Found Deceased IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, & Liberty (Libby) German, 14, The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #147

[helpfulcharlie]

I agree, and even a neighbor hijacking their wi-fi doesn't explain all the CSAM, search history, and conversations found on KAK's actual phones and tablets. Or searching CSAM from another house near where his grandparent's lived on the 13th, or Vegas stuff. LE could be lying about some of that, but KAK has serious charges due to CSAM found on his devices, so I think the chances of someone outside of that house being involved by means of wi-fi hijacking (or using his phone) is minimal. JMO.

I was looking at it from the opposite perspective, that of KAK using the wifi belonging to others to help hide his tracks.

 

[ChuckInHouston]

I have gone back and forth over the News Nation interview with Carter and the 2019 presser. Some things that really stick out to me:
When asked about the photo switch, he reiterates that the sketch is not a photograph and on to say that the investigation swerves, but that is not a swerve. It's a hard turn (my words).
A few thigs that at least to me, firm up my suspicion that there are more than one perp.
When asked about the voice, he states, that it's an investigative component. He does not say it's the same voice.
he basically says the BG video is not that important.
When asked about the high river bank, he makes a reference to multiple points of access to the area where crime took place.(maybe a 2nd person was waiting there)
He gets upset when pressed about details and says eventually they will have to tell all this info and then it will open up a whole other issue with the family, and community. To me that suggest a familiarity of some sort.
Carter does not mention the missing piece as in the 2019 presser.
When KK is brought up he literally gets angry. The expression on his face says to me that he is angry because KK could probably wrap this whole thing up by telling all he knows. Like who did it.
Also when he states that "He is watching now" it gives me the impression that possibly the murder has communicated with LE at some point.
Just my opinion, but Murder is serial killer. 2 suspects, BG and Murder. Possibly BG led the girls to the clearing for the murder. second sketch is not BG, and I don't know for sure if voice is same person, but suspect not since the beginning.

 

[sunshineray]

IMO, some very significant details have been hit upon by members on here in the last couple of days. For starters, if the MS podcast episode with the journalist is to be taken at face value, then she had LE sources telling her all along that KAK is not the killer but knows who it is, and that more than one user was on the a_shots account. That adds some credence to the 2020 KAK interview transcripts, imo.

Not everything in that interview necessarily had to be true (on KAK or LE's part), but I think the overall picture might be somewhat accurate based on the fact that KAK is in jail on charges of CSAM, BP knows a_shots was communicating with L, and LE has put out the a_shots ask.

We have LE telling KAK they think there was more than one user on a_shots, supported with what the journalist said, and perhaps, just maybe, this explains the two sketches. If, for example, the second sketch is supposed to be of KAK, then maybe that's because he's the known user of a_shots, and until he names the other user(s), his face is the one LE is going to plaster all over H*ll.

And as has been discussed, there's the matter of proving who are the users of a_shots, whether or not any or all users are involved in the murders, and if all those hours, days, months, and years of CSAM use connected to the Peru address are, in fact, connected to the murders, as well. JMO.

I wonder if KAK saying in his jailhouse interview that LE thinks his father is the killer was the pure truth. I do believe ISP Carter feels they have the identity of their man...from his last very much more positive interview. Let's add to that the fact KAK has also said in that jailhouse interview that his father has not had any contact with him since his arrest. IMO JAK is an extreme POI.

 

[sunshineray]

somewhere there is communication between a shots and Libby...they apparently have these ..what is missing is possible texts from other phones that pertain to these girls and their location..they are probably scrubbed and I hope someday they are retrieved. I also wonder if KAK did things with phones, you know swap sims, let people use them,
try to sell them? wonder if he sold anything on eBay?

I wonder if anyone out there can put JBC and KAK together? would be interesting if someone was maybe around at some point and can attest to any possible connection..

JBC changed his Facebook to private the day after the murders for an entire year. KAK and his dad ran away to Vegas and put false information about KAKS whereabouts on the day of the murders.

mOO

I came across some C's and K's (JAK being one) that did live in Young America (which is also sometimes refered to as Galveston, the town that girl who communicated with anthony_shots saw a masked man looking in her bedroom window) on the same street within spitting distance of each other. I do not know time frame though so it's just a possible connection if they were there simultaneously. AJMO

 

[sunshineray]

That is very interesting. I did not think of that ever happening.
But, in this case, would the friend then sit outside the Klines’ house and have hours long and days long conversations with young girls?

Whether it's probably or not it's certainly possible.

 

[sunshineray]

I was looking at it from the opposite perspective, that of KAK using the wifi belonging to others to help hide his tracks.

