Found Deceased IN - Kyran Holland, 1, Kyannah Holland, 2, Kyle Moorman II, 5, & dad, Kyle Moorman, 27, Indianapolis, 6 Jul 2022

[Puzzles]

Regarding not bringing food, diapers and medicine etc. I think the comment from family is more relevant since they were reporting him missing after a few days. They didn't expect him to be gone several days and he didn't appear to take items to be gone several days. I took the comments more in the context of last we knew he was going fishing, he's been gone several days now, didn't take any extra clothing or food for the kids, and we haven't heard from him something is not right. Most people probably wouldn't even notice if he brought the normal items a lot of people take when going out for a few hours like a couple snacks and diapers.

My opinion only this is a very tragic accident that occurred while trying to do something relaxing and enjoyable. It's heartbreaking.

BBM

Ah, @Paige Franklin, the voice of reason and compassion.

Thank you.

 

[Limecat]

Most modern cars (I'm fairly certain a 2009 model would fall under this category) need to have the brake pedal pushed down in order to shift the car out of park. At least with automatics. I'm not sure it's so easy for a 1, 2, or 5 year old to knock the car out of gear. MOO

ETA: It was also pointed out that the air conditioning didn't work in the car, so it may not have even been turned on. Making it harder to get the car out of park.

I know in my vehicle you not only have to depress the brake pedal, but my gearshift has a side button you have to engage rather firmly before the shifter will move. MOO

 

[MimosaMornings]

I thought Audi’s had a safety feature called break transmission shift interlock device or BTSI. This part prevents the car from shifting into gear, unless the driver’s foot is on the brake. Foreign cars including Audi had these on cars starting back in 2006 from what I remember.

They were way ahead of American car manufacturers in this feature. Which precipitated the following mandate.

Federal Register :: Request Access

www.federalregister.gov

“Pursuant to a statutory mandate in the Cameron Gulbransen Kids Transportation Safety Act of 2007, NHTSA is placing a requirement in Federal Motor Vehicle Safety Standard No. 114 that certain motor vehicles with an automatic transmission that includes a “park” position manufactured for sale on or after September 1, 2010 be equipped with a brake transmission shift interlock (BTSI). This interlock must necessitate that the service brake pedal be depressed before the transmission can be shifted out of “park,” and must function in any starting system key position. The BTSI requirement adopted by this final rule is identical in substance to the Congressional requirement.”

 

[Teche]

Or.......he just didn't want to send them a picture.

I must have missed something...who wanted a picture?

 

[LaborDayRN]

I must have missed something...who wanted a picture?

It was reported by family that the two girls he was texting with requested a picture. I'm not really sure how family knew that however.

 

[Teche]

It was reported by family that the two girls he was texting with requested a picture. I'm not really sure how family knew that however.

Thank you.

 

[Lillymac]

I thought Audi’s had a safety feature called break transmission shift interlock device or BTSI. This part prevents the car from shifting into gear, unless the driver’s foot is on the brake. Foreign cars including Audi had these on cars starting back in 2006 from what I remember.

They were way ahead of American car manufacturers in this feature. Which precipitated the following mandate.

Federal Register :: Request Access

www.federalregister.gov

“Pursuant to a statutory mandate in the Cameron Gulbransen Kids Transportation Safety Act of 2007, NHTSA is placing a requirement in Federal Motor Vehicle Safety Standard No. 114 that certain motor vehicles with an automatic transmission that includes a “park” position manufactured for sale on or after September 1, 2010 be equipped with a brake transmission shift interlock (BTSI). This interlock must necessitate that the service brake pedal be depressed before the transmission can be shifted out of “park,” and must function in any starting system key position. The BTSI requirement adopted by this final rule is identical in substance to the Congressional requirement.”

I just researched this and you are correct.

 

[vls12345]

The car is a Saab, not an Audi.

That said, it likely had various safety features. But, parts break, people forget to put cars in park, etc.

This is such a heartbreaking event.

 

[RaspberryMama]

I have a new Chevy Traverse, for what it's worth, and it has the button on the side of the gear shift. Broke almost immediately and now I can accidentally bump the shifter just slightly and suddenly I'm in neutral. Even if the SAAB had this feature, if it was a used car I'd say there's a decent chance that some of those safety features weren't in great working order.

 

[IceIce9]

I thought Audi’s had a safety feature called break transmission shift interlock device or BTSI. This part prevents the car from shifting into gear, unless the driver’s foot is on the brake. Foreign cars including Audi had these on cars starting back in 2006 from what I remember.

They were way ahead of American car manufacturers in this feature. Which precipitated the following mandate.

Federal Register :: Request Access

www.federalregister.gov

“Pursuant to a statutory mandate in the Cameron Gulbransen Kids Transportation Safety Act of 2007, NHTSA is placing a requirement in Federal Motor Vehicle Safety Standard No. 114 that certain motor vehicles with an automatic transmission that includes a “park” position manufactured for sale on or after September 1, 2010 be equipped with a brake transmission shift interlock (BTSI). This interlock must necessitate that the service brake pedal be depressed before the transmission can be shifted out of “park,” and must function in any starting system key position. The BTSI requirement adopted by this final rule is identical in substance to the Congressional requirement.”

