Found Deceased IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, & Liberty (Libby) German, 14, The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #93

[JillR]

I listened to the podcast where Kelsi talks. Have we ever seen/has A photo of Libby been released fro my hat day? Libby would be leaning down on the Highbridge? Kelsi, Libby’s sister, referenced that she “showed the police the Snapchat from her phone of the photo of Abby at the end of the bridge at 2:07 PM and a photo of Libby leaning down of Highbridge “

I listened again she says “ I showed the police the Snapchat it’s the picture of Abby at the other end of the bridge and the one of Libby looking? Or leaning? Down. “

 

[gregjrichards]

I don't think I'll ever catch up because these threads are flying but you all have put forth some great possibilities and theories. Just a heads up....True Crime on HLN is airing a a one hour special on the Delphi murders Monday at 2 pm ET.

I wonder if it is the same one shown on the two year anniversary or an updated one. Thank you for posting this hopefully one of us can watch and provide any new information in the forum. Unfortunately I will be heading home from physio when it is on.

 

[ms.jones]

honestly i think that's possible even if he DOES still have parents or a parent and also friends/roommates and people he is close with. Some people who have friends and family tend to not necessarily be loners, but just tend to do their own thing without always letting those close to them know. I have parents and close friends, but i'm also independent and i'm not keeping them updated all the time on what i'm doing or planning to do. On any given day if you asked them where i was and what i was doing at XX time on XX day they'd be utterly clueless.

I honestly do not know what my husband looks at on his computer or phone. He probably doesn't know what I look at. We love each other and are together every day but that doesn't mean we are Siamese twins. He wouldn't know which days I troll the racks at TJ Maxx during my lunch hour or that I stopped at Quick Trip for a cold drink unless I tell him and I usually don't. Not because I am concealing it but because most people don't report all of their movements to people around them if they are adults. Since BG did this because he wanted to and it satisfied something in his psyche he would not necessarily be acting differently after the act. He isn't like us. A person that does this isn't going to act like a normal person would after murdering people (freaking out, nervous, etc) because he isn't. He is gratified he satisfied his urge. Think about how John Wayne Gacy hosted parties in his house with boys buried in his crawlspace. There are other killers that had wives and children who had no clue. BG did this in broad daylight so obviously he thinks he won't be caught. I think he still thinks that. Isn't the scariest possibility that he is someone that everyone knows but really doesn't know? We all want to think we can spot the boogeyman. It is so much easier to think he is a vagrant, a drug addict or drunk. Not your friend's son who is visiting from college or a veteran just home from service abroad. I think the girls found him creepy because he was looking at them and maybe passed them more than once. I think it is very likely he said or did something creepy when he first saw them because he enjoyed flustering them. The sketch of him doesn't look like what we traditionally think of as creepy so it makes me think it was his behavior that threw up the red flag.

 

[TL4S]

I listened again she says “ I showed the police the Snapchat it’s the picture of Abby at the other end of the bridge and the one of Libby looking? Or leaning? Down. “

If there is a photo of Libby looking or leaning down, than I suspect there's a reason it hasn't been released. Maybe BG is in the background. Maybe Abby was the one filming him walking across the bridge. Who knows.

 

[wary]

I hope it’s the latter as well.

I’m giving this guy no credit for fooling anyone.

By its nature, a crime like this is difficult to solve.

I think he got lucky.

There are a lot of cases that are fundamentally the same, with respect to how the murderer took a lot of chances and risked getting caught.

In some of these cases, the murderer does get caught, quickly. Those cases tend to fade quickly out of the public’s view. Or, a potential witness comes into sight, and the crime never takes place.

Here, I agree—the murderer got lucky. That’s the reason we’re on thread #93–it’s not because he did anything specially strategic.

 

[gregjrichards]

Locals - are there any billboards showing the new sketch in Delphi and surrounding areas?

 

[gitana1]

Bernadette Sugrim? Woman turns her husband in for murder

Yes!!! That's the one.

 

[waltzingmatilda]

I wonder if it is the same one shown on the two year anniversary or an updated one. Thank you for posting this hopefully one of us can watch and provide any new information in the forum. Unfortunately I will be heading home from physio when it is on.

I got the impression that it is a new one with the recent updates. A reporter was in downtown Delphi and they zoomed in on a poster with pic OBG sketch. Then she held up a news paper with NBG sketch and said they will have professionals there to answer our questions. I guess like NG and JVM had people call in with questions on their shows back in the day.

 

[steeltowngirl]

This might help...just read the last page or two and you should be caught up.
IN - Abigail Williams & Liberty German, Delphi, Media, Maps, Timelines NO DISCUSSION

Thanks PommyMommy. My head is exploding. I had thought the second sketch was a just a better depiction than the first. Now I see it’s not the same person. Wow.

I will continue to read on and through to see if any idea is given of who the first person was? A random guy on bridge, or an accomplice, or never existed? I’m lost. Though I get it - that first sketch of a person is not the killer.