Me too

 

[sunshineray]

I have gone back and forth over the News Nation interview with Carter and the 2019 presser. Some things that really stick out to me:
When asked about the photo switch, he reiterates that the sketch is not a photograph and on to say that the investigation swerves, but that is not a swerve. It's a hard turn (my words).
A few thigs that at least to me, firm up my suspicion that there are more than one perp.
When asked about the voice, he states, that it's an investigative component. He does not say it's the same voice.
he basically says the BG video is not that important.
When asked about the high river bank, he makes a reference to multiple points of access to the area where crime took place.(maybe a 2nd person was waiting there)
He gets upset when pressed about details and says eventually they will have to tell all this info and then it will open up a whole other issue with the family, and community. To me that suggest a familiarity of some sort.
Carter does not mention the missing piece as in the 2019 presser.
When KK is brought up he literally gets angry. The expression on his face says to me that he is angry because KK could probably wrap this whole thing up by telling all he knows. Like who did it.
Also when he states that "He is watching now" it gives me the impression that possibly the murder has communicated with LE at some point.
Just my opinion, but Murder is serial killer. 2 suspects, BG and Murder. Possibly BG led the girls to the clearing for the murder. second sketch is not BG, and I don't know for sure if voice is same person, but suspect not since the beginning.

I also felt like there was an almost down grading of the audio and video evidence. I had always gotten the impression that the voice and image, in LE's mind, was the girl's killer. Now I get the feeling it might either be one of the actual killing's participants (so more than one killer) or just the person who funneled/directed the girls "down the hill" to someone there waiting. AJMO

 

[Peppery]

I believe the story is that Libby’s dad asked FSG if he had sent the girls and FSG told them no but there was a couple arguing down near the bridge or under the bridge.

I have wondered if FSG said “a couple arguing” which makes me think adult man and adult woman or “a couple of people arguing” which could mean any combination of people of various ages. It’s one of those telephone game things where one word makes a difference. Or even if DG said “have you seen two teenage girls?” And FSG replied something like “I didn’t see them but I heard a couple arguing” could mean he heard a couple of girls arguing (or screaming/yelling after BG confronted them)

 

[Boxer]

somewhere there is communication between a shots and Libby...they apparently have these ..what is missing is possible texts from other phones that pertain to these girls and their location..they are probably scrubbed and I hope someday they are retrieved. I also wonder if KAK did things with phones, you know swap sims, let people use them,
try to sell them? wonder if he sold anything on eBay?

I wonder if anyone out there can put JBC and KAK together? would be interesting if someone was maybe around at some point and can attest to any possible connection..

JBC changed his Facebook to private the day after the murders for an entire year. KAK and his dad ran away to Vegas and put false information about KAKS whereabouts on the day of the murders

MOO they likely shared a dealer at some point. The Flora Pizza King molester is a good candidate in m opinion.

 

[IQuestion]

I came across some C's and K's (JAK being one) that did live in Young America (which is also sometimes refered to as Galveston, the town that girl who communicated with anthony_shots saw a masked man looking in her bedroom window) on the same street within spitting distance of each other. I do not know time frame though so it's just a possible connection if they were there simultaneously. AJMO

Good info SUNSHINE!! Sounds very interesting and yes KAK lists Galveston, Indiana as his hometown. (I noticed homes in small Indiana towns seem to be a lot less costly than here on the West Coast.) I felt TK was kind of a wildcard in this and found details in this news story, towards the end states: (my comments in red.)
"Kline’s father, Jerry Anthony Kline, goes by Tony and has a criminal history that includes convictions of sexual harassment, battery and theft. We have not been able to contact Tony Kline. Indiana State Police will not tell us if Tony has been questioned about the Delphi murders." (Uh, ya' just did, because these are "convictions" not just arrests. It would be lack of due diligence if they did not question him after seeing the contents of the phones. And the wifi emanates from his residence. So the Rubicon was crossed long before KAK went to live with him.)

'anthony_shots' profile connected to another incident just days after Delphi murders

Police have identified another incident involving the fake 'anthony_shots' profile. This one happened less than a week after the Delphi murders.

www.wthr.com

 

[FromGermany1]

I really don't want to comeback to it, but what if with KAK there is a wellknown person in the play, who is protected by KAK. Not TK or JBC, but someone, KAK has (admiring) respect for and maybe a bit fear even. Someone, who could immediately sue him for defamation as soon as KAK even hinted at his name. Someone with enough money for the very best lawyers, should he ever get into trouble. What if?

 

[IQuestion]

MOO they likely shared a dealer at some point. The Flora Pizza King molester is a good candidate in m opinion.

BOXER Birds of a feather flock together. There has been confirmation of a huge investigation, per Det. V. All connected via internet and/or geographic proximity? When the pizza king of Carroll County did not show up for his police interview, they found him in the home of another convicted child predator. (I kid you not!) Police began searching for him. He was located in Clinton County. RD, is a convicted child predator and worked at the same pizza place in Flora.
Small town USA, everyone knows everyone. Maybe KAK helped him with his restaurant website? It is only 8 miles from his home, Young Am.