Kyle’s car was a 2009 Saab.

 

[MimosaMornings]

Kyle’s car was a 2009 Saab.

Oops. Thanks for letting me know!

 

[aimeea]

I don't know if the idea has already been raised but it's also entirely possible he was actively trying to back out of the ramp and with the tire situation, the steepness of the ramp, and the extremely low amount of gas in the car that he couldn't back up and it just went forward instead

 

[MimosaMornings]

https://safercar.dr.del1.nhtsa.gov/Vehicle-Shoppers/Resources/BTSI-equipped-cars-%E2%80%93-2010

“The following is a list of Model Year 2009 vehicles that are equipped with Brake Transmission Shift Interlock (BTSI) technology as reported to NHTSA by the vehicle manufacturers. BTSI is a safety technology that is intended to prevent children from accidentally putting a vehicle into gear. The technology forces the driver to have their foot on the brake, in all key positions, when shifting out of park. Vehicle manufacturers may elect to make BTSI available on other models during the model year. Check with your manufacturer.”

Saab	9-3	Standard
	9-3	Standard
	9-3 Wagon	Standard
	9-5	Standard

 

[realanastasia]

Oops. Thanks for letting me know!

Relevant to this discussion is that Saabs are notoriously idiosyncratic cars. See here the unique placement of the ignition on a 2009 Saab 97X SUV—it’s just below the gear shift lever. I know the car under discussion was not this model but as far as I know the weird location of the ignition was a signature feature of that brand and was in most (if not all) of its models. Purely conjecture here but I consider it very possible that little hands could have grabbed at, or even turned the key in the ignition even if the children were secured in the back seat.

Edited to show interior console of 2009 model 9-3, with same ignition position.

 

[ChiCubs2016]

I have been reading along and since the beginning I thought this would end up a tragic accident and now seeing the concrete slab and thinking maybe the car was parked facing forward. I wonder if the child were in the car and the father was standing in front of the car fishing and for whatever reason, child hit the gearshift, car malfunction the car rolled, hit the father as it was going in the water. MOO Such a sad, very heartbreaking ending.

 

[MimosaMornings]

Relevant to this discussion is that Saabs are notoriously idiosyncratic cars. See here the unique placement of the ignition on a 2009 Saab 97X SUV—it’s just below the gear shift lever. I know the car under discussion was not this model but as far as I know the weird location of the ignition was a signature feature of that brand and was in most (if not all) of its models. Purely conjecture here but I consider it very possible that little hands could have grabbed at, or even turned the key in the ignition even if the children were secured in the back seat.

Edited to show interior console of 2009 model 9-3, with same ignition position.

So little hands could have turned the ignition switch and then pulled a broken gear shift from Park down to Drive.

 

[carbuff]

Also if the car had a standard transmission, there would be more options--depending on how the car was parked, which direction it was facing, in gear or not, location of parking brake release...

 

[katydid23]

We took our babies and toddlers with us to drive in movies, knowing they were going to sleep from the time we left home until the time we returned. We could have left them in their beds and had a babysitter or friend stay with them but we chose to take them with us.

Parenting decisions vary, the decision you or I make isn’t necessarily the same decision another parent makes.

Unless further information is revealed I believe it was simply a tragic accident.

Going to a drive in with 2 adults to supervise the kids, is much different than night fishing, with one adult and 3 very young children, at midnight, with a donut tire, no phone charger, no supplies for the kids, no asthma inhaler....I am sad that this loving and doting father went on an impulsive trip without adequate planning. I do think it was an accident but it is heartbreaking for sure.

 

[Knox]

Back in June a woman and kids were night fishing in WV. The child (six-year old) went up to turn the lights off in the vehicle (Tahoe) and accidently put it into gear. The rest of the details are at the link below, thread link is below that.

IMO, this is going to be a tragic, heartbreaking, accident.

Search for 6-year-old drowning victim to resume Sunday - WV MetroNews

Witnesses say the boy knocked a vehicle out of gear causing it to roll into the water near Dunbar.

wvmetronews.com

Found Deceased - Deonco Howard, drowned in Kanawha River, Kanawha County, WV

PITTSBURGH (KDKA) - Search and rescue teams are resuming their efforts to locate a little boy who was in a vehicle that plunged into the Kanawha River in West Virginia. Authorities said the six-year-old was sitting in his aunt's SUV and apparently knocked it into gear Saturday morning...

www.websleuths.com

 

[Indy22]

“Why couldn't he take a picture???”

That’s a nagging question for me too.

@Indy22 my thoughts and prayers during this tragedy for family and loved ones. I hope our questions are not bothering you or seen as criticism.
Thank you for being on here and sharing information.

Thank you for thinking about me. I’m fine but even if I wasn’t, as long as they’re not violating WS TOS I wouldn’t want anyone to edit their content to spare my feelings. Or anyone elses either.

I don’t have any better idea than anyone else re how they wound up in that pond. Of course I hope it was a horrible accident and I’m choosing to believe that until/unless info strongly indicated otherwise. But I’m completely aware this may well have been an intentional act for a reason known only to Kyle. More than anything I hope one way or the other the family receives answers. Wondering is worse than not knowing.