt, I pack the gear that I'm going to need that day. I plan out ahead of time what I am going to do, what route I'll take, etc. I know that when I leave the house I am doing so with the intentions of killing an animal. I don't feel that BG went to the park specifically to hunt women (or anyone). I think he went to the park for a different reason, but when he saw his chance he attacked.

I guess for some there's not a huge difference, since either way he killed someone, but there is to me. For me, the difference comes in the form of WHY he was there.

 

[Inthedetails]

Maybe I wasn't clear in what I was trying to say. Sometimes it makes more sense in my head.

I meant "hunter" in the way of pre-planned. I'm a hunter. My family is big into deer hunting. When I go out to deer hunt, I pack the gear that I'm going to need that day. I plan out ahead of time what I am going to do, what route I'll take, etc. I know that when I leave the house I am doing so with the intentions of killing an animal. I don't feel that BG went to the park specifically to hunt women (or anyone). I think he went to the park for a different reason, but when he saw his chance he attacked.

I guess for some there's not a huge difference, since either way he killed someone, but there is to me. For me, the difference comes in the form of WHY he was there.

We are in agreement. I agree that he didn't specifically hunt two girls on the bridge that day like a deer hunter would plan it out.

Still, Delphi and STL don't seem like crimes that happened without some sort of plan. I think he fantasized about committing this type of crime, and he put those fantasies/plans into action (as opposed to just winging it) when the opportunity was there.

However....I think he had the urge that day, which he might not have all the time. The Delphi and STL crimes were both on Mondays, in the daytime, in "public," with multiple victims, soon after significant financial problems (bankruptcy and house sold). So while he didn't set out that morning to hunt like a deer hunter, I think he had temptation greater than a usual day. Ykwim?

He was ready to pounce.

And, I do wonder if his jacket and cap are his hunting "gear."
(Yes, I know plenty of men dress like that, no need to go through that convo again, lol! Yes, midwestern men wear blue zip-up jackets. The cap is a bit less common, I think, but yes, other people wear newsboy caps.)

jmo

eta the word "didn't" in 1st paragraph. That word makes a difference!

 

[inmyhumbleopinion]

As of today, it has been a week since the savage murder and horrifying sexual assaults took place.

I noticed that during the press conference last Wednesday, where the arrest of TB was announced, St. Louis County Police Chief Jon Belmar thanking the FBI for their assistance starting on Monda. He says they have been particularly helpful “on some parts of evidence we are trying to gather, or we have gathered I should say, in this case” (starting around 1’35” in the video).

I do not believe we know for sure if they found any foreign DNA at the scene of the CSS attack or in Abby and Libby’s murder. In the CSS case, however, they virtually have to have, IMO, due to the nature of some of the crime TB has been charged with (I cannot help but keep thinking about the things these three brave women went through ...).

However, assuming that they did (with “assuming” being the key word as always) in both cases, I do wonder now that it has been a week since the CSS attack, and with the assistance of the FBI, if they have at least preliminary results of DNA analysis. If so, perhaps they have already identified some sort of connection between the two cases (or any other).

Even if TB wasn’t required to submit a DNA sample immediately following his arrest, my guess is that he most likely will be once he is formerly charged, which he may be as early as today during the court hearing. So it shouldn’t be too long, IMO, before LE determines if there is a match between TB’s DNA and DNA found in any other unsolved cases, including Abby and Libby’s.

I admit I am getting way ahead of myself. I’m just finding it so hard to be patient right now!

 

[minazoe]

I am wondering if the similarities between the murder of TW and A&L . was more than just the arrangement of the gravesite, leaves etc.. but perhaps a gunshot wound with a specific trajectory at close range.

Just ruminating that the killer may repeat a specific scene in his fantasy where he executes
his victim. it may be a signature, or not.

just thinking . IMO .

 

[StarryStarryNight]

Most people seem to think in the photo of BG on the bridge he has a gun in his jacket pocket. The way the outline of the gun is facing seems to indicate he is left-handed.
Is there anyway to find out if TB is left-handed?

 

[MistyWaters]

Re: Indiana LE specifically saying that they are looking into TB and it’s too early to tell if he’s involved:

We know that LE is generally tight lipped about who all they investigate as potential POIs and suspects. Even with DN, iirc the said something along the lines of they are looking into him but also others (sorry need exact quote), but here are my thoughts re: why they would specifically go out of their way to comment about looking into TB:

We know that Indiana LE has a lot of problems with Facebook rumors, people putting side by sides on SM, etc so first of all they are highly aware of the publicity and SM awareness and involvement surrounding this case (various groups, etc).

I think that if they did not comment specifically on TB that they would be getting a million calls and messages re: this so they decided to nip it in the bud and make a statement, because normally they wouldn’t reveal their POIs, moo.

Additionally, iirc it says upstream that MIssouri authorities contacted Indiana because they noticed similarities, and while I do not want to discredit them if it was them who made the possible connection of the sketch similarity as it very well could have been them, I think chances are that someone(s) in the public may have alerted them also .

ETA: whatever the case TB (and BG for that matter, whether one in the same or not, at the moment I’m more skeptical than I was initially), they both likely have all kinds of sick, violent porn on their computer(s).

TB allegedly committed the STL crime the afternoon of Nov 19th and was arrested the morning of Nov 21st. It’s encouraging that it appears Indiana LE already had their eye on the unknown suspect based on his general description. It’s reassuring that police forces are actively proactive in mutual crime solving and maybe that’s also the reason the possible connection to Delphi was publicly disclosed.

Nov 22nd
“.......Authorities in Indiana have noted "similarities" in the description of the suspect released immediately after the Catholic Supplies attack and the description of an unknown suspect wanted in the February 2017 slayings of Abigail "Abby" Williams, 13, and Liberty "Libby" Rose German, 14, in Delphi, Indiana, reports the St. Louis Post Dispatch.

"We're aware of the similarities and we've been in contact with authorities there in St. Louis County," said First Sgt. Jerry Holeman, who leads the investigation for the Indiana State Police, the paper reports. "But it is way too early to tell if this is the same" person, he said....”
Report: Suspect in murder, sex assaults at religious supplies store was a pastor

 

[sunsetbeach]

Is someone amazing enough to be able to put the pic of TB over the scetch of BG? I’ve been looking at the pictures side by side. They have many similarities.

 

[inmyhumbleopinion]

“#BREAKING Judge just read off 17 charges to 53 year old Thomas Bruce. He’s accused of killing one person and sexually assaulting two others at the @catholicsupply store on Nov 19th. He requested a public defender and will not be eligible for bond. His next court date is Dec 5th”
Brandon Merano KSDK on Twitter

 

[inmyhumbleopinion]

Self-delete