Flora Pizza King owner arrested, charged with child molestation - Carroll County Comet

Carroll County’s First Deputy, Major Michael Thomas, filed a probable cause affidavit in Carroll Circuit Court alleging Flora Pizza King owner Mark J. “Joe” Sandifur, 36, had inappropriate contact with a 13-year-old youth. The court document stated the child was interviewed and stated Sandifur...

www.carrollcountycomet.com

 

[kalvis]

Here is the thread for Mark Sandifur.

IN - Mark Sandifur, charged with child molesting, Flora, 28 Aug 2019

Flora pizzeria owner charged with child molesting

www.websleuths.com

 

[Charlot123]

I really don't want to comeback to it, but what if with KAK there is a wellknown person in the play, who is protected by KAK. Not TK or JBC, but someone, KAK has (admiring) respect for and maybe a bit fear even. Someone, who could immediately sue him for defamation as soon as KAK even hinted at his name. Someone with enough money for the very best lawyers, should he ever get into trouble. What if?

This is my 50% bet. After all, the world-known collector of I once mentioned here bore a very well-known name and had unbelievable amount of money and connections. The reason he is known is because in his time, people did not hide it. Another 50% - that it is someone absolutely not known.

 

[FrostedGlass]

I think we need to be careful naming MS. The prosecutor, the judge and his atty agreed his molestation charges would be dismissed with prejudice. I believe he reads here.

 

[M. Kay]

Another 50% - that it is someone absolutely not known.

I think "known" because of "hiding in plain sight"...was not ambiguously stated by LE. Recalling that very early on someone prominent in community was considered because of a single Libby comment. Later, he came to court for CSAM, so could be connected with the Kline's (who we were not aware of back in earlier days). A local avenue for in a small town is difficult to hide. Also LE hinted about a higher-up who would surprise. Klines and JBC are not well-connected businessmen.

 

[ChuckInHouston]

I keep going back to the original press conference in 2017. Dave Bursten communications officer, says “we are not saying the voice is the same as the person in the video.” When questioned about the audio, they say where in relation to the video the audio comes may not coorilate, the only time say they both came from the phone. I have always questioned why not release Guys, in the beginning with down the hill. When they did, it is in tandem as if said together. Personally, I don’t think it is. If not why put it together. If it was then why not release it all together in the beginning. I have often wondered if guys came from another source and maybe someone they suspect. I understand keeping details close as in any crime, but one recorded word would not have given away their hand as they say. Bursten also admits there may have more than one suspect. Something on that phone that they are not releasing, may be the key to solving this. Maybe they should put it all out there. A lot of LE’s early assumptions and coded speculation have steered the public’s attempts to help solve this case. What if the car at CPS building, Logan, or the direction they think suspect exited are all wrong. How would this change your thought process regarding this crime?

 

[Trebor5591]

So how were these poor girls killed?

Yes he had a gun but imo that would be too loud. I’d say strangulation but I heard crime scene was messy so that sorta confuses me

knife. MOO

 

[Detective Willy]

If it turns out that JAK aka Tony was the killer then LE will be kicking themselves that they were so close early on in the investigation.

I see a resemblance to BG with his body shape for sure - 100%.

 

[IQuestion]

I keep going back to the original press conference in 2017. Dave Bursten communications officer, says “we are not saying the voice is the same as the person in the video.” When questioned about the audio, they say where in relation to the video the audio comes may not coorilate, the only time say they both came from the phone. I have always questioned why not release Guys, in the beginning with down the hill. When they did, it is in tandem as if said together. Personally, I don’t think it is. If not why put it together. If it was then why not release it all together in the beginning. I have often wondered if guys came from another source and maybe someone they suspect. I understand keeping details close as in any crime, but one recorded word would not have given away their hand as they say. Bursten also admits there may have more than one suspect. Something on that phone that they are not releasing, may be the key to solving this. Maybe they should put it all out there. A lot of LE’s early assumptions and coded speculation have steered the public’s attempts to help solve this case. What if the car at CPS building, Logan, or the direction they think suspect exited are all wrong. How would this change your thought process regarding this crime?

CHUCKINHOUSTON Thanks for addressing the elephant in the room! Thought I was going to burst a blood vessel when they added "ONE WORD".... the clue was going to set the world on fire. Not! ( "I can name that tune in 4 notes." insert big eye roll, please.) And, the new sketch...younger 18 to 40 ...but he could look younger than his age. (Great clue, not!...so if I see a suspicious guy who looks 40, should I ask him if he is really 50?) I know I am sounding harsh...but I do have a point.
The April 22, 2019 news conference, creating a big hype and lots of interest was done on a MONDAY....oh my. There we go again with the Monday connection. And I think it was meant to "cause discomfort, poke the fire so to speak" because KAK was definitely in the cross hairs. Maybe LE wanted to see if he would show up and who he would contact after the press conference. Turning up the heat a little? Betccha he was in the town of Delphi the afternoon of that press conference...even if he left his phone somewhere else, or just lurked around town, watching and listening. Hiding in plain sight.
PS. He wasn't going to go into the conference room because people had to sign in, identity stuff...maybe even leave DNA on a pen...nah, he wouldn't go in.