Intruder theories only. No posts from rdi members allowed

[Tawny]

I believe he never handed them over since no one has ever claimed to see them. That's enough for me.

 

[ScarlettScarpetta]

I believe he never handed them over since no one has ever claimed to see them. That's enough for me.

Except there is a news report further up the thread that says that they were delivered. I have not seen a news report or official report saying they were not handed over.

I believe they did receive them.

 

[Tawny]

I guess we are at an impasse. Because the report says "a source" and doesn't reveal that source. Who says they handed them over?

The only thing I found was that they turned them over to their own private investigator, Kotner.

 

[ScarlettScarpetta]

IF it was an outsider, I feel it would have to be someone the Ramsey's knew very well since this person (a) knew the amount of John's bonus (b) knew the layout of the house very well it seems (c) was able to get JB out of her bedroom with nobody hearing him/her do so (d) was able to replicate Patsy's writing style and diction extremely well. These are things a random intruder, or someone with just fringe knowledge of the family would not be able to do (especially the ransom note).

And why would an intruder try so hard to replicate Patsy's writing style in a ransom note if their point all along was to kidnap JonBenet out of the house (it was mentioned in this thread that the person's plan went awry and they killed JB in house). It doesn't make any sense. If their plan was to murder her all along, why bother with a ransom not that potentially could lead to the person's identity? The ransom note SCREAMS staging. Someone who knew of JB from being on the "fringe" of the family, as suggested, would have just taken her out of the house immediately. Why all the elaborate staging? Why redress her? Wrap her in a blanket? Wipe her down? If it was an intruder and he/she killed her by "accident" in the home, they could have still taken the body and disposed of it elsewhere. Why risk leaving it in the home with potential evidence that could lead to their identity?

Back to my point: If someone truly did break into the Ramsey's house that night, it had to have been someone very close to them. If that was the case, I feel the source of the DNA would have been discovered by now.

The problem is that the RN did not Replicate Patsy well. It had some characteristics but the majority were not like her.

I do believe it was not someone very close to them but close enough.

 

[CherCher]

The DNA is all I need really. It means everything in a case like this. And in any other case it would be the key.. Find that DNA donor and find the killer.

As I have previously mentioned, I clean houses for a living and I have run into some very "sticky situations" doing so. I bring home other people's body fluids, pubic hairs and sometimes their infectious diseases such as cold viruses.

DNA is not the be all and end all in any case. The whole crime, or "body of the crime" the "corpus delecti" must be taken into consideration. If the DNA matches up with the rest of the crime, then maybe you have a party started, but otherwise it's just something of interest.

 

[ScarlettScarpetta]

As I have previously mentioned, I clean houses for a living and I have run into some very "sticky situations" doing so. I bring home other people's body fluids, pubic hairs and sometimes their infectious diseases such as cold viruses.

DNA is not the be all and end all in any case. The whole crime, or "body of the crime" the "corpus delecti" must be taken into consideration. If the DNA matches up with the rest of the crime, then maybe you have a party started, but otherwise it's just something of interest.

Yes, really it is. It is used to include and exclude, Pinpoint murderers and set the wrong people free.

IT is different finding someone else's DNA on a sleeve or floor but You have two of the same DNA one on her jammies and one IN HER UNDERWEAR.

If this was the case of Jane smith it would mean anything.. Only in this case is DNA ignored. Since she was molested that night it has more to do with this case and fits the Crime. This is not DNA that was found on the bottom of her foot.

DNA matters.

 

[Tawny]

DNA matters, but we can't ignore the rest of the evidence.

 

[TroyinTX]

The problem is that the RN did not Replicate Patsy well. It had some characteristics but the majority were not like her.

I do believe it was not someone very close to them but close enough.

Considering how several handwriting experts have been unable to rule her out as the author, I dunno about this statement? I thought even the handwriting analysis experts hired by the Ramsey team of lawyers could not even completely rule her out as the author.

To me, that seems to signal her handwriting was replicated pretty darn well.

 

[ScarlettScarpetta]

Has Patsy ever been ruled out by any handwriting expert that examined the note? I thought even the handwriting analysis experts hired by the Ramsey team of lawyers could not even completely rule her out as the author.

To me, that seems to signal her handwriting was replicated pretty darn well.

