Found Deceased IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, & Liberty (Libby) German, 14, The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #95

[margarita25]

Are there similarities between the cases? Do you have a link to Lyric and Lizzy's case? Thanks! TIA

Hi, I am trying to link to their first thread(s) from the first post in the below link, but there is an issue with URLs linked as it redirects to WS main page. Alerting a mod.

Here’s what I got so far:
IA - IA - Elizabeth Collins, 8, & Lyric Cook, 10, Evansdale, 13 July 2012 - #18

In the meantime I did find this basement thread (not discussable up here per TOS but perhaps worth a read):

https://www.websleuths.com/forums/threads/elizabeth-collins-lyric-cook-scanner-thread-3.179957/

 

[Peppery]

I doubt it but, maybe stolen plates on the car.

If stolen plates, the VIN is usually visible from the outside.

 

[Boxer]

l

I doubt it but, maybe stolen plates on the car.

MOO police only have a witness saying they saw a type of vehicle parked at the old CPS building. Since they only have a time and general description of the car, they cant say what the make and model is to the public, because they are hoping to get a second witness.

 

[wary]

Hi, I am trying to link to their first thread(s) from the first post in the below link, but there is an issue with URLs linked as it redirects to WS main page. Alerting a mod.

Here’s what I got so far:
IA - IA - Elizabeth Collins, 8, & Lyric Cook, 10, Evansdale, 13 July 2012 - #18

In the meantime I did find this basement thread (not discussable up here per TOS but perhaps worth a read):

https://www.websleuths.com/forums/threads/elizabeth-collins-lyric-cook-scanner-thread-3.179957/

I think this should be the first thread.

IA - IA - Elizabeth Collins, 8, & Lyric Cook, 10, Evansdale, 13 July 2012 - #1

 

[ctmom]

For those of you looking for the News 18 footage the night of Feb 13th when family+ (Mike, Abby's mom & a fella the TV station named as Eric Williams) was interviewed.

 

[marisab67]

I agree with Betty. I tried to locate her original post.
The car license plate would reveal who the car is registered to or the previous owners. LE just runs the plate number, however, if the car was reported stolen or loaned it to a friend that day complicates matters. But pretty sure Le knew within 10 minutes the owner of the vehicle. I'm sure they interviewed the owner(s) already the same day on Feb.13th.

This is what I think. They realized who the owner of the car was, I assumed it couldn’t possibly have anything to do with this particular family, and then let it go.

 

[apples12]

That’s what I thought and why I think the original drawing was dismissed after first seeming unlikely, but revisited based on some new information. MOO is that this has been mulling in BG’s brain for a few years but that he’s never done this before.

I agree with you completely. May not do it again. Which is why we need to catch him now!

 

[windrower]

Here is a map (Google Earth 4/17), that shows some possible visuals anyone could have had, if parked at the CPS/DHS building (now demolished) and walked towards the N/W Trailhead/ Freedom Bridge. Not saying it may have been relevant, but it could be one more piece of showing how well planned the attack really was IMO.

BG in my view was/is all about being prepared for any (good) opportunity that day to attack. I do not think the girls were specifically targeted and I have to wonder, if BG would have possibly attacked them earlier - or somebody else-, if they had chosen to rather take the Nature preserve trail down towards the creek than the 501 (step) trail to the High Bridge. Of course we do not know, if the girls did go down there first or not, still wondering, if BG was aiming for anyone passing the High Bridge instead.

It is interesting to study any strategic points on the trail itself, 2-3 curves perhaps, points where one can see who is behind or in front of you. There are not many and the time of the year offered a good additional view past and through the leafless trees and shrubs.

This is an experienced offender IMO. He may have been out in the area before. He may have been out in many areas/parks before and may have been checking off different locations on a regular base all-while possibly making pics or videos of the area.

This killer IMO has many "killing grounds" and it is only a matter of time, when he will be killing again, if not apprehended soon.

I really hope LE is sure about the younger age, IMO it is the opposite and he is retired having ample time to plan, research and operate beyond Delphi, Carrol County or the State of Indiana. Yes, he blends in and that is his biggest asset IMO.

All IMO of course.

-Nin

Maybe some dashcam footage has been turned in to LE? Abandoned CPS building would have been visible from the highway, enough maybe to be caught on film?

Agreed I think they know exactly who the vehicle was registered to.

Maybe that person/persons has an alibi that LE are unable to disprove so far.

They just need someone to come forward and say they saw the car and who was in it during that time period.

If LE has DNA from the killer, wouldn't they go after perp possibles, especially the owner(s) of a suspiciously parked car, and get the perp's DNA to test from something the perp discards?

 

[margarita25]

If stolen plates, the VIN is usually visible from the outside.

This is interesting because I’ve always wondered about what other types of crimes might be in his wheelhouse, likely obviously DV perhaps, but I also wonder about anything else such a burglary/robbery. Often offenders have other types of criminal behaviors in which they engage, break ins, etc.

 

[x_files]

Makes me wonder her motives. Did he look so scary that she decided to capture him, or did the girls plan to make a photo and expose him to the whole world, for something he did? Like, pretending to be a peer and talking to them online?

