Found Deceased IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, & Liberty (Libby) German, 14, The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #101

[Jim_M]

But with Jayme it wasn’t really random. It was random how he first saw her. But from there she became targeted and essentially stalked.

Hmmm, exactly what happened to Abby & Libby. Random girls, check. Targeted, then stalked, then murdered. Or were they stalked? Then further stalked? Was it random? That is my sticking point. IMO it just does not feel random to me. However, this opinion is subject to change, if/when further details (ever) come out.

 

[Jim_M]

There is no reference to any cars parked at the cemetery.
Isn't this also a likely spot to park, while scouting the area.
MOO..

You really would think so. Unless the cemetery lot wasn't 'familiar' for him? Or, for all we know, he used that lot on previous 'test' runs. Then used the Office Building lot on the 13th. JMO & speculation

 

[Jamie737]

This?

May 7, 2019
“Police are still hoping for fresh tips about one piece of information released in the news conference.

"We're still looking for the car that was parked in the lot," Riley told News 18. "If somebody can give us that information, we want that information as quickly as possible."

The importance of the car also ties into why police now believe the killer is local. Riley said after reviewing many tips, investigators determined he was able to get around quickly on the day the girls were killed, and seemed to know the area.

The car would have been seen between noon and five on Feb. 13, 2017 at the old DCS parking lot, according to police. The office is on County Road 300 North near the Hoosier Heartland Highway. The building has since been demolished and the lot is vacant....”
ISP on Delphi killer: 'Somebody may have already interviewed him'

“Get around quickly” stands out to me.

It sounds as if the killer either left where he was supposed to be for a short time, or (here’s that theory again) abducted and returned the girls, or returned to the scene to join the search party.

I will say, from the video of the searchers we were talking about a couple or so days ago, one searcher looks quite excited to be there,

 

[ilovechili]

But with Jayme it wasn’t really random. It was random how he first saw her. But from there she became targeted and essentially stalked.

Yep. ITA with this.

 

[carbuff]

I always thought that his left hand was behind his back a bit. There's something that looks like a sheath right tgere on his hip. I'm not talking the thing that may be a pouch/fanny pack towards his right side.

It could be. But whatever it is, the video loop makes him seem fairly comfortable walking that way.

 

[ab01]

But with Jayme it wasn’t really random. It was random how he first saw her. But from there she became targeted and essentially stalked.

It still fits the definition of an unfamiliar murder / abduction imo. The victims didn’t know the perp. He had seen JC previously and came back for her.

I think when many say it was random they likely mean ( or at least I mean) that there was not a connection as in someone that the girls knew

Jmo

 

[cluciano63]

Somehow, showing a sketch if you already know who it is, seems like it would be wrong...like putting your suspect in a line-up with four people who looked nothing like him...I don’t know. Just don’t think it would be done. If they know who they need to find, issue an APD. If not, show a sketch...imo.

 

[CoolJ]

It still fits the definition of an unfamiliar murder / abduction imo. The victims didn’t know the perp. He had seen JC previously and came back for her.

I think when many say it was random they likely mean ( or at least I mean) that there was not a connection as in someone that the girls knew

Jmo

Right. It is possible the murders were random as well as planned and targeted.

Some see random and targeted as competing theories. That is not necessarily the case.

 

[ab01]

Right. It is possible the murders were random as well as planned and targeted.

Some see random and targeted as competing theories. That is not necessarily the case.

Agreed and just to clarify I think the victims were Random, but I think the crime was planned well ahead in his mind. I just don’t think he knew who the targets were going to be, before he got there that day.

Just where I lean based on the amount of time
The randomness of when the girls were going to be there

A few other things as well

But just how I’m leaning in general

 

[TheVisual]

It could be. But whatever it is, the video loop makes him seem fairly comfortable walking that way.

What gets me is that LE has the whole video of BG walking and still is giving us the stills put together for us to watch. They are hiding something they don't want us to see.

 

[wary]

It still fits the definition of an unfamiliar murder / abduction imo. The victims didn’t know the perp. He had seen JC previously and came back for her.

I think when many say it was random they likely mean ( or at least I mean) that there was not a connection as in someone that the girls knew

Jmo

That’s what I mean, too. No family/friend/friend of friend/friend of family/social media connection.

Just randomly drove down the street and saw her. The fact that he stalked her afterwards MIGHT have provided a clue, if anyone had noticed it—but not much chance.

 

[Charlot123]

I was going to say the same thing about lawyers, but thought someone might get offended.

I don’t see a bottle, but I also don’t really see a gun either. Just looks like the pocket is creased to me. My eyes are tired today though. Taking out the background really makes a difference IMO.

Honestly, I typed it, then did not post, thinking the same, they will be offended, but also, “what is wrong with it? It is a business like any other”. And forgot about it, this is why it is on top of the other post. Sorry, not wanted to offend anyone, forgot to check the post, and we all use lawyers of all kinds.

About the bottle - I am now thinking smaller, and flatter, like a silver liquor bottle some people carry with them. They are usually in back pockets, though.

But we can see anything at this point. I think we are all tired. And hopeful that justice for Libby and Abby will be done.

Good luck to LEs. They are probably overwhelmed. Wishing you a lucky break.

 

[JDough]

What gets me is that LE has the whole video of BG walking and still is giving us the stills put together for us to watch. They are hiding something they don't want us to see.

As they should, IMO. Especially if it were something that could jeopardise the investigation.