She scored a 4.5 on a scale of 1 being the author and 5 being not the author. That means she was most likely not the author.

I can sit and write a letter and my friend can also write a letter and you would not be able to tell who wrote what.

IT is not an exact science. It is left up to interpretation.

I don't think that note sounds like her or JR. The references the weird terms..

JMO

 

[Tawny]

It takes training to forge an entire note to that degree. The average individual would not be able to do that.

 

[TroyinTX]

She scored a 4.5 on a scale of 1 being the author and 5 being not the author. That means she was most likely not the author.

I can sit and write a letter and my friend can also write a letter and you would not be able to tell who wrote what.

IT is not an exact science. It is left up to interpretation.

I don't think that note sounds like her or JR. The references the weird terms..

JMO

What/whose scale are you referring to? Just one experts? Because I have read analysis that she is more likely than not the author.

Having been a teacher for several years, I can tell you that YES, I can tell who wrote what. I often could know that a paper without a name on it belonged to a certain student simply by the handwriting.

And several of the phrases (and hence/good southern common sense) sound like PR.

 

[ScarlettScarpetta]

It takes training to forge an entire note to that degree. The average individual would not be able to do that.

Sure they could. IT is just copying someone else handwriting, Something I think most of us did as kids. Some better than others.

How do we know this person did not write in a similar fashion to her as it was??
WE don't. Because we don't know who wrote it.

That note to me points way away from the R's. IMO

 

[CherCher]

DNA matters, but we can't ignore the rest of the evidence.

Exactly what I was trying to say. And isn't it strange that this supposed intruder child killer who leaves tDNA (the flimsiest of dna evidence) has never committed another crime ever since? At least that we know of.

 

[Tawny]

Sure they could. IT is just copying someone else handwriting, Something I think most of us did as kids. Some better than others.

How do we know this person did not write in a similar fashion to her as it was??
WE don't. Because we don't know who wrote it.

That note to me points way away from the R's. IMO

The average individual may not be able to tell the difference but handwriting analysis EXPERTS certainly could.

 

[ScarlettScarpetta]

What/whose scale are you referring to? Just one experts? Because I have read analysis that she is more likely than not the author.

Having been a teacher for several years, I can tell you that YES, I can tell who wrote what. I often could know that a paper without a name on it belonged to a certain student simply by the handwriting.

And several of the phrases (and hence/good southern common sense) sound like PR.

All your students from the beginning of your career to the end? You are conscious of the ones that you see presently. But could you do that for a student from 3 years ago? I don't think so.

I used to have to interpret Dr's handwriting for orders at a hosp. They all write basically the same, same short cuts, same symbols.. yes there is the odd one that sticks out but as a rule they all are very similar.

We are not experts and even the experts don't agree.

 

[TroyinTX]

This is interesting. The probability of the person that breaks into their home having the same writing pattern as the mother? Really?

http://gemart.8m.com/ramsey/note/

 

[ScarlettScarpetta]

The average individual may not be able to tell the difference but handwriting analysis EXPERTS certainly could.

And I can not find any overwhelming proof that Patsy wrote this letter. I see terms like possible. Probable but not an absolute she authored this. I don't believe it anyway. Being a middle aged mother and looking at that note, I don't see her in the note.
JMO

 

[ScarlettScarpetta]

This is interesting. The probability of the person that breaks into their home having the same writing pattern as the mother? Really?

http://gemart.8m.com/ramsey/note/

I did not say that.. I believe it was made to look like her handwriting in some way.. And that is why it is not a match. I just see too much that gives more credence to her not writing it than does. JMO

 

[Tawny]

That's why experts were hired and not me or you or any other random person. JMO

 

[TroyinTX]

All your students from the beginning of your career to the end? You are conscious of the ones that you see presently. But could you do that for a student from 3 years ago? I don't think so.

I used to have to interpret Dr's handwriting for orders at a hosp. They all write basically the same, same short cuts, same symbols.. yes there is the odd one that sticks out but as a rule they all are very similar.

We are not experts and even the experts don't agree.

You stated that your friend could write a letter and you could write a letter and nobody could tell the difference. I stated that is false.

And yes, I could tell if I had a sample of the student from three years ago writing. The expert compared the writing to Patsy's writing. And many of them stated she more than likely wrote the note.