GUILTY IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, & Liberty (Libby) German, 14, The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #95

[Yellow Rose]

Just a reminder that the HLN program for Liberty German & Abigail Williams is re-airing right now.
Watch HLN Streaming Online - HLN Live Stream - LiveNewsWatch

 

[teeandcee]

I think the problem that a lot of people are facing (including me), is that from the time the initial sketch was released, we associated it with the still of BG from Libby’s video.

So it’s hard to unsee that, and not imagine this guy as some creep in his mid 40s.

Law enforcement clearly believes this man is much younger, and that newly released sketch is an accurate depiction, but it’s hard for me to see that face, on the guy in the video.

I’m definitely having this problem. I was just thinking today how hard it is for me to overcome two years of imprinting. I look at it and I see middle age and a mustache.

That’s a good image though. His lower body is much more compact and youthful than I thought. I still can’t put the new face on it though.

 

[fred&edna]

I read here earlier that according to a podcast the man known as the original BG sketch had been arrested. Is there any more information on this, or has it been verified?

I missed this post. I wonder which podcast ??

 

[janesmith787]

Just a reminder that the HLN program for Liberty German & Abigail Williams is re-airing right now.
Watch HLN Streaming Online - HLN Live Stream - LiveNewsWatch

Interesting to me they said again how they were BRUTALLY murdered...I’m so thankful we haven’t had to hear all the details personally.

 

[MassGuy]

I’m definitely having this problem. I was just thinking today how hard it is for me to overcome two years of imprinting. I look at it and I see middle age and a mustache.

That’s a good image though. His lower body is much more compact and youthful than I thought. I still can’t put the new face on it though.

Yeah, it’s so frustrating. I trust it, I believe it, but I just can’t see it.

 

[apples12]

I disagree with those who think he's done other crimes and has experience. Or at least I don't think he's done anything that's gotten him in hot water with the law. It seems pretty clear LE is hinting at someone leading a double life, hiding in plain sight - as in a clean cut, outwardly upstanding person. I believe they have DNA from the crime scene, but his DNA is not in the database because he's never been arrested for anything significantly criminal. MOO. Of course, that doesn't mean he hasn't committed deviant behavior before, just that he hasn't been caught doing it. I lean towards the idea that the compulsion to do what he did was driving the boldness/risk of the crime he ultimately perpetrated. It was a build up of stresses which reached a boiling point, I think. I also haven't ruled out that he knew of/was familiar with one of the girls - perhaps through a group activity. For example Libby's church or her visits to Purdue classes.

I could not agree more. Nice summary here.

 

[neesaki]

Yes, I saw that earlier as well and it seems inexplicable to me that is how the original sketch was ruled out. Someone here might have a handy link, and it might have come from the HLN segment from today. I will have to go back and look at Margarita’s transcript (thank you).

It seems the original sketch gained enough attention, when it was all boiled down, the first sketch wasn’t the murderer of Abby and Libby, but some other kind of deviant, and there were two deviants around the the bridge that day.

Coincidence? That would be hard to swallow.

Would like to hear from the rest of you what that means, because I have always thought of BG as a lone wolf. Not quite willing to die on that hill, though. IMO.

That’s what I don’t get, a sex predator was arrested that was there the same day, who had originally been identified as the killer, yet he wasn’t the killer. New suspect introduced.
It is hard to believe, but I guess not impossible?

 

[Msl1966]

Just had this thought hit me...two years ago everyone’s eyes were looking for the original sketch. I wonder if there were any suicides of young men...one that might fit the new sketch. There never would have been a connection back then because the original sketch was quite different.

 

[raja]

I thought the HLN show was good in that they seemed to know the case well. So many times I see cases discussed and I want to scream, have you followed this at all. These "guys" were great.

 

[Jabarn]

Great points AND there are hundreds of unsolved crimes out there including murder so until he’s caught theres no way to know what he has done prior...

I do wonder, though, if priors will help lead to the murderer of Abby and Libby, especially with the new emphasis on a current resident, a prior resident visiting, or a person whose work caused them to be in Delphi.

If we think of BG as a fledgling SK, who has a fantasy and acts on it, there had to be something prior that could be cause of concern, like arson, cruelty to younger kids or relatives, maybe animals. It’s hard to discern, but anything prior is important. JMO.

 

[neesaki]

I missed this post. I wonder which podcast ??

I honestly don’t know, someone said “from the podcast”.

 

[mi_hiker]

I’m 600 posts behind and apologize if this is now redundant.

I said I was going to read The Shack again to see if I could find anything that LE might be trying to communicate to BG. I haven't seen the movie but usually they leave out quite a bit that's in the book. Anyhow IDK if Carter brought it up for a significant reason or not but if he did I may have found it. It was towards the end of the book and now I can't keep my eyes open. I'm kinda proud of myself for getting through the whole thing without having any panic attacks.

@Tillicum, I’d be very curious to hear what you found relevant near the end of the book. I haven’t read the book or watched the movie. Thank you in advance.

Here's a comparison of some of the language spoken by Superintendent Carter from the PC on the 1 year anniversary and the recent PC that introduced the new sketch and recordings.

Feb, 2018 Press conference:
"I just hope that one day I can look into the eyes of the murderer and ask him why? And I believe that we will.. I believe that we Will."
"I believe we are one piece of the puzzle away from figuring out who this individual is.. Then the real work begins."