 

[carmenugt]

Did someone say the police said he is around 5’9-5’10 and about 220 lbs? Is this correct information? If so, that seems stocky. For example, cardiologists want men at 6’0 ft to be between 170-180 lbs... However, I wouldn’t be surprised if the killer has attempted to alter his physique through dieting to conceal his identity.

I really, really hope it does not take 2 years to nail the murderer.

5'6' to 5'10 up to 185

 

[flashy09]

Who said they messed up?

The first sketch is not of BG. So that is a mess up. LE basically said it themselves when telling everyone to disregard it.

 

[bradfordsleuth]

I keep wondering about Carter saying, "You made mistakes."
We know one of his biggest mistakes was unknowingly being filmed and recorded by Libby.

What are some of the other mistakes this guy made?

 

[gitana1]

I’m trying and trying to catch up..

I just now got to the part on the last thread that the two sketches are NOT the same guy! WHAT? We were asking store owners to hang fliers of the sketch and barcode with the voice clip for 2 years... of the WRONG person?

Please - can someone briefly tell me what is going on?

"The information being released today is literally the result of thousands and thousands of hours of extraordinary investigative efforts, by Delphi, Carroll County, the FBI, Indiana State Police, and countless other agencies."

From the presser.

New video and a bit more audio:
ISP: Delphi Homicide Investigation

 

[LaborDayRN]

Who said they messed up?

I agree. Investigations aren't static, they're fluid. When new, reliable information is uncovered by LE they must act on that information. IMO this is what happened here.

 

[MassGuy]

I keep wondering about Carter saying, "You made mistakes."
We know one of his biggest mistakes was unknowingly being filmed and recorded by Libby.

What are some of the other mistakes this guy made?

If he’s like a lot of guys who do this sort of thing, he’s told someone about it.

If he hasn’t flat out said it, he’s probably alluded to it.

He was apparently spotted as well.

Hopefully, he left DNA evidence too.

 

[LaborDayRN]

Well, my understanding is that there’s billboards of Mr. Disregard This Picture Now, billboards spread over quite a few states.

I'm sure it will take time to change them out to the sketch that LE is saying is the POI.

 

[steeltowngirl]

"The information being released today is literally the result of thousands and thousands of hours of extraordinary investigative efforts, by Delphi, Carroll County, the FBI, Indiana State Police, and countless other agencies."

From the presser.

New video and a bit more audio:
ISP: Delphi Homicide Investigation

Thanks Gitana1. I was mostly up to speed and intently watched the presser and have been speed reading threads for 2 nights. Just stunned that the sketch isn’t a more updated version. Instead it’s NOT the SAME person. That’s what I’m wrapping my head around.

 

[gitana1]

Well, my understanding is that there’s billboards of Mr. Disregard This Picture Now, billboards spread over quite a few states.

Yes. So? I think they had strong reason to believe that sketch was of the perp. I don't think four agencies including the FBI just did that on a lark or because they blew it. It had to have been based on information they had.

Now, after "thousands and thousands of hours of extraordinary investigative efforts, by Delphi, Carroll County, the FBI, Indiana State Police, and countless other agencies", new information developed and was released.

There is nothing to suggest they "messed up." Different things develop along the way. These are professionals. Multiple agencies. They don't release information without good reason.

 

[gitana1]

Thanks Gitana1. I was mostly up to speed and intently watched the presser and have been speed reading threads for 2 nights. Just stunned that the sketch isn’t a more updated version. Instead it’s NOT the SAME person. That’s what I’m wrapping my head around.

Yeah. I get it. I can't wrap my head around that sketch matching the BG video. It doesn't look like a match to me. I think the first one made much more sense.

But I realize I don't know what I don't know!!

 

[Seattle1]

I always wondered too if they passed each other and BG did a 180 and B-lined it across the bridge to catch up to them.

I wonder when the girls refer to him as "creepy" what makes him creepy? The way he was acting? Did he say something to them? Was he staring? Was it something he was wearing (a mask)?

I don't think he saw and did a 180 on bridge to get to them.

After 26+ months, I've watched many shows on Delphi so forgive me for not recalling which one but I especially recall one profiler's suggestion on this tragic event:

She speculated BG likely saw when the girls arrived and/or were dropped off, and knew they were alone.

Also speculated BG had good knowledge of the people traffic that afternoon-- knowing he and the girls would most likely be alone on the other side of the bridge (he'd already been across and under the bridge just before girls arrived). Suggested the girls may have passed him on trail -- noticing him sloppy, overdressed for the moment, probably perspiring, an image most girls their age would refer to as a sweaty, creepy guy.

He could also watch the bridge without being seen. The girls were walking leisurely across bridge, taking photos. Only takes about 4 minutes at normal pace to cross. He could reach them quickly without being obvious about it.

I also don't think Libby intentionally filmed BG but he more or less photo bombed Abby. But I do think keeping the audio on when BG reached them was probably intentional.

MOO