 

[cluciano63]

I don’t see much of anything in the video of BG, much less outline of a weapon...just a very blurred image of a man of indeterminate age, probably Caucasian...

 

[Tiger Stripes]

That's very interesting. They want to know where he is NOW.

I find that intriguing, @Wells. Thinking out-loud here...could the suspect be:

a. "hiding in plain sight" in town (i. e., in Delphi, or a nearby Indiana town, living/working there -- say, over in West Lafayette, or south of Delphi in the Indy area, or in Bloomington)?

b. "hiding in plain sight", but...having changed various aspects of his appearance so as to not look anything/as much like the April 22nd PC sketch?

c. "hiding in plain sight", but...having, hmm, mysteriously left town/the area for a prolonged period of time (i. e., working as a summer camp counselor at a scouting camp or at a church camp [this, if the suspect might be in college or grad school, for example], working somewhere where nooo one has heard about the A/L case or Delphi would ever think to bring it up to him in conversation, etc. (say, helping out as a community volunteer or working at a summer job/intern on the East coast or the West cost)?

Has one of the key suspects (whomever any of these individuals may be) vacated their residence -- with no one (other than their immediate, and given-to-silence, relatives) knowing where they went?

d. "hiding in plain sight" (at least still during the school year, when the April 22nd PC was held), but... could the individual have not just "left town/a nearby community", but left... the country, for a summer "break"? Summer is a popular time for many college students to travel overseas, stay in hostels, etc. In another country, a potential POI could completely become "invisible" -- and would definitely be able to avoid the many people in the immediate vicinity of Delphi/surrounding communities who might instantly view him as looking like the April 22nd PC sketch.

e. "hiding in plain sight"... maybe having chosen to stay on campus for the next 3-4 months (if indeed the suspect is a college student), working in a campus office where, again, nooo one might eyeball him or view him as anyone other than one of the many thousands of college students who work on campus during the summer vacation period. "Ordinary Joe", so to speak -- and not "are you the one who killed those girls?" (Think of how being on the receiving end of odd looks and questions must surely wear on an individual...or -- would it, if the person had just "erased" all thoughts from their conscience?)

 

[cluciano63]

If they knew who he was, they would not have said he “could be in this room”...for one thing, of many, that shows me they do NOT know who he is. That is why they produced this new sketch for public view. Heaven knows, it caused enough confusion in the way it was handled...if they could have avoided that whole mess, they would have. But they had no choice.
Imo

 

[Tiger Stripes]

I keep wondering why the emphasis on the car itself. To recap, LE wants the car and/or a description of the car. I have run through so many situations but none make sense. Why just the car? If it had been tagged that day, they would have a description. If someone had seen a suspicious vehicle that day they would have at least reported some type of basic info.

@Wells -- I'm thinking that the suspect tends to be a bit of a loner, thus, not a lot of people know/knew of his comings & goings (save for his immediate family, who are keeping totally mum). Thus, once LE has details on the car, that will help to "locate" where the suspect was on Feb. 13th between 12-5p.

p.s. Guess it's possible that the car itself *may* have faint traces of DNA (since all people are continually shedding skin cells, etc.) that would also help to narrow down the investigation.

 

[Tiger Stripes]

Agree. Very confusing. This is what I was referring to in #464. There is a major difference IMO between looking for a car and looking for a description of a car. I understand LE needs to keep things quiet but I feel strongly this needs to be clarified once and for all. Is the public supposed to send in tips on the driver, the owner, the vehicle, the current location of the vehicle or some combination of the above.

Happened over 2 years ago... is it possible that the car has been sold since the Feb. 13, 2017 date? Can LE not do a vehicle search using Indiana vehicle registration records (if, in fact, the vehicle has been sold)? (Just thinking this if they were hoping to access DNA in the car... Learned during the BC case the summer of 2017 of how BC worked to clean his car, so there are suspects who think along those lines -by either cleaning or selling such a vehicle.)

 

[Charlot123]

I think the motive is likely known to police, and likely to be sexual assault, but jmo. Still, profiles are so broad and basic, imo, not sure it would help. Everyone expects a sex murderer, i.e. to be a weirdo loner who everyone steers clear of when they can be anybody. We have seen fathers of large families who killed large numbers of women, as well as “normal” looking guys like Ted Bundy. So profiles to me are generally worthless.

I always wonder if serial killers of women have deeper, beautiful voices. Studies have shown that women’s voices are usually not “attractiveness” denominators for men, but women perceive deep, rich male voices as attractive.

So if we are thinking of average, working fathers of large families, very proper, what else could make a woman trust a stranger? His voice. The timbre.

 

[mtnlites]

I look at other similar cases as a guide.

This has all the hallmarks of a random, sexually motivated double murder.

The “double” part is unusual, but not unprecedented.

I can think of several recent cases where the killer committed a crime of opportunity, and didn’t have any connection to the victim.

Vanessa Marcotte, Mollie Tibbetts, Karina Vetrano, etc.

I believe this case is just like those.

Other murder cases in which the perp was unknown by the victim and the crime was opportunity-driven:

- Hannah Graham
- Chelsea King
- Anna Dubois
- Samantha Josephson
- Morgan Harrington
- Jessica Lynn Heeringa
- Laura Smither
- many of Ted Bundy's victims
- Petit family
- Amy Watkins
- Barbara Leslie and Ruth Schwed