Apr 2019 Press conference:
"Directly to the killer who may be in this room. We believe you are hiding in plain sight. For more than two years you never thought we would shift gears to a different investigative strategy but we have. We likely have interviewed you or someone close to you. We know that this is about power to you and you want to know what we know. And one day you will."
"Never in my career have I stood in front of something like this. Please be patient with us. Please. We're just beginning. We are we are just now beginning. "

Make of that what you will, but IMO he does sound more confidant than he did in the earlier press conference, the language towards finding the killer shifted from an if to a when type of situation.

What stands out to me is saying Feb 2018 that the real work begins after they identify the person responsible. Fast forward to Apr 2019 and the plea to be patient as they are just beginning. Coincidence or could this imply they now know who it is and as many have said, the work of building an airtight case begins.

I’m not sure I fully believe they know the exact person but I really hope I’m wrong and they have that last puzzle piece.

 

[Jabarn]

I do wonder, though, if priors will help lead to the murderer of Abby and Libby, especially with the new emphasis on a current resident, a prior resident visiting, or a person whose work caused them to be in Delphi.

If we think of BG as a fledgling SK, who has a fantasy and acts on it, there had to be something prior that could be cause of concern, like arson, cruelty to younger kids or relatives, maybe animals. It’s hard to discern, but anything prior is important. JMO.

ETA: the priors would have had to result in an arrest or some other documentation to be useful, to be fair.

 

[spangled]

I’m feeling quite optimistic after that show on HLN.

What are your main reasons for your optimism Margarita? I haven't been able to watch the show

 

[margarita25]

Love to hear others views. You could be correct to. I've studied a lot about fight or flight. A natural instinctive human survival instinct. Have felt it many times myself. A person in a fear of death position may run even though there is a chance of death by weapon, even a gun. Again some may fight. Women also though seem to be born with intuition to help keep them safe in certain dangerous situations. Gotten me out of a lot of them. Thats when they can ignore fight or flight and listen to the voice in there head instead and play it cool until they see a better time for escape. One thing that was said about the girls is that they wouldn't ever leave the other. If that is the case here then they both have what I call heros hearts. Not everyone has one.

Jumping off this, as it was mentioned again today on the HLN special how the girls likely wouldn’t leave each other (hence another way for him to control them), I liked how they focused on the victims quite a bit by showing their pictures with their birthdates and things that Abby and Libby enjoyed. It of course made me sad.

Gosh we all want this case solved so badly.

 

[moonlessnight]

agree. Maybe he had stints in psych hospitals for his deviant behavior instead of arrests. If he's young this is more likely, as kids are treated more as having mental health or environmental issues than being criminal. There may be people in the community who expected him to do something like this when he was younger.

Kids who torture and abuse animals are often let off even if they're caught, because LE don't take it seriously.

The image of this guy just shouts out misfit, loitering and unkempt. Someone women of his age recoil from and reject which makes him angry.

He's probably someone who doesn't fit in with his peers, doesn't have a meaningful career, never established committed ties in his community.

The girls likely picked up on these signals which is why his voice and image were recorded.

He's not a typical "BTK" type as yet.



BBM:
Just because he hasn't been caught doesn't mean he hasn't committed acts of cruelty, theft and other deviant crimes that flew under the radar because he's sneaky, cunning and lucky.

Its unlikely that someone would just be driven to commit something as serious as murder and possible sexual assault etc (details of the murders not released by LE) without trying out other thrill crimes and deviances first. And although we don't have the details of the murders yet, I have a horrible feeling they were sexually inclined.

The grainy image of BG doesn't strike me as someone clean cut or upwardly standing in the community. He looks menacing and unkempt, someone who doesn't really fit in and resents it.

He's done other stuff he's gotten away with and he's escalating, sloppy and is probably trembling after realizing he's not as clever as he thinks he is after the LE info released on the 22nd April.

moo

 

[apples12]

Absolutely. There would be some warning signs in the form of lesser, but disturbing crimes.

Peeping, underwear thief, exhibitionism, molestation, rape, burglary, arson, animal cruelty; something.

This didn’t come out of nowhere.

I agree that constellation does fit the typical pattern.

I just feel this case is going to be an exception. One for the books. Considering his young age, it is possible that his "priors" had to do with non-criminal nevertheless deviant behaviors in interpersonal relating and school behavior. We do not know if this crime was sexual in nature, hence I for one cannot leap to the molestation/rape/panty thief/ burglary etc. idea completely. Aspects of this case to me suggest psychological deterioration, deviant fantasies such as revenge or need to establish omnipotent power would be two underlying such fantasies. Middle school girls probably are the subject of these fantasies. It could be sexualized. Not sure. I sense this is not going to fit the typical pattern. JMOO

 

[elmomom]

That’s what I don’t get, a sex predator was arrested that was there the same day, who had originally been identified as the killer, yet he wasn’t the killer. New suspect introduced.
It is hard to believe, but I guess not impossible?

I listened to the podcast (have been trying to find it again to no avail, sorry). What was said made a lot of sense. It is not uncommon to find two or more predators in a particular area, if it is identifiable as a “target rich” area. A place where young teens congregate, a somewhat isolated area, etc. There was an interesting recap of a previous case where the victim was being pursued by a predator who was then cut off and replaced by another who ultimately killed her (Jesse Matthews I think was his name. I had followed the case but I am blanking on the names)

 

[margarita25]

Rsbm
@Tillicum, I’d be very curious to hear what you found relevant near the end of the book. I haven’t read the book or watched the movie. Thank you in advance.



.

Yes, I second this, please post any thoughts about this book and movie-I don’t want to watch it honestly, so thank you for your insights.

 

[Tillicum]

I thought the HLN show was good in that they seemed to know the case well. So many times I see cases discussed and I want to scream, have you followed this at all. These "guys" were great.

Yeah if I didn't know better I'd think they've been reading here