And did the BG eliminate them as witnesses, or is it his modus operandi, to lure teenagers/women into a trap?

He might have put off a vibe, and Libby sensed it. Sometimes there's just not one thing but your intuition just knows, your hair stands up you get a bad feeling about someone. It seems he had his eye on them while they were playing, talking, enjoying themselves and he is stalking.
Her intuition was spot on and glad she took video/audio of him. At this point he was too close, if he had a gun they could attempt to outrun him, but that was a risky chance.

 

[NickoD]

More press coverage later tonight on local channel Fox 59 (video on the link):

FOX59 News @FOX59
2m
A chance meeting with this woman gave Kelsi German new hope in the search for the killer of her sister, Libby German, and her sister's friend Abby Williams. Tonight at 10 on FOX59. #DelphiMurders #Dephi #Indiana #AbbyandLibby

FOX59 News on Twitter

MOO: I wonder if this is an interview taken before the 2 week blackout period.

 

[x_files]

^^^^THIS

My hunch, and it's just a layman's assessment of the nature of the crimes and a possible partial psych profile, is that this killer gets off on the terror, the fear, and, more importantly, the media attention. I'll bet he gets off on the media posts, articles, etc., but as Supt. Carter noted, BG is looking closely at what LE knows. He's like a voyeur into his own crimes, after the fact, and like I said gets off on the attention. Much different than other killers I've seen detailed here on WS and around the Web.

Of course, JMO.

The killer is familiar with Delphi, may live close by visits often. Perhaps church outings, overnight campouts, probably have gone since early childhood. IMHO

 

[margarita25]

Rsbm
Also, can we please not get caught up on this silly back and forth which ends up in people being banned?
They may have been assaulted, maybe not. Maybe there was a kill kit, or not. Who knows if this was absolutely premeditated or a random, grateful act. None of us have definitive proof of anything, so let's leave it at that

None of us have proof of anything, that’s for sure, but specific discussions re: potential weapons/kill kits, aspects of premeditation and motive are all fair game on WS and imo is not a “silly back and forth”. That’s one of the main reasons for being on a forensics/crime forum is to question and discuss these aspects respectfully. Nobody is right or wrong because as you said nobody really knows squat for certain and it’s all the posters’ personal opinions and speculations, which is not grounds for banning as long as the discussion is respectful and academic. Moo. If you see any posts that violate TOS, you can hit “Report”.

 

[x_files]

Can they check reports of voyerism/exhibitionism/stalking/anything sexually creepy in the previous, say, 3 years in/ around Delphi area? Even Purdue, in the year that the woman reported the violent attack linked here?

Even better, since the man is 20-30, check Delphi alone for the last 15 years, when he allegedly had no car?

I bet they will find something.

Also, if the others in the family have similar issues with peeping, sexual abuse etc...Father, older brothers with records?

 

[Reluctant1]

It wasn't a report, per se, it was a quote from her grandfather.

The quote was from interview on news the night girls were missing. However, it also says the phone stopped pinging about 5 hours ago, and this was the night of the 13th. It is the same video with the interesting interviews at the end.

 

[x_files]

I think its highly likely that a few people ran into BG on the trail that day. I just wish one would have recognized him by name.

This is another reason why I don't believe this perp is going to be someone that is a well known public figure.

JMO

No, not a famous public figure, but maybe his father is a well-known prominent/wealthy or well-loved public figure locally.

 

[elmomom]

I don’t know how the system works—but I feel a little skepticism. I’d think they’d need a court order—and if they’re dealing with the usual third-cousin hit on GEDmatch—I’m not sure if a judge would sign off on that sort of violation of privacy. I’m a passionate enthusiast for genetic genealogy in crime-solving, but I know it’s not as easy and certain as we might hope. And in many adoptions, the father’s identity is undocumented or uncertain—there goes half the family tree, right there.

Very recently a new match for 3rd cousin popped up on my ancestry account, and as a 2nd cousin to my mother’s dna. It took me about 10 milliseconds to realize that we had an “unknown event” that led to the birth of this individual. Using match %’s to various relatives of mine and this person I was able to narrow down the paternity to about 3 potential relatives of mine. The new cousin had no idea that his/her father was a relative of mine and was in completely disbelief until the biological father submitted his DNA and he matched to this person as in the range of parent. It is not hard to do even if one is adopted or parented by an unknown and unsuspected person.

 

[x_files]

I would say that any man walking away from the murder site shortly after the murders would be suspect, yes.

Absolutely, everyone there that day would be suspect to me as well including women.

 

[Matic]

Looks like there is about a 1 minute delay between the live cable showing and the link provided for the HLN broadcast posted up thread.

 

[Wells]

If someone borrowed a vehicle [with permission], it's likely that whomever it was borrowed from has an idea of who committed the crime. I would be concerned that an individual who feels cornered, trapped, desperate, or who has nothing to lose might put that person (the owner of the vehicle) in harm's way. I sincerely hope that LE is keeping them (the possible person who loaned out the vehicle) safe, or at the very least keeping an eye on them.